I just had a game where I was the only one who voted no to an early surrender. Then my team said "we are done" and "open bot" and just let them push bot without defending. I am sick of the defeatism of this community that has accelerated in the past year. I remember when everyone would work extra hard to mount a comeback when behind. Nowadays you get called a troll for clicking no.
Brain Errör 40418 votesYou realize the difference between previous seasons and this season is the fact that it's next to impossible to come back now, right?
Unless 1 person on your team is fed and you guys can effectively play around them or you FEEL that the enemy team is making simply mistakes, it's better to ff right then and there. If you guys are down 10-0 by 10minutes, ff. I'd agree that games are comeback worthy. But there's fewer comeback moments than most people think. If it's a Bronze - low gold game, I can see where ff'ing would be pointless. High gold and up, I'd expect people to be competent enough not to throw a substantial lead.
Jo0o7 votesYou realize the difference between previous seasons and this season is the fact that it's next to impossible to come back now, right?
Unless 1 person on your team is fed and you guys can effectively play around them or you FEEL that the enemy team is making simply mistakes, it's better to ff right then and there. If you guys are down 10-0 by 10minutes, ff. I'd agree that games are comeback worthy. But there's fewer comeback moments than most people think. If it's a Bronze - low gold game, I can see where ff'ing would be pointless. High gold and up, I'd expect people to be competent enough not to throw a substantial lead.
You don't know OP's game, though.
I agree that we're in a highly snowball-centric meta, but throws happen all the time. You gotta at least adhere to the surrendering guidelines. If a surrender vote fails, you don't get the right to veto that vote by actively giving up.
Ellis Dee3 votesyes you do. free will. if you don't like it go get f'd.
HalcyonDweller1 votesAnd get banned? Sure, go ahead.
HalcyonDweller4 votesIt's not your place to decide for your other 4 teammates.
Doing so is selfish and stupid.
Ellis D2 votesIt's not riots place to tell me how to act while i'm gaming but they do the fuck out of that shit don't they
HalcyonDweller1 votesActually, they created this game and they wrote the EULA that you agree to every time the game updates with a patch.
If you decide to break the terms of that agreement and be a shitty person, you bet your ass they have a right to punish you.
UkeNeverSeme3 votesYour name really doesnt add up with your antisocial statement...
R31W1NG3 votesremember, all utopias are intristically distopias... his name makes perfect sense
Miss Shimmer1 votesI disagree. I won a ranked solo game 4v5. Our team's Draven was afk in the fountain the entire game. We tried to remake, but the Draven had connected then disconnected so we couldn't. We were behind but after the surrender vote failed we decided to work together and keep trying! I am plat 5 btw!
MUSHROOM MIDGET14 votesyou are wasting the time of 4 teammates because you are a dreamer. wake up to reality and let your teammates move on with their lives
DrCyanide2 votesIt takes 2 to fail a surrender vote. At most he can be "wasting" 3 people's time.
Jo0o5 votesWell, not a 15-minute vote, which I think is what the OP was referring to.
ChaosThief5 votesThere was a time where the average game lasted 40 minutes. Now people assume that every player is has such a defeatist attitude that you have to finish the game in a 15/20 minute surrender.
This is not fun for either team. There was a time where people could pick late game carries and wait it out, now if you're not clearing winning by the 10 minute mark it's an instant "wait to 15 and surrender."
Leetri2 votesThe average game time hasn't gone down that much, it's still 25-30 minutes depending on rank.
ChaosThief3 votesThat's still a significant drop in the game time. That cuts off at the minimum 25% of the game length.
This is also not counting the significant amount of times where the game is already over because the player's minds on one team have already left the game and counted the game as a defeat. Player mentality has dropped quite a bit since the time of 40 minute games being the average.
korg0232 votesExactly! if its lost game and 4 people vote yes and only one votes no i am going afk and let that one optimist waste his time.
Has No Team8 votesHonestly if you are the one that wants to be there and four people don't want to be then just let them leave. They're already tilted and you should just get out of there before you try to one man a game and also get tilted.
