So I asked the support staff about player who dont want to work as a team and not want to react to ping to save turrets or want to try win the game and this is there reply
http://i63.tinypic.com/2yl45l1.png
They think people shouldnt have to work as a team in a team game! lol Why make a team game then Riot if you dont feel people should have to work as a team.
ModThe Djinn7 votesThere seems to be a bit of a misunderstanding here. It can be summed up as follows:
Otherwise you get into awkward situations like this:
A Tryndamere knows if he gets 200 more gold he'll get Guardian's Angel and will be able to single-handedly carry a fight. He firmly believes your team will lose a fight without that. He's farming the jungle.
Your team is defending mid inhib. You feel that, without Trynd, you can't hold it, but he feels that even with him you'll all die and lose the game unless he has GA as another out. He believes sacrificing the inhib is the right call, so you can win the next team fight. Your team disagrees.
Thinking they have to defend, you fight, down a man, and lose. They wipe you while Trynd was absent.
Whose opinion/communication is "correct" here? Would you have won with him? Would you have stomped them if he'd had GA? It's impossible to say and, as such, Riot doesn't attempt to tell one person that they're "right."
Gamer Life1 votes[{quoted}](name=The Djinn,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=aEEKdBll,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2018-02-09T21:00:27.661+0000)
There seems to be a bit of a misunderstanding here. It can be summed up as follows:
- Unless a player is intentionally trying to lose, they are allowed to play the game the way they wish.
- Choosing to do something that you (or even the rest of the team) feels is suboptimal is not the same as intentionally trying to lose.
- Riot encourages teamwork and communication, but does not punish players for choosing to play their own way unless, again, they are intentionally trying to lose.
Otherwise you get into awkward situations like this:
A Tryndamere knows if he gets 200 more gold he'll get Guardian's Angel and will be able to single-handedly carry a fight. He firmly believes your team will lose a fight without that. He's farming the jungle.
Your team is defending mid inhib. You feel that, without Trynd, you can't hold it, but he feels that even with him you'll all die and lose the game unless he has GA as another out. He believes sacrificing the inhib is the right call, so you can win the next team fight. Your team disagrees.
Thinking they have to defend, you fight, down a man, and lose. They wipe you while Trynd was absent.
Whose opinion/communication is "correct" here? Would you have won with him? Would you have stomped them if he'd had GA? It's impossible to say and, as such, Riot doesn't attempt to tell one person that they're "right."
Then that not a team game then is it?
They need to make a new game then. Can make a team game and then allow people to troll and no listen to the other 4 member on your team also that what people are doing if there just fight over farm and no saving turret they are
Unless a player is intentionally trying to lose, they are allowed to play the game the way they wish.
Xidphel3 votesDjinn just explained to you how his call benefited the team and therefore acted as part of the team even if he wasn't doing what the rest of your team is doing as a team.
Or, I guess since this one person didn't die with everyone else thereby risking a loss for the team, there's absolutely 0 teamplay involved.
Gamer Life1 votesDjinn just explained to you how his call benefited the team and therefore acted as part of the team even if he wasn't doing what the rest of your team is doing as a team.
I hav e just omg! I fed up repeat my self
Xidphel6 votesEveryone else is fed up with repeating themselves as well. This is a discussion board. We're here to discuss. Not mindlessly agreeing with you even if that's the only thing you want.
Gamer Life1 votesEveryone else is fed up with repeating themselves as well. This is a discussion board. We're here to discuss. Not mindlessly agreeing with you even if that's the only thing you want.
No one is repeat them selfs just I am I have just explained in my reply to The Djinn
Xidphel4 votesFine. You are. You're repeating yourself with the same argument that is being shot down again and again and again.
Gamer Life1 votesFine. You are. You're repeating yourself with the same argument that is being shot down again and again and again.
Ok you think that. lol
fyi I havnt been shot down I am repeat my self because people arnt understanding or arnt reading the hole reply and then just replying back
Xidphel3 votesYou aren't explaining yourself very well, then.
Gamer Life1 votesYou aren't explaining yourself very well, then.
I am not my fauilt people arnt reading the hole thing properly before replyin
Xidphel1 votesOk. So let's look at this one more time:
So I asked the support staff about player who dont want to work as a team and not want to react to ping to save turrets or want to try win the game
That looks like it's about any games. Not just the one everyone is talking about, right?
