[MODERATION] Moderators should MOVE misplaced posts, not just delete them.

Okay, if our content is removed, how about it's saved so that we can just copy & paste it into the appropriate board so that our time doesn't go to waste?

**Edit: Yea I know we have that, sorry guys. **

Thanks for taking time for writing such a nice reply. While your point 1. isn't very convincing, since moving is actually COPY and DELETE, so it's pretty much the same as if the user posts it again in correct forum, the point 2. makes sense.

But there's a problem - some of the content you delete is high-quality, though misplaced. And it's often not reposted (or I can't find it). And the replies of the people on that post are also lost forever. So sorry Tamat, but what are you actually doing is making moderation easier at the cost of stealing good content from the boards. I do believe this makes the boards cleaner. I can see how well and fast it works.

But it's really like shooting anybody who walks on red lights on the road. Maybe he hurried to save someone's life...

I agree to a point, but mainly disagree with you. My reason being, having served as a mod where I had to move posts around on a forum, I found that when people were notified that their post was in the wrong place, people usually were pretty good about putting them in the right forum afterward. Deleting them is frustrating, especially when there is no feedback as to where they were supposed to go anyway. This has resulted in me rarely posting my own posts since i don't want to spend forever writing a post, to only have it deleted. This happened back when battlecast skarner was released and I took over about an hour writing and I never rewrote it even though I feel it was valid feedback, however it was deleted with just a note saying it was posted in the wrong spot.

I disagree. I have moderated on forums before and know it can be annoying when people post in the wrong section. However, I also know that most people will learn where to post things if when you move a post, you notify them that it is in the wrong spot. I have posted a few times here, but rarely make my own post since I'm not always sure where certain posts go. One I spent almost an hour writing a long super detailed piece of feedback on Battlecast Skarner only to have it deleted because I posted it in the wrong spot. Notifying people that they posted in the wrong location, and then telling them where to post in the future teachers people where to post. I found when I moderated that most people only needed one or two times and they figured out where stuff belongs. Stop deleting and start moving posts that are in the wrong area.

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Hey there. Appreciate that feedback! This particular subject is one that both Pendragon and I have commented on in the past, but I wanted to jump in here to explain why we delete instead of move. The biggest thing to remember is that there's not ONE appropriate board for each piece of content posted. Typically there are several boards that would work, and you don't have to choose just one. It's a matter of relevancy as set for each board. Exceptions are illustrated in the Guidelines for each board.

Anyway, here's are the most glaring reasons for why we delete verses move.

1. When content is posted, a bunch of math begins to happen behind the scenes to determine how it is sorted. As content matures (is voted on, viewed, etc) it's sorting will change. If we move something once we discover that it's inappropriate for the board it was posted it, that has an impact on the content in question, but also other content in the board it's moved to. It's fairly complicated to fully explain, but the TL;DR is that moving content causes problems.

2. Moving content is not scalable. You can give a man a fish, or teach a man to fish. Moving content for you guys wouldn't solve the problem long term, it would make it worse. Since we started deleting stuff instead of moving it, there's evidence to suggest that boards users spend more time thinking about where they post content before they do so. If it didn't matter where you posted crap because the mods would fix it, I believe we'd be digging ourselves a hole that would hurt everyone long term.

3. Returning to a board and not seeing the content you posted is jarring. This is true whether the content is deleted, or moved. We know its frustrating when you have to repost the content you spent time posting, but we try to make it as easy as possible for you by providing you with the content that was posted.

I'm more than happy to go back and forth on this. In all my years of moderation, this is the first time that moving content was not a thing. It was pretty difficult for me to get used to as well, but I do believe it's the best course of action for the health of the Boards.

The issue I have is when someone types a good 10 paragraphs on a very well written subject, and it is obvious that they accidentally posted it in the wrong section and the mods delete a good 45 min worth of writing when you know they could have easily just moved it or let them know to move it.

{quoted}

Hey there. Appreciate that feedback! This particular subject is one that both Pendragon and I have commented on in the past, but I wanted to jump in here to explain why we delete instead of move. The biggest thing to remember is that there's not ONE appropriate board for each piece of content posted. Typically there are several boards that would work, and you don't have to choose just one. It's a matter of relevancy as set for each board. Exceptions are illustrated in the Guidelines for each board.

Anyway, here's are the most glaring reasons for why we delete verses move.