Jo0o4 votesThey can always force a surrender five minutes later. Surely if it were intended for four people to give up the game at 15 minutes, the 15-minute surrender option wouldn't have been made unanimous, no?
Has No Team6 votesHonestly i think the 15 min surr vote is toxic and promotes tilting. Still if your team shows they don't want to be there and a surr vote has that many yes votes... It's time to gtfo because those dudes are tilted and you stand to gain nothing but tilt from that team.
Jo0o4 votesRegarding the 15-minute vote, we agree there.
It seems to be a concession to how snowbally the game is, and even when the vote fails, morale has taken a huge hit. But I still sympathize with the OP: People give up over tiny setbacks, and it's at least the hope of players that think they can win for their teammates to respect the result of the vote.
I was in a game last night where my ADC and support kept flaming each other, the ADC would spam surrender votes, the support would agree, and our jungler randomly agreed too. So we had multiple 3-2 failed votes throughout the game, starting at 15 minutes. Everybody voting 'yes' was either too tilted or too oblivious to notice that I had pushed top lane all the way to the inhibiter, solo'd Rift Herald, and was systematically breaking objectives across the map. It was a shaky game for a while, but we wound up winning pretty decisively.
So, less a "comeback" story and more a "bad time to surrender" story, but hey, I was outnumbered in those votes and we still won.
Hawckey8 votesBAFFLES me that Dorito thinks it's a good idea to require 5 people to say yes to an early vote. There will always be someone either trolling or being delusional so there's no point of even having it. Idgaf, 4 people's opinion matters more than the one fkin guy. If you're that one guy YOU'RE the one being selfish
OP Garen Support2 votesExactly. When we are behind 20 kills and at least 3 turrets, only those guys that are 0 5 0 KDA or worse vote for no. Yesterday I had 3 feeders vote no when the game was obviously lost. That is the problem. If I the 1 who is the only 1 who is not overfeeding the enemy thinks the enemy is better or they are way more fed then me thinks that I got no chance to beat them, why can the feeders decide to waste more of my time? Their selfishness of making people who play decently hostage so that they have a chance to be carried is annoying.
Anyone with stat like 0 5 0 should have no right to vote no. They clearly deserve the loose.(the enemy was better that is all move along with your life instead of wasting time for everyone)
Overall people who vote no :
-The dreamer who thinks every game is salvageable even if its 30 - 0 for the enemy team at 20 minutes. -The troll who decides not to surr just to piss of the team.(these guys usually have a premade as well) -The noob feeder who wont surr even if he counts as -1 so its more of a 4 vs 6 then a 5 vs 5 -The actual fed guy who think he can carry the trash teammates
out of 10 games only maybe 1 is winnable
If we manage to win that 1 game I usually very exhausted and tilted for hours. Usually we win because I was outperforming myself and manage to carry but it is so not worth the amount of brain cells I loose for boosting people who do not even belong to silver in my gold games.
I never feed intentionally but sure as hell I am not motivated to do my best for people who decided to make us suffer for no reason.
Dasdi963 votesBAFFLES me that Dorito thinks it's a good idea to require 5 people to say yes to an early vote. There will always be someone either trolling or being delusional so there's no point of even having it. Idgaf, 4 people's opinion matters more than the one fkin guy. If you're that one guy YOU'RE the one being selfish
There is nothing selfish about wanting to play out a game to the end. Once you queue for a game, you are obligated to stay and put your best effort until the nexus explodes.
Raoul4 votesYes, it is selfish to hold 3 other people hostage just because you and a buddy have some "never surrender even if its lost" attitude, which will just end in a lose 20 minutes later.
AirKingNeo1 votesAnd yet you are also obligated to be sportsmanlike towards team members. There's a reason many games/sports have a function called "mercy rule".
