a compromise for the "permamute vs permaban" debate

scazzman·Jun 5, 2016·1 votes·669 views

if a player recieves a 14 day ban for a chat related offense, they are permanently chat restricted once they are unbanned. and banned from ranked rewards and hextech until the end of the season, if a permanently chat restricted player is toxic while chat restricted, the chat restriction would give them less and less messages per game. until theyre permamuted which if this happens cannot be undone. if a permanently chat restricted player shows signs of reform. they are given more messages per game the longer they stay untoxic. and at a certain point. regain access to allchat and have a seperate amount of messages specifically for allchat. but still stay chat restricted

33 Comments

Angry MonsterJun 5, 20164 votes

So the problem with your thread is that the topic is not up for a debate. perma mute was tried and is considered a failure for LoL. Riot is not interested in changing the current system.

Anyone who thinks that Riot is interested in perma muting after 2 years of attempts and data is fooling only them selves.

scazzmanJun 5, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Angry Monster,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=ihFk5eWA,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2016-06-05T01:40:58.910+0000)

So the problem with your thread is that the topic is not up for a debate. perma mute was tried and is considered a failure for LoL. Riot is not interested in changing the current system.

however. it would be done on top of the 14 day ban. instead of as an additional step

Angry MonsterJun 5, 20163 votes

No, either they reform or the player can shoot themselves in the foot and be banned. I am a firm believer of minimum standards (in a general sense not just behavior). If a player can not learn to act in a expected bare minimum way they should be removed.

I see no reason to help players with behavior problems. Most people can act in the expected way. Why should league cater to the player base that is considered undesirable?

scazzmanJun 5, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Angry Monster,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=ihFk5eWA,comment-id=000100000000,timestamp=2016-06-05T01:48:58.191+0000)

No, either they reform or the player can shoot themselves in the foot and be banned. I am a firm believer of minimum standards (in a general sense not just behavior). If a player can not learn to act in a expected bare minimum way they should be removed.

I see no reason to help players with behavior problems. Most people can act in the expected way. Why should league cater to the player base that is considered undesirable?

because for a good chunk of them. the issue isnt "i dont want to change" but rather "im sick of it" and/or "i cant stop"

Angry MonsterJun 5, 20161 votes

Well then riot helps them stop by removing their account.

This seems to be another belief problem. Either you believe that they are incapable of learning or they themselves believe that they are incapable of learning.

My belief is that no one has the right to play the game. Riot has plenty of rules that i personally do not agree with, but i accept them as part of the condition to playing league of legends. Those that cannot play by the rules should be removed.

I have no sympathy for players looking for excuses to do what they know they should not be doing. If the player truly does not know any better, then they should look at their guardians for failing to teach them how to act.

Minimum standards.... They should be embraced.

scazzmanJun 5, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Angry Monster,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=ihFk5eWA,comment-id=00010000000000000000,timestamp=2016-06-05T02:09:52.964+0000)

Well then riot helps them stop by removing their account.

This seems to be another belief problem. Either you believe that they are incapable of learning or they themselves believe that they are incapable of learning.

My belief is that no one has the right to play the game. Riot has plenty of rules that i personally do not agree with, but i accept them as part of the condition to playing league of legends. Those that cannot play by the rules should be removed.

I have no sympathy for players looking for excuses to do what they know they should not be doing. If the player truly does not know any better, then they should look at their guardians for failing to teach them how to act.

Minimum standards.... They should be embraced.

and the minimum standards arent clearly drawn, just vague guidelines of "dont be a dick" which to every person is different.

Angry MonsterJun 5, 20161 votes

[deleted]

scazzmanJun 5, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Angry Monster,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=ihFk5eWA,comment-id=0001000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2016-06-05T02:20:03.571+0000)

Sigh

I will let you believe what you want. From this post and the last one I can see an agenda forming and this is no longer about perma muting. Maybe someone else will address your confusion.

A simple guide to the behavior is the "would i do this in front of a group of elderly family and your bosses test" Pretty simple would you act that way in front of both of those groups as you want in game. If no then do not do it. If yes probably safe, unless they KKK members or violent criminals.

which telling someone to shut up. or even telling multiple people to shut up. probably passes

scazzmanJun 5, 20162 votes

the other issue. is the fact that many players who recieve punishments. arent the most toxic. but rather the most noticable or the most reported" many of whom are just as frustrated by toxic players as you

SarutobiJun 5, 20161 votes

{quoted}

the other issue. is the fact that many players who recieve punishments. arent the most toxic. but rather the most noticable or the most reported" many of whom are just as frustrated by toxic players as you

if they arent toxic then they wouldnt have gotten ban. Being toxic back at someone who was toxic first is such a childish mentality that Riot doesnt want that for their game/community. especially since it solves nothing. Everyone has toxic people in their games, as well as feeders, trolls, and AFK that doesnt give you the right to tell them to kill themselves, or just be toxic in general. Just report them after the game.

scazzmanJun 5, 20161 votes

{quoted}

if they arent toxic then they wouldnt have gotten ban. Being toxic back at someone who was toxic first is such a childish mentality that Riot doesnt want that for their game/community. especially since it solves nothing. Everyone has toxic people in their games, as well as feeders, trolls, and AFK that doesnt give you the right to tell them to kill themselves, or just be toxic in general. Just report them after the game.

i never told anyone to kill themselves. and you are using extreme examples to prove a point

Angry MonsterJun 5, 20161 votes

no proof and just a personal belief. I know better than to argue when someone has a belief.

