Should give fizz the ezreal treatment

A Bad Nasus··95 votes·4,273 views

With how easy it is for Fizz to get cdr in his build now he should get a cd nerf on his troll pole and /or ult.

50 Comments

Abyssphere10 votes

Hasn't Fizz been getting 40% CDR for ages now? Doesn't really make a functional difference if he's getting the CDR from better items/options.

Marshbouy14 votes

Not always. Usually fizz players would have 35 from item 3165 item 3100 with their build looking like item 3165 item 3100 item 3158 item 3089 item 3157 item 3285 Or something like that. They dont have to get the ionian boots anymore now that zhonyas gives 10% CDR and they can get item 3020

Abyssphere21 votes

{quoted}

Not always. Usually fizz players would have 35 from item 3165 item 3100 with their build looking like item 3165 item 3100 item 3158 item 3089 item 3157 item 3285 Or something like that. They dont have to get the ionian boots anymore now that zhonyas gives 10% CDR and they can get item 3020

The point is that the cooldown on his abilities hasn't actually gotten any lower. Ezreal's cooldowns were suddenly too low in the pre-season and so needed nerfs but Fizz's cooldowns aren't any lower than they have been in a long time, so why are they suddenly unacceptable?

Ezreal was nerfed in the pre-season because he'd been balanced around getting far less CDR than he was actually getting access to and that needed adjusting because it was inappropriate for him to get as much CDR as he was with the cooldowns he had. Fizz's cooldowns have been tuned around him hitting 40% for ages now and so there's no inappropriate change in that department. What might be inappropriate is the lack of trade-offs he's making in gaining access to that CDR now (i.e. if he goes Morello he can get MPen boots) but that basically just equates to "Fizz is now too strong" and there are any number of nerfs that might be suitable for that problem. You could nerf his cooldowns but they're not necessarily the best thing to look at.

This thread is really clearly made by someone who finds Fizz's low E cooldown frustrating and has found what they think is a reasonable excuse to make it longer, but there's been no actual change in that department for a long time to this is just your standard "Nerf Troll Pole!" thread, that could have been made this time two weeks ago or this time six months ago. Patch 6.9 is relevant in terms of Fizz's overall power level but completely irrelevant in terms of how acceptable his cooldowns are taken by themselves.

Nahara5 votes

Ezreal's cooldowns were nerfed not only due to the fact that he had more access to CDR and he still had the cooldown reducing mechanic of Mystic Shot (which was buffed slightly in the Marksman update), which meant he could have all of his abilities up way more often than what he had before.

Fizz has more access to cooldown, yeah, but not nearly the cooldowns Ezreal had. Not that I disagree with the idea of a nerf to troll-pole/ult.

EROTIC RAID BOSS3 votes

it was only his ult's cd that was nerfed.

after all, ezreal was in kind of a shitty spot before preseason

Poske1 votes

{quoted}

The point is that the cooldown on his abilities hasn't actually gotten any lower. Ezreal's cooldowns were suddenly too low in the pre-season and so needed nerfs but Fizz's cooldowns aren't any lower than they have been in a long time, so why are they suddenly unacceptable?

Ezreal was nerfed in the pre-season because he'd been balanced around getting far less CDR than he was actually getting access to and that needed adjusting because it was inappropriate for him to get as much CDR as he was with the cooldowns he had. Fizz's cooldowns have been tuned around him hitting 40% for ages now and so there's no inappropriate change in that department. What might be inappropriate is the lack of trade-offs he's making in gaining access to that CDR now (i.e. if he goes Morello he can get MPen boots) but that basically just equates to "Fizz is now too strong" and there are any number of nerfs that might be suitable for that problem. You could nerf his cooldowns but they're not necessarily the best thing to look at.

This thread is really clearly made by someone who finds Fizz's low E cooldown frustrating and has found what they think is a reasonable excuse to make it longer, but there's been no actual change in that department for a long time to this is just your standard "Nerf Troll Pole!" thread, that could have been made this time two weeks ago or this time six months ago. Patch 6.9 is relevant in terms of Fizz's overall power level but completely irrelevant in terms of how acceptable his cooldowns are taken by themselves.

Zhonya is great item on fizz - It gives cd Abysal is great item on fizz - it gives cd Nomicon is meh item on fizz- it gives cd He no longer has to buy it because of above

My Waifu Vanilla1 votes

Nomicon gives 100 AP and fixes his mana problems. There is no reason NOT to buy it.

