RIOT: We hear the Viktor fanbase and wont make him into a cartoon villain

DoktorKaiser·Dec 8, 2016·34 votes·1,763 views

Viktor: Kill them all!!!

For science yaaaaay lets kill everyone. FFS can you just make him a good guy who wants to take a bit too much of peoples freedom with his augments instead of a maker of killing robot army for everyone who stands in his way. He couldnt have maybe tried to capture Jayce and reaosn with him? No?? And where the fuck is the part about him making Blitzcrank and getting his invention stolen, it was a CORE PART THAT MADE HIM WHO HE IS. Just dissapointing, I will wait for Viktor lore to find out more I guess. Good thing you didnt fuck up Orianna lore too or I would find you all and kick you in the ass so hard my boot would come out of your mouth!!!

37 Comments

NefasDec 8, 201620 votes

I don't think that's quite fair, but I definitely see your concerns.

Seems to me that Viktor had been trying to convince Jayce, for quite a long time in fact. Jayce had ignored him, rebuffed him, gotten him kicked out of the Academy. Even then Viktor still offered Jayce a role to help in the Glorious Evolution. But everyone has a breaking point and it seems to me that Viktor no longer believed there was any reason to keep trying to convince Jayce, who was clearly a threat to the Glorious Evolution.

We don't have any context outside of Jayce's thoughts on the Robobrains and Chem-users. There's definitely space for Viktor to have a more nuanced series of events - the weak and suffering of Zaun coming to him to save them, etc. I think Viktor definitely believes in the Glorious Evolution for the greater good and isn't just a cartoony villain, though Jayce in his self-aggrandizing arrogance might like to dismiss him as such.

SharjoDec 8, 201610 votes

This is what I got out of the bio too. When Viktor told his robots to kill Jayce it wasn'the for a lack of compassion, but a "I've heard this a thousand times and I just don'the care for it anymore". I mean hell the bio explains that Viktor was saddened by the fact he had to kill Jayce. That doesn'the seem like the reaction of your atypical villain.

Valaran NaraDec 8, 20164 votes

{quoted}

This is what I got out of the bio too. When Viktor told his robots to kill Jayce it wasn'the for a lack of compassion, but a "I've heard this a thousand times and I just don'the care for it anymore". I mean he'll the bio explains that Viktor was saddened by the fact he had to kill Jayce. That doesn'the seem like the reaction of your atypical villain.

You can definitely tell Jayce doesn't understand other people by how he treated a child.

He spoke to the kid like a bloody adult. Not only that, but the only reason he bothered helping her is because she actually LEARNED from Jayce what he attempted to teach her: "all humans are stupid."

The Anagram KingDec 8, 20169 votes

You don't have to kill someone just because they show up.

Like, at all.

The only thing this little interaction demonstrated was that Viktor is at least as happy to kill a former friend, as he is to detain or reason with him. He also won't necessarily go all out and kill Jayces after beating them over the head and rendering them unconscious.

But then again, we don't even know if Viktor would've cared to even check if Jayce was still alive. :P

SaltyToplaneGoatDec 8, 20161 votes

Dunno, if the one who got you kicked out of all the high social circles and who also calls you evil for your research, shows suddenly up with a gigantic prototype weapon with massive energy metrics right in your lab, ready to wreck you... let's just say you can assume that it's a "kill or be killed" situation...

The Anagram KingDec 8, 20166 votes

Jayce apologised for his attitude and tried to talk Viktor down. I understand there is an impasse; but "Kill him" IS NOT THE SANE OPTION.

Baron of BreadDec 8, 20162 votes

I don't know, if I was in Viktor's position I would think the only reason Jayce hadn't gone straight to violence is because he is worried he might not win. Jayce obviously showed up ready to fight, otherwise he wouldn't have been armed. Jayce had a history for being a jerk and thinking he is smarter than everyone else, him thinking he could pretend to be just there to talk seems pretty reasonable.

"Kill him" isn't the nicest option, but it is the safest option. One life is a small price to secure the future of mankind.

Chromatic EagleDec 8, 20162 votes

He showed up with a hammer and had a life time of screwing Viktor's plans. He knew that Jayce would just get in the way again. It was the logical thing to do.

The Anagram KingDec 8, 20161 votes

20 robots don't need to kill people. They can SIT on people, in order to neutralise a threat. And that's just one approach he could have taken. Frankly, I feel like a couple of words might have been in order, first. Jayce was clearly willing to talk; if not listen.

Chromatic EagleDec 8, 20164 votes

I mean, sure, when people inevitably try to fight Viktor, he can have a crisis of conscience and order his army to sit on his opponents.

The Anagram KingDec 8, 20161 votes

It's certainly more prudent than murdering lone witnesses. Unless you're eagerly anticipating a chance at violent antics. :P

ModAcademy KaynDec 8, 20161 votes

Jayce came to stop the Glorious Evolution, we can all agree on that. To Viktor, this is the final blow that his once friend has inflicted on him. And you're right!! Viktor does care for Jayce, even after the fact that Jayce was the one who got him kicked out of the Academy, and didn't want to hand over the crystal because of his "Lack of Moral Compass", since he only knocked him out.

