http://champion.gg/champion/Hecarim/Jungle
Can't farm, can't tank, can't do damage. What is he good for?
Even though the builds used are quite suboptimal, I still think that Hecarim is right now the weakest jungler in the game.
Dominick Destine2 votes
BluePolarizer1 votesover 50% win rate vs. lowest win rate in the game. 2nd least deaths of all junglers. 5th most assists. Top 10 damage tanked. Full build requires 1000 less gold. Sejuani and Hecarim aren't just not in the same league, they aren't even playing the same game.
TehNACHO1 votesActually, all his combat stats are just about average according to champion.gg
What I then assume is that Hecarims has weak objective control. He fights only on par relative to other Junglers but lacks the ability to actually contribute well to taking down towers/epic monsters, severely damaging his ability to win game.
BluePolarizer1 voteshe does nothing to epic monsters but eats towers easily. the thing is, other junglers might not be as good in pushing but do monsters far better or have way better ganks or scale way better.
Espy Psyche1 votesI think the real problem with Hecarim is that the items that carry movement speed also carry attack speed and crit instead of attack damage. If there was an item that gives AD, movement speed, and maybe like Armor Penetration or CDR, that would greatly buff Hecarim. That assassin's dagger Riot mentioned would be really strong on him. He doesn't have the itemization he really wants.
BluePolarizer1 votesnot sure about the assassin dagger. hec can't afford too many damage items and right now there is no competitor to the Trinity of maw, triforce and ghostblade.
EndlessSorcerer2 votesIf there was an item that gives AD, movement speed, and maybe like Armor Penetration or CDR, that would greatly buff Hecarim.
Crossette1 votesHecarim's amazing.
Winrates don't mean anything.
Play a few games with him and see how they go. (except this meta is absolute fucking shit)
BluePolarizer1 votesI'm a hecarim main with hundreds of ranked games and ended s5 plat 1 with hecarim.
Crossette1 votesIf you main him and do well with him, why the anger over him being slightly worse than other junglers?
Personally, I really enjoy him and do well when I do play him.
BluePolarizer1 votesbecause I dropped after continuing to use him. he is the worst jungler in the game.
Crossette2 votesThat's overstating it.
He's good for people who can adapt to the way they need to play against the meta, as all champions.
People said 
was shit and then people actually started playing him and winning
EcchiOtakuTM1 votescause keystones, doesn't change that the first rework ruined him
Crossette1 votesI meant before the mastery change.
People think he's good now.
EcchiOtakuTM1 votesWell he was my main before the rework but since htere's an incoming rework for him soon anyways we'll see what's in store. Whether it'll fix issues of not being able to stick on a target in order to use the passive or knowing rito screw it up for implement some major flaw (Still upset shen has no ranged damage tool)
ValyrianBlade1 votesI agree.
Hecarim is still my second-highest masteried champion in league.
I never play him anymore. He's been weak for a while now. S6 nerfs just made him a lot worse. He spent some time at the top, Riot overnerfed him, then subsequently implemented s6 changes which all went hard against him (masteries, new jungle, itemization... you name it, everything was bad for Hecarim) and instead of giving him compensation buffs they nerfed him further.
His first clear is weak, so he can't exert pressure on lanes early. That's likely where his poor win rate comes from, games are snowbally and Hecarim can't help a losing lane early on. At least after his nerfs in S5 I could do a full clear, base to buy stalkers and boots, then TP for a countergank or run towards wolves/raptors and be ready to countergank 2 lanes while continuing to farm. Now the best I can do is base for the hunter's machete and maybe 150g for pots, then go back to farming for my jungle item.
Hecarim's kit is fine. If his lanes don't fall behind, he's good. Which is why people will defend that he's fine because losses "aren't his fault". Thing is, junglers need one of two things: early presence, or late-game carrying ability. Hecarim is a snowbally champion so throw out the late-game carry, he needs early presence and has none.
Troiann1 votesHe's not the worst. The worst jungler wouldn't have over 50% winrate once you have more than 50 games with him.
