Boards›Concepts & Creations

[Open Yorick Community Rework] Unearthing the Gravedigger

Keagn·3/22/2015, 6:22:39 PM·3 votes·1,404 views

(Note: Additional questions lay in the comments. Would appreciate you to answer these as well, if not first.)

Update 3/26/15:

TLDR version: Yorick is an extremely complicated fellow, but progress is being made slowly but surely. I'm looking for all kinds of help, especially artists, and have reached out to a few.

Longer Version: Yorick is a pain in the rear in a lot of respects, and is proving quite difficult to capture the idea of which Yorick can successfully be the Gravedigger he's meant to be. Currently, there is some matter regarding the adaptation of his current kit (Omen's of War, Famine, and Pestilence), into new abilities in such a way that responds well and are fun abilities to use (Currently adapted into Shovel of War [Empowered AA which when killing a enemy spawns a ghoul], Soil of Famine [Skill shot which leaves behind dirt which Yorick can attack with a ghoul to rise a ghoul, or use to heal himself], and Pestilent Fog [Damage/Slow AoE centered around Yorick, ghouls deal more damage, but also take more damage within AoE], respectively). An Ultimate has yet to be decided on, but it is unlikely I'll go for his current ult, or even the 5 ghoul-rush squad. I think it makes him too commander-y for an usher/ferryman of the dead. I'd love for him to have an Ult like Mordekaiser, but this is probably out of the question. Reworked Yorick's passive is in a weird place right now, bordering the Thresh/Bard Zone as far as collecting things, but with some balancing acts implemented, the spirits will generate from dead minions/monsters/champions and come to Yorick to be resurrected. I think with some time I can polish Yorick into a pretty BA Gravedigger guy. Lore wise, I want him to be one of the oldest undead of the Shadow Isles, dating back to the Ruined King himself, and having lived pre-undeath. His command over resurrection should feel raw, and ancient, much like Yorick is. Hopefully I can reach a good spot with him, and then get some artists to start improving him visually. I'll be working dialogue, dance, interactions, and whatnot, but I do need artists to be able to get a nice visual representation going. I'd do it myself, but humanoids, especially Yorick, give me a lot of trouble, particularly his face and hunch (pretty essential parts). I've reached out to a few artists, but if there are any volunteers, I'd definitely appreciate it! His face is going to look a lot like Karthus, but bigger, and with possibly cuts in the lines of the cheeks. He'll have his death-robe, a really dark faded red, torn up with a little bit of patch work and some stains, and his shovel is going to look a lot like a tombstone, and the handle will be still wonky, just a little less than it is now. Not quite sure what to do with his lantern yet, but I'm sure I'll come up with something. Thanks for tuning into the update! If you have any suggestions, or know anyone that could help with the project, feel free to help me out here :)

Previously Provided Information: Hello members of the League of Legends Community! My name is of very little importance, but you may call me "Keagn", as is my Summoner Name. I've done a number of skin, reworks, and champion concepts over the years, hopefully improving my "skills" in the craft along the way. I've tackled a lot of different whatnots for the sake of a challenge and to occupy my interests. I've explored new mechanics, taken new looks on old ones, and created a variety of characters, not all of which have seen the light of day (RIP Arden T^T).

But that's not why I've created this post. No, I wish to utilize the massive horsepower of the community to tackle the issues Riot does. We are a team: In the grand scheme of things we all have our ideas on certain subjects, and with such, we could significantly cut down the amount of time needed for something of this scale. Now, for the reason why I gathered you all here:

Yorick has been something of a mess as far as champions go; while Yorick isn't as bad as Urgot per say, he has certainly fallen off in terms of what he could be. Yorick will act as an intro piece for Open Community Reworks (which will be hosted by me), so we'll see where we get. As a starting piece, consider the following:

  • What is Yorick's most definitive thematic element?
  • What is Yorick's most definitive mechanic element (besides ghouls)?
  • Do you think it is necessary for Yorick's ghouls to decay?
  • What play style do you believe Yorick best follows, or should represent?
  • How do you feel about Yorick's passive?
  • How do you feel Yorick's ult fits in with the rest of him (kit, thematic, etc)?
  • Anything else I didn't cover?

These questions are our starting point. The journey may be a lot longer than plain old Pt. A ==> Pt. B, but we'll get through this.

As a necessary disclaimer: I, Keagn, as OP of this discussion allow the ideas put forward in this discussion to be used by RIOT Games if they see fit, so long as some form as recognition to myself and the community is given. Those who contribute to this are under the same agreement, which is affirmed by your provision of ideas. By this extension, you agree to NOT sue RIOT Games for listening to community suggestions.

I had worked on an idea previously that may serve as a good base for this, but does not necessarily have to be used for this. It can be found here.

