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@Riot - Champion Modernization

Oleandervine··10 votes·940 views

Riot, Why are these champions and their "visual updates" acceptable as fitting normal modernization to the point where you won't work on them further to actually bring them up to full modern standards (with updated VOs, completely new models and rigging, completely new animations): Alistar Cassiopeia Fiora MissFortune Renekton Shen Sona Singed Maokai

When we have champions re-released like these that make these champions look older and older with each rework that makes them seem more and more half-baked?: Galio Gangplank Heimerdinger KarthusRyze Poppy Taric Warwick And even more on the way.

At what point will the previous category get the love and attention it deserves? You say you will no longer do just VUs - but you've given every champion at the top GUs over the years (except Singed and MF, who got QOL changes), yet they are still saddled with their original vocals (except Cassiopeia, and everyone else still talk to the summoners), their severely outdated animations, their lack of animations entirely (recall, homeguard), and everything else they need to qualify in the same ballpark as the likes of Galio, Poppy, and Warwick. Waiting for another 5 years for you to look at these champs again, when they REALLY will start looking their age (they already do) is just unfair. You guys need to pull the trigger and finish the work you started on these champions, and not wait for them to look truly out of place before you even consider them again.

12 Comments

Gapybo2 votes

They wont get back to those champions anytime soon since they look up to date visually and there are far worse offenders still in the game. They stopped doing those partial model updates anyway and I don't think any of those champions in the first group would even get a full VGU if they never tried with partial VU's.

Oleandervine1 votes

{quoted}

They wont get back to those champions anytime soon since they look up to date visually and there are far worse offenders still in the game. They stopped doing those partial model updates anyway and I don't think any of those champions in the first group would even get a full VGU if they never tried with partial VU's.

I beg to differ. Singed needs a VGU desperately, his playstyle is awkward and in dire need of modernization so that he's less of a pure stat check. Fiora GOT A VGU and they just slapped new paint on an already-feeling-older-rigging. They had ample opportunity to completely modernize Fiora, but half-assed it to the extreme. There's absolutely no excuse as to why they wouldn't completely overhaul while they were in the process of remaking her exterior and overhauling her kit. Shen, also, is in that exact same boat, and even Meddler has stated that Shen should have been a full VGU. Have you seen Shen run? There's no smoothness to it, his feet "click" at his ankles giving him a very inhuman way of moving. And then there's Sona, who looks absolutely atrocious in her base skin. Every single one of these champions could have benefited from larger scale visual and kit work (Alistar flat out got his kit overhauled after Worlds), so it's shameful on Riot for leaving these champions in the gutter with half-ass work done on them.

GreenLore1 votes

The thing is: Why should they give these champs a complete new overhaul when there are champs who need it much more? Akali Mordekaiser Pantheon Chogath DrMundo Irelia Kayle,etc. have a bad looking model,outdated gameplay,short VO and a bad rig. Wheras the partly updated champs at least have a good looking model.

Not to mention that if they ever went back to them again,they would likely keep the new model and just adjust it to the new rig.After all the models are quite good,so there is no gain in throwing them away.

Oleandervine1 votes

{quoted}

The thing is: Why should they give these champs a complete new overhaul when there are champs who need it much more? Akali Mordekaiser Pantheon Chogath DrMundo Irelia Kayle,etc. have a bad looking model,outdated gameplay,short VO and a bad rig. Wheras the partly updated champs at least have a good looking model.

Not to mention that if they ever went back to them again,they would likely keep the new model and just adjust it to the new rig.After all the models are quite good,so there is no gain in throwing them away.

Because those champs I listed, needed extensive work before their half-assed visual work. But because they got half-assed visual work, they are now removed from the queue for the extensive work they need.

GreenLore1 votes

I know that it sucks that their half assed reworks mean that they are likely not going to get any other updates soon,but it can't be helped now.

What matters is that these champs are still in a better spot than many others,thus there is no reason to skip the ones who are more in need for an update.

Oleandervine1 votes

{quoted}

I know that it sucks that their half assed reworks mean that they are likely not going to get any other updates soon,but it can't be helped now.

