@Riot Skin Team - Skin Elitism @ It's Finest

Vanjie · 2016-09-29T15:20:21.195Z

At this point why should anyone even bother trying to give you ideas or writing up posts on skin ideas. You pick the same champions every single year to receive 1350+ skins, the best skin lines, the coolest effects, the most character, the best storylines . . . . and you completely ignore the same champions that receive only one skin every 3 to 4 years and give them the same bland, hardly worked on, unimaginative skins, and 750 or 900 worthy skin. Now here we are, again, giving the same champions a Halloween skin another champion could have benefited from. Does Morgana really need another skin that fits her theme so good? No she doesn't. Does Tristana really need a skin like that? No she doesn't. While I am probably going to end up liking the Teemo skin, again . . . another champion that has so many skins and a 1350 skin . . . . . is getting another great quality skin . . . . HEY! LISTEN! You want to know what champions that could have benefited from a cute Halloween skin line with new artwork or a new way to imagine the character? . I mean . . . . . God forbid you give champions that receive the same looking and bland skins every couple years . . . a new theme and decent quality skin. It's ok. Lux is getting the Ultimate Skin. You decide to give us . Stop saying you care about all of your champions. You only care about the same champions you make decent skins for every single year. You put champions that don't fit skin lines in skins lines for the sake of giving that champion a good quality skins. . Your idea of champion skin diversity is giving us one "OFF THE SKIN LINE ROTATION" skin for one champion the entire year . . . . and that was Blood Moon Kennan. That is your idea of champion skin diversity and caring. Stop saying you care. You don't.

GreenLoreSep 29, 20167 votes

Zyra doesn't get that many skins simply because they require a lot more work for her than other champions,since Zyra has a lot of extramodels in her kit(pretty much all her spells have models on their own and then there are her plants as well)

Sexy Jack RabbitSep 29, 20161 votes

Yeah I'm aware of the work required towards a Zyra skin. However they are pushing towards 4 years now on a skin, there is a point where people aren't considered unreasonable to expect something by now. I'm hoping we'll see something along the lines of Lux's Star Guardian skin, where we receive something extra after all the bs.

GreenLoreSep 29, 20162 votes

Uhm 4 years?I mean Zyra came out 4 years ago,but she got 2 skins in that period,with her last being 2 years ago(though that is still a lot of time to go skinless,so she should get one soon)

Sexy Jack RabbitSep 30, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Uhm 4 years?I mean Zyra came out 4 years ago,but she got 2 skins in that period,with her last being 2 years ago(though that is still a lot of time to go skinless,so she should get one soon)

Zyra got her Haunted skin in 2013. We're 3 months off of 2017. As of October 2016 it has been 3 years since her last skin. I did say pushing for 4 years, not 4 years.
And if we push into 2017 without another that will be pushing onto 4.
Esports skin not counting as they are not part of skin rotations. Almost 4 years, give or take a few months since Zyra has received a skin.

GreenLoreSep 30, 20161 votes

Well in that case your "pushing towards" includes a whole year. And I think the whole "esports-skins don't count"-thing was a rather new rule,so Zyras was still done in a year where it still counted as a new skin.

Sexy Jack RabbitSep 30, 20161 votes

?? It's never been a new rule. Fnatic Janna didn't count and that was the first year we got Esport skins for winning teams. Includes a whole year but like I said, looking at current trends it could end up that way

RavenhaleSep 30, 20162 votes

Esports skins are rotated as frequently as Harrowing or Snowdown skins. Assuming these new skins are for the Harrowing, then I guess any complaints about champions not getting the latest Harrowing skin are invalid because they don't count anyways.

Zyra is in the top ten but she hasn't made top five just yet. I'll list the 12 outliers that haven't received a skin in two years.

