Any ideas when we might see the Urgot rework?

Eternal791·May 8, 2017·10 votes·21,659 views

Now that Xayah and Rakan and the mid season update are out of the way, does anyone have any predictions on when we'll start to see stuff about the Urgod?

61 Comments

RiotReav3May 8, 201723 votes

Should be sometime after the next new champion. Could always change of course.

Variks the LoyalMay 8, 201715 votes

You sneaky sneaks.

I remember someone saying, sometime after Warwick's rework (I think), that there would be 2 champion releases before Urgot.

i thought what they said was a trick, since Xayah and Rakan are technically two releases, which meant Urgot would be next.

I'll get you next time.

e46 FanaticMay 8, 20173 votes

{quoted}

You sneaky sneaks.

I remember someone saying, sometime after Warwick's rework (I think), that there would be 2 champion releases before Urgot.

{quoted}

Should be sometime after the next new champion. Could always change of course.

They're not bein sneaky ;P 'could always change of course'

Linna ExcelMay 8, 20171 votes

What about Evelynn? Is she going to be before or after that?

GreenLoreMay 8, 20174 votes

Eve is definetly going to be released after Urgot. Urgot is getting worked on by the team that did Warwick,who got his VGU in january. Eve on the other hand is getting worked on by the team that did Galio,who got his rework in march.

So work on Urgot likely started 2 months before they started to work on Eve.

SpideraxeMay 8, 20171 votes

When you guys release the updated champ subclass list will you show Urgot's new subclass if it changed at all

RiotReav3May 8, 201712 votes

We will. Not sure if it will be immediately though. We plan on updating that list every 6 months or so.

MyrkrvaldyrMay 11, 20171 votes

Is the new champ leak coming next month, perhaps?

Raid Boss MordeMay 9, 20172 votes

From the leak, it says that Urgot will be a juggernaut

SpideraxeMay 9, 20174 votes

Leaks aren't guaranteed even if it's been accurate so far especially if they are still heavily WIP

Raid Boss MordeMay 9, 20171 votes

True, but just by looking at Urgot right now, he looks like he should be a juggernaut. I will comment back on this when Urgot is revealed to see if he's actually a juggernaut!

SpideraxeMay 9, 20171 votes

Just want to err on the side of caution since you never know what might change in development

Eternal791May 9, 20172 votes

Yeah I could definitely see him as a juggernaut, though who knows? Maybe he'll end up being a mage.

AtanchanMay 11, 20171 votes

I feel like he's already pretty much a juggernaut / mage, which is an odd, but interesting combo.

BenParadoxMay 11, 20171 votes

I kind of see him as an AD Battle Mage tbh. Sustained spell damage, utility with his ult (also some minor utility with his passive, W slow, and E armor shred), tankiness with W and R, mana scaling on W, ranged but not focused on AA's (though you should auto between Q casts).

RaxistaichoMay 8, 20171 votes

Oh. Is the next new champion going to be a while away?

LeyinMay 9, 20171 votes

Riot said that the time between the new champion and Rakan and Xayah is not so huge.

DigielfMay 10, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Should be sometime after the next new champion. Could always change of course.

another new champion? you just released 2 champions together you should take a break of 3 months from that and focus on the reworks of outdated ones

RiotReav3May 10, 20179 votes

Well we currently have 3 Champion teams, so while 2 were working on Xayah and Rakan the third one was still making a new champion. We are currently evaluating our cadence of New Vs VGU's though (As we do every year or so.) Overtime we will likely start to do more VGU's and less New Champions. With how long it takes to make champions the effects of that shift will take awhile to be seen though.

Nothing drastic or anything. Current thinking is probably shifting to more of a 50/50 New Vs VGU rather then the 60/40 we have now. Overtime this could shift more of course.

ShadowParkerMay 10, 20171 votes

Does the community react more positively to new champions or VGU's?

RiotReav3May 10, 20178 votes

Our recent survey data shows that about 25% prefer new champions, 25% prefer VGU's and 50% don't have a preference between the 2.

T8 SpeedwagonMay 11, 20171 votes

No preference means both are ok or they want something else than those 2?

RiotReav3May 11, 20175 votes

No Preference means they don't care if it's a VGU or a new champion. The view both as the same value.

