Boards›Player Behavior

My cool Idea to combat toxicity :)

lolptwo··59 votes·3,237 views
http://imgur.com/2cwZMZJ

I have a couple ideas to combat toxicity, I want to see if the community likes any of the ideas. it's Long so Thank you if you stuck around and read it all

**1: A meter bar that shows how toxic you are, It can look similar to a gas tank meter but small on the client when you log in. ** Light Green - You are not toxic at all - If you remain at this level at the end of the Season you will receive 1 Free Mystery Skin

Dark Green - You have bad days - If you remain at this level a the end of the Season you will receive 1 Free Summoner Icon

Yellow - You are slightly toxic - You receive no EXTRA rewards but still your end of Season Rewards

Orange - You are toxic - You get a pop up when you open the client to remember to stay positive (Idk? )

Red - You are extremely toxic and nearing your next ban phase - You get no end of Season rewards (Remains the same)

Reasons why I think this would help

1: I don't think this would promote toxicity, as that was the first issue I thought about my idea, but I think people who are toxic generally are toxic and people who aren't toxic, wouldn't suddenly become toxic just because there's that option.

2: You can add incentizes for remaining in the Light Green - Dark Green at the end of the season. You can add a Mystery Skin for Light Green summoners and a Mystery Summoner Icon for Dark Green Icon.

3: It provides clarity for Toxic players to realize they need to stop and will also provide clarity as to whether the reports against you are valid. I see alot of people saying they get report warnings for games they never spoke in, it happens to me too. This would show post game that your toxicity level never raised and provides a VISUAL feedback for people who are so inclined to know where they are standing.

4: It will promote less permabans and a generally nicer community. People will know exactly where they stand. I'm sure more people will stop toxicity all together once they reach the Red Stage in fear of actually getting banned. It can also show (to couple with my other post) how hate speeches and racism,homophobia can jump you from Tier to Tier, so it shows just how serious Riot is about these occurrences in League.

5: As someone who's been toxic and reformed, I can tell you first hand if I had something like this. I never would of made it as far as I did. The chat logs and never ending warnings that I didn't know were serious or not because I was in the heat of a two way argument was not giving me incentive to stop. However staying at that Light Green at the beginning of the season and really wanting that Mystery Gift and seeing it on a day to day basis would probably of been better in serving MY personal preference.

Second Idea: This one is a little more controversial but funny to me

**To people who are Chat Restricted and Toxic, make it so they can't say toxic words. Not that it's beeped out but that it simply doesn't show in chat. **

I just think it would be really funny if you saw a Chat restricted person say ____ you Teemo , Id _______ love ________ you

I find there's some words that in general just don't belong in online gaming and there no need or way that anyone would ever need to use them constructively. This includes Racist, Homophobic, Death Threat words. So why even allow people to have to read this nonsense? Make them invisible.

Now I know the counter argument "Freedom of Speech! Freedom of Speech!" "Mute button!"

Yes I know, but I think this should only apply to Chat restricted people, where their right to talk freely has been taken away(it already is) because of their abusive nature. It would also make it so that they can't send other people on tilt because people won't have to read their sometimes hurtful words(not so much to me but i've seen people on the forums here genuinely hurt)

It would encourage the toxic player to know, there is no fighting back against the system, you are chat restricted, anything you say that is toxic will sound like a funny mad lib and actually promote laughter and positivity to your team.

Thank you so much if you read it all. Leave comments, Replies and feedback down below!

43 Comments

Wolfenstin15 votes

So, essentially this? https://coffee2words.files.wordpress.com/2013/01/stitchbadness.jpg

lolptwo7 votes

Yes, in so many words, this.

MeleeNuke14 votes

Yes! Visualizing toxicity is genius! I love it.

ModUlanopo7 votes

This has been suggested before and the problem people always forget is that it can be used to safely maximize your toxicity.

Jari1 votes

If someone is legit trying to be an exact level of toxic, then they likely are just trying to hard. A toxic person isn't going to care, and a non-toxic person will most likely not care about it since if they're doing good they won't be effected.

ModUlanopo7 votes

{quoted}

If someone is legit trying to be an exact level of toxic, then they likely are just trying to hard. A toxic person isn't going to care, and a non-toxic person will most likely not care about it since if they're doing good they won't be effected.

