"Guys hurry, their RYZE IS SUPER LOW, WE CAN WIN! :D"

Ben Sharpio·Dec 21, 2016·37 votes·4,012 views

http://i.imgur.com/V0eRMrd.png?1

Oh.... forgot that this is what its come to

55 Comments

TheHurricaneGamrDec 21, 201640 votes

But that mana shield is on like a 120 second cooldown though. Plus, he's lvl 18, meaning he's reached lategame. He's also 3 levels ahead of you, meaning that he's probably fed with a ton of AP+Mana items, both of which increase that shield.

Off Meta EvanDec 22, 20165 votes

but why does a champion that has bully potential in lane have the right to have such an insane late game. i get that he's fed and all but that shield is fucking preposterous.

TheHurricaneGamrDec 22, 20166 votes

He's actually pretty hard to play. He requires good game knowledge for his ultimate to be used effectively, has to position well to keep from getting bursted but has to keep withing a certain range as well to get his damage off. In addition, every champion has "bully potential" in lane. It really comes down to who can trade better. If I main Gangplank (which I do) and the enemy plays Darius for the first time, I'm probably going to flat out bully him out of lane. Why? Because I know when it is a good time to trade, I can play my champion better than he can and have more of an impact on the game than he can. Now, if this same player also had around 180K mastery on Darius and was similar to my elo, he would probably dumpster me due to his game knowledge on the champ and the fact that Darius has a better laning phase than Gangplank .

Off Meta EvanDec 22, 20165 votes

i disagree, i don't think he's hard to play at all. Due to him being ranged and having a mostly point and click kit, his mechanical skill amounts to "know the right combo." which is an extremely basic gameplay mechanic that pretty much EVERY game implements in some way or form. is ult does require game knowledge but honestly, its not an ult like Orianna Ziggs or Xerath where landing it requires really good precision and can change the course of the game, its just a simple tp ult, which yes can negatively affect your team but honestly for the most part you can just use it to roam and you'll be fine. He requires proper positioning, but thats a universal mechanic that literally every champion in the game requires. and while yes every champion can simply outclass another in terms of game mechanics. ryze due to his level 2 spike actually being rather strong, being ranged and the fact that he scales super hard into the late game, means that you are a late game champion that can easily bully a large chunk of the champions top and possibly even mid depending on the match up. On top of having all the tools for success, late game scaling means that even if you play like garbage and feed, as long as you can stall the game you'll eventually be one shoting adc's and being useful. he's able to play safe due to his crazy wave clear as well. A safe, almost entirely point and click, late game scaling, lane bully does not sound hard to me.

DoozkuDec 22, 20162 votes

If he is so easy, why is his winrate so low? You say the positioning is required on every champion, but on champs like the mentioned Xerath Ziggs Orianna can stay way behind their team. Ryze has a really low range, so he has to get close to deal his damage. Here is a list of mages that can outrange ryze: Ahri Anivia AurelionSol Azir Galio Gangplank Heimerdinger Karma Karthus Kennen Morgana Malzahar Orianna Syndra Veigar Velkoz Viktor Xerath Ziggs Zilean Zyra . I definetly missed a few but you get the idea. And what you say about Ryze ult doesn't make sense. Comparing a TP ult to a damage ult like Xerath is like comparing apples to oranges. They are both completely different. Ryze ult requires good map awareness, communication, game knowlegde, and more to use. You can use it for quick rotations, or to swap the locations of minions. You can only use Xerath ult to snipe people. It is really simple game knowledge wise, but is harder to use mechanically. Him being able to bully isn't really intended, and any good mage with more range than him will just poke him out of lane. He has virtually no answer to getting kited and poked by any burst or artillery mage. He also wastes a shitload of mana early, so abuse that.

