Is he the new Renekton? Win lane lose game? Sure as hell feels like it, same for when I jungle him.
I can snowball like hell in top lane, but do nothing because I do no damage lategame to a fed carry, or I can snowball one lane as a jungler and everywhere else will fall apart WITHOUT the enemy jungler ganking
flibitydoo20 votesFor me, Sion wins lane
then wins game
because his peel is immense
I don't know what you are doing lategame, full damage doesn't work on Sion, in fact, ANY DAMAGE doesn't work on Sion. Just build CDR/tank and peel all the tanks/assassins off your carry and win game.
His Q is basically a "for the next 2 seconds, you can't stand next to my ADC". Basically if you're a short ranged assassin (AKA ALL OF THEM) you can't jump on his carries (or you get cc'd by Sion and killed by the carry). And the cooldown for Q is super short, and if they stun you out of it, then GJ, they didn't stun your carry;proceed to win teamfight because they wasted cc on the tank. Landing R into a squishy mage/adc leads into another Q which leads into them getting hard cc'd long enough to win teamfights. R has an insanely low CD lategame, running enough CDR,* it can be cast every 36 seconds*. Apparently it has semi-global range, but I just use it as an extra stun/gapcloser. His W I rarely detonate in a fight, it just makes him so much more tanky that no one bothers to try to stop you from the nonstop cc. It's a nice extra nuke on top of his kit (but again, you aren't damage, you're cc). His E sets up his Q so that your opponent is forced to dash out or get knocked up (in which case, GJ they wasted a dash/flash that they could have used to jump onto your carries).
Wullf3 votesI must say i have been succesfull with Maw 
. It gives you sustain aginst AP damage and the scaling AD from missing health is just great. Plus it goes well with Sions passive.
I have seen some Korean league games (a month back i think). They built him full tank without any damage and even though he got fed in early he just got ignored in teamfights because he dealth no damage. Also his CC did not help his team mutch.
Though he does need to be built as pretty heavy tank I would still suggest to take one damage item on him.
Droogzy2 votesFor me, Sion wins lane
then wins game
because his peel is immense
I don't know what you are doing lategame, full damage doesn't work on Sion, in fact, ANY DAMAGE doesn't work on Sion. Just build CDR/tank and peel all the tanks/assassins off your carry and win game.
This right here, Sion is amazing for me in SoloQ for two reasons: He's tanky as hell and difficult to kill, I can play incredibly aggressive to force the jungler to camp my lane to no avail, and allow my two other lanes to play aggressive without retribution.
Come team fight, you can peel so damn well for your carry and soak up so much damage. I don't generally don't even build any damage, just rush frozen heart, than Randuins, then Aegis and anything after that is bonus.
His zoning is just godly, in a fight where the enemy tank goes to zone your team and you go to zone his, you will win, 9/10, he's incredibly difficult to even hurt with his W, especially since most tanks try to get at least one damage item, you straight rush armor and you already have one item more than their tank for soaking up damage.
In the off chance that they do somehow manage kill you first, well guess what? You come back with your passive and you have another 3-4 seconds of tanking you can do in which scenario, your autos freaking hurt like crazy, he's the ultimate zone tank in the game right now.
Late game the squishiest champion on the enemy team is going to have at least 80 armor (the ADC), and are only taking 660 from a RQ assuming you actually hit them (which doesn't generally happen)
Even in the off chance that he does hit that 660 damage, that's at least 25% of the carries' health already gone (Assuming they have 2.2k which is usually only achieved with a Banshee's Veil) and in addition to being stunned for 2+ seconds before any of your carries are involved, I don't think there are many other tanks out there that can even dream of doing that, that's pretty damn good for a tank.
Completely agreed: Darius brings tons of insta-hard-CC to a teamfight.
Difference between Sion and Darius though is his map presence, with TP and his ultimate, you can anywhere on the map at any given time. Not only that, Darius, if he misses his one hard CC, is easily kiteable, and compared to a Sion, is easily killable, Sion can be kited as well yes, but it's a lot more difficult to do so, and as a Sion, you really shouldn't be chasing anyways as there's little incentive to do so, as oppose to Darius who actually does have an incentive to chase (resets).
vonGroopah1 votesFor me, Sion wins lane
then wins game
because his peel is immense
I don't know what you are doing lategame, full damage doesn't work on Sion, in fact, ANY DAMAGE doesn't work on Sion. Just build CDR/tank and peel all the tanks/assassins off your carry and win game.