9 Comments

Booleans3/23/2015, 6:10:03 PM1 votes

I actually created my own Yorick rework a few months back :D. I never posted it, but it seems incredibly relevant to your topic.

Yorick's defining thematic element is that he ferries the souls of the dead. In terms of appearance, his most defining features are his shovel and his lantern.

Mechanically, Yorick's most defining element is not just ghouls, but using ghouls as a source of both damage increase and damage mitigation. Theoretically, having ghouls should noticeably amplify his power and not having them should noticeably decrease his power. This is not reflected well in his current kit.

The whole point of decaying ghouls is so that they have a time limit. This is a good idea, but poorly executed. Currently, the ghouls last the maximum duration unless the enemy actively tries to destroy them. Ideally, they should last the minimum duration unless Yorick actively tries to extend their duration.

The kit I want to see from Yorick is the ability to summon an army of ghouls, as I think Riot's original intention for this champion was.

Missing Number3/23/2015, 8:26:48 PM1 votes

lemme start with saying so far so good with yorick rework concepts, not just in this thread but in your original one too

I like the idea of furthering the concept of gravedigging, but i can't say im happy with losing the ghoul summon frenzy that yorick currently has.

Passive - Shallow Grave Standing over a deceased champion or large monster's body buries it over 2 seconds creating a Shallow Grave (represented by a tombstone). Each monster buried grants 1 stack of Gravedigger's Quota, champions grant 2. Every 10 seconds unearth one Ghoul up to a maximum of 3. If you are standing on a Shallow Grave when unearthing a Ghoul it will be a Ghoul of whatever was buried.

Ghouls Stats + 1% per Quota Stack for each

  • Ghoul Health: 35% of Yorick's maximum health
  • Attack Damage: 35% of Yorick's AD.
  • Armor / Magic Resist:「 10 + (2 × Yorick's level) 」
  • Attack Speed: 0.670
  • Move Speed: 300 / 340 / 390 / 443
Keagn3/24/2015, 11:12:47 AM1 votes

Hey guys, I've heard responses from a few of you, but this is by no means a complete survey! I need a lot more data to make a nice representation of Yorick.

Keagn3/26/2015, 10:09:37 PM1 votes

Okay, so I've spent some time thinking about what makes Yorick tick, and here are some points that I found are pretty consistent:

  • Ghouls should still decay, but there some be some function to keep them going.

  • Yorick is a humble guy, and has been doing his job for awhile mainly because if he doesn't, "who will?".

  • Yorick should feel stronger when he has ghouls, and be more vulnerable when he doesn't.

  • Yorick must always have his Shovel and Lantern (And hunch)

Some types of elements that I've been considering:

  • Attracting souls via his passive, and gaining stacks which he can use to spawn ghouls
  • Focusing on the various aspects his kit contains, like his slow, heal, speed boost, etc. But have these aspects in a new way.
  • Yorick's ult is a bit strange as it sits now. In fact, prior to his release, he had an ability quite similar to Thresh's ultimate, but it was described like Karthus's wall. Yorick's ult is also the only "life-after-death" ability that isn't a passive, unless you count Zilean's ultimate. However, it kind of sits weird considering Yorick isn't a support. Perhaps some changes here should be made as well?

I would like you guys to answer a view more questions if you would. They go as follows:

  1. Do you think Yorick could benefit from attracting spirits, like Bard and Thresh, but for summoning ghouls?

  2. What kind of ultimate would fit best for a solo-lane necromancer like Yorick?

  3. How would you feel if Yorick's ghouls behaved more like Zed's shadows, and Azir's soldiers?

  4. I personally don't believe that Yorick should be a "Commander of Ghouls" as indicated in the ultimate Xelnath has (allegedly) begun to draft. What are your thoughts on this?

Zarxis3/26/2015, 10:19:25 PM1 votes

The main things I really want from a Yorick rework are: I want him to still have references to the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse (I think he should keep the names of his abilities, if at all possible). I want him to be League's premier necromancer and [mobile] minion master. I don't mean that he should be particularly mobile; I mean that he should be the main go-to champion for pets that can move, as opposed to immobile pets, like Heimerdinger turrets and Zyra's plants. I want Yorick's visuals to be updated drastically. His model is ugly and his animations are dull (though his particles aren't too bad). His head juts out of his chest like pre-VU Alistar and Malphite. His hobbling walk is about as attractive as Urgot's blubbery gut, and it doesn't add to his character. I can live with him having bad posture/slight forward leaning/slouching, but I don't want his head to be a tiny third nipple on his chest.

His ghouls could use a slightly larger hitbox; they're nearly impossible to click on.

