Boards›Gameplay

Team Vision Score should be implemented to the interface

CoolKnightST··16 votes·5,855 views

Vision Score is something that is recently introduced in the end-game stats. I'm not sure how exactly it's currently calculated but it seems to be a valuable number that reflects the differents between a team that has vision controle and someone we doesn't have it.

A simply update to the interface: https://i.imgur.com/9qyiyFT.png

Often I have seen games lost because lack of vision controle. If you on the winning team and all of a sudden they slowly start to lose their lead it's often by the lack of vision controle. Most players aren't aware of this and start to get frustrated because they aren't aware of the reason they are losing. If the support starts telling them why they are losing. They often just get flamed upon. It's not like they have much proof regarding the issue.

Useally the team with the most vision controle is the one with a lead like this one: https://i.imgur.com/nqatOs1.png

24 Comments

RiotRiot MapleNectar17 votes

We actually have plans to do this! We don't have a set date for it yet, but this is definitely on our list of things to do. I doubt we'd show the enemy teams vision score during the game for reasons like why we're moving towards adjusted cs in the scoreboard for jungle camps, but admittedly we haven't spent too much time thinking about how/what we'd show for vision score, only that we want to implement it somehow.

The Yetii Rider1 votes

That reminds me. I'm confused. So if I take Raptor and four mini raptors, then leave the camp with one mini-Raptor still up, my CS score doesn't increase at all? But if the enemy jungler comes by and kills the one mini I left for him, his CS goes up by 4?

Nefas1 votes

We can already see the enemy team vision score (and for that matter own team vision score) on trinket hover in game. The plan is to take this away?

We can see where enemy wards have been placed, we can see when our wards are destroyed by the enemy team. That’s a lot of the vision score visible already intrinsically in the game itself. Why can’t we keep the number?

50000000000000001 votes

What do you mean? I don't know about this trick.

Nefas1 votes

Hover your cursor over trinket in the tab scoreboard menu - it will give vision score for each player on each team

Mysticman891 votes

I assume it only updates with vision of the player in question, and besides since you can't hover all 5 at once (and theres generally at least 2 potential candidates for people placing a ward that might have spotted you), it's much harder to gain any useful information for a specific players vision score, in contrast with the teamwide vision score.

Nefas1 votes

I highly disagree. It’s quite easy to just hover down each trinket to get the scores. Specific player information is much more valuable. It can give an idea about how much a particular lane is being warded rather than some combined number that doesn’t tell anything specific other than “more or less total vision” which isn’t a helpful stat at all for specific actionable steps just like if total team damage was displayed.

Unless you are talking about trying to catch the moment that a ward sees you and enemy vision score ticks up? That would be such a specific use case that is so fraught with error (what if it’s some other ward some where else seeing someone else? Etc) that I wasn’t considering it

Mysticman891 votes

I was indeed referring to the ward sees you and enemy vision score ticks up situation. It's super impractical under the current circumstances, but with a global team vision score it'd be slightly more viable.

The circumstances would be laning phase ganking most likely, so you generally have eyes on your own team and most of the enemy team, reducing the possibility of false positives. They'd still happen of course, but it's a conceivable usage.

Another scenario is if you're moving as a 5 man squad to baron or something along those lines, and happen to notice the enemy vision score jump as you pass through an area.

I have no particular issue with the current ability of seeing specific players vision scores via trinket hovering, and didn't get the impression they were going to change that.

Nefas1 votes

Ah okay - I guess I could see it. Still think there’s plenty of opportunity for false positives. Five man squad definitely a good point. Still requires a lot of focus on tab though since you pretty much have to keep it up constantly to get a good idea of ward placement and that is a bit dangerous.

I got the impresssion that the Rioter didn’t know about trinket hovering in the first place and was saying that they thought any showing opponent vision score was not good for game health. Could have been mistaken.

LostFr0st1 votes

Why is Player builds gone :( I filed a client bug report, but it being gone makes me pretty sad.