DoktorKaiser6 votesYeah I would agree with you 5 years ago, 2 years ago, maybe even a year ago, but not now. You know when was the last time my team made a comeback (not counting enemies being absolute retards and literally refusing to finish the game) ? I honestly cant recall. The game is so fucking snowbally that its impossible to come back any more. So sorry, but these days I just go and fuck around (not inting) if my team refuses to surrender an obviously lost game because its literally just a waste of time and my nerves. Its sad for me to behave this way because I always spoke against it, but times have changed and the game is much shittier now thanks to RITO wanting shorter games for fucking casuals...
Has No Team3 votesI would agree with you about staging a comeback being difficult but I disagree that it's because of snowballing. The game feels the opposite. It used to be one guy on your team could snowball and carry. Now it feels more like whoever can better prevent someone from chimping out on their team wins. Moron mitigation is like the biggest thing this season.
DoktorKaiser4 votesOh yeah definitely, I remember when I used to go fucking beast on my Jax, Galio or Orianna in season 2 and solo carry everyone. Nowadays its almost impossible unless you are playing a noobstomper vs noobs, but its much more common for a team with the biggest idiot in the game to lose it because of that idiot. Its not about your skill any more, its much more about how lucky you are not to get a feeder/troll/ragequiter and its a step in the wrong direction definitely. Yes this is a team game and thats all nice, but its never a good idea to make you depend on someone else to win in an online game without giving you a chance to win it all yourself. That is why I am lately going back to Counter Strike which I played for 10 years before moving to League and the reason I quit CS were cheaters, but if I have to choose between cheaters and depending on random online people not being mentally challenged, I choose cheaters honestly.
Ellis Dee2 votesyou are the only smart person in this thread!
Ash Lockheart6 votesI just had a game where I was the only one who voted no to an early surrender. Then my team said "we are done" and "open bot" and just let them push bot without defending. I am sick of the defeatism of this community that has accelerated in the past year. I remember when everyone would work extra hard to mount a comeback when behind. Nowadays you get called a troll for clicking no.
Come backs have changed. Not because of players. Its the direction Riot has taken with the game. Towers being the biggest change. I remember back in the day when towers took time to get down, and it allowed late games to happen, and that's what allowed players to get better over time during the match. This also allowed champs who's kit was made for late game to give match's more of a 50/50 chance to win or lose. After all the changes many champs are in a very bad spot because they are more effective late game, and not early or mid. How ever the changes have made fast games more effective. So when your games are lasting avg 15 to 20, and not longer you end up cutting out half of the roster for champ select because those champs can't get to late game. Players know this and that's why the mentally is now to give up rather then drag the loss out.
You can't blame players for wanting the game to end fast rather then dragging it out knowing its easyer then ever now to back door and not have to work so hard on towers, and inibs. There are even enough videos out there showing how easy it is to down towers and end games less then 10 mins. Its not the players fault. Its the choice Riot wanted to take.
Towers use to prevent people from 3v2 under it. You could get the kill, but you would still end up trading. So riot did not like the. They wanted people to take the risk, and get away by the skin of there teeth. They didn't like the idea of pulling off a combo, and then dying still to the tower. Even though the whole point of the training they give you for new players tells you to stay behind the tower when low, and they also show the zone of the tower so you can get a idea of what you should do. As it stands Riot has made it clear they are happy with how towers, and minions are, and there are no plans for change. So at the end of the day the match is base more off of how good the snowballing is at the start of the match. Is there still a chance to win the match with high snowball? Yes, but lets not lie to our self's. The chances are smaller then ever trying to turn a match around, and giving the fact one single match could be as long as a hour and still end in a loss it will still not feel worth it.
The other part you have to take into account is how much points you lose vs win in a match. So your weighing time of the match, points for win or loss, what champs your dealing with in the match, There skills, and knowledge of items, and how they use them, how your own team is doing when it comes to fights, and the choices they are making, and what items they are building. At the end of the day there's a lot to think about. That kind of thinking is pretty over whelming with knowing have fast you have to react in the game.
You can try hard for the win yes, but ask your self one thing when making that choice. Do you think the enemy team is willing to 5v5 and risk a bad out come or do 4v5 and back door when the fight breaks out?