His Q is basically a "for the next 2 seconds, you can't stand next to my ADC". Basically if you're a short ranged assassin (AKA ALL OF THEM) you can't jump on his carries (or you get cc'd by Sion and killed by the carry). And the cooldown for Q is super short, and if they stun you out of it, then GJ, they didn't stun your carry;proceed to win teamfight because they wasted cc on the tank. Landing R into a squishy mage/adc leads into another Q which leads into them getting hard cc'd long enough to win teamfights. R has an insanely low CD lategame, running enough CDR,* it can be cast every 36 seconds*. Apparently it has semi-global range, but I just use it as an extra stun/gapcloser. His W I rarely detonate in a fight, it just makes him so much more tanky that no one bothers to try to stop you from the nonstop cc. It's a nice extra nuke on top of his kit (but again, you aren't damage, you're cc). His E sets up his Q so that your opponent is forced to dash out or get knocked up (in which case, GJ they wasted a dash/flash that they could have used to jump onto your carries).
Great answer! To reiterate Sion does well in teamfights because his Q is somewhere between zyra ult/nunu ult, zoning your enemies from going somewhere + forcing them to blow diables on you. WQRQ is also a really strong combo to get off in teamfights.
bluegolisano1 votes
: Slow, High Damadge, very fast.
: Slow, High range, massive AS and AP damadge.
: Goddamn fast, Realy fucking massive AD, short-range TP/Dash
: Slow, high AD, stun
: Knockup, Slow, pokey-harass
THIS TEAMCOMP PROVES SION NOT SO HELPFUL
LordKentravyon1 votesNow I've played a tad of Sion and what about IBG? Armor + CC + A bit of damage that comes with more CC that can be proc'd after your many Qs
Have you tried BorK? I've been doing a bit of IBG + Bork + straight tank so I amnot useless should the carry get caught out and killed when face checking the bush etc... (also active is nice when your dead to help chase someone out of the fight)
Whats your take on them?
Misticaltom7 votesYou should learn how to Tank Towers and push lanes with your team. Sion is one HELL of a Team fighter man. He just eats damage like he's Patrick Star or something.
SpongebobIsLife1 votes+1 for the spongebob reference.
Vicarious1175 votesYeah I was playing Sion top a lot at the start of this season cause he's fun, unique, and can easily win lane against most other top laners.
But you are like 99% reliant on your team not being stupid as fck and being at least relevant gold wise cause you are not going to be able to do anything on your own..... so I stopped playing him so much cause relying on your team in solo Q is simply setting yourself up for failure.
Leti the Yeti2 votesevery support champion ever
Vicarious1172 votesTo be fair the support can at least keep their adc relevant cause they're in lane with them and can as well roam without the threat of losing a tower as easily to help the other lanes out. As Sion top you're kind of stuck in that lane just praying your team does fine until you have TP up.
So yeah, basically the same thing, but at least a support can actively work to avoid the gold deficit lol
Leti the Yeti1 votesyou keep them relevant so long as they arent stupid - w- you still rely on them to get shit dont
HeWolf3 votesIf we are discussing about which lane is more impactful support ot top, top has no way the impact a support can have. Even if the adc is the worst player in the world, a support can completely carry them. We've all done it before.
As Sion top you're kind of stuck in that lane just praying your team does fine until you have TP up.
Just like that you just pray to God. Sion is a pretty good tank tho.
KellenGrace3 votesSion didn't realize that pushing down my tower and going even in farm with me didn't mean he won his lane. He has to maximize that early game lane potential or he's goddamn useless. If you can't win in 25 minutes or less, Sion's a trap. A dirty, chastity-belted trap.
Thefriendlyorc2 votesHis issues are that in order to hit any of your abilities you need a primary initiator. So you're the second string guy that either flanks and forces them a direction or sets up ambushes. Sadly with everyone having a dash or 12 you will hit as many q knock ups as veigar hits his stun.
ABlueQuaker2 votesI've only played a handful of games as Sion, let alone Top Lane Sion, but he's seemed pretty strong at all stages of the game (Example Match: http://matchhistory.oce.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/OC1/79189812/200276954?tab=builds).
