Yorick was able to proc aftershock with his wall. Why was this removed?

y0r1ck·Feb 9, 2018·16 votes·6,203 views

If I try to take aftershock now my rune is automatically changed to grasp. Why and when did this happen?

52 Comments

ShuyinTheXFeb 9, 20187 votes

Yorick was never suppose to proc it, the game's spaghetti code confused the forced-movement of the wall with actual displacement. Besides, the chances of using Aftershock on Yorick is extremely slim.

MohawkBirdFeb 9, 20182 votes

[deleted]

ShuyinTheXFeb 9, 20183 votes

Trundle's pillar was coded as a knock-back and even states it is one. Yorick's wall is like Jarvan's ult, it creates terrain and moves them to one side of the wall or the other, it's not suppose to be actual CC.

y0r1ckFeb 9, 20182 votes

Cool thx

{quoted}

Yep, oversight on our part there. Yorick will be able to take Aftershock again shortly (pretty certain it's fixed in 8.4).

y0r1ckFeb 9, 20181 votes

It's very good on support Yorick. It adds a lot of skill expression. I don't see why they'd remove it. Anivia, trundle, ornn, and the mid lane rock girl all have displacements on their walls, why does yorick not get one?

ShuyinTheXFeb 9, 20182 votes

Anivia's isn't a knock-back like Trundle's Orrn's or Taliyah's. 3/4 of your examples are actual CC, not confused-as-CC like Yorick's is.

y0r1ckFeb 9, 20181 votes

It moves people to the side because they're in the way. How is this not a displacement?

ShuyinTheXFeb 9, 20181 votes

It's the same tech that pushes champions and wards out of walls so they don't get stuck, that's how it's not a displacement.

y0r1ckFeb 9, 20181 votes

Ok so you're saying if a champion pushes another champion out of an area by using one of their abilities, then it's not a displacement? Do you see what's wrong with that argument? Because that's literally what Yorick's wall is doing.

Not only that, but unless you work for RIOT I don't see how you could know what the tech is.

DeathBurstFeb 9, 20181 votes

I'm pretty sure it's not good on Yorick, not even as Support... Try Guardian or whatever.

y0r1ckFeb 9, 20181 votes

Guardian is garbage for support Yorick. Trust me, aftershock vs squishy supports and grasp vs tanks. I've played a lot of yorick supp and tested all the keystones in lots of matchups.

DeathBurstFeb 10, 20181 votes

Well, I said Guardian because Grasp is the standard Keystone that you normally use, so assuming you need a different Keystone as Support for whatever reason, that leaves Guardian. But Aftershock is absurd. Even against squishy enemy sups. It's unreliable as a defensive tool, and how much damage is it really, as an offensive tool? Not enough to make a difference compared to Grasp, I wager.

I mean, I saw on your profile that you played it a lot, but I can't believe Aftershock is more useful than Grasp, no matter the circumstances...

y0r1ckFeb 10, 20181 votes

Grasp will get procced max 10 times in lane vs squishy supps. The thing that makes yorick lose in those matchups is taking too much damage while closing the gap. Aftershock helps with that more than grasp does. And honestly it's not unreliable, most of the time if you manage to land a wall on adc/supp you will proc aftershock because they will run into the edge of the wall as it comes up. In the rare occasions when they do not run, it won't proc.

Vs tanks you're not worried about taking too much damage and so grasp lets you sustain in the longer fights.

It's ok if you don't believe it but don't tell people it's useless if you haven't used it enough to test it.

Wait sorry you didn't tell people it's useless, I confused you with some other guy.

DeathBurstFeb 11, 20181 votes

Grasp doesn't need to get proc'ed constantly to be worth it. It worked for a whole season without giving any permanent stats. I know the situation was different, it's not a straight comparison, but still. People too often and too easily dismiss Grasp when they can't reliably proc it in lane, when that's still a good Keystone just for the in-combat healing in late fights too.

So Aftershock versus Grasp basically boils down to: if you proc Aftershock, you'll take less damage while closing the gap (but you're not sure you'll be able to proc it) versus with Grasp if you manage to close the gap you're sure you'll get a heal (but you need to close the gap first).

Except the condition on Aftershock means you need to place a delayed skill-shot with a margin of error of something like 20 units, because you want them to be right on the wall to get bumped and proc Aftershock, but still be bumped back inside the wall, not outside. Your margin of error is half the width of the wall, and your opponents even have some time to react, and even with the slowest movespeed, that's still enough time to move 20 miserable units. You're basically counting on them making a mistake right here, you can't seriously say it's "honestly not unreliable".

On the other hand, the condition on Grasp is just "walk at them", and since Grasp needs 4 sec to be primed anyway, you may not even lose any time while gap closing. And you can get multiple procs in team-fights, whereas Aftershock leaves you dead in the waters.