Off Meta EvanDec 22, 20161 votes

his winrate is low because he as a champion is not that amazing in the current meta. ranged top laners at the moment need either engage, or siege and ryze doesn't have either but thats just the meta not suiting him, that doesn't mean his kit ISN'T horribly designed. and to say OH YEAH MAGES COUNTER HIM is not really a solution. If i'm NOT a long range mage then that doesn't really help me does it? getting countered by long range poke as a mage sucks yes but thats why you don't need to pick him mid lane, he's extremely good against melee champions, thats his gimmick. While yes he doesn't very high range with just his abilities, he can abuse minions to make his poke infinitely better, on top of that, while yes kennens Q is SLIGHTLY longer, its not by very much and they basically have the same range on their Q. I compared ults like xeraths ult to it because xerath ult if used to assist your team, ALSO requires map awarness, communication, and game knowledge, it just also requires mechanical skill as well. on top of that, game knowledge, map awarness, communication, are ALL THINGS YOU NEED TO BE SUCCESSFUL WITH LITERALLY EVERY CHAMPION IN THE GAME. thats the equivalent of saying, "he's hard cause you have to last hit minons." him being able to bully was entirely intended for top lane champions. And the fact that he has no answer to getting kited/poked is another reason WHY his kit is so unhealthy and inorganic, his kit basically amounts to, if i counter you, you can't do anything about it. if you counter me i can't do anything about (unless he can stall the game long enough for him to scale). that makes the game boil down to who picked what in champ select, which is not fun gameplay. As for the mana issue, the E W are point and click and the W essentially holds you down for a fresh Q on top of giving him a shield and move speed to kite more. Anyone who ISN'T a hypermobile champion isn't going to be able to do anything about that, so abusing the mana isn't that easy when he won't run out of mana before killing you, or alternatively if he brings tp and just zones you of farm cause he bought an early tear.

TheHurricaneGamrDec 22, 20161 votes

I diffidently agree that he is not in the best place at the moment in terms of game balance and game health. However, his BIGGEST weakness is his lack of range. He basically has an aura around him that says "come in here and you die" His Q does no damage without his spell flux and is a slow, single target skillshot. The range on his W and E is relatively short, meaning that he needs to get close to do his damage. He also takes decent mechanics like you said, but all of his combos have tradeoffs. If you want more damage, you have to E>W>Q. This reduces his damage though, but still gives a shield. You can also W>E>Q, but the CC duration is halved. If you do the full combo, Q>E>Q>W>Q>E>Q, you lose out on the shield, but get hella DPS. Also, I would recommend playing as Ryze for a few games to learn what he does. If you know when he wants to push, you can potentially avoid his E>Q damage altogether just by staying away from the waves. It's pretty telegraphed.

Off Meta EvanDec 22, 20161 votes

heres the issue, there is literally no reason to not go the shield combo against melee opponents unless you're gonna all in them. yeah you won't be doing the optimal damage but you will pretty much win every trade against a melee as long as its not some hyper mobile diver like Riven or Irelia the same thing can go for a lot of mages, why would i ever bother doing the full damage combo when i could just use the shield combo to win the trade? while yes his combos have trade offs they're not good enough to warrant the damage he does, the cc from the W E Q is lowered but it still allows you to hit it against most champions, as well as possibly get another E Q off if your close enough/fast enough. i have played ryze, he's not hard, like at all. and while i can avoid his E Q damage from the waves the issue is that his waveclear is so strong that it allows him to farm a lot more safely than other low range mages, and because he's such a late game monster him being able to farm safely is NOT something i would like.

NineTailedMysticDec 22, 20161 votes

Here is a list of mages that can outrange ryze: Ahri, Veigar

lol I stopped picking Ahri into Ryze because he outtrades me with a fucking Tear and Catalyst when I have Codex + Lost Chapter. EQW vs his WEQ.

Veigar also doesn't until 6.

MirkhailDec 22, 20161 votes

Outrange isn't the same as outtrade

NineTailedMysticDec 22, 20161 votes

I must have misread. Mana scaling still pisses me off.