GarentheonMay 11, 20174 votes

I myself prefer VGUs. And I've noticed that with each new VGU release more and more people seem to be interested in VGUs and want more

GreenLoreMay 11, 20171 votes

If thats the case,then I think it'd be actually better to give VGUs a bit priority.

Because I think the game itself profits more from VGUs than it does from new champions. After all VGUs help to fix existing problems and are probably better when it comes to attracting new players(as they could try out outdated champs first).

FlemmanMay 10, 20171 votes

as the team of rakan and xayah finished the work at the same time (suppose it's them who balance the champ few patch after their released), do you alread know who must produce his new champ first or is it first finished, first released (so team can work on 1 champ while another can release 2 in the same time)

RiotReav3May 10, 20174 votes

While Rakan and Xayah finished at the same time, Xayah was a bit ahead of Rakan in production so they started on the next new champion first. Many members of the team that worked on Rakan also helped out on Rift Herald so that there will be a delay between the next 2 champions those teams work on (Rather then the next 2 they work on coming out at the same time)

I think I wrote that correctly.

GreenLoreMay 10, 20172 votes

Out of curiosity: Who will get their price reduced first?Xayah?Or Rakan?

DecritMay 11, 20173 votes

i guess by that moment hell will be frozen over and warcarft 4 released.

GreenLoreMay 11, 20171 votes

Well it is likely going to take ~6 years,but I'd still like to know if they have a plan for that or not^^

SukishooMay 11, 20171 votes

They should keep the duo theme all the way and reduce them together XD

RaxistaichoMay 11, 20172 votes

How'd they manage to synchronize their production periods anyway? Presumably the designers working on Xayah and Rakan did Ivern and Kled before them, so was Kled's team just twiddling their thumbs for a couple months until Ivern was finished so both teams could get to work on Xayah and Rakan?

what you deserveMay 11, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Well we currently have 3 Champion teams, so while 2 were working on Xayah and Rakan the third one was still making a new champion. We are currently evaluating our cadence of New Vs VGU's though (As we do every year or so.) Overtime we will likely start to do more VGU's and less New Champions. With how long it takes to make champions the effects of that shift will take awhile to be seen though.

Nothing drastic or anything. Current thinking is probably shifting to more of a 50/50 New Vs VGU rather then the 60/40 we have now. Overtime this could shift more of course.

That's good. Honestly I think the reason League has balance issues at all is because you don't take time to deal with dated champions and update them to fit into the current game before adding new things that interact poorly with them. Aatrox is a brilliant example of this.

GarentheonMay 11, 20171 votes

YESSSSSSS!!!!!!

Electro522May 11, 20171 votes

If thats the case, do you guys have any plans for if the VGUs catch up with the New? Eventually, you guys will come to a point where nearly every champ is at a desirable level, especially with these mini-reworks coming out.

By my count, there are currently 25 champs who are in need of a significant rework (all at varying levels, of course). Sure, this list may grow or shrink over time, but even with all of these mini-reworks coming out (Alistar, Rammus, Class updates), that list will surely keep growing smaller and smaller.

Meta NoirMay 11, 20171 votes

Actually they are more than around the double amount, I count 53 (29 VGU & 24 VU) in total.

A small amount is debatable, if they also need some small or even big gameplay changes.

Visual & Gameplay Update:

Nunu Mordekaiser Swain Pantheon Irelia Chogath DrMundo Shaco Rammus Malphite Jax Fiddlesticks Amumu Tryndamere Akali XinZhao Volibear Skarner Kayle Morgana Leona Diana Nocturne JarvanIV Corki Teemo Blitzcrank Udyr Ezreal

Visual Update:

Malzahar Kennen Anivia Veigar Rumble Vladimir Janna Gragas Graves Talon Riven Zilean Shyvana KogMaw Leblanc Olaf Vayne LeeSin Lux Ashe MonkeyKing Lulu Soraka Annie

The lists are also in semi (!) order, what got mentioned to be in top tier ranks for next VGUs with also some logical additions and I tried to put some champs that in my eye fit in different niches of need, champion age and so on, right next to each other.