Perhaps you misunderstand. Let's say that I get punished when the meter hits 10. I do a little testing and discover that I gain 0.1 - 0.2 if I'm especially toxic during a match. I also figure out that a week's worth of not being reported causes me to drop 0.5. Now I know exactly what I need to do to never be punished and punishments become useless

Given an opportunity, people will game the system.

lolptwo2 votes

This is exactly what I was initially thinking. You bring up a really good point. This is why I think more harsh hate speeches can immediately jump people from one level to the other. I think overall you will have to be minutely toxic to be able to game the system .5%'s at a time. Which already exists in League on a game to game basis.

Riot suggests that they have harsher and immediate escalation in penalties for hate speeches. It would be even more beneficial to show that person. "Oh man I was really toxic that game, I went up half a bar! I need to stop"

Overall. That is the biggest issue with this concept. I still believe that non-toxic people wouldn't attempt to game the system due to their nature of not being toxic, and toxic people might look to reform more than they already are.

In addition I would imagine Riot has a similar system in place right now, but is just rather invisible to us, and people are still learning to abuse that system.

TLDR; Riot's system already has a similar implemented system, I believe the clarity would be more beneficial rather than the current state of unknown(everyone knows you go down a tier of punishment after 3 months of playing on a smurf or etc. doesn't mean you have reformed)

ModUlanopo1 votes

You don't want people thinking they have any leeway. They must believe, at all times, that being toxic puts their account at risk.

verall. That is the biggest issue with this concept. I still believe that non-toxic people wouldn't attempt to game the system due to their nature of not being toxic, and toxic people might look to reform more than they already are.

We have several years of data that shows that people who are going to reform do so at fairly consistent rates regardless of what the punishment is. They respond solely because the punishment shows them that Riot is serious. This is why the "punishment volcano" was shortened to four steps.

Trust me, I suggested a thermometer system a long time ago.

lolptwo1 votes

On second thought, perhaps you're right.

However I disagree that the majority of toxic players right now believe at all time that their accounts are at risk, maybe it's just careless disregard.. I'm sure you have more info than I do, or maybe I'm seeing more outbursts than usual, I agree on one thing though. There is less taunting about the system now than during the punishment volcano period. Simply from my perspective though. Mind you, I play a lot of games.

I always tend to forgot that Riot has a lot of people putting fourth ideas all the time.

Maybe this idea isn't the best given that when system's get abused they get abused hard.

Though after every game that I get a toxic player I do find myself asking "is there really any way to fix this?"

Thanks for the feedback. Good to have a logical constructive point of view.

One last question: I wonder if Riot will of seen a massive increase in permabans since the implementation of their new system, I know for a fact I've seen a lot more on the boards lately...what does this tell us about our previously conceived ideas about the current state of the "toxicity" in the games? Is it really as low as we think it is?(1-2%) or is it much larger than we expected(taking into consideration smurfs dont get played on as much as mains, bot accounts, double -triple account owners) since the new system clamps down better than the old.

PunisherJBY1 votes

Every toxic player i have run into has said something along the lines of "This won't get me banned anyways" because they don't fear it. So the argument while it would hopefully have people suffering from the "fear of God" doesn't actually have any effect unless they see "an act of God" (if that analogy doesn't makes sense to sum up unless they see they are being watched they don't care.)

Edit: better comparison. If a parent says "hey do this or else" and you never do it and no consequences come you won't ever do it when asked again. I do see your point but i think a meter would be awesome to remind people "hey chill" and the rewards are nice for those that chose to follow the rules.

DeynaTaggerung6 votes

xD the mad lib idea sounds pretty hilarious.

I don't know about the viability of your toxicity meter but it's an interesting idea so I'll bump for visiblity

shyv5 votes

great idea!

Nin10do00145 votes

I strongly support the toxicity meter. This visual warning offers much more clarity to toxic players who need to reform their behavior. Once they know that they are close to receiving a punishment, that gives them more incentive to monitor their actions with other players in a game.

TSM Scarra4 votes

I like this idea, it works with the psychology of people who are toxic. They will see where they stand, and realize that "oh shit" or "nice im set!" and work towards there goals, if they can visually see this. Seems like a really good idea, and very very useful tool to prevent and bring out the best of players in this game.

GetMariahCarried4 votes

I'm gonna have to stop you at "free mystery skin". That doesn't seem right. It's like telling an ex-con, "here, have a free 100 bucks. You didn't rob a store this month." Wait what...

Seriously, don't give people a medal just for not having anger management issues. Rewards are for results that exceed expectations. Not for things that are MANDATORY.

Should your boss hand you a cookie every morning you remember to put your pants on before coming into work? ... ... Well, actually, I could live with that.

