Wouldn't it be nice if there's another item made with Hunter guise?

Hochelaga·Jan 16, 2017·85 votes·3,771 views

There's only 3 items with flat Magic Penetration stats :c

Sorcerer's boots Hunting guise Liandries

79 Comments

Malicious MetalJan 16, 201729 votes

*Haunting Guise.

HochelagaJan 16, 201726 votes

:O My game's in French ! It's called ''Déguisement hanté'' so i tried to badly translate it

Zen InethJan 16, 20175 votes

Now it makes sense. The person is French; He's named Guy, and he's a hunter.

Velzard of KozJan 16, 20177 votes

Jhin

heterosexual DIEJan 17, 20176 votes

... Sees 5 upvotes

http://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2017/03/1484660849-jhin-idiota-x2-by-jofegu-daajew4.jpg

IA9hRfpP5qJan 16, 20173 votes

{quoted}

:O My game's in French ! It's called ''Déguisement hanté'' so i tried to badly translate it

le baguette sigu ple?

aspects1Jan 17, 20176 votes

thats not french i assume you are trying to say a baguette pls its s'il vous plait

Velzard of KozJan 17, 20175 votes

Je thingé he joké

aspects1Jan 17, 20172 votes

oh XD

WolfeurJan 18, 20171 votes

"Je pense qu'il blague"

MrWasjigJan 17, 20172 votes

According to Google Translate, that translates from French to English as "Halloween costumes" :D

Trias000Jan 17, 20172 votes

Hm... I put it to google translate and it said... haunting guise... in Polish

WolfeurJan 17, 20173 votes

Hi, French native here. "Déguisement" is usually a costume, but it also has the meaning of "disguise". "Hanté" means "haunted", because "haunting" would be weird to translate. So it means approximately "haunted disguise"

MrWasjigJan 18, 20171 votes

Just goes to show, Google Translate is a piece of shit xD

OrangesilkJan 16, 201724 votes

There is a reason though. Ranged champions don't get MR per level, this means that if there were multiple MPen items it'd be VERY EASY to get to the point where your abilities deal true damage to carries, this is a BAD THING

xeviJan 16, 201711 votes

Aw yes

I remember the Syndra on my team who was so delighted to have ~45 flat mpen from runes, masteries, and items. The enemy ahri was not happy at all.

Velzard of KozJan 16, 201725 votes

Ahri wasn't happy that someone else's balls are penetrating her? Weird.

rtbf76109271Jan 17, 20173 votes

you actually already do nearly true damage to squishies if you build liandries anyways so it wouldn't really matter if you had even more mpen past this. Flat pen doesn't penetrate below zero mr

item 3020 item 3151 + 7.8 mpen marks = 37.8 mpen. Possibly 6 more from mpen quints but usually not. All adc's have 30 base mr and probably 12 in mr glyphs.

So you are doing ALMOST true damage, 37.8 mpen vs 42 mr. It really would not be game breaking to have more flat pen. It would only reduce their mr by 4.2 to zero, and I would bet that at the same gold an ap heavy item would net more damage

If you built item 3135 on top of this, it would go in effect first. So it would take their 42 and make it 27.3, THEN flat pen through that which takes them to zero which is legit true damage

VerdadeJan 17, 20172 votes

With marks, quints, masteries and 3 pen items you ignore up to 80 MR. If you throw in pen glyphs you're looking at 90 MR. Dealing true damage to someone who bought MR item is disgusting. What is even more disgusting is Vel'koz ignoring entirety of Maw, including its passive shield.

However, Vel is still not broken despite this and despite the ridiculous damage he deals.

Edit: Im huge user of MRp quints. If you do the math, they're stronger than flat AP runes at any time except for very early game.

flibitydooJan 17, 20174 votes

actually there's a chinese build/strategy (chinese as in a lot of pros from china do it),

where in your runepage, as an adc you drop 6 of your MR blues,

and instead replace them with like, 6 Attackspeed blues.

the idea is if a mage is running mag pen reds, sorcerer shoes, the flat mag pen in mastery tree and has a void staff (which are all common builds on mages), they would shred all of an adc's MR. Even if they were running 9 MR glyphs. So the assumption, is that mages already are doing true damage to you with their pen when you have 9 MR glyphs, why not run 3 instead, take the same amount of damage because penetration can never exceed 0 (only reduction does that) and get a little bit more out of your blues.

Now, the one issue is that this rune set up starts netting an advantage once the mage builds void staff, and also usually by the time they get void staff, which is a flex item, you should be able to pick up an MR flex item like banshee's veil or mercurial scimitar. Also this build existed before keystones existed and reworked the entire mastery tree, so the greedy build is also like 2 years old at this point. The meta was a bit different too, with most supports not being magic damage harassers like brand/zyra and instead was largely braum and thresh.

VerdadeJan 17, 20172 votes

Thing is, with just 30mr mages spike much earlier. In fact, reaching 30mrpen is matter of sorc shoes+runes/masteries. This is huge, as it allows mage support to go Frostfang-Sorcs-Ludens instead of Frostfang-sorcs-guise, so they spike earlier and much harder.

SpecterVonBarenJan 17, 20172 votes

Carries already die to a stiff breeze, why not go ahead and give them scaling MR at this point?

ChaoticPineconeJan 17, 20174 votes

Its not a carry vs noncarry thing. Its a range vs melee thing.