1 - Yorick (6/11) 2 - Urgot (3/12) 3 - Swain (5/12) 4 - Cassiopeia (4/13) 5 - Shen [Using TPA (5/13) as last - would be 3rd (4/12) if excluding TPA] 6 - Viktor (10/13) 7 - Rumble (4/14) 8 - Zyra (Using SKT (5/14) - would be 7th (10/13) if excluding SKT) 9 - Heimerdinger (7/14) 10 - Veigar (8/14) 11 - Karthus [Using Fnatic (9/14) - would be 2nd (8/11) if excluding Fnatic] 12 - Jarvan [Using Fnatic (9/14) - tied with Cassiopeia (4/13) if excluding Fnatic]

I'll also add Malzahar [#16 when Using Snow Day (12/14) but would be ahead of Urgot (9/11) if we are dismissing all Legacy Skins]

Also assuming Morgana is in fact getting a Legacy Harrowing skin, that would make all three of her last skins Legacy/Limited (Victorious, Lunar Wraith, Harrowing) which would make Ghost Bride (6/13) her last regular store skin. Throwing out Challenger skins puts Nidalee in the top twenty. See what happens when you dismiss limited and legacies?

The Last BalladOct 2, 20161 votes

They do not consider E-sport skins in factoring the time since a champs last skin, as they have no control over who will win or what champs.

RavenhaleOct 2, 20161 votes

Nonsense. If they requested a skin for someone on the VGU, I guarantee it would be dismissed. They definitely have control on whom they will not make skins for.

For that matter, how did Sivir even get through if the team had always wanted Kalista?

The Last BalladOct 17, 20161 votes

For that matter, how did Sivir even get through if the team had always wanted Kalista?

I assume that they used the champ the team won with or played most often when winning, however, Mr. Adc for last years winning team liked Kalista better and had played her equally during worlds. Not to mention they had to redo all of the skins anyways, as people had such an outcry about them, so it wasn't like it would've cost them any extra work.

Nonsense. If they requested a skin for someone on the VGU, I guarantee it would be dismissed. They definitely have control on whom they will not make skins for.

They do? Well, that shows me. I thought they were one of those machines that you put your penney in and choose the design to be stamped on. That shows me!

Seriously though, in order for the exact circumstance you suggested to come forth, a champ that is in desperate need of a VGU(Urgot, Pantheon, Galio, Warwick, etc.) would need to be not only played a lot by a team during worlds, but the team playing them would have to win, which would be hard as they are far from the best of champs. Looking at the Wiki's information on each years skins, one phrase pops out on all but 2013's, and that is "represent their team composition during the final match". So unless someone wins with Mordekaiser, Urgot, Pantheon, etc before they are revamped, you can't tell me for certain that they would not make a skin for the champ.

Meep ManSep 29, 20161 votes

Taliyah is a little soon for a skin, but would be ok. She's in a period to where I wouldn't be surprised if she did or did not get a skin soon. Bard got a Winter skin. Cassiopeia was reworked not too long ago, so that put her off the skin line for a while. Karma got Warden, but that was a little while ago, so she is about due for a skin. She isn't skin starved though. Syndra I am not sure on. She is a little like Karma I guess. She is probably due for a skin sometime soon.

SukishooSep 30, 20161 votes

Actually Riot recently said that Cassiopeia had been in discussion for awhile in the skins area, so we may see one for her in the coming months.

Taliyah 's issue is more or so that she was a newer champion, being released in May it's only been about 4 months and most skins take at least 5-6 for conception, modeling, animation, ect. So she's coming just gotta wait a bit... of course you can also argue that Ekko got his second like 3 months after his release but it was only a 750 and those take a lot less work then most of their skins (unless it's still a Zyra skin cause even a 750 on her takes a ton of work).

Sexy Jack RabbitOct 1, 20161 votes

I don't think I've seen much on Cassiopeia being in discussion? KateyKhaos mentioned as to why Cass hadn't received a skin in a while, but I didn't see much elaboration. I could be wrong. Taliyah is new, but like in Ekko's case she could easily get a new skin sometime soon. The downside is that she is relatively high scope - low playrate, same goes for Cass. Zyra is a just a monster to make a skin for, albeit there is most likely other reasons beyond workload as to why she hasn't seen a new skin in a while, could be lack of inspiration etc.

SukishooOct 1, 20161 votes

It's was actually right here about 2 weeks ago http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/story-art/vELz7iX5-kateykhaos-any-new-cassio-skins-in-discussions-or-brought-up-elderwoodcassopeia-please?comment=0002 She's been on their minds and could use a skin is what was said. So she could see one sometime soon, in the next year.

