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We wanted to make Cass healthy

yellowbricks·2/7/2015, 2:58:20 PM·63 votes·3,787 views

Good job guys, I'm seeing people post Cass OP threads now, glad to know you were so desperate to shut everyone up that you just threw numbers at her until she got out of control.

Are you ready to step down from your high horse and listen yet, Stashu? Here it is again in case you missed it the last hundred billion times:

The passive needs to go, it's not fun to play as, it's not fun to play against. Riot says they hate ball of stat passives, and passives that are useless until a certain point, well gee, let's put both of those mechanics into one thing. Also burden of knowledge because there's no real indication that she's in her murder mode. Just make the poisonous snake champ actually debilitate people rather than this dumb curse garbage.

The poisons need to be better, they merely tickle enemy champs, merely a vehicle for the E spam that you've taken to the extreme with this rework.

The fangs need to be worse. It's a pseudo ADC autoattack with a scaling ratio that also heals you and buffs your poisons. It sounds like one of those things kids come up with when they're playing pretend. Cut off all the fat, we asked for better poisons and so you put it on the fang, how about you buff the poisons, and tone down the fang so it isn't just a binary point and click adventure?

What else is there? I've played Cass like twice since this rework, I forgot the laundry list of things wrong with this rework, but those are the main points, a good starting area to clean up if you actually care.

I'm probably just screaming into the void judging by Stashu's "presence" lately, but hell, why not give it a shot. Maybe I'll at least spark others to pick up the torch again, hopefully someone remains that hasn't been Stockholm Syndromed by "muh winrates".

55 Comments

Cosmic Warper2/7/2015, 5:29:08 PM20 votes

I think Stashu died... Or riot deems the rework a success and told him to stop working on it. Either way we're screwed because now if she's op her numbers are going to be nerfed and she's going to be bad again. Her Passive is just not thematically or mechanically relevant to her playstyle at all.... It's sad.

Ciudadano Can2/7/2015, 5:44:00 PM14 votes

It's better for them (and only for them) to stay quiet until people forget about it, like they did with Karma, who lost her charm, fanbase and gameplay to the meta, or Olaf, seeing as "olaf'd" is just a meme now and nobody brings it up as a serious discussion. In a couple of months these discussions will disappear and it's another successful rework in their eyes.

Keep up the good work, Riot, I guess. Trundle

Krys Star2/7/2015, 7:03:06 PM11 votes

The likelihood of Stashu commenting and discussing this is like, non-existent. The guy is so irresponsible and lazy it's disgusting. I don't know how he got hired at Riot, or maybe Riot just has very low standards to begin with. I'd hate to imagine how neglectful he is toward everything else, especially his responsibilities.

Auryiel2/7/2015, 8:58:30 PM10 votes

Cass is so boring now :(

Aboylova922/7/2015, 7:20:40 PM6 votes

I do have to agree, and I don't even player her. She just feels like a hyper carry that the only way to make her that, is through waiting for your passive to fully stack. I hadn't really played her since the original Cass, and her poison feels useless unless except to mark someone for your fangs, and generally feels pretty "meh" until late game. There's a plethora of other champs I'd rather play than her, and that's saying something because I like playing underplayed AP mids, Viktor, Velkoz, Malz, pre-rework Xerath, ect.

Oleandervine2/7/2015, 10:58:33 PM6 votes

Despite what Riot has said, there HAVE been constructive criticisms towards Cassiopeia that haven't busted their balls over the past few months, but they've still been awkwardly quiet. In fact, almost all Rioters have been quiet except for the two or three social networkers that post on the forums because its their job. Most all of the developers and designers have clammed up, and that doesn't really bode well for the community. Cassiopeia is in an ugly place right now, as there is a dichotomy of the super-gamers who love her OPness and claim she is good and the people who liked her playstyle and diversity pre-rework who got shafted when her kit was pigeonholed into a singular point and shoot play style. She honestly needs to be reworked from the ground up so as to address all of the issues that plague her.