If Viktor had always been shunned by others for his odd ways of progress, how do you think it'd feel if your possible only friend told you the very same things others have said for years. Even after all that, he still only knocks him out. But, to see your once-friend come all this way, with a dangerous weapon to boot, simply to stop you... can you imagine the betrayal that Viktor would feel?

And once again, I ask you, what is there to gain from talking with Jayce? Viktor is obviously dead set with his Evolution, and Jayce is obviously dead set against it... this is not an issue that can be solved with Tea and Biscuits. Viktor has given him chance after chance again for Jayce to join and help him, only to be betrayed every time. Knocking him out didn't work, he simply came back to stop Viktor. Killing is the only option.

KuroCaliberDec 8, 20161 votes

Sharjo-Senpai notice me pls.

That aside, I completely agree. This was JAYCE's Biography, it would not have made sense to make him idolize Viktor, whom Piltover dislikes. Everything thought in this bio was Jayce's not viktor, which is why I feel a lot of excitement for the Zaun story. IT has the potential to really show a difference in perspective.

(Please check my post on Orianna being the Grey Lady, it has a lot on viktor as well). I kinda guessed Orianna lore from Camille's.

Sraeg2013Dec 8, 20162 votes

Ezreal's story was his very own.

Jayce's story isn't from his point of view.

KuroCaliberDec 8, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Ezreal's story was his very own.

Jayce's story isn't from his point of view.

Yes but it's set with explaining JAyce's side. Every thought mentioned in the story is Jayce's. Which is why Viktor's story will contain Viktor's thoughts. It's stupid, it's like saying I know Shen's lore because of Jhin.

Sraeg2013Dec 8, 20161 votes

Unless Jayce is so self-centered he thinks like a Khajiit, I don't see it that way.

Yes, it's a story about him, but it's told from a third person perspective.

KuroCaliberDec 8, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Unless Jayce is so self-centered he thinks like a Khajiit, I don't see it that way.

Yes, it's a story about him, but it's told from a third person perspective.

Well, think about it, story is focused on Jayce. It's HIS bio. It talks about how his crystal 'sang' to him, the thrum of the hammer, the way he just felt like bashing things. NONE of these descriptive technique were used for Viktor. It's because IT'S NOT HIS LORE. It may have him in it, but it's focused on characterizing Jayce. Hell Garen was in Urgot's lore. Is it fair to judge Garen off of what was in Urgot's lore?

Sraeg2013Dec 8, 20161 votes

Yes, because old lore was cohesive.

KuroCaliberDec 8, 20162 votes

{quoted}

Yes, because old lore was cohesive.

Actually the old lore was not at all cohesive. summoner lore literally bent time and space, pulling characters from differnt times and dimensions to duke it out for politics. Hence, they did not need proper backstories and Riot could get away with pasting a paragraph or two and calling it a bio. There isn't much in Viktor's Lore. The majority of what you're upset with is your PERCEPTION of what he should have been, given a proper story. Well sorry, Viktor isn't. The only reason your views of this champion exist are because Riot didn't care about cohesion or story until recently. Now they've been doing an amazing job of ensuring every character has proper interactions with everyone. Like Olaf and MF meeting in shadow and fortune. How Taric is related to pantheon and leona. How the new shadow isles lore properly establishes a hierarchy among those who live there (sans eve, but she's getting a rework soon anyway.) Like it or not, this is Viktor's role in Jayce's story. Now what Viktor is in his story, we have yet to see. But not everyone-especially an uptight rule-abiding citizen like Jayce, is going to see Viktor as the misunderstood genius he is. At least it is confirmed he doesn't believe he is evil rather evolving like he's always done. Sorry that not everyone in Valoran sees him the way you do, but Riot's lore isn't some one dimensional sham where a prince meets and marries a princess and they live happily ever after. so LET IT GO.

Sraeg2013Dec 8, 20161 votes

So as a part of making an "amazing job" they are twisting champions' established characteristics, even though most if not all of them weren't necessary to change with the retconned lore.

Gotcha.

Glory ln DeathDec 8, 20161 votes

There's a difference between third person omniscient and third person limited.

Third person omniscient tells a story from a neutral position - the reader can know anything about anyone in the story. Every character's thoughts, intentions, and motives are open to the reader. The story isn't told from a "side".

Third person limited, however, tells a story from one person's perspective. Even though the reader doesn't become the main character like in a first person story, the story is still being told from that character's perspective. You, as the reader, only get their thoughts, motives, etc. If they misinterpret or misunderstand something, so do you.

Jayce's bio is third person limited. It is just as much his point of view as Ezreal's story was Ezreal's point of view.