There are no range champions with any MR growth per level. The list of melees without it is short - Kassadin, Kayle, and Yasuo, and Kayle doesnt even play like a melee.

forrestoJan 17, 20171 votes

it's already very easy. If I play high magic champions I tend to use my 19 mpen rune page. add in masteries, and sorcs, and you get 19+15+5ish = 39 add in haunting guise, and you get > 50 depending on your level

OrangesilkJan 17, 20171 votes

19mpen rune page really hurts your waveclear because minions have 0 MR, not to mention many champions have AP utility scalings that you lose out on. It's not a bad idea, I often do that myself on several champions, but it's not without costs, and champions with low bases and high scalings often need the AP anyways.

EfficientDynamoJan 16, 201711 votes

Honestly, I don' think more Mpen is needed. I run maybe 8-15 Mpen in my runes, plus another 15 from sorc boots, and I am just about dealing true damage to squishies. If you are trying to deal with tanks then void staff is better anyways.

That said, it would be nice to have more options with haunting guise.

Troll for TrumpJan 16, 20178 votes

Liandry's is supposed to be the antitank option.

As you can tell, it's doing a shtty job at it

TyrekGoldenspearJan 16, 201713 votes

Unless you're Brand.

SmileInABoxJan 17, 20176 votes

Brand is just anti-life.

ChaddyFantomeJan 17, 20173 votes

{quoted}

Unless you're Brand.

Or Malzahar. Or Swain. Or Teemo Or Karthus Or...pretty much any AP with DoT.

EfficientDynamoJan 18, 20171 votes

I don't know about that. The flat rather than %pen is odd, but I would be willing to bet it does a lot of damage over the game to tanks.

As a slight aside, I would love to see the damage output stats for some items. How much did a Liandrys burn over one game, or how much did BotRK do with its % damage? Its kinda hard to judge their impact without that information.

Votable JesterJan 17, 20173 votes

They could just make the (hypothetical) new magic pen item have the same unique passive name as Haunting Guise and Liandry's Torment. That would prevent stacking further than is currently possible while opening up more build options.

SteelMankindJan 16, 20178 votes

First off, Haunting Guise has been sleeper for years. It's like the AP version of The Brutalizer back in s5 - a solid bundle of stats for a low price. Main issue with it is that Liandries isnt the best item on most mages. Id be worried about a new item building out of Haunting Guise being too strong.

Also, a little-known secret is that the magic pen from Sorc boots can stack. Only champ I think doing this is a good idea on is Brand support after getting Eye of the Watchers, Liandries, and Void

HochelagaJan 16, 20177 votes

who in the world would stack magic pen boots -_- other than Veigar

ChaddyFantomeJan 16, 20175 votes

imo, no component should build into only 1 item. That said, more flat MR pen really isn't needed.

GrReaper96Jan 16, 20173 votes

Would be nice to have a melee only flat MR pen. Give the AP assassins something unique

ChaddyFantomeJan 17, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Would be nice to have a melee only flat MR pen. Give the AP assassins something unique

They don't really need it tho. at that point, we'df be doign it for the sake of doing it, which is silly. They already have items like item 3146 item 3100 item 3285 item 3152 item 3001 on top of all the AP itemisation that works amazingly on them as is.

Velzard of KozJan 16, 20175 votes

Hunter's Mask +300 Health +20% Attack Speed +50 Ability Power UNIQUE Passive - Eyes of Pain: +15 MP UNIQUE Passive - Marked Prey: Damage over time effects last one extra tick.

:^) May the Teemoing begin

PaladinNOJan 17, 20175 votes

Hunter's Mask

You mean "Scout's Mask [read: True Face]", right? ;)

Big LincolnJan 16, 20174 votes

mages don't need anything

MicbranJan 16, 20173 votes

Mages have more than enough magic pen tbh

TargonJan 16, 20173 votes

I would like another magic penetration item myself personally - mainly as an alternative to buying Sorcerer's shoes. These boots are near mandatory on all AP champions because of how valuable magic penetration is as a stat to do damage late game.

What I would like Riot to do personally is rework the magic penetration items. It used to be that flat armor penetration was meant for AD assassins and % bonus armor penetration was meant for ADCs with sustained damage. There is almost no distinction for magic penetration with AP champion classes.

forrestoJan 17, 20171 votes

I never really got why they didnt just make lethality a catchall of magic pen and armor pen.

VerdadeJan 17, 20172 votes

Magic pen is fine, Armor pen was broken. Why fix MRP if it's perfectly balanced?

forrestoJan 17, 20171 votes

I believe you, it just seems a little weird to give them completely different mechanics.

EnloctJan 17, 20173 votes

My only complaint with Haunting Guise is what it builds into. Liandries has a mixture of general and anti squishy stats but an anti-tank passive that needs external utility to function properly. That makes it inherently super situational unless its so strong it doesn't need its ideal situation to be good.

Which, I think, is the case right now.

ReZisT LustJan 16, 20172 votes

Haunting guise

arc95Jan 17, 20171 votes

plz no look at what happened when they introduced more flat armor pen when made serrated dirk...

mages would literally be doing true damage with ease if they add more pen items

you want to keep flat pen items to a minimum(whether its ad or ap)

giving more flat armor pen broke the game so instead of reverting back to minimal flat pen being available they made lethality

doing the same thing with magic pen will lead to the same issue but only worse

only way is i see it being balanced is if they make all the added items have the same unique passive so the pen doesnt stack... meaning you have more options to acquire flat pen but you dont have a chance to stack it

MagikarpIsBossJan 21, 20171 votes

Based on math from other people's comments, mages deal true damage already with the right items and possibly runes/masteries. Either way, your comment does still make sense because we dont really need it stacking (besides having the mpen boots able to stack with them).