1. When content is posted, a bunch of math begins to happen behind the scenes to determine how it is sorted. As content matures (is voted on, viewed, etc) it's sorting will change. If we move something once we discover that it's inappropriate for the board it was posted it, that has an impact on the content in question, but also other content in the board it's moved to. It's fairly complicated to fully explain, but the TL;DR is that moving content causes problems.

2. Moving content is not scalable. You can give a man a fish, or teach a man to fish. Moving content for you guys wouldn't solve the problem long term, it would make it worse. Since we started deleting stuff instead of moving it, there's evidence to suggest that boards users spend more time thinking about where they post content before they do so. If it didn't matter where you posted crap because the mods would fix it, I believe we'd be digging ourselves a hole that would hurt everyone long term.

3. Returning to a board and not seeing the content you posted is jarring. This is true whether the content is deleted, or moved. We know its frustrating when you have to repost the content you spent time posting, but we try to make it as easy as possible for you by providing you with the content that was posted.

I'm more than happy to go back and forth on this. In all my years of moderation, this is the first time that moving content was not a thing. It was pretty difficult for me to get used to as well, but I do believe it's the best course of action for the health of the Boards.

Ok so its a "problem" to move vs just delete/remove. at least tell the poster in the message to them the place/places their post would be acceptable so they can place them properly. This would solve many confusions and should stop some of the complaints.

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3. Returning to a board and not seeing the content you posted is jarring. This is true whether the content is deleted, or moved. We know its frustrating when you have to repost the content you spent time posting, but we try to make it as easy as possible for you by providing you with the content that was posted.

If you delete something that I spent many paragraphs and hours composing because its in the wrong board, then I can assure you not only will I NOT spend more time to repost the lost content, I'll leave the forums and the game as well.

#1.

As content matures, its sorting will change. If we move something once we discover that it's inappropriate for the board it was posted to, that has an impact on the content in question, but also other content in the board it's moved to.

While this statement is basically fluff, I understand what you're getting at. Threads being moved are affected differently by the sorting conventions present in each individual board.

That being said, is there any particular reason you can't move just the content of the thread rather than the vote totals and how they affect sorting? Threads should never be getting to the point where they are well-established with high vote totals and comment density before they are deleted, and I have trouble seeing an instance where moving a thread with 5-10 comments from a different board to the one that's relevant would be a particularly bad thing.

#2.

Since we started deleting stuff instead of moving it

When was moving the default rather than content eradication?

There's evidence to suggest that boards users spend more time thinking about where they post content before they do so.

What metrics are being used to support this evidence? If this conclusion is primarily based on how often users post content in the wrong location, we're kind of just looking at correlation and ignoring potential tangential causes. For example, if content is not properly explained when deleted, users may just not even bother continuing to add novel value to the platform. This might technically mean the user posts in incorrect locations less often, but it may potentially be stifling.

If it didn't matter where you posted crap because the mods would fix it, I believe we'd be digging ourselves a hole that would hurt everyone long term.

One would assume this is the case, but historically (through forums that allow moving) it just doesn't happen. With properly scaled punishments and effective guidance, it's pretty unlikely for someone to repeat a mistake like misposting. From a psychological standpoint, people don't generally work on something with the intent of making a mistake. If they are intentionally making mistakes, they probably deserve a punishment that differs from those that are clearly just misguided.

Using your fishing analogy, I would honestly consider moving to be like teaching a group of people to fish. Moving a thread with a clear public moderation message not only specifically addresses the OP, but it's also something other people can view and learn from. Deletion would be more like handing a man a fishing rod and telling him how not to catch a fish, and I just don't think that's as effective a learning tool.

#3.

Returning to a board and not seeing the content you posted is jarring.

Agreed. It's tough to see that something has been removed, and I'm glad this is being improved. I actually have a quick question: When a reply (not a thread) is deleted, does the moderation message show the actual content yet or does it just link the user to a comment that just says "Deleted"?

I'm more than happy to go back and forth on this.

I sincerely hope this is the case, because historically this has been difficult.

Edit: Over a week later, no response. I understand you're a busy man, but this is a consistent pattern. If you mention on a thread that you would like to have a discussion or go back and forth, it's important to follow through on that statement.

Man. I didn't say these messages are vague. I never got my post deleted, so I actually don't even know what they look like. But I had to report several quality posts that were unfortunately here, in boards feedback, instead of other sections. And they were gone, forever, along with my replies.