Yeah, Taliyah, play rate is kind of meh at the moment but they still do try to give new champions skins as that sometimes helps improve that.

Nah, I'm pretty sure there's plenty of inspiration for Zyra skins, I've seen so many concepts around here... any one of them could happen.

Sexy Jack RabbitOct 1, 20161 votes

Plenty of Designs doesn't equal inspiration. Fan designs are abundant but it doesn't always mean they're good.

A lot of skins come from the skins team becoming inspired, the Program skin line by Kindlejack was an example of this.

Zyra could suit a lot of themes, but it doesn't mean the skin team feels them to be good enough to bother making.

As I mentioned Taliyah is new but she could still easily get a new skin, nothing. rock solid. but it's possible.

SukishooOct 1, 20162 votes

There's plenty that are amazing especially for Zyra even Rioters have commented saying so. The real issue is that she has 7 models to build up for a skin and they've said that takes the same amount of time as a Legendary skin. So that's massive amount of time they have to spend on a skin for one champion every time they want to make a new skin for her, even if it's a 750 skin like her SKT skin.

Sexy Jack RabbitOct 1, 20161 votes

I don't understand why you're telling me this? I already said I'm aware of how difficult a Zyra skin is to make. Rioters comment on a lot of stuff they like, it doesn't really mean all that much. They have opinions, don't hold too much weight to them.

Personally I've found a big majority to be pretty un-inspired for Zyra. Most are just pre-existing skin lines slapped on, Death Blossom is okay, but it's not very fitting considering it's meant to be Arachnid/Insect Exclusive.

I liked Hylia's Mythic Zyra, but otherwise I've not really seen many worth making.

But that is my personal opinion.

There is a difference between Particle effects and Models. The only models featured in Zyra's character are herself, Ranged plants and Short-ranged plants. Her Q, W, E and R are all particle effects. Yes they are still heavy in regards to how much they require to make, but they're still particle effects as opposed to models.

SukishooOct 1, 20162 votes

Who says it's supposed to be Arachnid/Insect Exclusive? Just because two champions of that happen to have it doesn't mean others can't.

I personally didn't see much from Hylia's myself, I saw more from the River Spirit Zyra and/or 4 seasons Zyra (which would have to be an Ultimate if they were to ever do anything like that).

They've said she has 7 models, it used to be 8 with her old passive, so there's more then just those. You have to look at all parts of a champion, as they aren't whole where the creation process is concerned. There's Zyra (1), Plant Melee (2), Plant Ranged (3), Recall (4), Enlarged plants from ult (5-6), Old Passive (7), not sure what the other is but yeah those are pretty much what make her hard.

Sexy Jack RabbitOct 2, 20161 votes

Kindlejack confirmed it himself that the Death Blossom skin line was a skin line built around/dedicated invertebrate that disguise themselves as plants?

It's not impossible for Death Blossom Zyra to happen, but it wouldn't make much sense.

"Death Blossom is inspired by insects (and arachnids) that camouflage by taking on the appearance of flowers. Species of mantis and spider are well known for this trait, hence Elise and Kha'zix sharing this theme."

http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/skin-champion-concepts/wmkMgfAX-the-next-arcade-skin

The bottom paragraph of the 20th red comment along.

I dunno when they said that? Seems more like an assumption. Zyra, Plant Melee and Plant Ranged. Recalls are animations and not models, the Englarged plants are the same model just enlarged like you said, they aren't entirely new models in any way. Enlargement usually just entails increasing the size of the polygons used in the case of Maya.

SukishooOct 2, 20162 votes

That just says " is inspired by insects" it doesn't 100% mean it couldn't happen for something else, but I never liked that theme idea for her anyway so doesn't matter.

It's not impossible for Death Blossom Zyra to happen, but it wouldn't make much sense.

Skins don't need "to make sense" they are alternate looks at a champion, most of which are WAYYYY out there and don't even make sense when you look at them.

I dunno when they said that? Seems more like an assumption.

Zyra, Plant Melee and Plant Ranged. Recalls are animations and not models, the Englarged plants are the same model just enlarged like you said, they aren't entirely new models in any way. Enlargement usually just entails increasing the size of the polygons used in the case of Maya.

I can't quite remember when it was said but it was mentioned that she had 7-8 models.