He's outclassed by mundo, jax, rammus as a jungler but he's still pretty good.
BluePolarizer1 votesand Sejuani/Volibear/Kha'Zix.
The typical win rate for a main with 125+ games on a champ is 55%. Hecarim requires 125+ games to just not be trash. Why don't I just play Volibear and get a higher win rate than a 125+ game Hecarim main?
Troiann1 votesBecause Hecarim is more fun.
I mean.
yeah Voli's really fucking strong atm but Hecarim is far from being as awful as you claim he is.
BluePolarizer1 votesKha'Zix is both better and more fun than Hecarim right now. No reason to pick Hecarim.
It's not me that says he's awful. He's objectively awful. I have to have 500+ games on him just to not feed.
EcchiOtakuTM1 votesHecarim is by no means the worst, sure atm he's suffering because it's a tank/mage meta while he's an assassin but the amount of sustain, team disruption and solo target kill potential he has is immense. just needs slight buffing which hopefully riot will do since the heavy passive nerf(tbh I wished they would buff the passive to actually be scaleable)
BluePolarizer1 votesLMAO Hecarim is nowhere NEAR an assassin. He is a fighter/tank. The only way he can "assassinate" is homeguards TP and even a Lichbane Maokai does it better. Did you know that mathematically his 3 second burst is on par with such bursty assassins as Maokai and Blitzcrank? He has near ZERO solo kill potential against assassins or any fighters.
Do you think that I play Hecarim for 500+ ranked games in plat and don't know what he can do?
EcchiOtakuTM1 votesHe's a Bruiser(fighter)/Assassin he's nowhere near a tank especially after the nerfs.
His entire playstyle is burst a squishy in 1 second then disengage. Only using your ulti if they use an escape/disengage (While if they use both like trist or hourglass you just back off and wait to ulti or ulti to engage and burst them before they recover). He's not hard to learn but people who use other champs tend to forget how to play hecarimon a regular basis.
I cringed when after the hecarim nerf people took flash when even before the nerf he's suppose to always ghost. Not saying that the nerf was justified since riot decided to screw up minion pathing and collision in general then nerf poor hecarim for it.
BluePolarizer1 votestell me how building full damage on Hecarim goes lol.
EcchiOtakuTM1 votes? Why would you have to build full damage for an assassin
You just build swift, warrior, triforce, deadman,visage,death dance dive bomb a squishy then run away. Assassination complete. You don't play hecarim and just stand in combat like a bruiser or tank you go in get out typical assassin playstyle. Assassin never = full damage, it just means how you should play said champ hence why some non-full damage champs are still assassins because
Their playstyle is to get in take out a target and get out
They use something heavy then have nothing to do the same exact thing to another target right after
They can curve a game to their favor but not heavily carry a game unless the enemy team is just letting them snowball or they're doing godlike pick plays
They don't just stay in combat while tanking/off tanking or building up damage while in combat
You usually build damage
(Melee carries and marksmen aside from quinn aren't assassins because they're suppose to be able to destroy an entire team with heavy scalings with crit the only reason quinn is an assassin is quinn can only burst 1 person in .25 seconds then has to back off to do it again or use filler AAs)
Aside from this I don't know any assassin who doesn't fit this,
BluePolarizer1 voteskeep telling me how to play Hecarim when you are bronze tier and play mostly bots and arams. keep telling me that's the way to play hecarim in plat+ lol. these forums seriously need to be rank gated otherwise you get idiotic assertions like Hecarim = Assassin hurr durr.
EcchiOtakuTM1 votesSigh guess there was no point trying to talk to a dumbass who thinks hecarim is suppose to tank an enemy team.
Illgore1 votesimho adapting to the new jungle is the real problem here (i had the same, especially after 1 year lol break^^). I did tons of bot games (with almost all heroes I have) just to draw myself a picture of the new jungle and how to handle the first clear/minutes.