They think people shouldnt have to work as a team in a team game! lol Why make a team game then Riot if you dont feel people should have to work as a team.
From here, it looks like you believe their reply was that people don't need to work as a team and can do whatever they want. Am I correct?
HalcyonDweller2 votesI've been where you are now. "They just don't understand!" only goes so far as an excuse. At some point we have to start questioning our own view and re-evaluate if maybe we have made some incorrect assumptions.
You claimed that Riot advocates for people to not be team players, this is not the case, as the support agent made quite clear in their reply to you. They encourage teamwork, but they also realize that the team may disagree on things, and Riot understands that disagreements over the best way to win are not necessarily the same thing as trolling.
Gamer Life1 votesI've been where you are now. "They just don't understand!" only goes so far as an excuse. At some point we have to start questioning our own view and re-evaluate if maybe we have made some incorrect assumptions.
You claimed that Riot advocates for people to not be team players, this is not the case, as the support agent made quite clear in their reply to you. They encourage teamwork, but they also realize that the team may disagree on things, and Riot understands that disagreements over the best way to win are not necessarily the same thing as trolling.
As I have just explain for the 1000 time they arnt try to win as they just want to fight over farm and mean me trying to be in 2 or 3 lanes at the same time
HalcyonDweller1 votesDid they say something in chat about "I'm not helping, you guys deserve to lose." or other similar words?
ModThe Djinn6 votes[{quoted}](name=Gamer Life,realm=EUW,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=aEEKdBll,comment-id=00050000,timestamp=2018-02-09T21:07:30.987+0000)Then that not a team game then is it?
In my example each party truly believes they are doing the thing that will most benefit the team.
If a Basketball team things that Player A has the best chance to score, but the guy with the ball knows a pass to Player B is safer and more likely to win them the game, is he a bad team player for taking the path he thinks is best? I would say no, and that there's no fair way to objectively judge that.
Gamer Life1 votes[{quoted}](name=The Djinn,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=aEEKdBll,comment-id=000500000001,timestamp=2018-02-09T21:18:31.113+0000)
In my example each party truly believes they are doing the thing that will most benefit the team.
If a Basketball team things that Player A has the best chance to score, but the guy with the ball knows a pass to Player B is safer and more likely to win them the game, is he a bad team player for taking the path he thinks is best? I would say no, and that there's no fair way to objectively judge that.
OMG I just explained to you if you dont going to read the hole reply to you then what point reply to me as I just said
the other 4 member on your team also that what people are doing if there just fight over farm and no saving turret they are. so that mean then they are intentionally trying to lose
Unless a player is intentionally trying to lose, they are allowed to play the game the way they wish.
ModThe Djinn5 votes[{quoted}](name=Gamer Life,realm=EUW,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=aEEKdBll,comment-id=0005000000010000,timestamp=2018-02-09T21:21:27.145+0000) the other 4 member on your team also that what people are doing if there just fight over farm and no saving turret they are. so that mean then they are intentionally trying to lose
If they legitimately think that getting that farm is the best way to get back into the game and that you cannot defend that tower, they're playing to help the team as best they can, even if the other 4 of your disagree.
Just because 4 people think one thing does not make them right, nor does it mean their teammate who disagrees with them is not a part of the team.
If they're intentionally letting the turret fall because they want to lose that's a different subject. But that's VERY hard to judge, and you can't build a system that can detect it, because there are many legitimate reasons for not joining that fight.
Gamer Life1 votes[{quoted}](name=The Djinn,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=aEEKdBll,comment-id=00050000000100000000,timestamp=2018-02-09T21:26:46.367+0000)
If they legitimately think that getting that farm is the best way to get back into the game and that you cannot defend that tower, they're playing to help the team as best they can, even if the other 4 of your disagree.
Just because 4 people think one thing does not make them right, nor does it mean their teammate who disagrees with them is not a part of the team.
If they're intentionally letting the turret fall because they want to lose that's a different subject. But that's VERY hard to judge, and you can't build a system that can detect it, because there are many legitimate reasons for not joining that fight.
Now you are just making excuse. how is fight over jungle camps and letting 2 inhib turret to be taken and inhibs, going to get you back into the game.