Important to note is, that ''Gameplay Update'' doesn't automatically mean insanely huge changes. Morgana is a perfect already confirmed example for this and Tristana an already released one. Just small touchups to increase the interaction/flow/satisfaction of the kit.

About the Visual Updates… Riot could safe a lot of resources by just updating a lot of champions just straight via the looks of the updated classic splash arts, together with new VO, SFX, VFX, animations and updated skin splashes like they did with Shen, just giving the concept very small changes to smooth out the appearence for the actual character in that special case, as you can see on his armguards & gameplay related swords (examples: Malzahar -> Riven and Vayne/Lee Sin, Wukong – out of the VGU list: Malphite, Fiddlesticks, Nocturne, Blitzcrank, Udyr, Ezreal). All others, which I didn't mention, probably could need some reconceptuation to fit more in their specific (or not even yet overall chosen) regions in terms of visual design.

Some also could just need their base model and a few older skins updated together with more upgraded stuff as already stated above (Wukong, Riven, Lee Sin, Vayne, Lux, Soraka, Gragas, Annie come to mind).

A lot of champions could also use their Legendary/Ultimate tier skins rig (Ashe, Veigar, Rumble, Teemo, Lee Sin, Anivia, Nocturne), which also would save a lot of resources and speed up the process in general.

There are a very small amount of outliers, which I don't need to name, that also fall under VU, but only need very small work and are totally fine, before these gigantic lists got finished.

But yeah, that's pretty much all that needs to be done to finally make League of Legends an overall consistent game. Only a status update for Grievous Wounds like seen on the Visibility Indicator a few patches ago, modern camps and two different shopkeepers on Twisted Treeline, some modern VFX for already existing items and other stuff missing and very important – a lot of item icons updated to also fit in specific regions of the game (!).

That should be it for the most part!

GreenLoreMay 11, 20171 votes

Annie got already her VU and tbh she looks rather fine ingame. Same goes for Soraka.

Also several of those that you mentioned in the VU-list do need gameplay updates as well(like Kennen or Zilean for example)

Meta NoirMay 12, 20171 votes

''A small amount is debatable, if they also need some small or even big gameplay changes.''

(right at the top of the text – regarding your mention of Kennen, Zilean and others)

''Some also could just need their base model and a few older skins updated together''

(right at start of the middle part of the actual bottom text explanation)

Annie already got her VU, yes.

So did Kayle and she is high in the priority list. Janna, Tryndamere, Ashe and Soraka all got ''Visual Updates'' and yet they still look outdated as hell regarding classic looks, animations, VFX and so on in a lot of those cases. All those happened before Riot defined their modern consistent and timeless standard regarding the actual game theme et cetera.

Visual Updates only started to be modern quality standard with Nasus, Sivir, Garen, Twitch… fitting the redefined world we now can witness in the lore and updated feel of the new Summoner's Rift.

Annie is a modern day ''kawaii'' little school girl with cat ears and a backpack, wearing non-fantastic clothes. That is basically like saying, that Olaf & Pantheon should remain Thor Viking & Leonidas Spartan and Gangplank should have remained Piratey McPirate, as IronStylus, Meddler and I think a lot of other Rioters called it.

Annie base model has nothing to do with Runeterra/Valoran. A Even Caitlyn looks more fitting to the world and yet a lot of players (including myself) & even Rioters (!) want her changed in the future. IronStylus came up with this actual years ago.

Just remembered myself, that Gangplank also already got a VU before his actual relaunch, that made him a modern and timeless champion.

Don't get me wrong, just her classic model needs an update. Literally all her skins are fine.

Soraka's classic model doesn't look like in her splash at all and some tweaks not a huge update would do wonders (not talking about her modern skins, this counts also for several other champions).

Soraka and Annie were mentioned for a reason and I completely forgot about Caitlyn.

Look what they did to Zyra at the Mage Roster Update. A lot of Champions would love this work for their base and several very old skins and overall work. What I actually meant with by

''Some also could just need their base model and a few older skins updated together with more upgraded stuff as already stated above (Wukong, Riven, Lee Sin, Vayne, Lux, Soraka, Gragas, Annie come to mind).''

A lot of individual cases with different specific needs.