My conclusion is, that many heroes who are used to full clear on their first run can't accomplish this anymore at all or only with sacrifices (jungle optimized masteries without mastery keystone). Hecarim is one of them. So what to can/should you make out of it as Hecarim?
a) you can go 12/6/12 - attackspeed marks - armor seal - MR glyph - Lifesteal Quints http://gameinfo.euw.leagueoflegends.com/en/game-info/summoners/masteries/#HnDPypVao.3ZNwanqDV.2HXESg00 this will enable you a fullclear and leave you after the Rift Scuttler with enough HP & MP left for one gank attempt
b) go for a more fitting mastery and runepage build for Hecarim and don't full clear in the first run. Which mean a lvl 3 gank attempt after 3 jungle camps. Imho this should be the more valuable way, cause Hecarim can gain so much power from the new mastery keystones.
Imho one you get the hang how to get the first minutes going, Hecarim should be a Nightmare in the hands of a good player with the new meta. It's just the start where he is risky (a bit like lee sin, but you are more gank addicted since of bad early clear).
What the new meta has for Hecarim:
Further I rarely see Hecarim players build Zz'Rot Portal, which is an insanely good item imho for him. Gives him the defensive stats needed to initiate teamfights (armor + MR). Further the Point Runner passive makes his lane ganks more deadly, allows even safer splittpushing and escaping when his charge is on CD. In the enemy base it gets really funny for Hecarim with his passive in the endgame.
Pls don't give him up, just because his early clear is bad and his early play is risky. Imho it is worth when you see how badass he can be now in endgame. I would really like to see more pro play Hecarim. I just think he is underrated and played my to many noobs who just fail at him, because of his high skillcap.
BluePolarizer1 votesI don't build him cookie cutter. I can clear the jungle without even using 3 pots with my runes and masteries that don't give up a keystone. I don't know where you get the idea that he's a bad clearer. On the other hand you will be weak after 3 camps and a gank is way riskier than just clearing for your smite item.
It's his mid and late game that is precisely where he is weak. He lost 10% of his tankiness for nothing.
Illgore1 votesimho he gained tankiness when you go for Windspeakers Blessing and Runic Armor combo and max W 2nd. It makes him incredible tanky in any teamfights. Add Zz'Rot Portal and you are ready to go to initiate any mid/lategame fights.
BluePolarizer1 votesWindspeaker's is useless for him. He only uses 1/3 the effect.
Illgore1 votesWindspeaker's is useless for him. He only uses 1/3 the effect.
He may only make use of 1/3 of it's effects, but you take it for the same reason you take Spirit Visage. Spirit Visage increases your Healing by 20% and you can already start with 18% from the right masteries (adding Runic Armor), accumulating to 38% increased heal (for W). U can't tell me that this is useless. Maybe in the earliest lvls, but since you pointed out mid/lategame, it will give you the tankiness that you are atm missing on Hec. ;)
Hecarims W is so powerfull that you take anything that increases the heal. That's the reason why Spirit Visage is so mandatory on him. And now you wanna tell me that a keystone with half that amount is useless?
Pls give it a try and see how it works out for you. You are complaining about lost tankiness and don't take the best defensive mastery for Hecarim, do you get what I mean? ;)
BluePolarizer1 votesYou lose tankiness for nothing. If you take that then Hecarim loses damage, do you get what I mean? It's always a loss either way.
Also, an extra 10% on his W from Windspeakers amounts to 2% extra heal. Guess what - Strength of Ages is literally 100x better than that.
All you are proving is that Hecarim is indeed the worst jungler in the game. I have 500+ games of experience on Hecarim in plat level ranked, so I am not just saying this because I played Hecarim for 1 game and lost. My last Hecarim games were wins. I am saying this because Hecarim is objectively bad and I could've won even harder with any other jungler.
AlwaysByMySide1 votesimho he gained tankiness when you go for Windspeakers Blessing
No.
PDE5 Inhibitors1 votesUh? He is actually rated 39/46...
Tourian1 votesPlayed Hecarim for the first time in a while, and aside from relatively slow clears, he feels good to me. Second highest played champ.
BluePolarizer1 voteswhat elo? ranked or normals?
He isn't good in plat+ ranked.