SmokingPuffin2/7/2015, 5:52:03 PM6 votes

Just make the poisonous snake champ actually debilitate people rather than this dumb curse garbage.

It sounds fun and fluffy, but I haven't seen a debilitating passive design that actually plays well. If you've got proposals, I'd be happy to discuss.

we asked for better poisons and so you put it on the fang, how about you buff the poisons, and tone down the fang so it isn't just a binary point and click adventure?

Old Cass having both good poison damage and good E damage is what made her kit unhealthy. The basic problem is that there is no favorable zone for the opponent. With New Cass, the counterplay is clear -- don't get chain E'd, you're winning the trade. That's why Riot had to choose between strong poisons and strong E.

I'm probably just screaming into the void judging by Stashu's "presence" lately, but hell, why not give it a shot.

I do have to wonder where the guy is. Gotta do what you say you're going to do, or people will not respect you.

TacoPunch2/7/2015, 6:13:44 PM5 votes

Here's a secret. Don't tell anyone I told you, however, as it's a really big secret.

If you dodge skillshots properly, Cassiopeia does almost nothing.

togapika2/7/2015, 10:19:17 PM4 votes

My question is this: if you want to make a poison based character (or any character based on dots), how do you make it so that they are required to do more than just hit an enemy with powerful poison and then walk away to safety as the enemies health bar gets depleted.

TheTyeGuy2/7/2015, 9:53:47 PM3 votes

Remember the post that said Riot responds to constructive comments?

You make points, but attacking rioters with aggressive insults make it really hard to take you seriously.

At this point, it's starting to feel like a circlejerk.

BeatzBoyFTW2/8/2015, 1:34:04 AM3 votes

Anivia- Needs to land Q for her E to hurt a lot

Urgot - Needs to land E for his Q to all land successfully, plus extra damage

Swain - Needs to land E for more damaging abilities with his ult.

Sion - Needs to land E to land Q successfully.

And lastly for Cass, Cassiopeia - Needs to land Q to throw multiple painful E's, with heals each.

About every champion needs to be combo-base in order to be damaging, or more demanding in teamfights or skirmishes. Basically, all I'm seeing in this thread is a TL;DR version of "I want to land a Q that drops enemy HP to 40% cz I'm lazy, pls Rito". But I'm not totally saying she is fairly balance right now, I kind of appreciate if they increase her E range a little but to cope with her Q range, and also increase the E AP stats a little bit, since poison is improved. with each landing E.

Incoming "You're silver, so stfu" comments for the loss.

Hupsis2/8/2015, 12:34:49 PM2 votes

Here's a kit idea. Tell me what you think :)

Basic idea is to apply poison stacks with Q and W and then punish with either E or ult:

Passive - Q and W applies poison stacks on enemies. Each stack deals 3 damage per second and last for 5 seconds if not refreshed. Max 20 stacks. Casting E or R will remove the stacks.

Q - applies 3 poison stacks (+ does all the same things it currently does) W - deals damage, slows and applies poison stacks every second when enemies stand in it + ticks twice as fast on petrified targets (double damage + double poison stacks) E - no reset if enemy is poisoned, only if it kills them + deals %-damage based on the stacks (+1% of target's missing health per stack?) + of course has a base damage R - stuns for 1 second + an additional 0.2 seconds for each poison stack. Slows for the same duration if enemy isn't facing Cassiopeia. Max stun/slow: 5 seconds >:D

I dunno... just something I thought would be interesting.

I Main Swain2/7/2015, 8:12:09 PM2 votes

I think the idea of the passive is nice, but it is improperly implemented and may be better on a different champ.

What Is Smite2/8/2015, 7:58:37 PM1 votes

Make Cassio Healthy? She spits out poison.... I don't think that's very healthy for anybody.

Hard Penetrator2/8/2015, 7:03:51 PM1 votes

Been here saw that.

Now they will nerf her too much and she will go back to being tier 2 or 3 ap mid that you play against once every 100 games.

DarkenedSoul4202/8/2015, 7:24:55 PM1 votes

Dont worry they already nerfed her since she isn't one of Riots fav LCS champions