Who Could Possibly Challenge Aurelion Sol?

Subject 5·Jun 16, 2017·26 votes·5,953 views

His lore is just so insanely OP that in fact, it just seems like it's an impossibility that anybody could ever challenge him, period.

Lore power goes from: I use weapons skillfully to I use weapons skillfully plus magic to we don't use weapons but we use magic- to We are colossal beings that should be respected as devastating creatures- to Yeah, well. I create universes. And make stars orbit around me, because that's just how massive I really am. Wanna 1v1 me mid?

I can't help but feel like this god-dragon is just so OP that it is impossible to relate him to literally anything at all - he is just THAT massively different compared to everybody. It would've been better if he was like who at least represents a spirit that is capable of being challenged by other people like

Thoughts?

128 Comments

PsyrixJun 16, 201717 votes

Bard can. Other spirit based champs possibly could as well if their power extends that far e.g. Kindred (as we dont know how far their reach is), Tahm Kench, Anivia. It is possible some of the Ascended and possibly even the Aspects can challenge him. Other champs that may have unlimited power/potential (e.g. Syndra) might eventually be able to. While not a champion per se, Nagakabouros may be able to. Side note, Aurelion didnt create the universe: He made some of the stars (not all of them)

MhihnjJun 16, 201718 votes

Veigar definitely can after some time

PokladnicaZlaJun 17, 20171 votes

I see this point over and over again. Can someone elaborate why?

I mean,I know Veigar can use cosmic magic,but nothing indicates that he could over power someone as strong as Aurelion Sol. It's similar with Nami. She can control tides and the sea,but there's bound to be someone much above a caliber who could create a Tsu-Nami with a wave of a hand.

MhihnjJun 17, 20171 votes

Veigar's power is unlimited. It keeps increasing.

PokladnicaZlaJun 17, 20172 votes

That's a game mechanic.

MhihnjJun 17, 20172 votes

doesn't mean its false

PokladnicaZlaJun 17, 20172 votes

Doesn't mean it's right either

EpicurusJun 16, 20172 votes

Serious question: Why is Bard considered to be so powerful? He's mentioned several times in this thread, and whenever there is a thread about "power levels" Bard always comes out close to the top. Why? We know nothing about Bard. Why are people so sure he is god-tier powerful?

GreenLoreJun 16, 201712 votes

Because bard is the guy who makes sure that the universe doesn't collapse. Meaning its Bards job to stop catastrophes that threaten whole worlds or even the very fabric of reality.

And since he has to deal with these massive threats,he is likely quite powerful.

Though there are probably a lot of people who overhype him a bit too much(some even claiming that bard is a god or that he could easily annihilate everything,which is rather unlikely).

EpicurusJun 16, 20171 votes

It is said that with great power comes great responsibility. But great responsibility does not necessarily entail great power.

Bard is obviously magical. He is obviously cosmic. But I see no reason to consider him to be that much more powerful than any of Lague's mages, Ascended, Targonians, etc...

Something to think about: Bard uses a tool of some kind to work his magic. It looks like a saxophone. So is Bard's power really his own, or does it originate in the tool? What would happen if someone took that saxophone away from him?

FasmodeyJun 16, 20173 votes

As I know, his harmonica/flute/saxophone (whatever you say) is just a tool to help for channeling his magic easier. I'm pretty sure he is not useless without it.

RobertsmashJun 16, 20172 votes

I think Riot said the tool is what he uses to travel between worlds/dimensions.

GreenLoreJun 16, 20174 votes

Overall the way I understand it,it is more likely that bard is simply really really wise. It was said that he often does some things that appear to be trivial at first,but then have a great effect later on.

In this case he likely wouldn't have much raw power,but the sole fact that he can predict events unfolding like this is indeed a huge power.

Warlord DienekesJun 17, 20177 votes

A few comments from Rioters have implied that Bard's real power is knowledge. Claiming if Bard saves you, it's not because you're important. It's because 11 generations down your offspring will be important. Which means he has pretty insane abilities to know the future.

Similarly, Sol mentions that Bard exists in multiple dimensions and that jumping between them confuses the normal people.

This all leads to Bard being kind of like The Doctor from Doctor Who if you watched the show. In it, The Doctor is a bit stronger, and smarter than those around him, has technology that is super advanced and allows him to jump through time. But in terms of real physical power The Doctor facing off against any of his usual main villains and he'd be squashed like a bug. Similarly a bullet could kill him.