In response to some of Keagn's questions: I think the ghouls should remain targetable (like a Malzahar Voidling), not static objects (Zed shadows and Azir soldiers). I do think Yorick should retain his shovel and lantern. I'd be fine with a sort of "gathering mechanic" (like Bard and Thresh)... Perhaps he could wander around digging graves for dead minions/monsters? I'm not sure how it could be integrated into his kit without it being overbearing or making him rely on it too much. I don't think Yorick should have to perform a "gathering" mechanic just to have any ghouls in his kit (remember, Riot chose not to force Bard to gather chimes to get more Meeps— they have an independent cooldown and simply appear automatically). Yorick's ultimate is fine as-is. It doesn't do much to enhance his lane-bullying, it fits thematically, and it allows Yorick to make plays later in the game. I think that Yorick's basic abilities should allow for him to interact with his ghouls and direct them against his opponent; I don't think his ultimate should be some sort of "ghoul swarm" attack that makes him a "ghoul commander." The current way ghouls decay is bothersome for both Yorick and his opponents... It's very difficult to time when to last-hit the ghouls for the opponent, and they don't last long for Yorick. I'd prefer that they were changed to be permanent until killed. This would require some interesting rebalancing to prevent Yorick from becoming too strong (ex: only one ghoul of each ability out at once), but it would reinforce Yorick's minion-master/necromancer theme and gameplay style. Currently, the ghouls serve as little more than weak extensions of Yorick's abilities; I want them to be useful in and of themselves. Yorick's passive enhances himself and his ghouls... But his ghouls tend to die too quickly for them to help Yorick, and they still decay at the same rate despite gaining stats from Yorick. Again, I think the ghouls should be made permanent until killed.

Ideas: E could be used to both summon an Omen of Famine (red) ghoul and direct your current ghouls to attack a specific target. W could be used to both summon an Omen of Pestilence (green) ghoul and direct your ghouls to move to a certain location. -Q could be used to both summon an Omen of War (white) ghoul and direct your ghouls to return to Yorick.- Edit: Ignore the Q idea; that would lead to Yorick's ghouls simply running back and forth between Yorick an his opponents.

Keagn3/27/2015, 2:03:11 AM1 votes

Post has been updated with the following information:

Update 3/26/15:

TLDR version: Yorick is an extremely complicated fellow, but progress is being made slowly but surely. I'm looking for all kinds of help, especially artists, and have reached out to a few.

Longer Version: Yorick is a pain in the rear in a lot of respects, and is proving quite difficult to capture the idea of which Yorick can successfully be the Gravedigger he's meant to be. Currently, there is some matter regarding the adaptation of his current kit (Omen's of War, Famine, and Pestilence), into new abilities in such a way that responds well and are fun abilities to use (Currently adapted into Shovel of War [Empowered AA which when killing a enemy spawns a ghoul], Soil of Famine [Skill shot which leaves behind dirt which Yorick can attack with a ghoul to rise a ghoul, or use to heal himself], and Pestilent Fog [Damage/Slow AoE centered around Yorick, ghouls deal more damage, but also take more damage within AoE], respectively). An Ultimate has yet to be decided on, but it is unlikely I'll go for his current ult, or even the 5 ghoul-rush squad. I think it makes him too commander-y for an usher/ferryman of the dead. I'd love for him to have an Ult like Mordekaiser, but this is probably out of the question. Reworked Yorick's passive is in a weird place right now, bordering the Thresh/Bard Zone as far as collecting things, but with some balancing acts implemented, the spirits will generate from dead minions/monsters/champions and come to Yorick to be resurrected. I think with some time I can polish Yorick into a pretty BA Gravedigger guy. Lore wise, I want him to be one of the oldest undead of the Shadow Isles, dating back to the Ruined King himself, and having lived pre-undeath. His command over resurrection should feel raw, and ancient, much like Yorick is. Hopefully I can reach a good spot with him, and then get some artists to start improving him visually. I'll be working dialogue, dance, interactions, and whatnot, but I do need artists to be able to get a nice visual representation going. I'd do it myself, but humanoids, especially Yorick, give me a lot of trouble, particularly his face and hunch (pretty essential parts). I've reached out to a few artists, but if there are any volunteers, I'd definitely appreciate it! His face is going to look a lot like Karthus, but bigger, and with possibly cuts in the lines of the cheeks. He'll have his death-robe, a really dark faded red, torn up with a little bit of patch work and some stains, and his shovel is going to look a lot like a tombstone, and the handle will be still wonky, just a little less than it is now. Not quite sure what to do with his lantern yet, but I'm sure I'll come up with something. Thanks for tuning into the update! If you have any suggestions, or know anyone that could help with the project, feel free to help me out here :)