Kingsgrave1 votesTeamfights even if I'm 10/0 just feel awful as Sion because all of his abilities are unreliable
Your W is easily popped Your Q is easily dodged Your E isn't as useful as it was in lane because you can't push players Your R is super easy to avoid
Renekton falls off because he goes from high damage to ok damage, like pantheon. Sion falls off because your abilities just don't have any real use to them in full on fights.
I'd rather take Hec, Renek and Mao over Sion top any day in solo queue. Winning lane as Sion is so fucking easy tho Lol
TCU Dushi1 votesTeamfights even if I'm 10/0 just feel awful as Sion because all of his abilities are unreliable
Your W is easily popped Your Q is easily dodged Your E isn't as useful as it was in lane because you can't push players Your R is super easy to avoid
Renekton falls off because he goes from high damage to ok damage, like pantheon. Sion falls off because your abilities just don't have any real use to them in full on fights.
I'd rather take Hec, Renek and Mao over Sion top any day in solo queue. Winning lane as Sion is so fucking easy tho Lol
Your W provides plently of tankyness in the late game because it scales from your hp and you should be at 4.000 hp or higher in the late game
Your Q is best used to follow up on a target that is already cc'ed (R into them to get the easy stun from Q) or you can utilize your Q for zoning the enemy
Your E is a hard slow that shreds the targets armor as well
Your R is almost impossible to avoid giving that you use it point blank. Yes the damage from a max range ult is immense. But your main priority in teamfights is not to deal damage. it's to keep your carries alive and let them deal the damage.
When i play sion i most of the time end up using my ult to point click knock up whoever tries to engage on my carry, follow up with my Q for the stun and hit them with your E as the stun is about to time out. In the meantime you detonate your W and they probably lost half their life from your damage alone.
Sion in teamfights is a beast. You can make sure that multiple targets are unable to reach your carry for 4 seconds total (2.25s Q and 1.75s R) and on top of that a 2.5s slow.
WutsKraken1 votesOh lovely, so even when I'm 9/1/10 as Sion 25 minutes in (the last game I played as him top lane which I lost), even RENEKTON is more useful than me lategame for teamfights?
OhOkYea9 votesPeople who say sion is OP either lag way too much or stand in one spot the whole game.
He's an awesome champ but there are better choices for solo Q. If you're on voice chat with a 5 man team who can utilize sion's abilities properly, then he's amazing.
WutsKraken1 votesGuess you're right. I haven't lost a game as Sion with a premade ever (even as support Sion), but come soloq I do nothing. 90% of the time I'll win lane and be ganking, as in I've killed my lane opponent multiple times and have a massive farm advantage, but if the team never presses the advantage (which happens way too damn much in soloq) then we just insta-lose, arg
ProfDrDeath1 votesSion in the later stages of the game is somewhat difficult - in a teamfight, his abilities are more about the area control than about hitting everything. Consequently, he is not a champion who dives for the fed enemy carry, but rather serves to protect his own ones by meatshielding skillshots and creating safe zones (for example, your ADC can position on your charging Q to doubledare those pesky divers...).
WutsKraken1 votesI've never built full damage on Sion, always really tanky. Issue in soloQ is that I can't count on people to take advantage of the massive amount of CC I have/use.
I've had games where my ADC flashed forward to try and kill the enemy ADC, nothing I could do. I've had games where I've tried to peel for my ADC but the rest of the team lacks the damage to take out the enemy carries, so while I'm protecting my carry from 1 bruiser, the rest of the team is trying to kill the enemy carries but fail
I've never lost a game in a premade with Sion, but come soloQ, logic is thrown out the window, there's always some miscommunication or lack of cooperation because "why da hell isn't the 5/0 Sion carrying?" when they see me take out that assassin like it was nothing
SS Enforcer1 votesSion is a tank. Or, well, he is best used as a tank. As a full tank he is a bit less opressive in lane, but much better later on. I've tried offensive Sion a couple times and sometimes it worked, sometimes it didnt. My last 7 Sion games were won, and i played tank in all of them. In lane it is pretty much impossible to die with him (given that you do not suffer from mental injuries) and later on he's just stronger and stronger because of the hp stacking. It is ridiculous.
