Zoe and Vayne have a 50%+ ban rate

cPXt3JHpf4·Jan 23, 2018·106 votes·4,580 views

To all those who are banning them you're doing league a good service thank you

https://media.giphy.com/media/l4HodBpDmoMA5p9bG/giphy.gif

132 Comments

Dankest KhanJan 23, 201854 votes

I have never played against a Zoe and I never will

[sg-ezreal]

Jinx HunterJan 23, 201814 votes

[{quoted}](name=Dankest Khan,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=4EvTILZ3,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2018-01-23T05:00:10.010+0000)

I have never played against a Zoe and I never will

[sg-ezreal]

Then you will never learn. [zombie-brand-clap]

Dankest KhanJan 23, 201837 votes

I dont want to.

I knew she would have a toxic, overloaded kit as soon as I saw her champ spotlight and I was right.

Jinx HunterJan 23, 20188 votes

[{quoted}](name=Dankest Khan,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=4EvTILZ3,comment-id=000300000000,timestamp=2018-01-23T07:28:30.660+0000)

I dont want to.

I knew she would have a toxic, overloaded kit as soon as I saw her champ spotlight and I was right.

http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/32/32202decb2eab6c8f0dcb6043444368dcd470a5e0dcde36396d4486562460498.jpg

Dankest KhanJan 23, 201839 votes

I'm just exercising my right to use the free ban that Rito gave me as I see fit.

LuxMaliceJan 24, 20181 votes

Please note. The one who designed her also created Fizz and Yasuo.

The steam lifeJan 24, 20181 votes

He didn’t create fizz tho

SEKAIJan 23, 20189 votes

[{quoted}](name=Dankest Khan,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=4EvTILZ3,comment-id=000300000000,timestamp=2018-01-23T07:28:30.660+0000)

I dont want to.

I knew she would have a toxic, overloaded kit as soon as I saw her champ spotlight and I was right.

I made threads, or more specifically replies, regarding just how broken her kit is, almost as soon as she was released; I specifically pointed towards her aspects of having a minuscule fail state, bare minimum opportunity and resource cost and management so nothing really stops you from just spamming, and that for some reason her kits also have extreme rewarding factors despite both of those things above which makes her design a very unhealthy disaster from the very get go. I also pointed out her W being overly reliant on RNGesus is also a clear problem given how much Riot and the playerbase as a whole is against that kind of stuff.

I repeated stated that her design is highly, clearly, and fundamentally questionable (just like the vast majority of all CertainlyT's designs, but I digress), if not borderline insane. Guess what I got, bunch of ridicules, and most people believed that it was nothing more than 'bronzies whine' (which is, tbh, given I'm borderline bronze. But I think I'm very justified in this particular whine).

Thank god that people have been finally realising just how much of a problem Zoe is, as a piece of champion design.

But I guess, Zoe is supposed to be arguably the most obnoxious champ ever given her personality so props for immersion? Nah...

TerozuJan 23, 20184 votes

She has the exact opposite of an overloaded kit...

Dankest KhanJan 23, 201810 votes

Spell thief is the single most overloaded ability in the game and offers zero counterplay.

KennysDreamGirlJan 23, 20186 votes

"zero counter play" i guess not pressing f doesnt count

Dankest KhanJan 23, 20184 votes

Spell thief procs on minions. There is literally no counterplay.

It grants more than just free summs btw. Remember the whole RNG gunblade fiasco?

KennysDreamGirlJan 23, 20185 votes

there is plenty of counter play lol. it shows you which minon has it (only one minion might i add not "minions") so you can harass her because you know she will try to go for it.

Votable JesterJan 23, 20183 votes

She also then has to pick up the bubble which always falls away from her (thus usually on your side of the lane) opening up further chances for harass or easy ganks.

Bob the ToastrJan 23, 201837 votes

50% ban rate? Vayne has a 100% ban rate in ALL of my games [slayer-jinx-wink]

SkeletoasterJan 23, 201818 votes

As a toplaner, I feel compelled to ban nasus and just pray that somebody else bans vayne... [zombie-nunu-bummed]

Jinx HunterJan 23, 20182 votes

{quoted}

As a toplaner, I feel compelled to ban nasus and just pray that somebody else bans vayne... [zombie-nunu-bummed]

Personally I rather ban Maokai and Ornn , because if they pick Nasus? I pick DrMundo and spam cleavers at him and kite him anytime he tries to engage. Mundo doesn't give a crap about Nasus, same with Illaoi . She wants nasus to try to face tank her.