Asayake 5150glowDec 23, 20161 votes

{quoted}

lol I stopped picking Ahri into Ryze because he outtrades me with a fucking Tear and Catalyst when I have Codex + Lost Chapter. EQW vs his WEQ.

Veigar also doesn't until 6.

Don't let him pull off his W+E+Q, just E at max range and Q at max range, then run away with the MS.

NineTailedMysticDec 23, 20161 votes

You say that like it's easy to hit a max range E. Regardless I'm saying its horseshit he gets so much damage from Mana items.

ElikainDec 22, 20161 votes

Have you played Ryze at all or are you literally basing your entire argument on the amount of skillshots his kit has, compared to someone like Xerath?

I am a better Xerath player than i am a Ryze player and that's because Xerath has an even greater range i can just miss a lot of my skillshots from but if i hit some, i still win. With Ryze, you need to understand how his passive works to either get a shield or spread damage for waveclear. Not to mention a full blown utility ult to make a good use out of or you play with 3 skills only.

Off Meta EvanDec 22, 20161 votes

you'd be right about the utility ult if they didn't make is normal abilities so fucking strong. lets just look at the other mage in the game with a tp ult shall we? TwistedFate its much longer range, telegraphed better imo, and the basic tp ult, it is FAR more balanced on him however, whys that? because his ap scalings, range, and base damage are so fucking shitty that he is FORCED to roam to get kills if he's up against a laner thats as good as he is. yes you can just outclass the fuck out of your lane opponent, but his scalings and normal abilities were clearly designed to make his laning phase garbage and unable to duel effectively without like 3 items. Throw in that he wins farm lanes not from outscaling (although his late game and scaling is pretty good.) but from having higher gold on minion kills so by default he's gonna get his items quicker, which is something you can prevent by zoning him of farm. TF actually makes a sacrifice for having mostly click abilities in that they have piss poor range, he needs items to scale and not just a resource, and the fact that without blue, he can't farm NEARLY as safely as ryze can. i base my arguement off of the fact that ryze is a champion that if you are good at league of legends, or just video games as a whole, you're good at ryze, where as actually hard champions like Azir require that you know the champions extremely well on top of just being good at the game.

ElikainDec 23, 20161 votes

Ryze's abilities aren't strong if you don't know how to use them properly. Again, his passive is the key and depending on the situation, you either get a shield and less damage or more damage but no shield.

Annie is a spammer champion that doesn't need some advanced skills. Ryze is not at all as easy as Annie.

Off Meta EvanDec 23, 20161 votes

And as i've said, knowing combos and how they work is an extremely basic gameplay mechanic that almost EVERY game implements. Every single fighting game ever, darksouls, some of the 3d legend of zeldas, a bunch of league champions that are combo based, the god of war series, adventure rpg games like ultimate alliance, the kingdom hearts series, the megaman.exe series, the elder scrolls series, the new FF 15, the list goes on. Understanding what combos to do at what time is a gameplay mechanic that is universally understood to anyone thats played a video game. A hard champion should not require that you're just good at video games it should require that you understand that champion. Like what you're telling me is that the hard part about ryze is reading his fucking descriptions and properly understanding what his abilities do, AKA what you need for every OTHER champion in the fucking game.

ElikainDec 24, 20161 votes

No, the hard part is realizing how combos work and when to use and not use certain combos. When to use his ult and when not to use his ult. When to bait with it and teleport no one, to force the enemy team to move the way you want.

I'm absolutely not talking about anyone having difficulty reading the ability descriptions. I'm talking about actual experience with the champion, which you can't acquire from reading it off a high ELO player's guide to Ryze. That part of the knowledge you have to experience yourself.

If you look at statistics across ELO for Ryze, you'll see that since he's a high skill cap champion, his performance (win rate) is below 50% in lower ELOs while going slightly above 50% in higher ELOs. If he was so easy and beginner friendly champion, you'd see him in every ELO. Last time i checked, he isn't a pick/ban worthy champion.