In Jayce's bio, any assumptions he had were presented to us. Anything he ignored or didn't pay attention to, we didn't get. There are a ton of facts we don't have, based on Jayce's self-centered personality.

ModKnightsKemplarDec 8, 20161 votes

Makes me feel better that Sharjo isn't among the crowd freaking out... I agree completely. I think he's got plenty of nuance.

SharjoDec 8, 20161 votes

I'm pretty mellow as an individual when it comes to most things, which helps.

OelykDec 8, 20161 votes

Thats because Jayce is a arrogant jerk protagonist with a moral compass... Viktor is the antagonist that lacks a moral compass... And I like both of them, fighting for ideals and it could just as easily be seen that if the community believe in Viktor's glorious evolution then Jayce would be a massive villain, and the moral compass would be redefined... Jayce even thought of killing Viktor in his story...

midnight oil24Dec 8, 201610 votes

Overly aggressive, but I can see where you're coming from. I hate the Jayce lore (and Jayce) and the way Viktor is portrayed in it too.

Papa AndreiDec 8, 20163 votes

Jayce as he is portrayed is amazing, he is now this genius asshole, who embraces being an asshole.

And we only see Viktor from Jayce's perspective. Who again, is an asshole who can't understand others

Chromatic EagleDec 8, 20162 votes

I don't think Jayce embraces it. He just doesn't know how to not be an asshole.

SharjoDec 8, 20162 votes

It's like that's his natural state of being and he finds it hard to appreciate other people and what they're going through. Which made him a horrible guy to try and talk Viktor down, because Jayce is TERRIBLE at sympathising.

Chromatic EagleDec 8, 20164 votes

He's basically a sizable portion of the internet.

bad arcade kittyDec 8, 20168 votes

the current riot's lore authors are god awful

i bet none of them could write and publish even a crappy a genre fiction book on their own, without nepotism

LanceworksDec 8, 20167 votes

Its Jayce's story, of course Viktor will be portrayed as a cartoon villain.

It's like you guys haven't heard of different perspectives.

Jon1174Dec 8, 20164 votes

Wait for the Zaun event which i believe will coincide with the Warwick rework which makes sense because it will be out soon after Camille

LimrickDec 8, 20162 votes

Evil is all perspective, if you think what Viktor is now is evil, that's on you. Viktor certainly doesn't think of himself as evil. And keep in mind that the story is from the perspective of JAYCE, the narcissistic asshole who is Viktor's nemesis. Of course he will portray Viktor as evil.

DehitayDec 8, 20161 votes

Don't worry, give it a year and the lore might change again. Seriously, League's only been out for under 7 years and Riot's already retconned their lore more than Marvel.

Stars ShaperDec 8, 20161 votes

I think this was too harsh of a judgement.

You're reading Jayce lore, not Viktor's. You're not supposed to grasp every facets of Vik's character but only Jayce relation with him and the facts concerning them from Jayce perspective.
Viktor has been heavily hit by Jayce when he talked about Piltover government about Vik plans about the hulk-dock worker suit and this lead him down to a path of resentment that would consider jayce better off dead. Plus we don't know what other things happened to him and how bad Jayce decision made things harsh for him.

Glory ln DeathDec 8, 20161 votes

Why would Jayce's lore include anything about Victor making Blitzcrank? It's Jayce's lore. About Jayce. It's not supposed to include anything about Viktor other than direct interactions with Jayce.

KuroCaliberDec 9, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Viktor: Kill them all!!!

For science yaaaaay lets kill everyone. FFS can you just make him a good guy who wants to take a bit too much of peoples freedom with his augments instead of a maker of killing robot army for everyone who stands in his way. He couldnt have maybe tried to capture Jayce and reaosn with him? No?? And where the fuck is the part about him making Blitzcrank and getting his invention stolen, it was a CORE PART THAT MADE HIM WHO HE IS. Just dissapointing, I will wait for Viktor lore to find out more I guess. Good thing you didnt fuck up Orianna lore too or I would find you all and kick you in the ass so hard my boot would come out of your mouth!!!

Uggh where do I begin. Where the fuck does it say this is Viktor's lore? Hmm? I'm waiting. Hint: It's not. I've spent this entire day on around 15 threads all circle-jerking the idea that Viktor is doomed because JAYCE interacts with him as a villain. Not only that, but they seem to believe that this is VIKTOR'S story. Unfortunately, that's not true. Viktor's bio has yet to be released. Yay, now you viktor mains should buckle up for the ride. To judge viktor through jayce's lore is like judging the USSR using US propoganda, and vice versa. They are CONNECTED, and this just illustrates their CONNECTION. Viktor MAY NOT BE EVIL. It's just that HE'S ALREADY HEARD ALL OF JAYCE'S BS. This is also why there is no mention of BLITZCRANK or other parts of his past THAT JAYCE WAS NOT A PART OF. Hope you guys can sit tight. Ty.