IrokaiserJan 23, 20182 votes

Illoai? Dude, you do realize that nasus can stack off of her tentacles right? Fighting against nasus as Illoai would not be a good time. He'll hit his susan spike much faster.

Over InnsmouthJan 23, 201818 votes

https://i.imgur.com/x9dUvCu.jpg

sangeslandJan 23, 201816 votes

They seem to be forgetting ornn :(

D4M2X0Jan 23, 201811 votes

we're balancing the game that riot refuse to balance by banning this shit lmao, shame we dont have more bans -_-

Daddy AntsJan 23, 20186 votes

{quoted}

we're balancing the game that riot refuse to balance by banning this shit lmao, shame we dont have more bans -_-

Yet nerfs are going live tomorrow morning for Vayne.

Shit post rating 10/10

InfernapeJan 23, 20186 votes

-10/20/30 AD off her ult, when her ultimate's AD boost isn't even the problem.

Votable JesterJan 23, 20183 votes

Actually the AD on her ult is quite significant. It made her crit rush that much more powerful.

If you look at an IE crit, that nerf is -25, 50, 75 damage per crit.

ISLAMICWARRIOR99Jan 23, 20184 votes

{quoted}

we're balancing the game that riot refuse to balance by banning this shit lmao, shame we dont have more bans -_-

They already fixed vayne in 8.2 tho lol

Colton147Jan 23, 20187 votes

Zoe has a very high skill ceiling.

nm1010Jan 23, 201843 votes

Yes she does, but her skill floor is currently below sea level she is so accessible. Who needs to utilize her high skill cap when you can just spam e constantly and one shot someone if it actually hits.

Jinx HunterJan 23, 20182 votes

{quoted}

Yes she does, but her skill floor is currently below sea level she is so accessible. Who needs to utilize her high skill cap when you can just >**spam **e **constantly **and one shot someone if it actually hits.

Orianna Xerath Lux Syndra Velkoz

SweedishGunnerJan 23, 201820 votes

You won't stop at anything to keep defending Zoe will you?

abca98Jan 23, 20186 votes

None of those have RNG in their kit. Zoe does. Xerath, Lux and Orianna, as Zoe, have special effects on their autoattacks. The difference is that Zoe has a blink to auto you and go back faster than you can answer. Vel' Koz true damage works through stacks. Syndra needs to stack Q's before using R ( still a pain in the neck anyway). They need ap before they start waveclearing too. And also they have real cd's and mana costs.

Jinx HunterJan 23, 20184 votes

{quoted}

None of those have RNG in their kit. Zoe does. Xerath, Lux and Orianna, as Zoe, have special effects on their autoattacks. The difference is that Zoe has a blink to auto you and go back faster than you can answer. Vel' Koz true damage works through stacks. Syndra needs to stack Q's before using R ( still a pain in the neck anyway). They need ap before they start waveclearing too. And also they have real cd's and mana costs.

At this point your just you are just naming things in a champions kit you don't like.

If Zoe uses her ulty to poke you with passive? Then she is an idiot and if you have a brain you should target her return spot since you know where and when she will be in about a sec. This is beyond easy to punish especially considering how squish she is. She only gets Actives that you allow her to get and if you know anything at all about how to lane properly, you can make her pay very severally if she tries for an active. Again, you know where she is going and you can easily punish her because you know where she has to walk if she wants her active, if she uses ulty, you do the same as I stated first. Nuke the hell out of her return point.

Now you are just whining. Most of those can wave clear the exact same as Zoe with no AP. Add to it Zoe only has 1, count them ONE tool to use for waive clear, where most of the others have 2 or more. Also no one has mana issues atm due to mana flow and lost chapter. Not just Zoe, nice try.

Now you are just complaining to complain. Her paddle star is suppose to have a lowish cool. E has a COOLDOWN: 16 / 15. 5 / 15 / 14. 5 / 14 and is useless for waves, R has a COOLDOWN: 11 / 8 / 5 and has no damage and you don't start with an ultimate anyways, W's cool down is based on if you blew summons's, If you haven't used any summons's, she gets one every 2 waves or so and that's about 30 secs and its basically a worse Ahri W aside from the random actives she can get add to its its always leveled last because it does shit damage and is only used for its passive.