Off Meta EvanDec 24, 20161 votes

knowing when to do what combo is NOT that hard. Like at all, knowing how to and when to tp is also ANOTHER MECHANIC that pretty much every top laner needs to know. I've seen him played by bronze players, i've seen him played by diamond players. he's overall not that popular with a tiny 2.0% pick rate. ryze is a combination of a bunch of universal mechanics that you can pick up by playing other champs. a truly difficult champion should be one thats unique and doesn't have many mechanics that are from other champs, OR they require a high amount of mechanical skill, or both. like Kalista nobody else has a mechanics QUITE like hers. AurelionSol has some of the most awkward spells to land and is easily destroyed by melee champions. Cassiopeia has extremely low mobility, very squishy and demands that you land your skill shots precisely. ryze has simple positioning, simple combos, easy to lane abilities, and very easy decision making.

StarboyˇDec 22, 20161 votes

Caitlyn

Off Meta EvanDec 22, 20161 votes

^ i fucking hate cait.

ElikainDec 22, 20161 votes

Because he's a scaling champion. It's what he does. He has a pretty tough to beat late game and you can still beat him if you zerg rush his ass. What people always forget is that you can't 1v1 Ryze when he gets his items and mostly people ignore him when a fight breaks out, leading to team wipes.

Off Meta EvanDec 22, 20161 votes

being able to zerg rush him is not always an option is the issue, a lot of champions either don't have the mobility or don't have the early game to just go super fucking ham on him and because of that fighting ryze becomes "champion select league of legends edition." rather than actually organically outplaying the ryze. and if you ignore a full build ryze in a team fight your team is going to die.

ElikainDec 23, 20161 votes

Considering that Ryze isn't an artillery mage, if a champion is in his range to get hit, he's in their range for a retaliation. Ryze isn't an early game champion and if you also pick a scaling champion into him, you created that situation for yourself. It's not Ryze's fault that he exists. Anivia is a good scaling champion to rival him in any case.

Any champion can die if focused properly and just one well placed CC can do that. People can't be getting tunnel vision when a fight breaks out and never seeing the bigger picture or chasing infinitely for that 1 HP ADC, getting wiped out in the process.

Off Meta EvanDec 23, 20161 votes

you keep using mages in your examples for counter to him, but ryze is primarily played top lane. he's only played mid 24% where as he's played top 29%. on top of that MANY champions that get into ryzes range are not able to win trades if he positions properly. Yorick Garen Darius Illaoi Nasus Rumble Teemo Gangplank Malphite just to name a few, on top of the fact that his shield combo makes trading with him a fools errand if he already got an QEQ on you.

Yes a champion can die if focused properly but thats pretty much every champion in the games weakness. having a universal weakness doesn't make up for your strengths. not to mention ryze can be built extremely tanky so focusing him may end up being an extremely poor idea.

ElikainDec 24, 20161 votes

I can already name a few from your list that can win against Ryze top lane - Garen, Darius, Illaoi, Nasus, Gangplank and Teemo. The key to victory is their own scaling, not 1v1 early game fighting. Illaoi is especially difficult for him because if Ryze gets his spirit pulled out and he's as well in her range, then it's lights out for him. In any case, he takes damage from her tentacles. Malphite is especially good for initiating against Ryze for his team and he's exceptionally tanky for him to cut through so if you're picking Malp into Ryze, don't expect to fight him.

Depending on how experienced a Ryze player is (and you with these champions) anything is possible really.

Off Meta EvanDec 24, 20161 votes

with exception of nasus, all of those champions are out scaled by Ryze, not attempting to gain a lead is a HORRIBLE idea against him. as for malphite i don't want my solution to a champion to be, wait and relay on your team. Thats not fun or engaging. I'm playing a video game to entertain myself and have fun. taking it up the bum for 20 minutes until i ACTUALLY get to play the game, is not my idea of fun. While yes, ANYONE can outclass another person, against ryze that gap between skill needs to be massive. he's not fun to play against, he's not hard or engaging, his gameplay is extremely unhealthy, and overall he's a mess of a champion. As long as his identity as a mana scaling, easy to pick up, tanky, mage is kept, he will ALWAYS be a train wreck to balance. there is a reason he's been reworked 3 times, ryze just flat out needs an identity change if he ever hopes to be balanced.