Also... completely removing censored words? Right, because THAT will stop players from putting spaces in between the letters just so ANY form of censorship is totally bypassed anyway.

lolptwo4 votes

The only problem is whatever you're implying you have a problem with is already in place. They already give you rewards for positivity, and ALREADY take away rewards for bad behavior, this wouldn't change league at all just provide clarity as to where you stand.

In addition Riot has already said most players are in the "have a bad day "category where they rage sometimes just not all the time I think the number is 76-80% Lyte said. Which makes it even more special to get into the Light Green category, So Ex-Con? More like Man of the Year.

Your example is a complete fallacy. Why are you comparing an upstanding citizen with an Ex-Con? There is no way you can be an Ex-Con and still be in the Light Green section to receive the mystery skin a way to make sure of this is that after reaching a ban you start off 1 section higher each time.. A better example would be your boss gives you a cookie because you show Organizational Behavior of the workplace at work and exemplify a good attitude while at work.

Second one, yeah meh...but by your logic why even have any rules at all. People still find a way to break em! Why even have laws! People will break em! The idea is to make it harder for people to break it. Pretty simple concept. If someone is typing out their whole rage speech spaced out, I would personally find that pretty hilarious that they went through all the trouble to do it. RIght now you can just rage away freely.

Jari2 votes

Not to mention a mystery skin is <$5 and it's at the end of the year, not monthly, so his argument about just giving someone $100 a month to not steal your store is even more invalid. :P

GetMariahCarried1 votes

When I treat people respectfully in game, I don't expect anything in return. Especially not from Riot. I just hope I've made the day a little bit better for other players. That's the thing about manners. You don't do it for yourself. You do it for other people. If you want to completely miss that point, fine. This discussion is a waste of time then.

But in case it's not, and you'll actually take something away from this, here's what I have to say about your comments.

this wouldn't change league at all just provide clarity as to where you stand

I did not object to your "meter" idea, nor did I even comment on it. You're either digressing, or implying you need a free skin for, ahem, "clarity as to where you stand". I don't need a free skin to know when I'm not being an ass in games.

Why are you comparing an upstanding citizen with an Ex-Con?

It's called an analogy. And in order for it to work, you scale every comparative trait up. And the comparison is not to all players, but SPECIFIC players. Players who don't treat other players like dirt by default don't need a cookie. They grew up at some point. So the only people we're talking about are the ones who have trouble acting decently in the first place. And if they cease that activity, then yes, they're REFORMED players. Ergo, Ex-Con is an appropriate analogy, provided everything else is scaled accordingly (offense, reward, penalty, etc.) Hence, $100 for not robbing a store... yet you fault me for scaling up the offense while someone else replies to you saying "it's even worse, he scaled up the reward". The lack of understanding here is astounding. You probably already realized all this, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that you are sincerely missing the point.

There is no way you can be an Ex-Con and still be in the Light Green section...

Um... I didn't realize you had a meter color for "so outrageous, is probably an ex-con". Either that, or you think I'm talking about theoretically well-mannered players who are ACTUALLY ex-cons, who's existence you've denied by stereotyping ex-cons as punks... ... Whatever of the case, your paragraph gets face-palm-ingly absurd, really quickly. Which is why I actually had to say the sentence, "It's called an analogy."

A better example would be your boss gives you a cookie because you show Organizational Behavior of the workplace at work and exemplify a good attitude while at work.

This is what you get rewarded for at work: PERFORMANCE. Quality at whatever you were hired to do, which has NOTHING to do with behavior. Here's how you get "rewarded" for behavior: No one fires you.

The idea is to make it harder for people to break it.

Censoring with asterisks vs underscores vs spaces does not make anything harder to break.

That's the last I'll say in this thread. Respond all you like, but I won't be reading it. I put forth the time for one response out of kindness to most people, but beyond that, I don't waste time in a thread once I realize it's populated by players with hopelessly skewed reasoning.

knighthawlk3 votes

i like the idea a lot

themachamp3 votes

Good idea but you are forgetting somethings.

  1. free skin = money lost for riot
  2. It could encourage more false reports
  3. Toxicity is a relative term. If i get someone who cant take a joke or advice or anything, I could get reported when i was only tying to help.
  4. It would discourage comm between players as no one would want to say anything for fear of losing a free skin.
lolptwo2 votes

Hey TheMachamp, Interesting points. However the only difference of this idea is letting you see what is happening around you.

1: Riot already rewards players with Rewards and have said they are looking into MORE rewards for positive behavior

2: This isn't changing the reports system at all, just letting you see how toxic you are, you can still false report this would actually provide MORE clarity and show you. The false reports against you are not raising your toxic bar.