You are given more then enough time to work around her and kill her just like any other burst mage. Stop making excuses for being bad, and learn to play and stop asking riot to nerf things you refuse to learn to play against. In other words. Git Gud. Zoe has counter play. Unlike cancer like Vayne Akali and their point and clicks. So stop crying and get good. [zombie-brand-clap]

VardenSaladJan 23, 20187 votes

>Lux >waveclearing for less than 200 mana before you get Luden's

The only mage in the game required to take Minion Dematerializer to one shot the back-line. At 130 mana per E.

Pika FoxJan 23, 20182 votes

I love how you decided to tell people the truth in that you can actually play against Zoe properly if you try to actually learn her kit instead of complaining and got downvoted into oblivion.

Zoe is balanced and hated similar to Zed, but id still say both zed and leblanc are far more toxic of a design than zoe could ever be. At least zoe has clear weaknesses you can play around and has limited mobility; Zed and leblanc just dash everywhere and unless youve actually played them and are good at them its difficult to tell wtf theyre gunna do.

Zoe is pretty simple; she hates fighting at close range, everything is blocked by minions, and her W cant be used unless you use a summoner, or she manages to last hit a minion with the bubble that you can see and punish and prevent her from even getting it to drop. Not to mention Cleanse/Mikaels/QSS pretty heavily hurts her as she becomes really predictable once she sleeps you

Jinx HunterJan 24, 20183 votes

[{quoted}](name=Pika Fox,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=4EvTILZ3,comment-id=000200020000000100000001,timestamp=2018-01-23T19:45:39.899+0000)

I love how you decided to tell people the truth in that you can actually play against Zoe properly if you try to actually learn her kit instead of complaining and got downvoted into oblivion.

Zoe is balanced and hated similar to Zed, but id still say both zed and leblanc are far more toxic of a design than zoe could ever be. At least zoe has clear weaknesses you can play around and has limited mobility; Zed and leblanc just dash everywhere and unless youve actually played them and are good at them its difficult to tell wtf theyre gunna do.

Zoe is pretty simple; she hates fighting at close range, everything is blocked by minions, and her W cant be used unless you use a summoner, or she manages to last hit a minion with the bubble that you can see and punish and prevent her from even getting it to drop. Not to mention Cleanse/Mikaels/QSS pretty heavily hurts her as she becomes really predictable once she sleeps you

Just par for the course. People like to complain and not admit they don't know how to play against something. Easier to call it OP. That's not to say their aren't legit broken champs, but Zoe isn't one of them, she is just new. That and because of the ban spam, no one has gotten the chance to learn how to play against her correctly.

If you check most of the profiles of those that are raging here you will find marksmen players and maybe 1 or two mid players. So really its just bad mids and your regular marksmen players (they are the reason why people hate marksmen players in general) whining as usual when something kills them. I mean I don't care about the down votes. I told the truth, if they don't want to listen? Then its their loss and they will never grow as a player. Doesn't hurt me one bit if they want to keep being ignorant, they are just hurting themselves in the end and making themselves look foolish all because they are too prideful to admit they made mistakes and they don't know how to beat her. [sg-ahri-2]

LordGeovanniJan 24, 20182 votes

[{quoted}](name=Jinx Hunter,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=4EvTILZ3,comment-id=0002000200000001000000010000,timestamp=2018-01-24T05:03:42.608+0000)

Just par for the course. People like to complain and not admit they don't know how to play against something. Easier to call it OP. That's not to say their aren't legit broken champs, but Zoe isn't one of them, she is just new. That and because of the ban spam, no one has gotten the chance to learn how to play against her correctly.

If you check most of the profiles of those that are raging here you will find marksmen players and maybe 1 or two mid players. So really its just bad mids and your regular marksmen players (they are the reason why people hate marksmen players in general) whining as usual when something kills them. I mean I don't care about the down votes. I told the truth, if they don't want to listen? Then its their loss and they will never grow as a player. Doesn't hurt me one bit if they want to keep being ignorant, they are just hurting themselves in the end and making themselves look foolish all because they are too prideful to admit they made mistakes and they don't know how to beat her. [sg-ahri-2]

Its not that people dont know how to play against champions its that some champions take playing against them much more often than other in the case of zoe. She has a nuke on a super short cooldown so you have to run out of her range when she is ready to fire it but by time you come back to farm or punish her her next one is only 2 seconds away and you have to start running out of her range again. I agree people who play squishy carries complain that things kill them alot but i main bruisers and I fare no better when i get 70% of my hp chunked before i even get in range what am i supposed to do. I can dodge some of them but I also have cant catch anyone if it do because all of my movement speed is reliant on hitting the enemy with phage or running at the enemy and hitting them the losing it all with dead mans plate same with righteous glory but ranged carries all have items with permanent ambient movement speed with no conditions. They also get movement speed / dash abilities that help them to kite initially and excape when they do get caught that is ignoring all the cc they have too. They have better slows / roots values than tanks because its deemed balanced because they are skill shots versus other ranged champions and while still skill shots versus melee champions much less skill because melee champions have to run directly at you to have any chance in hell of catching you.