ElikainDec 24, 20161 votes

as for malphite i don't want my solution to a champion to be, wait and relay on your team. Thats not fun or engaging.

Then your problem is that you expect to play 1v1, in a team game. Hate to break it to you, that's not the experience League offers anymore. It hasn't offered it for a long time. You depend on your team as much as they depend on you, individually.

Obviously you haven't played against a good GP as his barrels and damage is insane at the same time Ryze can scale to his items.

easy to pick up

Again, his winrate is higher the higher you go up ELO and that means he isn't easy to pick up or play in lower ELOs. If you won't even bother checking this data before we continue, i see no reason why i should waste my time explaining that Ryze isn't easy to play. Your view of him is not important when the actual data speaks the truth.

You can't sit there and claim that adapting your pick, playstyle and items to counter the enemy team is not fun. That's literally the essence of League's experience and that's what all high ELO players do. That's the correct way of playing the game. If you hate playing against him, learn how to play his counters. Or have your team gank him often. There are ways of dealing with any champion and you wanting to deal with each one personally, not depending on a single player in your team is a wrong way of playing this game.

Your expectations are wrong. You expect that whatever you pick should have a decent chance at beating Ryze. Roles exist because not every champion has same expectations and playstyle. You can't pick a champion with poor waveclear and say "Oh, Ryze's broken because he's constantly pushing me in". You can't pick a tank champion and say: "Oh, Ryze's broken because he outduels me". You can't pick a Marksmen or a support and say: "Oh, Ryze's broken because i can't survive an encounter with him".

So here's a challenge for you. Since you say Ryze is easy once you read his ability descriptions (LOL) and since he's a champion that can clearly win a 1v1 against anyone with no skill, play him yourself for 10 games and see. I can guarantee you that you won't be satisfied with the results since i see no drive to improve in your attitude. I wager you'd drop him after a first embarrassing loss because it's fun for you when you can 1v1 people and win. And i say embarrassing because you'll then realize how your comments lacked actual experience to back up the words.

Off Meta EvanDec 24, 20161 votes

okay few things.

while gp does scale well i feel that ryze scales better because he's not as reliant on RNG.
being able to actually be an individual is a major issue i actually have with this game. i love league but its biggest fault is that it IS a team game in my opinion. I would prefer that they lean to a more organic and individual.
i haven't said ryze is broken, i'm saying his kit is poorly designed. Just not allowing someone to actually have a chance at beating you, just by virtue of champion pick rather than mechanical skill is extremely poor gameplay that focuses more on picks rather than whos better.
i've been playing him, he's super fucking boring. literally every game has panned out the same however, i win laning phase, someone on the enemy team thats a hyper carry gets fed, we lose because while ryze is easy, i'm not good enough to actually carry with him single handly cause i've barely played him.
the lacking of individuality in league is why people like dunkey left the game in first place. CS:GO i feel has a better mix of team game play because while yes, grouping up with your team is typically a good idea, if you're just that much better than the enemy team you can just straight up destroy everyone in that game and i feel league should take example from that.

ElikainDec 24, 20161 votes

Dunkey left the game because he got banned for two weeks, because flamed a lot. Getting to a temporary or a permanent ban requires that you have prior strikes already, which means that this wasn't his first rodeo with Riot.

Without getting into much detail (because that wasn't the point of the argument), he didn't even take the blame for his flame, he played it off like it was Riot's fault he's bored out of his mind and he even said that flaming should be allowed in any game. I have no sympathy for someone who supports this shitty attitude.

if you're just that much better than the enemy team you can just straight up destroy everyone in that game and i feel league should take example from that.

