So... elise vgu maybe please?

Hammermancer··4 votes·381 views

Hey, So i pulled up elise on my alt lately and came to a conclusion that elise, the spider queen, feels a little dated. Not bad, just kinda clunky and slow.

Her graphical standards also seem a little lower than many other champs, and her interactions are lacking. I feel like Elise is a prime candidate for a VGU, but not for a full rework. Or to be more direct, give this girl the Warwick/Taric treatment as opposed to the Sion/Urgot treatment.

I'd like to see a bit more mechanical reward for her, and some base line fluidity ugrades.

I'd like to be pretty clear though, Elise is still actually pretty good, but her kit is pretty meh in comparison to what i'd call her two sibling champions (Jayce and nidalee)

Jayce and Nidalee have much cleaner casts, they have generally nicer animation quality, and they have a higher variety of skins and themes, whereas elise has almost all of her skins based on different flowers, save for her esport and super galaxy, which both show her potential for various skin themes and what can be explored with the champion.

Abilities I'd like to see touched up?

Oh.. this is tough, I gotta say her toxic spiderling is, while not without skill, a little too much on the RNG side of things. I think her melee Q and W along with passive could be moved around in such a way that they give room for a new ability, (life gain on hit maybe a stacking passive for leveling up an ability)

I always thought her ranged Q was... boring. But that's opinion based. Her ranged E is nice but suffers some hitbox issues, and I feel like riot could do so well to make the web effects look better

I always felt that her spiderlings were a missed opportunity based on the old game, while i don't propose something akin to malzahar or yorick, i'd love to see even more visual effects on her abilities involving the spiderlings and maybe even utility for them in her human form, maybe they would fire web attacks when she's ranged granting either a bit of AP on hit/on attack after an ability is cast.

Another thing about this girl, she leads people into a trap, in exchange for eternal life from the spider god, which as a denizen of the shadow isles is likely somewhat necromantic in nature.

I'd love to see Elise have some sort of special dialogue with yorick like "I'm not here to deal with your problems", interactions with thresh " these souls belong to the spider god" and interactions with illaoi such as illaoi saying "my god is bigger than yours" and elise saying "But mine is.... better"

Elise's ranged stun, while i think is useful, I think it's almost too good for a champ who bursts people down, and it almost invariably eats up a lot of her power budget. I think adding more setup for the stun would be pertinent.

So yeah, thats just a few cents worth of thought, nothing dynamite in here but just something to say to riot

5 Comments

Chembaron Yamada3 votes

While I can agree that she doesn't live up to the standards new champions and reworks are bringing into the game, she is really low in the priority list.

I mean, take a look at the champion roster. There are tons of champions way worse than Elise, in every term (gameplay, visuals, lore...).

Amumu Blitzcrank Corki DrMundo Fiddlesticks Jax Malphite Mordekaiser Kayle Morgana Nocturne Nunu Rammus Shaco Teemo Udyr Volibear

These are just the top offenders and everyone of them deserves a VGU before we start even thinking about Elise....

Chembaron Yamada1 votes

[deleted]

JarodDempsey2 votes

Amumu : pretty fine, hes a simple to easy engage tank, hes good for new players who want to try the role Blitzcrank : really just needs to have his grab blocked by walls, ledges, player created terrian, and turrets, then he'd be fine. Corki : pretty bad kit, has been for a long while. simply outdated and outclassed, few can do well with him but in general isnt fun DrMundo : unique kit but low skill required and can be nearly unstoppable, definitely not up to par with current champs considering risk/reward Fiddlesticks : to buff his crap skills youd have to nerf his op skills and people who use him wouldnt like that, imo not a high priority Jax : simple kit, currently overtuned as are all fighters, pretty ood intro to fighters for newbs but could use more complexity Malphite : not bad but his ult doesnt leave enough room for counterplay so it could use some mechanical tweaks Mordekaiser : hes been consistently crap or op and has had those like hundreds of bugs since like forever, i'd say he'd be #2 to rework Kayle : unique playstyle not necessarily requires rework, i definitely think she either needs hard cc or a movement skill, likely change her q and e but her w and r should definitely be left as is Morgana : idk i think she's pretty good, shes good at catching and can put out respectable damage, maybe make her ult damage more sustained instead of 2 bursts but otherwise only a visual update is required, would definitely like to see her take flight like kayle but only while ulting Nocturne : another champ with simple mechanics and an easy ult for newbs, overall not super effective as a whole, I think they should look at his projectile skill if anyhting Nunu : is definitely at the top of that list, hes been nearly useless for so long aside from being a slow bot. he needs hard cc and q needs use outside of teamfights, his ult also needs some kind of mechanical buff or synergy with a different mechanic so it's not so easy to break Rammus : very good at catching but pretty uninspiring in the damage department, maybe make the taunt occur as a passive after so many attacks on him or nearby allies while also giving him a different damage skill and tuning down his damage reflect so he's more active overall Shaco : boxes need mechanical changes since theyre useless in lane, also his complete removal from game during cloning needs to be changed simply to a blink, he shouldnt be dodging karthus ult with that Teemo : doesnt need a full vgu as much as a part rework for w and e, q and r is fine. Udyr : need to tone down his ability to output stuns on the same target and he'll probably be more healthy Volibear : just got a moderate buff, his ult actually does a lot of damage and his kit isnt too bad, his passive is very good compared to most

Elise : shes good at securing kills on low health enemies with rappel but even though she has a relatively alright engage it just isnt overall good enough, either they hsould change her stun into a root that passes through minions and can be turned into a stun by comboing her spider bomb or they need to increase the usefulness of her spiderlings, maybe give her some type of zone presence, especially in the jungle, they could do a lot with webs and roots as traps through the jungle that would make her more useful to her team

Chembaron Yamada1 votes

The thing is, kit is not everything. Even if a champ might function kitwise, lacking visuals can put them on the list, too.

All these champions are tier 1 on the VGU list for a reason. Elise isn't as bad as them.


But just to discuss one thing I disagree with: Amumu

This guy, for current tank standards, is definitely not fine. He has no real tank steroid like other tanks usually have (armor and Mr boost, shield, healings.... anything that makes him more durable).

He just has 10 flat damage reduction.... which, honestly, is bad. It helps him clearing raptors, but that's basically it. His jungle clear, as an intended jungler, is horribly unhealthy.

After engaging with Q and R, his only job is walking next to the enemy to deal damage passively. Riot mentioned the "glorified sunfire cape effects", like old Sejuanis W. Amumu has one.

And his thematic is so underdeveloped.... His fantasy of being a cursed mummy Yordle (at least that's the direction they will most likely take) has so much more potential. I hope he gets his rework fairly soon.

JarodDempsey1 votes

fair enough about the lack of tank ability but that could easily be rememdied by giving him a shield upon connecting to anything with bandage toss and voila hes basically fine mechanically. Also since there are so many champs in need of a vgu, champs who need the most mechanical changes should get priority over champs who work fine but look like crap.

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