Poske1 votes

[deleted]

My Waifu Vanilla1 votes

Fizz =/= Brand

Before you go on a mindless rant please atleast attempt to read ANY of the comments in this chain and you would know we were talking about Fizz. Or did you think the Lich Bane was for Brand too?

Poske1 votes

[{quoted}](name=My Waifu Chocola,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=1hzVEPf0,comment-id=0001000000000001000000000000,timestamp=2016-05-10T16:54:29.429+0000)

Fizz =/= Brand

Before you go on a mindless rant please atleast attempt to read ANY of the comments in this chain and you would know we were talking about Fizz. Or did you think the Lich Bane was for Brand too?

Rofl my bad I ll delete a post

I would rarely see fizz with nomicon though but I would ussualy see them with abysall and zhonya

Lady Hammerlock2 votes

{quoted}

Not always. Usually fizz players would have 35 from item 3165 item 3100 with their build looking like item 3165 item 3100 item 3158 item 3089 item 3157 item 3285 Or something like that. They dont have to get the ionian boots anymore now that zhonyas gives 10% CDR and they can get item 3020

Zhonya's gives CDR now...thats 45% with lich bane and morello's.....

Marshbouy2 votes

thats what im saying...

SpongebobIsLife1 votes

you can change to the expanded mind mastery.

DarkBillyBoy2 votes

zhonyas got nerfed really really hard now. its a defensive item from now on. fizz won 10%cdr and lost some damage and zhonyas active now has 2 minutes cd, where it used to have 60 seconds.

Hammerpriest2 votes

Zhonya's cd was 90 seconds, not 60s.

DarkBillyBoy1 votes

before that it was 60 seconds. zhonyas got nerfed twice in this season

Hammerpriest3 votes

http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Zhonya%27s_Hourglass

No it wasn't. Zhonya''s Hourglass has ALWAYS been a 90's cd since they split it from Zhonya's Ring. Please don't spread misinformation.

Marshbouy1 votes

soooooo, fizz still wont buy it for the passive?

MunchCrunchLunch7 votes

especially now he doesn't need to get cdr boots anymore.

yay nibbers3 votes

Fizz doesnt have a Q that reduces cooldowns on hit (the reasons hisbcooldowns were nerfed and why he became a menace when he had easy access to CDR) or long range poke or really anythung comparable to Ezreal other than their mobility abilities (which wasn't even the problem with Ezreal). Not to mention Fizz's items being completely different and not comparable to IBG and whatnot. You can't really compare them like this...

Voluug131 votes

Lets ignore the fact tht both Fizz's most used items were added cdr this season, along with a couple of other new items he can probably get.

DarkBillyBoy1 votes

abyssal isnt fizz's most used item. fizz builds morello lichbaen and zhonyas. abyssal doesnt fit in his build. he cant give up zhonyas for abyssal as thats his core item, and its not cost eficient to give up lich bane either.

Voluug131 votes

I never mentioned Abyssal, I meant Zhonia's (MYMU) and Lichbane (S6 preseason).

DarkBillyBoy1 votes

i thought lich always had cdr xD

Voluug131 votes

Pre-Sheen change it didnt, back when Sheen had AP instead.

yay nibbers1 votes

I'm not ignoring that fact I'm saying he's not comparable to Ezreal and his situation. Ezreal's ult cooldown was nerfed because his sudden easy access to 40% CDR meant his Q cooldown was much smaller and he could therefore spam the crap out of it to make his come off cooldown much faster. CDR wasn't really the issue, it was his Q which, again, lowers all his other cooldowns on hit. Let's not forget as well how IBG (the item he was abusing) not only gave him easy access to that CDR because it was buffed up to 20% CDR, but also gave him armor, mana, and a spellblade effect to proc with his Q for even more damage.

Fizz could hit 40% cooldown for a while now, all he had to do was build a Morellonomicon to go with his Lich Bane. The only difference now is he has more options to get to that 40 from items. Otherwise he's pretty much the same, nothing else has really changed about Fizz or what he can do with his items since he's building pretty much the same stuff. If anything he should at least be doing less damage because both Zhonya's and Abyssal had their offensive properties nerfed.