So yeah, I didn't straight out say that Aftershock is useless, because you played it extensively, and I didn't. But I can't help but think that you're gimping yourself by taking a sub-optimal Keystone. Even if your results with Aftershock are good, it doesn't mean they couldn't be even better with another Keystone.

y0r1ckFeb 11, 20181 votes

It's not unreliable and you don't have to land the edge directly on them. Even if they walk into the side of the wall as it comes up, then shock procs. They don't even have to be on the inside. So shock is also better while running away.

redniwediSFeb 9, 20184 votes

They made it so champions without the CC needed to proc it would have it auto-switched for them. Guess they didn't realize Yorick had a way to use it.

y0r1ckFeb 9, 20181 votes

Can you upvote this so they fix it? Not too many care about yorick so every upvote helps a lot.

redniwediSFeb 9, 20182 votes

Actually if I were you I would repost this under the Report A Bug section, that might get noticed a bit more. Just make sure to follow the format.

RiotMeddlerFeb 9, 201817 votes

Yep, oversight on our part there. Yorick will be able to take Aftershock again shortly (pretty certain it's fixed in 8.4).

y0r1ckFeb 9, 20184 votes

Cool thx

Tychusfindlay918Feb 9, 20183 votes

{quoted}

Yep, oversight on our part there. Yorick will be able to take Aftershock again shortly (pretty certain it's fixed in 8.4).

Amazing this thread gets answered to and not this one

https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/w2IpZziB-this-has-been-ignored-for-too-long-and-bug-reports-dont-seem-to-matter-to-riot

Like holy shit, how many people take aftershock on yorick anyways?

Yeah, don't worry, you got your priorities I'm sure.

ShuyinTheXFeb 9, 20183 votes

In regards to you,

Riot Wittrock (NA) QA Analyst - about an hour ago Looked into this, found what seems to be the fix. This should clean up some similar funkiness his W sometimes had against towers, inhibitors, and wards as well. The fix should show up on PBE tomorrow or Monday.

Tychusfindlay918Feb 9, 20183 votes

{quoted}

In regards to you, Looked into this, found what seems to be the fix. This should clean up some similar funkiness his W sometimes had against towers, inhibitors, and wards as well. The fix should show up on PBE tomorrow or Monday.

Man you're late huh?

ShuyinTheXFeb 9, 20182 votes

You're 11 hours late friend.

ShuyinTheXFeb 9, 20185 votes

Honestly speaking, I think this should remain as-is. Aftershock would only be able to proc in the random chance you manage to knock someone with the wall, it's essentially a trap rune for players if they take it on Yorick. I thought the point of the auto-switch was the prevention of trap runes.

The only way I feel allowing Aftershock on Yorick would be acceptable is if it went off when you managed to trap someone, maybe a new form of CC called "Caged" or something. It would activate off of "prison" based spells such as Yorick's W, Jarvan's ult, Camile's ult, Thresh's ult, Veigar's E, etc. Anything that puts enemies into a "box" created by a champion.

RenownedWheat42Feb 9, 20181 votes

100 times this. This is honestly just as situational as getting someone with a blast cone or something. It really should just stay switching to grasp.

ShuyinTheXFeb 9, 20181 votes

If they added the "Caged" CC method I'd be perfectly accepting of Aftershock being available on him, but without it it needs to never be an option.

y0r1ckFeb 10, 20181 votes

It's not situational. It's not as hard to proc as you seem to think.

DarkSoul1994Feb 9, 20181 votes

Who are you to say this? OP could be a Yorick 1-trick that gets the knockup on 90% of his Walls.

ShuyinTheXFeb 9, 20182 votes

Who are you to say that a 1-trick should be the one to dictate a champion's usability for the rest of the playerbase? Anyone that takes Aftershock on Yorick instead of literally any other rune is going to be at a major disadvantage. In fact, I'm willing to bet that they are going to miss their W more often trying to force Aftershock to proc with weird W placements.

That's why I suggested the "Cage" CC method, it would allow usability without changing his playstyle involving his W.

y0r1ckFeb 10, 20182 votes

This was already his useability before they made him unable to take shock....

You'd lose that bet....

There's no need for weird placements...

Do you really think allowing Yorick to proc aftershock is going to ruin or greatly enhance his useability?

Like I said, how about you try this out before tossing hate on yorick.

ShuyinTheXFeb 10, 20181 votes

I'm not tossing hate on Yorick, I love Yorick, that's why I'm trying to prevent his win-rate from dropping further than it is. The moment the patch notes say "Yorick can proc Aftershock with his W" his win-rate is going to drop with all of the people trying it out and realizing it's a trap interaction. Leaving Yorick back to his old playrate with an even lower win-rate to show for it.

y0r1ckFeb 10, 20181 votes

Mate if you loved yorick you'd want his playrate and winrate to be as low as possible while viable.