NoMonku1 votesSion eventually becomes a fat tank that won't die. You can basically do anything you want without dying, but you won't have the damage output to kill anyone, probably not even the support unless you blow EVERYTHING on them and hit it(and no real reason you'd want to do that imo). In most cases coordinated teams will ignore him and pick the rest of his team off, then go back and finish him 1v5.
Yuki Akuma1 votesAs long as you farm well in your lane and keep decent CS flowing, you can basically have 2 giant's belts with good farm by late game, on TOP of a full build. it's actually really great, because you can afford more flat defensive stats like Frozen Heart and Thornmail and not worry about being melted.
1011001110001 votesBuild Ravenous Hydra as your one damage item, then be as tanky as you want. Then you'll be a bit more threatening :^)
TheRainInSpain1 votesThe way many of the "brawling" bruisers feel, is that they are best in the thick of the fighting: close quarters, horns locked, the only way you're getting out is Ace-ing the enemy team. However, this is not a tactic you want to use against kiting teams or wombo combo teams.
Since your strategy is to brawl, any team that can disengage and kite you to death will win. Your strength is to get on top of the enemy and slaughter them. You can't do that to a hyper mobile team.
Wombo combo teams are likewise very deadly, because you want to group up and jump on the enemy. That's precisely what a wombo combo team wants you to do: group so they can chain five nasty AOE ultimates in your face, ace your team, and take a Nexus turret or Baron.
ThePlasticSpork1 votesSion is a tank. So yeah, lategame he does no damage. He's not supposed to do damage lategame. Really, Sion's damage is actually pretty good for a tank.
Sion's lategame is much better than Renektons just because of his CC. He can tank for longer and disrupt much better than Ren can.
AHeroNamedHawke1 votesIf you're going to play Sion I'd duo with an ADC main that isn't shit
He's one of those top laners that can't do shit in a teamfight alone but is great for peeling
BastionKross1 votesHe's similar to a 
since unless you get unreasonably fed or build lots of offensive items at the cost of your tankiness, you have little damage late game.
However, unlike those three, Sion's CC is unreliable. If you don't have another team member to prime the other team for you, your Q and R are a gamble at best. Hitting someone with a mobile champion with your E is also quite the task. Finally, if your shield gets popped by the enemy, you lose your %HP damage which is the only damage that scales well enough to be relevant at that point in the game.
What ends up happening in the case you don't have an ally to initiate for you to initiate is that you become a peeler. Any ally that stands in your Q might as well be ulted by a 
. It's really odd that someone as bloodthirsty as 
is best used protecting his teammates instead of murdering the enemy team, but that's about the only option you have vs opponents that are crafty enough to avoid your CC.
MrBuffington1 votesI do no damage lategame
Dude. His ult does like 900 base damage in an AoE. Get some CDR and it's on like a 40 second cooldown. R+Q is like a 5 second AoE permastun that does 1200 base damage. You don't need to build damage on him (in fact it's a pretty bad idea). Sion is a monster late game, you just need to know how to use him.
AHeroNamedHawke1 votesDude. His ult does like 900 base damage in an AoE. Get some CDR and it's on like a 40 second cooldown. R+Q is like a 5 second AoE permastun that does 1200 base damage. You don't need to build damage on him (in fact it's a pretty bad idea). Sion is a monster late game, you just need to know how to use him.
Late game the squishiest champion on the enemy team is going to have at least 80 armor (the ADC), and are only taking 660 from a RQ assuming you actually hit them (which doesn't generally happen)
MrBuffington1 votesWhich is still a massive amount of damage and initiation/CC for a super-tank. Again hitting them is a part of "knowing how to use him".
AHeroNamedHawke1 votesWhich is still a massive amount of damage and initiation/CC for a super-tank. Again hitting them is a part of "knowing how to use him".
That kind of stops being your choice late game
Their front line should be body blocking later on, and you can't exactly weave around champions during your ult
MrBuffington1 votesThere are ways around it, TP flanks and some maneuverability still; no it's not going to be 100% but that's the nature of the abilities, high risk high reward, plus that's where the skill of playing Sion comes in. Even if you hit the front line you can basically zone a lot of their team out with your Q since it has a pretty massive AoE. Sion is monsterous in teamfights; no he's not going to be assassinating people, but that's not his role; he's a tank, and he does a ton of damage for a tank.