Pika FoxJan 24, 20181 votes

Zoe has some range, but also zero mobility. Her only mobility access is rng on W or summoners, and you can play against her RNG mechanic.

That said; if Zoe doesnt land E, and youre actively running at her, she will be hard pressed to deal even 30% of a tanky champ's HP with just Q unless she has been incredibly fed. Running at her reduces Q damage significantly, and people really underestimate just how much of Zoe's damage is actually from her E, not her Q. And once you get to her, shes pretty much stuck.

Champs like Malph and Jarvan are pretty popular atm, and both pretty well counter Zoe as they have engage strong enough that Zoe's range is largely irrelevant. She has to either flash the engage, or pray she predicts it and dodges with ult (not easy to do, but also puts her right back where she was anyway)

LordGeovanniJan 26, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Pika Fox,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=4EvTILZ3,comment-id=000200020000000100000001000000000000,timestamp=2018-01-24T21:00:54.158+0000)

Zoe has some range, but also zero mobility. Her only mobility access is rng on W or summoners, and you can play against her RNG mechanic.

That said; if Zoe doesnt land E, and youre actively running at her, she will be hard pressed to deal even 30% of a tanky champ's HP with just Q unless she has been incredibly fed. Running at her reduces Q damage significantly, and people really underestimate just how much of Zoe's damage is actually from her E, not her Q. And once you get to her, shes pretty much stuck.

Champs like Malph and Jarvan are pretty popular atm, and both pretty well counter Zoe as they have engage strong enough that Zoe's range is largely irrelevant. She has to either flash the engage, or pray she predicts it and dodges with ult (not easy to do, but also puts her right back where she was anyway)

Zoe has no mobility she only has a summoner spell ghost attatched to her w every time she procs it ignoreing that it stores flashes which is typically an easy 30% drop rate and held out of any other thing she can pick up and her q forces flashes or deaths off of cooldown. with her low cooldown low mana cost spells

Pika FoxJan 26, 20181 votes

W requires you to either use a summoner yourself and then have her walk to that spot, or have her last hit a minion with a bubble and walk over to said spot again. And then she gets RNG as to what that actually even dropped.

And if she Rs onto that spot? Congrats, she telegraphed where she is now going to be in a second, and you can punish her heavily for that.

Her Q alone doesnt force a "flash or death". Its thin and predictable, and if youre near minions they will eat it for you, or you can just walk at her and it wont hurt anymore than any other mage's spell (it will even hurt less, given its main damage boosts arent backing it, being her E and range)

Seriously, its annoying having everyone hyperbolize her as some god who can just QQ 100-0 you full tank 60 mins in with 0 CS. Either learn to play against her clear and apparent weaknesses, or continue to die to her because you refuse to acknowledge said weaknesses in her kit and the outplay potential you gave against her.

LordGeovanniJan 26, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Pika Fox,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=4EvTILZ3,comment-id=00020002000000010000000100000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-01-26T08:23:13.669+0000)

W requires you to either use a summoner yourself and then have her walk to that spot, or have her last hit a minion with a bubble and walk over to said spot again. And then she gets RNG as to what that actually even dropped.

And if she Rs onto that spot? Congrats, she telegraphed where she is now going to be in a second, and you can punish her heavily for that.

Her Q alone doesnt force a "flash or death". Its thin and predictable, and if youre near minions they will eat it for you, or you can just walk at her and it wont hurt anymore than any other mage's spell (it will even hurt less, given its main damage boosts arent backing it, being her E and range)

Seriously, its annoying having everyone hyperbolize her as some god who can just QQ 100-0 you full tank 60 mins in with 0 CS. Either learn to play against her clear and apparent weaknesses, or continue to die to her because you refuse to acknowledge said weaknesses in her kit and the outplay potential you gave against her.

Zoe's W procs off of her own flash too and other spell. Thank goodness it leaves out her item slot uses.