Yes, but they are separate pieces, recalls usually tend to include new objects (i.e her thrown in Haunted). Another one would be her Seed, since they do have different looks in some skins and that's not a particle since it is what becomes her minions. The enlarged plants would be the same model but again it's another piece that is activated by her ult and only seen then.

Sexy Jack RabbitOct 2, 20161 votes

I'm so done being polite at this point.

Because like I fucking said kid, It's inspired, and I as literally followed up with and you even quoted, just because it was inspired by Insects doesn't mean a non-insectoid champion could get the skin. But considering the skin line is inspired by Insects, it's not going to make much sense.

I don't know if you just don't understand what an implication is, or what??

Secondly, a lot of skins do need to make sense from a thematic level. As much as skins are just for Aesthetics the skins team takes a lot of pride in their skins design. They're not going to give Zed a Bittersweet skin because it simply wouldn't be a viable enough fantasy for his character. They don't need to make sense from a lore perspective, but design wise it's basically necessary.
If skins didn't have to make sense they would just sit with the first design of any skin and ship it, but they don't. They work hard to make each skin make a lot of sense and be appealing at the same time.

Lastly I still don't understand why the fuck you are arguing with me about this XD I already said I understand how hard a Zyra skin is too make, I already know all this bs, I don't know why you continue to hound me on it.
They're separate pieces sure, but eh. It's closer to 4 models, not that her seeds are that taxing animation wise.
It's no reason or excuse for her not to have another skin at some point, if that's what you're even arguing about at this point. It's a lot of work sure, but so is any part of game design.

SukishooOct 2, 20162 votes

Like I fucking said kid

Kid, no that'd be you. I'm 32 thanks and know how to actually stay sensible in a conversation, where you are clearly losing it for no reason.

Actually a lot of skins do need to make sense from a thematic level. As much as skins are just for Aesthetics the skins team takes a lot of pride in their skins design.

They're not going to give Zed a Bittersweet skin because it simply wouldn't be a viable enough fantasy for his character. They don't need to make sense from a lore perspective, but design wise it's basically necessary.

Some of the skins out there don't make much sense theme wise on a champion, it's like people crying out so hard for a Blood Moon Diana, when the skin itself has nothing to do with the MOON. The skins are based on Japanese Kabuki, and thus would still be a fine fit for her but people keep wanting it badly because she is the moon and blah blah blah.

Most skins don't even have lore or look at lore, so that has like nothing to do with this in the slightest.

They could totally give Zed a skin like that, it'd clearly be part of an April fools where they make truly silly skins that totally go outside of the champions existence, so it could happen.

http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/skin-champion-concepts/V8qMmuvY-blood-moon-zyra-concepts?comment=002200000000

"Zyra in her current state is a legendary amount of work to make a skin" she is harder then any champion end of story.

Sexy Jack RabbitOct 2, 20161 votes

Considering the fact you've been nothing but argumentative and dismissive this entire time I can't help but laugh. I swore, it's not like I insulted you personally. Calling you a kid is more a shot at your maturity, then your actual age.

Almost all skins actually have some form of lore behind them in the recent years. Elderwood, Project, heck even Pool Party has a solid lore working with them.

Once again, I'm aware of how hard difficult Zyra is to work on. You have yet to provide a reason. I do not understand why you keep grinding this information into me. She's a lot of work, doesn't mean she doesn't deserve a skin though imo.

SukishooOct 2, 20162 votes

Calling you a kid is more a shot at your maturity, then your actual age.

And yours is showing it's not much so try again :)

Sexy Jack RabbitOct 2, 20161 votes

I'll be honest I did not understand that sentence XD Regardless, I'm done haha. Was a nice convo, ty.

GaleWinUnleashedSep 30, 20161 votes

More accurately, they aren't pushed down the list, they simply are not pushed up.

Sexy Jack RabbitOct 1, 20161 votes

{quoted}

More accurately, they aren't pushed down the list, they simply are not pushed up.

Same sorta diff, doesn't assist their positioning in regards to skins. Doesnt' help a lot of these champions (Much like Zac) are relatively high scope to low playrate, which doesn't make them too appealing.

@Riot Skin Team - Skin Elitism @ It's Finest

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