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Mixed feelings on Enchanters

StoryDuck··15 votes·1,032 views

I want supports to feel powerful like they can carry a game so I want them to be stronger. I want to be that Soraka that can carry my team by being the best positioned healer in the game keeping people alive. I want to be that Lulu polying the Zed to protect my Kog while making him a killing machine for a few moments with well timed buffs. I want to save my Varus with a well timed ult as Janna. I want to be the buffing machine carrying my team to victory as Sona. I want to feel like supports can carry the game if they play well.

I want to reduce the power of ADCs just as much as a lot of other people and I know nerfing Ardent can do that...but...I really want supports (even enchanters) to be powerful. I just want supports to be able to go into a game, play well and people notice "Hey, that support carried." as much as other roles. Any nerf to anything support makes me so torn because I know it could have the effect people want but I just can't accept that the only answer is to hurt the weakest role in LOL. As a result I get mixed feelings because I know people could be right but I want to feel more powerful in my role.

It's been a long road from season 3 where supports were glorified ward depositories to what they are now. Now, supports are starting to matter like a real role and I love it. i would love to see tank support buffs to make them more competitive with enchanters. In a perfect game supports would be just as powerful as any other role and 1/5 games they need to be killed first to win. We probably won't ever reach that but I can hope.

18 Comments

PokladnicaZla4 votes

It's kinda sad that supports became a real class(with good items just for them) not long ago and anytime bot is too strong they nerf them instead of the ADCs. Sigh

StoryDuck2 votes

That's precisely how I feel. I mean, I know nerfing buffs that supports give hurts ADCs but why is that the answer instead of making ADCs weaker?

IcyPepper4 votes

Maybe if supports could amplify the power of something other than AD carry then maybe we'll get there.

StoryDuck2 votes

I would love to see some support items that synergize with abilities rather then auto attacks.

Rockem Sockm2 votes

Taric is a tank support and an enchanter. Unleash the op beast.

I think enchanters are in a good spot. I think support items are in a great spot. The problem is when you combine them, it becomes insane.

I feel yoy and wish I knew a solution.

StoryDuck1 votes

I love playing Taric. I've lately been having fun playing some of the forgotten supports like Leona, Nautilus and Braum though. Naut is especially fun to play.

Daedric Etwahl2 votes

I feel the same. Personally I love building Censer, Tear, Athene's, etc on Sona and rallying around my team and keeping them alive through the harshest of onslaughts. It just feels so rewarding that I've finally reached my full potential, especially if the game so far has gone badly otherwise. So many comebacks have been made because the enemy can't end before I finally get going. What makes that so much different than say a Jinx or a Vayne or a Yi hitting their lategame amd getting full build?

I agree something needs to be changed but so many people just hate that supports can feel like they're doing something, I guess.

TyrekGoldenspear2 votes

I feel you. I love playing my Raka and saving people, as an example.

Thing is I wish less emphasis was in a support's items and more in their kit. Heck I'd be happy with support items that let me support our mage if our adc needs to farm back into the game for example, or support a Jugg.

SB Arneeman2 votes

I agree, I often almost feel like an item bot when playing support. Ardent censer+Redemption+Locket just have so much impact in fights compared to what you can do the rest of the kit. Also, Ardent forces you into following your adc around most of the time which isn't very interesting. If ardent or other items gave other buffs than just for auto attackers, for example, you could support the team where it was needed and not mostly the adc.

Forcing the support to peel mostly for adc due to the strong ardent bonus is also what makes this into an annoying hypercarry-adc meta.

StoryDuck1 votes

I really liked the added stat of %bonus heals and shields. It really added to a support's kit instead of just all kinds of added bonuses/abilities from items. That stat made me feel really good as a support. I love building item 3222 on Soraka because it makes her feel so strong with her heals. I wish there was another item that granted 20% heal and shield power. I wouldn't say no to other low stat items that grant bonus duration on CC too.

Apex Support2 votes

Jup don't nerf the enchanters just buff the other types of sups.

StoryDuck2 votes

You I like.

Zetto1 votes

The problem with supports, enchanters specifically, is that in order to be "Strong" they have to have the kind of shielding and healing that we all know and hate. They have to be able to shield and heal teammates to a point where they just can't die. If they do, they're strong and viable, if they can't they're weak and useless. There's no middle ground to be achieved because their whole purpose is to stay far away from the enemy and keep people alive. This alone is a problem, but when coupled with the ADC, whose whole thing is "either kill me or I'm gonna kill you with insane BPS (Burst Per Second)" it gets even worse. This is an enchanter problem specifically because the playstyle they have allows them to hang back and not be in a position to get cut down, which is supposed to be their main form of counterplay.