Your R punishment assumes that you are also ranged like Zoe or have a blink like zoe. after ward she still has her new w spells which she can use for the movement speed damage and what ever other effect is in the slot (ignoring that she can q when R ing forward and E once forward so punish that) Zoe's E damage is minuscule the main problem is that her e sleeps you for so long and zoe's Q range does lots of her damage so unless you can get to less than half her auto attack range in less than 1 second you can keep that dream of her Q doing less than half your hp if you have magic resist and less than 70% of your hp if you dont to your self. No one here has said that she 100-0s a tank even full tank her q's chunk more than 30% of your hp with 2 magic resist items thats why for everyone else building less max hp and less magic resist its much more. Full tanks cant afford to go more than 2 magic resist items with how adcs are running around crit shotting everyone much less any fighter. Its more fair to adcs because adcs can kill you in less than a second from range too but people have been calling those champions bs too. People dont like getting 1 shot which is why assassins were nerfed from season 4 up until preseason 7 much less getting 1 shot from far range with safe ranged back line characters when you have defenses. people like you pretend like zoe's rng doesnt drop flashes all the time on top of her having her own if anyone ever jumps on her

Pika FoxJan 26, 20181 votes

She still uses up her own flash to activate Ws ghost. Even then, you still blew her flash. Thats a successful gank and now she literally has 0 mobility for multiple minutes.

Literally every single champion mid either has the mobility or range to punish zoe. Almost every champion in the game has some form of dash or engage. Jarvan is the most popular jungler atm, and he practically hard counters Zoe. Malphite is one of the stronger tops atm, and he does the same. Not only does mid have so many ways to punish her, the 2 other roles who would likely gank her also have multiple options to do so.

Q wont deal 30% of your HP unless she uses it at max range, in which case she has no real follow up til Q is back off CD. Plus its literally your own fault for not dodging the predictable skillshot. Either way, you have the opportunity to punish her or her team.

And again, zoe doesnt 1 shot you. Unless she uses E and R, shes unlikely to kill anyone. She just used 3 abilities. Literally ANY mage that hits an ADC with a 3 ability combo will kill them. Thats not "1 shot". Thats 3 shot.

And i dont care if her RNG gives her only flashes. You. Can. Play. Against. It. She still has to last hit the minion to even get it to drop, so you can either keep her off that minion, or punish her for it. THEN she has to actually walk over to it or R onto it. BOTH of which can be punished.

LordGeovanniFeb 1, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Pika Fox,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=4EvTILZ3,comment-id=0002000200000001000000010000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-01-26T20:31:46.965+0000)

She still uses up her own flash to activate Ws ghost. Even then, you still blew her flash. Thats a successful gank and now she literally has 0 mobility for multiple minutes.

Literally every single champion mid either has the mobility or range to punish zoe. Almost every champion in the game has some form of dash or engage. Jarvan is the most popular jungler atm, and he practically hard counters Zoe. Malphite is one of the stronger tops atm, and he does the same. Not only does mid have so many ways to punish her, the 2 other roles who would likely gank her also have multiple options to do so.

Q wont deal 30% of your HP unless she uses it at max range, in which case she has no real follow up til Q is back off CD. Plus its literally your own fault for not dodging the predictable skillshot. Either way, you have the opportunity to punish her or her team.

And again, zoe doesnt 1 shot you. Unless she uses E and R, shes unlikely to kill anyone. She just used 3 abilities. Literally ANY mage that hits an ADC with a 3 ability combo will kill them. Thats not "1 shot". Thats 3 shot.

And i dont care if her RNG gives her only flashes. You. Can. Play. Against. It. She still has to last hit the minion to even get it to drop, so you can either keep her off that minion, or punish her for it. THEN she has to actually walk over to it or R onto it. BOTH of which can be punished.

this would be true if any summoner spell or activation of her w didnt give her ghost movment speed and the possibility of another flash, ghost, heal.

CowseedJan 23, 20182 votes

Absolutely false. She's so easily countered that you have to really suck to be abused by a bad one.

nm1010Jan 23, 20184 votes

Any specific reason you say that? Because she is 100% too easy to do well with right now, but I'm curious what you think makes her "easily countered".

CowseedJan 23, 20182 votes

Unless she's really creative with misdirecting the Q you can't dodge 4/5 of them by just standing close to your minions and repositioning appropriately when she casts the first part of it.

Her sleep shouldn't be problematic unless she's taking a long shot from the dark through a wall and if it misses then there isn't too much to worry about because the trap gets popped by anything with a hitbox.

As for her W, outside of minions just don't use summoners and your golden

nm1010Jan 23, 20181 votes

Unless she's really creative with misdirecting the Q you can't dodge 4/5 of them by just standing close to your minions and repositioning appropriately when she casts the first part of it.