But the Doctor nearly always wins because he is playing by different rules to his enemies. He does not get into situations where it's a slug out brawl, unless the deck is so ridiculously stacked in his favor it's not even a contest anymore.

That's Bard. If you ever threw him and Sol in a cage match, Sol would probably blow him up. But there is next to no chance for Bard to ever get caught in that situation. While Sol, for all his power, got played a fool by a piece of bling.

EpicurusJun 17, 20172 votes

An excellent comparison. I like the idea of Bard being a master manipulator on a cosmic scale.

Ebonmaw DragonJun 16, 201714 votes

http://ddragon.leagueoflegends.com/cdn/img/champion/splash/Veigar_0.jpg

Everyone thinks that Veigar is a joke and no one takes him seriously, so, they ignore him when talking about things like this... but here are some FACTS (That may be old, but he hasnt been updated... so, still canon) about the MASTER OF EVIL and why he could defeat Aurelion:

Aurelion Sol is a Celestial Being made of Cosmic energies.
Veigar is a master of black arts and CORRUPTER of Cosmic energies.
Aurelion sol wears a stupid crown that handicaps him
Veigar has a cool hat that makes him look EVILIER.
Aurelion fears a random laugh
Veigar can see the fear in his heart
Aurelion was enslaved by Targonians and he cant escape from that
Veigar was imprisoned by Noxians but he escaped the Noxian prison even before learning evil magical powers
Aurelion Sol can die
Veigar is a timeless being feared by DEATH ITSELF
Aurelion Sol can create stars
Veigar can create Black Holes
Black Holes eat stars as breakfast

Subject 5Jun 16, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=Ebonmaw Dragon,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=xiiTF9cJ,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2017-06-16T05:17:14.526+0000)

http://ddragon.leagueoflegends.com/cdn/img/champion/splash/Veigar_0.jpg

Everyone thinks that Veigar is a joke and no one takes him seriously, so, they ignore him when talking about things like this... but here are some FACTS (That may be old, but he hasnt been updated... so, still canon) about the MASTER OF EVIL and why he could defeat Aurelion:

Aurelion Sol is a Celestial Being made of Cosmic energies.

Veigar is a master of black arts and CORRUPTER of Cosmic energies.

Aurelion sol wears a stupid crown that handicaps him

Veigar has a cool hat that makes him look EVILIER.

Aurelion fears a random laugh

Veigar can see the fear in his heart

Aurelion was enslaved by Targonians and he cant escape from that

Veigar was imprisoned by Noxians but he escaped the Noxian prison even before learning evil magical powers

Aurelion Sol can die

Veigar is a timeless being feared by DEATH ITSELF

Aurelion Sol can create stars

Veigar can create Black Holes

Black Holes eat stars as breakfast

In a lore match up, if Veigar created a black hole to kill something remotely close to the size of Sol - he would kill himself in under .000000000000000000001 of a second. (There should probably be more 0's but I really don't know how many 0's should be there. XD.) but yeah, Veigar might be super powerful but Sol is the size of galaxies. I don't really understand how he could be imprisoned by Targon other than "because it happened." like when batman beat superman.

Baron of BreadJun 16, 20172 votes

Because the Targonians can be approximated as divine beings? They are indeed powerful and clever, as was mentioned in Aurelion's lore. It is important to remember that Pantheon, Diana, Leona and Taric ARE NOT the Targonians from Aurelion's lore. They are merely vessels of the Targonians power, like a cup they can only hold so much of it. Even then, Taric at least seems able to take on armies as seen in his story.

Ebonmaw DragonJun 16, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=Baron of Bread,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=xiiTF9cJ,comment-id=000600000002,timestamp=2017-06-16T18:34:06.042+0000)

Because the Targonians can be approximated as divine beings? They are indeed powerful and clever, as was mentioned in Aurelion's lore. It is important to remember that Pantheon, Diana, Leona and Taric ARE NOT the Targonians from Aurelion's lore. They are merely vessels of the Targonians power, like a cup they can only hold so much of it. Even then, Taric at least seems able to take on armies as seen in his story.

Actually Pantheon IS the Targonian from Aurelion Lore, but his body isnt. They are like spirits that take over the body of a human... is weird.

Baron of BreadJun 16, 20171 votes

I was talking about the champions, if I was referring to the Targonian I would say "the Pantheon" as they are called in the lore.