There's some facts for you.

ll League God ll3 votes

focusing on fizz nerfs while malzahar is literally 100% ban / pick.... you people make no sense sometimes

morris11 votes

Maybe because he is getting beaten by the nerf hammer next patch?

Solitair2 votes

Why stop there? Give him the Ao Shin treatment and just delete him.

Cardinal Sinveil1 votes

Yes please, listen to this man !

TotalJerk1 votes

If Zhonya's froze cooldowns Fizz would be a lot more tolerable. Sadly no one else seems to have went for the idea when I suggest they add that and give Zhonya's compensation buffs.

DorkunedAuras10 votes

that would utterly break zhonya's. 100% make it useless and pathetic.

Voluug131 votes

Even more.

See? This is why Zhonia's was never that good on mages (except Morg, Fiddle and Kennen) while being broken on mobility AP assassins.

DorkunedAuras2 votes

except it is good on mages. The 2.5 seconds of safety can give enough time for CDs to tick down, and they can play again.

Voluug131 votes

That 2.5s wont save any mage cooldown-wise that isnt Karthus 1v1 (but then again 1v1 Karthus wont defeat anyone unless massively fed). Plus most abilities are not impactful enough to

Assassins? Mobility abilities makes Zhonia's so much stronger compared to other spells. You can save yourself by running away, but usually not even CC abilities in mages will save you if you have someone on top.

WinBoat1 votes

I think he will be nerfed once and for all after his galaxy skin releases next patch. His nerfs will probably come the next patch after, this is my prediction.

It's been a long time coming, but I think the due date is drawing near and you can expect the nerfs to roll in soon.

excodar1 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Best EV3R NA,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=1hzVEPf0,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2016-05-09T02:16:21.848+0000)

I think he will be nerfed once and for all after his galaxy skin releases next patch. His nerfs will probably come the next patch after, this is my prediction.

It's been a long time coming, but I think the due date is drawing near and you can expect the nerfs to roll in soon.

Just out of curiosity, what makes you think that fizz will be nerfed next patch and why he should be riots priority to nerf? Why should they nerf fizz over lets say, Zed who cant be stopped by qss anymore?

Voluug131 votes

Because Riot is infamous for nerfing champions right after they release a big skin for them, usually a week or two.

Jannitor1 votes

Yeah, but with ezreal You can easily still get 30% in build.

morris13 votes

item 3100 item 3165 item 3157 If that's not max CDR more easily obtained than Ezreal's I don't know what is.

yay nibbers2 votes

Ezreal can and does easily max CDR withitem 3025 item 3158 and runes. That Fizz build costs 9000 gold, almost triple what Ezreal pays (3600). On what planet is that more easily obtained than Ezreal's?

Ezreal should have at least 30% by the time Fizz even has 20%, though he can have 40% in the same time if he gives up an AD quint on his runepage for CDR. Fizz can arguably do the same but still has to pay way more gold because his CDR is all in comparatively expensive offensive items. Ezreal can also buy Essence Reaver, which gives him CDR just for building crit (a cheap stat to build).

To say he has easier access to Fizz than Ezreal is just foolish and really shows your bias.

GrReaper962 votes

or fizz could just buy item 3057 item 3108 item 3165 for max cdr

yay nibbers1 votes

Well I mean, that's not wrong lol. Still more expensive than Ezreal's CDR though.

CaptainAsasin1 votes

Lmao There are 130 champs here Do you mean the other 129 won't benefit from CDr items? Answer me directly.

Sevixys3 votes

The other 129 champs can't literally delete themselves from the game every 4.4 seconds for 0.75 seconds while doing hefty amount of damage and slowing IN AOE.

EDIT: Not to mention Zhonya's, which leaves only 1.15 seconds to attack Fizz after he is untargettable - again.

GrReaper961 votes

To be fair the slow only procs if u dont recast it

speedboy1 votes

I main fizz and agree to this....

doiminat0r36001 votes

Or maybe give his poll an internal cooldown like Yasuo's E and Q?

LaserDeathBlade1 votes

How would that work?...

Fizz cannot troll-pole himself for the next 8/7/6/5 seconds

doiminat0r36001 votes

Like how Yasuo's Q cooldown scales with attack speed. Maybe scale it with MS capping at ~700 so 700 is a full 40% cd and his base is a 0%. It is a mobility spell after all.

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