Mid-late game mage has trouble harassing in lane, while this is true her q has a fairly low cool down and not all champions can meaningfully punish her in the time it takes to come up. Note her laning phase is her weakest point, but that is not the problem I have with her. Even with this being her weakest point a q auto q auto trade is not bad and if she has a combat summoner she can all in off of an e hit super easily.

Her sleep shouldn't be problematic unless she's taking a long shot from the dark through a wall and if it misses then there isn't too much to worry about because the trap gets popped by anything with a hitbox.

2 second soft cc with a 2 second hard cc + damage amp. This has a 2-3 second or less down time with 45% cdr even when missed, this is absolutely broken. Get blue buff and spam this over the wall every 5 seconds, if you actually hit someone you kill them if they are squishy or chunk them to 50% on a tank.

As for her W, outside of minions just don't use summoners and your golden

Just don't use your summoners is an excellent tip, never mind the fact a good Zoe can force summoner trades then take yours.

As for the guy that said banshees, doesn't luden's echo pop it? Super easy to just r q q to proc it off splash damage on a minion line or q q r over a wall.

CowseedJan 23, 20181 votes

In lane if she spams Q then she's gonna go OOM pretty quick. In team fights when she's spamming it, just dodge. It shows you exactly where it's going. It's not that hard to predict outside of that either. If she Rs then you know what's she's about to do so just be careful.

I'm going to address the sleep point last.

Zoe cannot force a trade of summoners. She is the least mobile character in the game outside of stealing actives and flash. She roots herself. She opens up a portal before she blinks so you know where she's going and she is going exactly where she came from. Unless it's a gank she can NOT force you to flash without you having a LOT of other options.

Now to address the sleep issue that you seem to be having. I just went into the practice tool. Got 40% CDR because I couldn't bother changing runes. I ended up with 8.4 sec cooldown on E.

Because you didn't even fact check that bold statement you made I'm pretty much done here. You're heavily biased and didn't even check on the stats of the champion you hate so much. I assume you are unwilling to actually try to learn how to play against her. All you ever seem to be focused on is her strengths and even exaggerate a few of them some what

...chunk them to 50% on a tank.

Good bye.

nm1010Jan 24, 20183 votes

This is why people don't take players like you seriously.

In lane if she spams Q then she's gonna go OOM pretty quick.

Mid-late... Get blue buff and spam this over the wall

I never talked about spamming q in lane, or at all, I talked about e with blue buff so stop making up arguments.

If she Rs then you know what's she's about to do so just be careful.

Let me guess, you didn't know she can cast q q and then r? You don't see her portal or the extended q range until a fraction of a second before it hits. Let me refer you to the person who found this combo

https://youtu.be/v5Bw6kjQUVw

Oh look that's me LOL

Zoe cannot force a trade of summoners.

Flash e as you go for a last hit, especially if your jungle is there the enemy will flash/heal/ect. and you get to pick them up.

She is the least mobile character

Free 10-70% movespeed after summoner/w use plus very long range vs something like Karthus . Tell me how she is less mobile? Also 340 base ms on a mage is pretty high.

Got 40% CDR because I couldn't bother changing runes. I ended up with 8.4 sec cooldown on E.

Holy FUCK man you literally admit you didn't do what I said, AND THEN BITCHED ABOUT IT.

2-3 second or less down time with** 45% cdr** even when missed,

7.7 second cool down .5-1.5 seconds of travel time, .8 seconds of arm time, 4 second trap. assuming an almost immediate miss you get 2.4 seconds of down time.

As for your assumptions in the final paragraph, maybe you should ask if I play against her?

https://i.gyazo.com/c94fab2b0d2ff8cd9843bac3c0bc793c.png

I am fully aware of how strong she is, I do not ban her and I played a TON of her on the PBE before the 60%+ ban rate release. As I said her E is absolutely far too strong in its current iteration and makes her brain dead to play. Up the damage on her q or give her more w damage to compensate but her e uptime when she misses is ABSOLUTELY RIDICULOUS.

Good bye.

Assuming no runes, pen, or lich bane procs, an e into q combo with luden's @ lvl13 is 1205 post mitigation damage on a tank. Assuming 1 non mr hp item + one mr item that comes out to 1205/2434 hp on a Malphite or 49.5% of his health. Any other smart ass comments?

The steam lifeJan 24, 20181 votes

If her skill floor was low she wouldn’t have a low winrate considering everyone knows she’s broken. I’m not saying she isn’t broken but it’s untrue that her skill floor is low.