I didn't make the comment to get nitpicked on, like what 2 or 3 Champions to not need changes or whatever regarding personal opinions, but to clarify, that there is a giant amount of work needed overall, shown by clear examples.

GreenLoreMay 12, 20171 votes

The thing is that while GP and Kayle got VUs before,these VUs were far older than Annies. I mean those VUs were done in 2011,wheras Annies was done in 2013,the same year that gave us champs like Thresh or Jinx ,who still look good today.

However I agree that her design could need a bit of a change,because it really feels a bit out of place.(then again,her whole background feels out of place)

And yeah you are right that some could need a VU like Zyras base model,but Riot doesn't seem to do these anymore(they didn't do them during the tank update),so currently they only do full VGUs.

JhobiMay 12, 20171 votes

Are you sure about Diana needing a VGU?

Meta NoirMay 12, 20171 votes

Leona & Diana are entangled similar to Morgana/Kayle.

They are described fairly differently in the new lore, at least Diana directly, and the VGU path had more success so far.

''Important to note is, that ''Gameplay Update'' doesn't automatically mean insanely huge changes. Morgana is a perfect already confirmed example for this and Tristana an already released one. Just small touchups to increase the interaction/flow/satisfaction of the kit.''

You already could have gotten the answer by actually reading my comment in a way (friendly banter).

About the looks… the quality standard of Diana already is super high. Even her splash is pretty great and iconic. And when Leona got updated in the massive texture update undergoing, with her new metallic shader, she also started to look really modern. Thing is though, that even IronStylus, their creator, wanted to give them some touchups in the far future to do them more justice, by adding things he learned over the years in terms of conception to them (sorry the sentence might be totally grammatically incorrect abomination).

Diana could be much more thematic and Leona a lot less one dimensional in her combat pattern.

Riot has learned quite a lot over the last years and both could turn out much more fitting/satisfying/skill expressive/versatile/unique.

Several Rioters stated numerous times over the last years, that Diana is a mess, even though she is functional.

There are even recent achievements to maybe give you a better picture!

For example Zac was more than fine before his roster update, but now he is basically a new Sion. Super skill expressive and satisfying to play. He didn't necessarily need changes, but there was so much more room for his thematic and strategic diversity.

Sejuani was a super boring ult bot before and now is an actual champion, that also has pretty unique interactions in her kit and Maokai is in a much more healthy and versatile state with his new unique saplings and balancable ultimate.

All of them just need small tuning adjustment.

Sejuani deals far too much damage as a tank with huge crowd control. Maokais Ultimate is far too dodgable at this rate of turtle/snail speed. Zac is undertuned, but will probably already be fixed next patch.

Closing words… They need it, it would improve them a lot, but there are so many others that probably should be priority and are much more outdated in terms of kit and visuals!

Meta NoirMay 11, 20171 votes

This is actually big & great news hidden in a small thread and now I am just hyped.

Waited for this direction of thought/decision quite a long while. Just glad, that your team is revaluating their priorities!

All your straight relaunches have been huge successes and it is just frustrating having to wait so long to see all of the roster updated to modern standard in terms of gameplay & visuals.

We will for sure already get a big milestone with Urgot Evelynn Nunu Mordekaiser Swain + Volibear .

After this happened all of the total clusterchampions regarding thematic & gameplay will have been remade and from then on things will start to get really interesting in my opinion.

Super excited.

Thank you, Reav3 & ChampUp!

Ashen RiderMay 11, 20171 votes

What exactly does "New Vs" VGU mean?

RiotReav3May 11, 20172 votes

"New Champion" Vs "Visual & Gameplay Update to a Old Champion"

SukishooMay 11, 20171 votes

So with that in mind, it'd be when I predicted and probably around July.

ItsOrvalMay 12, 20171 votes

Any news on when we are getting item sets back?

Also, can we rework DFG? Its so weak, it needs a buff or rework imo. Only about 2 champions use it I think. Jhin Swain

Wind WhistlerMay 13, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Should be sometime after the next new champion. Could always change of course.

I really hope so. It's only been about two months since you removed Galio. I remember Sion, Poppy, and Yorick were a year in between, but it seems to be going so much faster now. Still, 7 months to 2 months is still really short. I'd love it if I had more time to enjoy Urgot before he kicks the bucket.