3: This isn't changing the report system at all, just letting you see how toxic you are

4: This isn't changing the report system at all, just letting you see how toxic you are, but yes it's more likely to discourage you from being toxic(that's the point), it's a have nothing nice to say, don't say anything at all. Which is what league has been striving to do

Thanks for the feedback though!

rtbf2232199601 votes

They already had a green teir a long time ago, that's how Maw of Malmortius was named (He was given so many friendly commendations they made an item named after him, this shows that they do monitor and reward players for being kind.)Braum

rtbf2232199601 votes

Albiet common thought, rito actually looks at reports to ensure they are justified....

T RexHasTinyArms2 votes

Why would freedom of speech be an argument? It's not like that's a requirement anywhere except the areas that the constitution guarantees in the US (which is only from the government). Private property/media is completely free to censor content and in fact is generally expected to do so. If ESPN suddenly didn't think to focus on sports instead of gardening their viewers would be amazingly upset. There may be many words or phrases like "damn it" that people don't agree on whether they are an issue, or agree they should not be edited, but some language just doesn't have a use in a positive community and could easily be agreed upon by most civilized human beings that as a private company Riot would be entirely okay to code the game to not allow it.

Zav5HDjHuJ2 votes

I really like this idea! Rito pls.

Dealth2 votes

As long as MSNBC doesn't sue riot.

The Deckowner1 votes

if rito's system is smart enough to detect all toxicity then all the toxic ones would be already banned.

PIMPSMOOTH1 votes

Don't be a dick and you want need this meter. Ezreal PZ

lolptwo3 votes

Well actually it would still be nice to see that you're light green and currently in the running for getting rewards from Riot. It would more or less be meaningless to them until the end of the season but the point here is that it will actually improve toxic play from the game.

Primaquarius2 votes

#WantNeed

themachamp1 votes

I could see it if it was a special skin....like one only given out to "positive" players.

I just meant people being scared to talk at all.....not necessarily saying something negative. i.e. asking someone to max a skill 1st but they get mad cause they don't like you telling them how to play their champion etc.

lolptwo1 votes

I think they only thing it would do would make people scared of engaging in an argument. Remember talking isn't toxic and would have no effect on your meter, and false reports would not change your toxic meter at all. However engaging in an argument and becoming toxic in a game might

Occams Raiser1 votes

There are only two kinds of reenforcement I know of. Pos and NEG. People on this thread have made opposing arguments to both types. It is baffling to me. Do you want the carrot or the stick, people? Give me bonuses for doing good or punishment for doing bad. OR both. But both options can't be wrong.

Skoonie1 votes

While I love this idea, and I hate to play devil's advocate, this also seems easy to abuse for trolls who would just report everyone at the end of the game to deny them rewards. If they would implement this idea, I'd like them to reinstate the Tribunal as well, so we have a safeguard against this practice.

lolptwo1 votes

That wouldn't be abusable with this system. It's not changing anything with our current system and people already do that now. False reports are false reports and just like any other false report. False Reports change nothing. The only difference would be now you have the peace of mind knowing false reports aren't changing anything to your Toxicity status. So it's actually beneficial in that sense. This also would just be more benefited from Tribunal coming back and is in no way shape or form a** substitute** to any of the methods we currently have

rtbf2232199601 votes

Albiet popular belief, riot has employees look at reports and the suspect's actions during game to make sure the report was justified.

Koonta Kintae1 votes

This idea is ridiculous simply because there is no discrete measurement system for toxicity. It varies tremendously with context and subjective values. No automated system is going to be able to measure it in a meaningful way. It would just bloat the game with yet another unnecessary and pointless system.... kinda like the current honor system.

lolptwo1 votes

Well you're not exactly arguing against this system then but our current system. Which is a whole other argument. This isn't adding any different forms of finding toxicity, it isn't adding any form of what is considered toxic or false reports it's simply VISUALIZING it for you to see how toxic you are.

If you have a problem with automated systems and discrete measurement for toxicity. League might not be for you. There is ALREADY a system for that and they are only putting more, there always will be.

SerenityMIA1 votes

Can I vote for this?

Hotlin3 Fling1 votes

This would work, if we had a tribunal to judge whether they get demoted a rank or not

WarchfGinger1 votes

Shouldve added poll

I like the idea a lot

1 800 MID LANE1 votes

RITO PLS

Meanie401 votes

I have my misgivings on this; for some people, it would be "I'm not in red? Unleash the toxicity!"

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