Wrathof300Jun 17, 20171 votes

Pantheon the champion IS THE PANTHEON aka the Aspect of War/ Targonian spirit of War. Unlike other aspects the Aspect of War completely replaces the persona of their vessel with their own/ a new one. Pantheon is the closest to being the actual Targonian than any other aspect we know of, outside of gameplay issues the fact that he doesn't convey this 'god of war' theme is a major factor as to why he is slated for a rework.

Baron of BreadJun 18, 20171 votes

He is almost the Pantheon itself. It is still Atreus's body and that makes a difference. I doubt that the Pantheon has zero powers beyond being perfect or nigh perfect at fighting in mundane ways.

Wrathof300Jun 18, 20171 votes

Assuming that the Aspect does have additional powers just because they haven't been shown as of yet doesn't mean he can't use them. Even if they can't use their powers while in Atreus' body that doesn't make them any less of the Aspect of war, what is important is the inhabitancy of Atreus' body with their psyche not the powers. It makes sense as a trade off as well, reduced powers for full control over the vessel.

Baron of BreadJun 18, 20172 votes

Here is a quote from Pantheon's lore: "They are not immortal, limited by the human flesh they inhabit, and can be killed, though it takes great effort to do so." Another thing of note from Pantheon's lore is that the Pantheon is the Aspect of the Warrior, not War (just a nomenclature thing, I doubt it makes a huge difference).

Also worth mentioning from Aurelion's lore is that Pantheon is not the entirety of the Pantheon, he is merely one avatar of many scattered across the cosmos.

My opinion is that the powers do matter. Since Pantheon is not the entirety of the Pantheon, I do not consider him as the Pantheon but merely some lesser amount of it. I also am not 100% convinced that Atreus is completely gone, but that is a discussion that could be long and arduous.

NiamhNyxJun 16, 201711 votes

The american dragon could.

Subject 5Jun 16, 20178 votes

{quoted}

The american dragon could.

Offensive language isn't tolerated around these parts. Respect your god, lord and savior, Aurelion Sol.

Fondling GemsJun 16, 20179 votes

Illaoi, her God is so much more powerful than Aurelion that it isn't even a fight, though whether it would help is another matter.

To mention a couple things: Aurelion Sol didn't create galaxies. In fact he didn't make MOST of the stars, only some of them. Now he is powerful sure, but he is lacking in a number of areas and most certainly isn't anywhere near the top of the food chain.

Bard might be comparable. Bard is able to cross multiple universes and has possibly existed longer than Aurelion Sol. Sol on the other hand is bound to this Universe.

Nagakabouros also completely outclasses him. Nagaka is a true god, while Aurelion Sol is just a creature. A powerful one to be sure, and very very old, but still capable of dying and possessing nothing resembling omnipotence or the like. If Nagaka is the sky and we are just small eddies in the wind then Aurelion Sol would be nothing more than a light breeze.

There are a number of Rioter comments about stuff like this but I can't dig them up.

SqkergJun 16, 20175 votes

I don't think Illoai could, while she certainly had ties with nagakabouros, it's in the way that a priest has ties with their god. While she is empowered by her god, she doesn't understand it, let alone how to channel her to the effectiveness that would be required to beat Sol. So apart from nagakaburos directly intervening and defeating Sol that way (which it easily could), Illoai would most likely win.

RiotKindlejackJun 17, 20179 votes

Nasus 30 stacks per minute for infinite years... eventually he will eclipse all Nasus

UnpaladinJun 17, 20178 votes

Nasus is an incredible strategist, surely he could find a way to get into space and dunk the space dragon personally. As soon as the tip of that cane touches anything it's absolutely super dead.

Pierce The VealJun 16, 20177 votes

Nocturne might be able to contest with him. Nocturne's real form is formless and is the embodiment of fear and nightmares in all beings.

ModThe DjinnJun 16, 20176 votes

I'd say Bard for sure, in terms of raw power. Bard's power isn't as...flashy or destructive though. Aurelion Sol would win in a race of destruction, but I doubt he could actually defeat Bard so much as stalemate him. Kindred is another contender, although we don't know if Kindred is only a minor avatar confined to Runeterra or part of a greater entity that handles death on a cosmic scale.

Nagakabouros would, I suspect, wipe the floor with Aurelion Sol and maybe Bard as well.