Gankhard1 votesits 900 true damage+ur ad i think...
SionideCN1 votesStep one: Build a black cleaver
Step two: Build full tank
Step three: Protect your carries
Step four: win
Iittala1 votesSounds like your having must group syndrome. I play galio top quite a bit... no where near as much peel as sion but plenty of utilty.
if your grouping as 5 in ranked and its not a dragon.. your doing it wrong. your team is 4 and under tower.. push top and ping them back. Your E has great wave clear.. and if your team needs help just ult down the river.
I view sions ult typically as a ghost.. or similiar to a galio ult.. hit to disegage at a close range.
Son Olivia Hye1 votesYeah I usually have the same issues that OP has. I do well early game then when its late game I can't do anything. Someone posted that there needs to be another initiator which is true.
SIayton1 votesSion does really good damage if you build him for it. Hydra and Triforce and leave the HP scaling to his passive till then, then get some defensive items. Triforce helps you stick to people with your passive and he generally uses it really well, and hydra makes it so you pretty much take 0 damage clearing. I feel like he's pretty meh when you go full tank since he can't kill people by himself but going a more bruiser oriented build seems to remedy that. I get fed as jungle sion a lot, and this is at plat level, so it atleast works here. If your team NEEDS a tank, you can build tankier but I find in solo queue atleast, its harder to carry games as a tank, since you rely on your teammates too much with an overly tanky build.
Drunk Rummate1 voteshe brings a lot to teamfights, especially in his initiation. the problem is that the rest of your team needs to bring a lot of extra damage to the table to make up for you.
LordOfTheLeague1 votesJust adapt your build to your playstyle. You seems to be like me, you can't play a tank without any damage so just build damage. I do the same with Nautilus and it works wonderfully. You should use things like maw, hydra, frozen mallet and sunfire cape that are semi tank/fighter items. I dunno how it will work but you should try.
DJ Hatsune Miku1 votesI jungle sion a lot and wonder how you do no damage. Even warrior full tank chunks carries with a good q. His ult is amazing engage and roam power and his w does good burst. He's very strong atm and is honestly such an under the radar pick. His top and jungle are very strong and he brings a lot to the table. It won't be long until he takes J4's crown to keep his father's company. Brutalizer items are amazing for him, especially youmuu
4262871 votesConfirms my theory that playing tanks relies too much on trashcan teeammates following up on your play. In high elo its fine but low elo....yeah dont try it and expect to have consistent results.
Droogzy1 votesConfirms my theory that playing tanks relies too much on trashcan teeammates following up on your play. In high elo its fine but low elo....yeah dont try it and expect to have consistent results.
It comes down to the type of tank you use, pure initiator tanks such as Leona and Braum generally don't do well because part of their utility is tied to have a huge initiator which only lasts a few seconds, in which your team needs to respond, but usually don't.
"Extended stay tanks" as I like to call it, such as Rammus does extremely well as a tank in low elo, and I'm sure Sion, if one knows how to play him, can be right there with him, due to the fact they both build so damn tanky due to the nature of their kit. They're able to tank enough damage for the two seconds of hesitancy that your teammates show while still being able to live through the fight.
Spacesuit Spiff1 votesFrom what I've seen of Sion top:
Lose lane, splitpush like a monster Win lane, splitpush like a monster Destroy lane, carry with your hugeness
But if you're in an elo where splitpushing doesn't work because ppl can't do headcounts before they hard engage (aka everything below high gold/plat), he's pretty useless.
Jungle is hard to say, mostly because the handful of strong junglers just push everyone else straight out. I think it deserves to be good, but apparently Nid should be buffed first.
Silents4291 votesI don't understand if your fed, I delete carries, just use your ult at point blank range, Followed by E and Q (half charged at least)
Not that hard as a fed Sion to become a monster to the enemy.
RanmanReborn1 votesSion is one of those champs that even if incredibly fed, just doesn't scare me. There's so many ways around his Q and such. Also, a good split farming and pushing comp can really negate his crowd control and tankiness.
Fiorinol1 votesHaving the same problem with Gnar. Top lane seems like an unreliable place to win a game from with my playstyle.