Edit: it's back now. Thank you x100 to whomever brought it back.

Skorch1 votes

Hey Maple Nectar. Im not sure how Vision score is calculated. But is it possible to show the number of vision score for both teams? Since just your team vision score doesnt tell much without a comparison. However, similar to how you can only see current CS of enemies in vision, it only updates every 2 or so minutes. So that most current warding isnt displayed in VS?

IcyPepper1 votes

I doubt we'd show the enemy teams vision score during the game for reasons like why we're moving towards adjusted cs in the scoreboard for jungle camps,

Skorch1 votes

And i responded with why i think they should as well as how to make it NOT like jungle camps... so...?

k wìx2 votes

This is an fantastic idea. It'd be really obvious to tell which team is at a huge vision advantage/disadvantage.

Only problem i see, is that it might give someone insight into how many wards the enemy team has, which is its own problem from a balance perspective.

CoolKnightST1 votes

How I think the value is currently calculated is the amount of time areas are revealed by you. This would make it very difficult to calculate the amount of wards placed. It's not like the cs number of jungle monsters that makes tracking possible.

dunder kill2 votes

Please no. We dont need yet another thing for people to bitch about in game and flame otherS for. As a player I am fully aware if we do or dont have great vision. All this serves is for "WOAW NOOB SUPPORT HALF THEIR VISION SCORE GG"

notice me Sin pi2 votes

i agree with this as long as it doesnt display enemy's vision score

Mysticman891 votes

How vision score works: https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/developer-corner/4Pv0FcII-vision-score-details

I'd have concerns about it giving away information. In particular, paying close attention to vision score as you say, approached for a gank could indicate if you were spotted by a ward, and with coordination people could infer exact ward locations with pretty high accuracy.

And even at a lower level, if a team noticed the enemy team had a high vision score then theres more call to bring out sweepers, while if their vision score sucks people might be more inclined to blues/yellows.

Something like total team gold isn't shown as is, and that's a pretty strong indicator of which side is winning too (and for example might remind people that just because they're up in kills over their lane counterpart doesn't mean they're ahead if they're down 100 cs).

CptBonex1 votes

If you hover over peoples trinkets in the tab score display you can see that players current vision score in the info box that appear. Also if you are interested in learning how vision score works there was a thread about it here: https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/developer-corner/4Pv0FcII-vision-score-details [slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

Teriyaki Bukkake1 votes

Wouldn't it be better if everyone had their own vision score in the scoreboard? An overall score would be nice but it's a little general as to what you actually achieve during the game. If one person isn't using their tinket as much, you'd be able to get them to ward more often!

Fear Justice1 votes

That would be cool xD. I have avg 65 vision score, for me I think its pretty high by playing mid. Would be amazing that others could saw it at interface. They would feel even worse xD [galio-happy] #galioOP

NTrumpWeTrust1 votes

I'm trying to imagine how this is a good tool to let people know that they need to do more in the vision department. If your support is bad at warding/doesn't know how effectively, does this stat help them improve upon that? The short answer is, probably not. If you have this state labeled in game the result will just be people blaming supports for not warding enough while they continue to not buy pinks. A personal vision score would actually be pretty helpful. Your top laner losing and complaining he keeps getting ganked? Just tell him to compare his vision score to the enemy top laner. Ez

CoolKnightST1 votes

Stats are stats, vision is vision. Total Vision score doesn't exactly mean the support is warding poorly. If his teammates doesn't ward it would generate the same result. Vision is a team effort and if that fails everyone is their to blame.

As far not improving goes your not wrong (but also not right). It's like an adc that goes 0-4. On it's own it only indicates that the adc didn't perform compaired to his counterparts but it shows nothing how he can improve besides dieing less, making less mistakes. That's exactly the same with vision score. Knowning you ward poorly won't fix your problem. It only makes you aware of it.

ZT Xperimentor1 votes

What about lifespans? Just curious.

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