What matters is that these champs are still in a better spot than many others,thus there is no reason to skip the ones who are more in need for an update.

My whole point is that because these champs were half-assed, they're being skipped because of that exact mentality. They say "We gave them some QOL visual updates. They're good to go for another 5 years!" and thus, these champs are skipped over and considered done. This is not ok in the grand scheme of things. I do understand that there are worse off champs, but these champs were worse off too, and instead of getting the full rework like they should have and like the current worse off champs will get, these champs get guttered in the design department because "there's more worse off champs now that these look fine." Hell, now that Maokai has a new VO and his tank update on the PBE, this essentially means that he's undergone every single aspect of the VGU process EXCEPT for actual rigging and animation updates. The animations and how champions move are arguably the most important element for a champion, and the most telling in terms of their age. Compare champions like Zed, with seamless, smooth walking and animations, versus Shen, who's got jerky foot movements and some erratic animations. This is not acceptable to me, and it shouldn't be acceptable for Riot either. Having incomplete work that they call "finished" live in the game is just tacky and unprofessional on an Electronic Arts level of game design.

GreenLore1 votes

I don't think they are considered done,its just that they are less of a priority now.

I mean imagine if you are a doctor and you have 3 patients who are all suffering from an illness that makes them feel constant pain. You get an experimental cure and apply it to the first person,which lessens their pain,but doesn't completely heal them. Then you get an improved cure that heals the illness of the second person completely. And then you get another dose of the improved cure and you need to decide who'll get this new cure first,the patient who doesn't feel the full pain anymore or the one who still feels the full effect of the illness? Naturally the only logical choice here is to give the improved cure to the 3rd patient who didn't receive any treatment at all.

And its the same here. Riot knows that these champs are still in need of animation updates,its just that there are other champs who are in need of even more than that and who get priority over the others because of it. If they went back now and finished these reworks again,then it would delay the reworks of champs like Urgot Evelynn Mordekaiser Pantheon ,etc.champs who are waiting for their VGUs for years already and need it even more than the others.

TheHappyReaperz1 votes

Riot did add recalls to champions and skins who lacked them. As for most of the champs you listed, their animations/models seem fine atm. The only ones that could use some work are Renekton, and Alistar, although he would lose some of his identity if his model was reworked. The only thing these champions need, are more voice-lines.

Oleandervine2 votes

{quoted}

Riot did add recalls to champions and skins who lacked them. As for most of the champs you listed, their animations/models seem fine atm. The only ones that could use some work are Renekton, and Alistar, although he would lose some of his identity if his model was reworked. The only thing these champions need, are more voice-lines.

This is simply not true, and people who can sit Maokai, Singed, or Miss Fortune side by side with Poppy, Taric, or Galio and tell me that they are on the same level of quality is not telling the truth. They need a helluva lot more work than voice lines, every single one of them.

Regarding the recalls, they flat out said that they were space fillers for the time being, and they cannibalized their other animations to make recalls. These are not real recall animations, like say Poppy hammering the ground and hopping onto her hammer to look out, or Taric swirling his gems around him and invoking light.

TheHappyReaperz1 votes

I'm not saying its the same level of rework quality. I'm saying that they look fine as they are. Maokai has about the same amount of detail in his model as Galio. His abilities look good, his animations are smooth, and he overall is made pretty well. I don't see what other work he would need, besides a new VO.

In regards to the recalls, yes, they are fillers, which mean they will eventually be replaced. However, for the time being, they fit fine.

Oleandervine1 votes

{quoted}

I'm not saying its the same level of rework quality. I'm saying that they look fine as they are. Maokai has about the same amount of detail in his model as Galio. His abilities look good, his animations are smooth, and he overall is made pretty well. I don't see what other work he would need, besides a new VO.

In regards to the recalls, yes, they are fillers, which mean they will eventually be replaced. However, for the time being, they fit fine.

I will give you that for now, they are fine. However, what I dislike is that "for now, they are fine" will turn into "these champions will not receive any more art work done to them until years and years later when they become the new Urgot."

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