Though i would say people should know to just mute at this point. No one is hit for losing their temper and responding to the bait, in those rare occasions. They are hit for dropping down to the toxic players level (if they do) and responding in kind. Their is a difference and most people tend to forget this.

scazzmanJun 5, 20162 votes

[{quoted}](name=Angry Monster,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=ihFk5eWA,comment-id=00010000000000010001,timestamp=2016-06-05T02:03:00.661+0000)

no proof and just a personal belief. I know better than to argue when someone has a belief.

Though i would say people should know to just mute at this point. No one is hit for losing their temper and responding to the bait, in those rare occasions. They are hit for dropping down to the toxic players level (if they do) and responding in kind. Their is a difference and most people tend to forget this.

ive gotten chat restrictions simply for telling someone to shut up

Angry MonsterJun 5, 20161 votes

No you haven't. You got them for a history of combative behavior and refused to mute when people irritated you. Just cause you got one chat log does not mean that was the only time.

scazzmanJun 5, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Angry Monster,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=ihFk5eWA,comment-id=0001000000000001000100000000,timestamp=2016-06-05T02:13:37.393+0000)

No you haven't. You got them for a history of combative behavior and refused to mute when people irritated you. Just cause you got one chat log does not mean that was the only time.

look. if you dont want to agree with me fine. but please refrain from using personal attacks

Angry MonsterJun 5, 20162 votes

lol that was not personal it is called logical deduction. Riot has said that no one is muted for the one of or the 1 in 100 response of shut up. Riot also has said that just cause one or three cases are emailed does nor mean they are the only ones cases.

By using that logic i got my statement about your chat restriction. You only consider it a personal attack cause you do not like what was said.

scazzmanJun 5, 20162 votes

[{quoted}](name=Angry Monster,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=ihFk5eWA,comment-id=000100000000000100010000000000000000,timestamp=2016-06-05T02:24:36.720+0000)

lol that was not personal it is called logical deduction. Riot has said that no one is muted for the one of or the 1 in 100 response of shut up. Riot also has said that just cause one or three cases are emailed does nor mean they are the only ones cases.

By using that logic i got my statement about your chat restriction. You only consider it a personal attack cause you do not like what was said.

ok. so i told someone to shut up in 10 games instead of just 1. still doesnt change the fact i got restricted for telling people to shut up

TreeofwarJun 5, 20161 votes

i like the idea of a perma mute because at that point people who dont troll but are just super toxic wont get banned just cant talk

scazzmanJun 5, 20161 votes

the idea. is instead of adding another step to the ladder. give more weight to the previous step

SarutobiJun 5, 20161 votes

i dont think people understand what the word Permanent means.

scazzmanJun 5, 20161 votes

also. i shouldnt have to fear for the safety of my account. simply because i dont know where the invisible line of "dont be an asshole" is precisely drawn, also. i have aspergers disorder. and especially find it difficult to ignore people who are taunting or provoking. i shouldnt have to delete the chat file from my install to continue to play and not get banned

AstôlfoJun 5, 20161 votes

Or, no. We could just keep the system as it is because it works perfectly fine. Dismissed. Bye bye.

scazzmanJun 5, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Or, no. We could just keep the system as it is because it works perfectly fine. Dismissed. Bye bye.

it works 'perfectly fine" for people who dont have issues with getting banned please dont post passive aggressive jabs on my threads

AstôlfoJun 5, 20161 votes

It works perfectly fine for people who know not to be an asshole, you mean.

VernMcHansonJun 5, 20161 votes

passive aggressive. pls ban rito.

scazzmanJun 5, 20161 votes

{quoted}

It works perfectly fine for people who know not to be an asshole, you mean.

but for the people who dont it's not as as cut and dry

AstôlfoJun 5, 20161 votes

Then they have no right to complain.

SmokedAlmondsJun 5, 20161 votes

Why should we be compromising with people who cannot follow the rules?

I appreciate the effort you clearly put into trying to come up with solutions, but this is trying help the wrong people.

scazzmanJun 5, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Why should we be compromising with people who cannot follow the rules?

I appreciate the effort you clearly put into trying to come up with solutions, but this is trying help the wrong people.

because i shouldnt have to auto mute my team and not type an entire game in fear of losing my account, or if i do have to. at least make itso i cant turn it off in game

SmokedAlmondsJun 5, 20162 votes

You would only "have" to do that because of an unwillingness or inability to behave properly.

Muting and not talking are not requirements to avoid punishments.

VernMcHansonJun 5, 20161 votes

Except we are not all wired the same way. Just because you are capable of not defending yourself (pathetic imo), doesn't mean others will do the same or should be expected to do the same. I mean, I mute those I disagree with because I don't care what they think or say. Just like if you were to try to talk to me in real life, I would ignore you. Understand?

SmokedAlmondsJun 5, 20161 votes

There is nothing to defend against. The game is going to be over in less than an hour. The only thing someone can do is waste an hour of my time and that is going happen regardless of what I say to them. Player's aren't punching bags for people to vent their frustrations at.

If that is how you feel, that is your business. But don't expect people to make accommodations for it.