I already explained that League is a strategy game and having a single player shit all over the entire team of 5 people, does not have any strategic value. If you're overfed and your stats are too high, you don't even have to use your brain but run it down a lane, take every objective and kill anyone who stands in your way.

You're dipping quite a lot into double standards zone. You should be allowed to kill everyone single-handedly with a single champion but when the situation is reversed and your team is getting killed by a single champion, then it's unfair? By your logic, you had no right to complain about a single unfair champion that was OP in those situations because that's the exact way you like to have your fun. But the difference is that you don't like to be on the receiving end when you're getting shit on but you like to shit on someone else in that regard.

i win laning phase, someone on the enemy team thats a hyper carry gets fed, we lose because while ryze is easy, i'm not good enough to actually carry with him single handly cause i've barely played him.

So you admit that you don't play him much and even though you claim that he wins against everyone and that no one can stop him at some point, you can't replicate a better player's success. Does that tell you something valuable? You don't know how to play him well to realize his full potential. There's a lot more to knowing how to play this game then reading skill descriptions and thinking you're an expert.

Just not allowing someone to actually have a chance at beating you, just by virtue of champion pick rather than mechanical skill is extremely poor gameplay that focuses more on picks rather than whos better.

You do know that every champion plays differently, right? The only way you can accurately measure champion mechanics is if you play mirror matchup and seeing if your or your opponent has better mechanics on Ryze. You can't accurately gauge "mechanics" on different champions because they have different mechanics associated with their kit and playstyle, that all boils down on their own strengths and weaknesses and on player's overall skill levels in playing with their champions, in the specific matchup.

If Quinn always beats Darius, an inexperienced Quinn will almost never beat an experienced Darius. If Darius always beats Irelia, an inexperienced Darius will almost never beat an experienced Irelia. League does not play by the rules of hard counters. But good or bad matchups still exist and you should be mindful of that fact. Play on your strengths, not on your weaknesses. Don't blatantly ignore your champions weaknesses and the enemy champion's ability to exploit your weaknesses. Respect the fact that you have to adapt to your team's and enemy team's picks by picking someone that synergizes well with your team comp or disrupts the enemy team comp.

Stormshadow3503Dec 22, 20161 votes

Calm down, this is a joke. I mean it happens surprisingly often, but this was meant as a joke.

KoKobotoDec 21, 201614 votes

I actually love these posts, their was one for twitch as well right? LMFAOOOOOO

Hello I am BirdDec 22, 20161 votes

*there

triggered

Hello I am BirdDec 22, 20161 votes

*they're

triggered

Weight of LawDec 22, 20161 votes

**there

triggered

fuffychanDec 21, 20168 votes

Ryze name checks out

SSJTribeDec 21, 20161 votes

beat me to it

invisiblecat1Dec 22, 20167 votes

Once again If Veigar pressed R he would still die

Ben SharpioDec 22, 20162 votes

tune in next week

SpecterVonBarenDec 22, 20165 votes

Everyone here talking about balance while I'm just looking at this pic like it's some epic throwdown of shield vs shield, like it's an anime scene where two opponents are trying to overpower each other with their aura's or something.

KingnewgameplusDec 22, 20163 votes

WE GOT A NEW SHITPOST BOYS!

Dominick DestineDec 22, 20161 votes

{quoted}

WE GOT A NEW SHITPOST BOYS!

This.

bbQsauçeDec 21, 20162 votes

[deleted]

5000000000000000Dec 21, 20163 votes

They're nerfing the movespeed bonus from charged Q.

Papa AndreiDec 21, 20163 votes

And the shield.

5000000000000000Dec 22, 20163 votes

Oh are they also needing the shield? Okay.

paperbIadeDec 21, 20162 votes

his name is right

NaturesMayhemDec 22, 20161 votes

Had this happen to me as well when playing Ryze. It was me vs the other Ryze, but he got his trade in a second sooner so he got his shield faster than me. His shield blocked all my damage which was close to 1k magic damage without any MR. Feelsbadman :'(