StoryDuck1 votes

So what is wrong with supports being strong enough to be considered a threat on the team? Isn't that a good thing? I mean if you could ignore the support's shields and heals then why give them in the first place? I do understand that its a bit crazy with ADCs dealing so much sustained damage and being unkillable which is why i understand why people want to nerf supports but couldn't lower scaling defensive stats on ADCs fix the issue just as much as weaker shields? I want this crazy ADC meta under control as much as the rest of us but why are supports paying the price?

Erockandroll1 votes

{quoted}

So what is wrong with supports being strong enough to be considered a threat on the team? Isn't that a good thing? I mean if you could ignore the support's shields and heals then why give them in the first place? I do understand that its a bit crazy with ADCs dealing so much sustained damage and being unkillable which is why i understand why people want to nerf supports but couldn't lower scaling defensive stats on ADCs fix the issue just as much as weaker shields? I want this crazy ADC meta under control as much as the rest of us but why are supports paying the price?

The one guy mentioned that Enchanters are on a Knifes edge of Unviable and OP. But the source of that Knife's edge, is a general lack of counterplay. Poke and CC are generally tied to skillshots which intrinsically provide counterplay by allowing you to dodge them. But their isn't much their to block/counter healing/shielding abilities.

Though their are some exceptions, with some of our more recent champs. Rakan's Q requires you to poke an enemy champion first, exposing him to danger. (Raka's Q is some what similar in nature) The other interesting one is Bard. Because his healing cookies take like a good 10 seconds to bake, and your opponent can destroy them.

With our older champs however, it's often that they can simply cast their abilities on their opponents without much consequence. And aside from Arden Censor, You could also blame coin for the lack of counterplay, since those champions are now much less mana gated. Personally, I use to think that the main draw back was the fact that you were made of glass. (Perhaps more so than the glass cannon) But with experience and teamwork, that drawback become less relevant.

StoryDuck1 votes

Urgh, coin makes it way too easy to get gold. I wish the coins had a shorter pipckup range or at least a smaller time frame to pick them up. It should be easier to punish coin buys if they just play passive all lane. I think the gold amount is spot on but it needs to be more easy to punish a lack of stats.

Rakan isn't a good example of a healer/shielder. He can yes but that is not why he is picked and he isn't really an enchanter more some kind of weird hybrid (fun to play though!). If I was to pick the healthiest enchanter I would have to say it is Soraka. I know a lot of people don't like her but what it comes down to is that she needs to be targeted (like a carry) and people don't like that. People say she can just stay in the back line but that's the same of any ADC as well. Soraka is one of the most intensive positioning champions in the game. She also becomes weaker the more she heals making her easier and easier to kill. She's actually a bad pick into a team with little CC (aka tanks) but can carry with her healing as long as she is protected. People can also itemize against her carrying potential (I would argue that there needs to be an anti-shield item). I think her base heals are a bit strong though which allows tank Soraka builds and those are unhealthy as she should have to worry about assassins and divers. I think she would be perfect if her heals scaled 50%-100% better with bonus heal and shield power but the base heals were lower forcing item 3504 item 3222 item 3107 instead of item 3504 item 3083 item 3107 .

Helios Sama1 votes

I think maybe an increase in items to counter healing other than item 3123 and item 3076 (item 3165 is conditional, but maybe a buff to the health requirement?) and maybe making true damage bypass shields? summoner 14 may need to be nerfed because that would make summoner 21 useless. Also making shields not mess with missing health damage calculations? (Example: If Jhin 4th shot deals 500 damage to a target missing 50% health, the shot should still deal 500 total damage to the same target if they were shielded for 200 of that damage.)

Rins Thigh Socks1 votes

{quoted} but I just can't accept that the only answer is to hurt the weakest role in LOL.

That's funny. We're not nerfing toplaners.

Support is, and has been for a good part of the season, one of the hardest carrying roles. You might not have noticed it because you think that raw damage and tankiness is what correlate with strength, but they have absurd impact.

Before, they'd do it by roaming. By making sure that you got shit done across the map. Olleh got to rank 1 on his account Humble Diligent this season by doing that. You effectively work as a second jungler and coordinate all sorts of fantastic ganks that would turn every lane in your favor.

Right now they're probably THE hardest carrying role. What's worse is that they're not doing that by being skilled, clever, or anything high-gameplay. They're pressing their shield and letting their AD collect a huge defensive and offensive buff. My buddy has been hardstuck Gold 4-5 for 2-3 seasons now. He just played Janna this season and he hit Plat less than a week ago.

The role is fucking busted.

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