Subject 5Jun 16, 20175 votes

Unfortunately, the information concerning bards power is very mysterious and 'not very present.' Not that I doubt he could contest or beat Sol, but I would need to really know what the guy can do other than transcend reality.

Where can I find some information about Nagakabouros? That's sounds interesting :o

ModThe DjinnJun 16, 20172 votes

[{quoted}](name=Subject 5,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=xiiTF9cJ,comment-id=00050000,timestamp=2017-06-16T05:21:35.793+0000)Where can I find some information about Nagakabouros? That's sounds interesting :o

Here you go!

The big takeaway is this bit:

_Aol Sol is, at best, a demi-god-- he serves only one reality and exists on only one realm. He mocks humans because they are as small to him as mites to us. BUT comparing him to Nagakabouros is like comparing a dung beetle to the theory of relativity. _

In short, Aurelion Sol gets his giant cosmic space-dragon butt handed to him by a tentacle god that transcends reality as we know it.

PhishnCritsJun 16, 20174 votes

Have we considered Zilean and Ekko because technically they'd know exactly what AurelionSol was going to do before he did it and they both have an infinite amount of attempts to beat him

GreenLoreJun 16, 20173 votes

Zilean experiences the past,not the future and Ekko is done for if Aurelion manages to kill him before he can rewind time(and his time machine is likely not able to rewind time infinitely)

Baron of BreadJun 16, 20175 votes

Zilean experiences all time, all the time. More or less. He can see the future but he can't change anything.

Ekko still lives that time he rewinds, so he still ages from that time (I saw a Rioter say it in an AMA I believe, I probably won't be able to find the source even if I tried). Considering how many tries it would take, if it was even possible, Ekko could die of old age before beating Aurelion even if Aurelion doesn't kill him.

GreenLoreJun 16, 20174 votes

Taken directly from Zileans lore:

He now mentally drifts through time,** from any point he has already lived to the present**, unable to impact the events which unfold.

So no,he doesn't see the future.

Legacy HydralphaJun 16, 201710 votes

http://i.imgur.com/LFYoHxt.gif?noredirect

HalfTangibleJun 16, 20171 votes

Xerath and Syndra are both potentially omnipotent, for one.

GreenLoreJun 16, 20178 votes

Syndra is powerful,but definetly not omnipotent. Xerath is in a similar boat,at least as long as he is bound by that sarcophagus

EpicurusJun 16, 20176 votes

I annoys me a lot when people say Syndra is, or can become, omnipotent. Whatever her powers may be, she has a human mind. If she became omnipotent she would be rendered brain-dead in milliseconds.

PsyrixJun 16, 20174 votes

Omnipotent doesnt necessarily have to include omniscience. People argue Syndra and Xerath have the potential to become omnipotent because they are really the only two mages that seem to hint at having unlimited potential canonically in lore. Additionally we can't just limit a mages mind to what we know about humans, for all we know they could have special adaptations to suit.

PsyrixJun 16, 20171 votes

But yh haha, it's doubtful either are actually omnipotent as no entity so far in league actually is omnipotent, just extremely powerful. It is generally thought however that Syndra will naturally achieve what Xerath had to Ascend to achieve

GreenLoreJun 16, 20173 votes

Honestly we don't know how powerful syndra is compared to Xerath,so its a bit too early to say that she could achieve the same as Xerath.

We've barely seen the 2 in action within the lore,so its hard to compare them. The important thing is that both are a lot more powerful than most other champions(I mean Xerath for example defeated Nasus rather easily and that despite the fact that he is basically bound to a power limiter),but not omnipotent

EpicurusJun 17, 20172 votes

Moments after commenting, I realised I'd confused omnipotence and omniscience in my mind. Silly Epicurus.

Syndra is definitely powerful, but I don't buy that she might become infinitely powerful. Her lore is too old to have a serious discussion about anyway. Having unlimited power is just silly, and detracts from the story, in my humble opinion.

Xerath, I make an exception for, as he is no longer a flesh and blood being. And because his lore is up to date. One can only imagine what he would be like unchained.

HalfTangibleJun 17, 20171 votes

I said POTENTIALLY.

Because Riot has said previously that both characters are theoretically able to become omnipotent.

GreenLoreJun 17, 20172 votes

I never heard of that statement and it sounds more like fanon than anything else.

FasmodeyJun 17, 20172 votes