then why the hell i need to be out of battle for 4 seconds with caster minions? If the keystone works only against enemy champions should it not be "out of battle with enemy champions for X seconds"?
Done258 votesPersonally I wish it was "Don't auto attack for four seconds."
Daddy Ants5 votesPersonally I wish it was "Don't auto attack for four seconds."
That's basically what it is.
You cannot attack ANYTHING at all for 4 seconds.
Sire Hippington1 votesYes, but that alone wouldn't be to bad, the issue is that if you get hit by (caster minions), it also resets the timer, or if you use a dot or recive a dot.(
has a horrible anti-synergie with HoB)
If you go for a trade, you usually get minion agro, and it needs quite some time till you drop agro and the last caster missle did reach you, and after that it's another 4sec of not AAing(or otherwise hitting) anything.
Daddy Ants5 votesthen why the hell i need to be out of battle for 4 seconds with caster minions? If the keystone works only against enemy champions should it not be "out of battle with enemy champions for X seconds"?
Completely agree.
The fact you got to stop CS'ing to get your keystone back is stupid imo.
Rathar Dashing9 votesI think that's a perfect trade-off for having your burst keystone up every 4 seconds, as opposed to every 25 for Electrocute, 45 for Dark Harvest, and 150 for Predator.
Daddy Ants1 votes[{quoted}](name=Rathar Dashing,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=2pLbePXy,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2019-02-02T18:39:22.640+0000)
I think that's a perfect trade-off for having your burst keystone up every 4 seconds, as opposed to every 25 for Electrocute, 45 for Dark Harvest, and 150 for Predator.
None of those keystones require you to stop farming to get it back up.
Needs changing to out of combat with champions.
Rathar Dashing3 votesYou can stop AAing for 4 seconds, you're not going to miss out on CS. If you are, then take the CS and wait another 4 seconds at a better time, you'll still be using HoB more often than any other burst keystone.
Saevum1 votesYep, pretty much like old ashe passive.
Deez Crits4 votesI would assume it's due to balance issues. There's a big difference between having to be out of combat to refresh the buff as opposed to having to be out of combat vs. champions.
If they changed it so that you only had to be out of combat with champions, it becomes easier to have access to Hail of Blades for trading and there are fewer windows of weakness for the enemies to take advantage of.
With the way it works currently, it also means you might have more difficulty with wave management because you have to make a choice between pushing the wave vs. holding off to wait for the the buff to refresh.
I'm not here to argue what the refresh mechanic should be. However, arguments about how things should change must always revolve around balance. Your initial point applies logic, but with no context of balance implications.
As a final minor note, Hail of Blades might only proc on champions, but you can still utilize the attack speed to hit minions. I bring this up simply since we could discuss/decide what 'works' means in your title for the sake of your argument.
Sire Hippington1 votesI think early on it's fine, they'd need to heavily nerf the early AS numbers on it other wise or it would be to strong in lane. However, they could change it to ignore minions and monsters at some point, either lvl 11 like Garens passive or maybe after 14min, when the turret plateing comes of and laneing is kinda 'officially' over Or they need to increase the required time out of combat quite a bit at early lvls.
FCJAAAAGOOOO1 votesHail of Blades sounds busted on a ranged support in duo lanes, actually. So long as they're marksmen/at least hybrid I guess. Heck maybe it's fine on some mages.
hrooza dota 1 votesgive it a real cool down then i will agree
Metal Janna1 votesI like HoB on 
support because the nearly double DPS really makes engage champs like 
think twice about walking past the minions and tanking the damage to get their CC in.
I imagine it would work the same on 
because she also has a passive that adds damage to her autos.