Raoul5 votesYeah, i totaly LOVE to waste 20 more minutes of my life because the super positive duo queue thinks that 1/15 at 15 minute games can still be turned around even though all lanes lost and our jungler got bullied out of his own jungle already.
Jo0o3 votesDunno what sad clown downvoted this. You're 100% right.
Martensitic11 votesWell, I wasn't the one downvoting him, but I'm certainly gonna downvote you.
People have every right to agree and disagree with opinins as THEY see fit, not as YOU see fit.
BigBellBrute4 votesWell, I wasn't the one downvoting him, but I'm certainly gonna downvote you.
People have every right to agree and disagree with opinins as THEY see fit, not as YOU see fit.
A downvote should be for something so bad it deserves to be hidden, NOT for an otherwise decent post someone personally disagrees with.
Martensitic5 votesI decide what I downvote and why, comprende?
Lux or Rando3 votesOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MIDOPEN MID OPEN MID
ElfOfTheDesert3 votesOPEN THAT MID BABY. OPEN IT SO HARD!
AirKingNeo3 votesYou're going to lose anyways once 20 minutes comes around by a 4-1 vote. I don't see the point in selfishly wasting the time of others.
korg0231 votesGO UP :D
JESUSSAYSNO3 votesIt does when the team's score is 4-12 at 15 minutes, with the deaths spread across multiple lanes.
It's so much faster to surrender at 15 than play out a 35 minute stallfest only to lose because you have no jungle and cant push out past base.
korg0232 votesI dont get why people downvote you, if my botlane has 0/7 at 10 mins im not going to play anymore since its auto lost. Why playing vs fed Caitlyn is considered fun and not waste of time? Imagine if your mid and bot feed and are like 0/11 at 12 min of the game and you are top lane Nasus,just go in base and wait out surrender vote my friends.
MillForMe2 votesWhile I definitely understand the point of not playing with 4 people who gave up at 15, I value the chance of winning enough to wait 5 minutes for them to revote at the 20 minute mark.
The game is super snowbally, but comebacks are really easy. The issue is the skill and mentality of the players now. Getting your whole team to prioritize vision or objectives. Getting your team to turtle safely. Getting your jg to stay near objectives.
These things aren't universally picked up as you move up in rank and it's actually upsetting, imo.
A team that can safely defend their towers while actively fighting the vision war is a team that can come back.
joker bam bam2 votesWhat the hell?! What am i reading? Comebacks are nearly impossible this season?
Well im afraid that is not right lul. I am master tier at the moment and throws happen so often untill diamond 1.Literally any lead can be thrown and lets be real here , u will never be 0/20 in each of these games that u throw a min 15 surrender , in fact there will be a very small amount of games in wich your team actually goes 0/10 or 0/20 or shit like that , usually you are just behind in a good amount of kills and u can always comeback if you have the experience or awareness about how to do it.
So pls , im sick of all these comments saying that comebacks are nearly impossible rofl , fuck off , they are only impossible when you are just as bad as every1 in your elo.
korg0232 votesAgain one of those "moral" posts. We get it "this is bad to do!" posts are all the time on main page its almost like "stealing is bad,dont do it!" we get it dude its common sense. Everyone knows that saying "open mid" if your team wants to try and play is bad not just after surrender vote fail but in all situations. Also making this post is never ever ever ever going to change that,people will open if they are frustrated,so behind,dont have will or wish to move on, or just tilted. So this post is useless my friend.
OP Garen Support3 votesYep you cant expect your teammates to perform perfectly if you are holding them hostage in a lost game. If you think the game is salvageable then prove it to them. Show them how good you are at carrying. (if you were feeding all game and still refuse to give up when you deserve the loose then you are toxic player)
ESeTyRC1 votesSummer break.
AfterTheFall1 votesI do it. Quite often. If the game is a lost cause then it makes it end quicker. The snowballing in this game is still way too much. Comebacks are few and far between anymore. Some games are just completely one-sided and its ok to admit defeat. Just accept it and move on to the next one. Unfortunately some ppl cant accept that fact