But hey I guess I should defer to your points since you can apparently see the future!

DarkSoul1994Feb 10, 20181 votes

So you're saying we should lower the skill ceiling of an already-underplayed champion so that people don't take Aftershock?

y0r1ckFeb 9, 20181 votes

It's really not that hard. People just run into the edge to proc it for me lol. And yeah I am a yorick one trick.

y0r1ckFeb 9, 20181 votes

It's not a random chance. It procs often. I've played like 2k yorick supp games, and I know it's not a random chance to proc. If they're running away and you wall them, you're very likely to proc it because they run into the wall as it comes up. I very much doubt that you've played enough Yorick aftershock games to be able to comment on it's chances of happening.

Besides it displaces champions so it fits for aftershock. It's very skill intensive. It's only good on support and jungle Yorick but it's just as viable as other keystones in those roles. Yorick wall is excellent in the jungle and procs easily because of the funneling effect of the walls. It's twice as likely to proc in bot lane than it would in top.

So it's not a trap rune. How about next time you try to say something's a trap you try it out first?

ShuyinTheXFeb 10, 20181 votes

I very much doubt that you've played enough Yorick aftershock games to be able to comment on it's chances of happening.

You're right, I haven't played enough Yorick Aftershock games because I'm not foolish enough to use Yorick with Aftershock. Grasp and Press The Attack are far more usable and consistent for Yorick as they play to his strengths. An interaction as small as Aftershock is a trap rune no matter how you try to spin it. I'm going to be honest when I say this, if Riot didn't straight up say "The Ultimate Hat Doesn't work on Udyr" and allowed it to be picked instead of auto-switching it, I'm willing to bet you'd be one of the people using it and believing it works with Phoenix Stance's cooldown because it's on the Ult key.

Aftershock on Yorick is as useful as The Ultimate Hat on Udyr. Which is not very-if-at-all with every other rune option available.

y0r1ckFeb 10, 20182 votes

Yes good luck proccing grasp and PTA, consistently as jungle or support.

How about you let sleeping dogs lie? This isn't hurting anyone and only adds to Yorick's flexibility so let it be.

Also, now that you're exposed you're resorting to strawmans and personal attacks. Such a stupid debate but at least others can see this.

DragonSheaFeb 9, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Yep, oversight on our part there. Yorick will be able to take Aftershock again shortly (pretty certain it's fixed in 8.4).

If Dark Procession(W) is gonna be viable with Aftershock. The area inside the wall has to root the target for a short while. Otherwise it is gonna be too difficult to proc just by hitting someone with the wall itself.

Z3SleeperFeb 9, 20181 votes

But as long as it's possible there's no reason to remove the rune.

Daze CloverFeb 9, 20181 votes

SO IS NEXT PATCH FROZEN MALLET CHANGES SUPPOSED TO BE A HIDDEN Urgot ** NERF?**

URGOT IS NOT EVEN OVERPOWERED! HE IS A SITUATIONAL PICK! LIKE COME ON

Reaper5599Feb 9, 20181 votes

What are the changes? I can't access Surrender at 20 at the moment so could you tell me whats going on with mallet?

DeadUnbornFeb 9, 20181 votes

for ranged slow is changed from 30% to 15%

Reaper5599Feb 9, 20181 votes

Ah, I mean It could be a lot worse for Urgot, but its still a bit of a hit to him.

RiotSparkleFeb 10, 20182 votes

THIS IS MY BAD, I AM SORRY FRIENDS I FORGOT ABOUT THE GLORIOUS WALL INTERACTION!

Jinx HunterFeb 9, 20184 votes

http://i1.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/015/266/Z7HeRxU.png that's why.

no to toxicFeb 9, 20181 votes

Problem solved. So now that this thread has no reason to exist can anyone tell me if Black Cleaver is still better than item 3384 on Yorick.

y0r1ckFeb 9, 20181 votes

Never really. Only into matchups where you need IBG, and you want to avoid those matchups like the plague anyways (yas, fiora, jax, trynd). You never need the armor shred because of your ult damage, so the only reason you get cleaver is so you can get IBG. Triforce >>> tank item/Sterak's.

Sheen >>> cleaver >>> IBG. You don't ever want to go this build path if you can afford to get triforce.

People will say you need triforce for the big damage sheen proc but the attack speed shouldn't be overlooked. It makes it easier to auto for each %hp proc with your ult.

Sometimes you can take fleet footwork and go for a phantom dancer deaths dance build but you need to play perfectly to make that work.