ModThe Djinn3 votes[{quoted}](name=Gamer Life,realm=EUW,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=aEEKdBll,comment-id=000500000001000000000000,timestamp=2018-02-09T21:34:33.946+0000)
Now you are just making excuse. how is fight over jungle camps and letting 2 inhib turret to be taken and inhibs, going to get you back into the game.
Getting a Guardian Angel on your hardest carry can be a legitimate reason to sacrifice a turret as opposed to possibly losing an all-in teamfight and letting them push into the nexus. It's often better to sacrifice the inhib and defend with 4 at the two Nexus turrets than it is to risk a teamfight that could lose you everything since you're down a possible big advantage you could get in a fight fifteen seconds later.
Gamer Life1 votes[{quoted}](name=The Djinn,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=aEEKdBll,comment-id=0005000000010000000000000000,timestamp=2018-02-09T21:37:48.640+0000)
Getting a Guardian Angel on your hardest carry can be a legitimate reason to sacrifice a turret as opposed to possibly losing an all-in teamfight and letting them push into the nexus. It's often better to sacrifice the inhib and defend with 4 at the two Nexus turrets than it is to risk a teamfight that could lose you everything since you're down a possible big advantage you could get in a fight fifteen seconds later.
You just make excuse now they dont do that as I said the fight over farm and that all they do all game untill the other team just push every lane and win as there still fight over farm
What you said doesnt happen in my game that what I am saying. You are make these excuse.
So you are say then the case were that person was play 
support and would take other team jungle camp and go help other lanes is ok then? as he doing what he think that will win him the game, yet Riot still banned him for it. All this shows its one rule for some and another for others
ModThe Djinn2 votes[{quoted}](name=Gamer Life,realm=EUW,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=aEEKdBll,comment-id=00050000000100000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-02-09T21:45:46.792+0000)What you said doesnt happen in my game that what I am saying. You are make these excuse.
I'm not talking about your game in particular. I'm explaining why such a system is, effectively, impossible to build. It's entirely possible that your team IS doing things that are costing you the game, but my point is that you can't know why, a system can't identify those behaviors specifically and, even if it could, there are times when certain behaviors found in that play could be valid. That's all.
In short, I'm sorry your teams often don't play together, but there's no system Riot can build that will make them while not falsely flagging people who ARE making what they see as the best decision.
Gamer Life1 votes[{quoted}](name=The Djinn,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=aEEKdBll,comment-id=000500000001000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-02-09T21:49:26.991+0000)
I'm not talking about your game in particular. I'm explaining why such a system is, effectively, impossible to build. It's entirely possible that your team IS doing things that are costing you the game, but my point is that you can't know why, a system can't identify those behaviors specifically and, even if it could, there are times when certain behaviors found in that play could be valid. That's all.
In short, I'm sorry your teams often don't play together, but there's no system Riot can build that will make them while not falsely flagging people who ARE making what they see as the best decision.
your doing it again just look at one part of the reply to you. I wont debate with you anymore if you no even going to take the time to read all. because if you did you have seen that it is making sence
They dont need a new system for it. If someone report it on the report tool and your team mate have been going it then they get punished simple.
Xidphel1 votesI think this thread has served its purpose.
HalcyonDweller2 votes"you are just making excuses" is not a valid reply. Stop bashing people who are defending their reasoning. You challenged them to explain it better by saying "you don't understand!" So you have no right to blame them for replying to try to show a clearer understanding of the subject.
Gamer Life1 votes"you are just making excuses" is not a valid reply. Stop bashing people who are defending their reasoning. You challenged them to explain it better by saying "you don't understand!" So you have no right to blame them for replying to try to show a clearer understanding of the subject.
Yes it is! You cant excuse everything someone does or they will never be in the wrong would they. if they are doing wrong then they should be punished
HalcyonDweller2 votesThe problem is, without having powers of mind-reading, you cannot accurately determine a person's intent unless they say what that intent is.
If a person intends to throw the game, you can only tell that that is what they are trying to do if they say so, or if they do something as obvious as buying 5 Tear of the Goddess and 1 Mobi Boots and running it down a lane. Many unusual choices could be either inting or trying to win and without being able to read the person's mind you won't actually know which is their intention.
AFK farming a side lane while the team needs help defending an objective could absolutely be trolling, but it also could absolutely be that the player who is farming believes that getting farm and/or split pushing that lane is more important for winning the game than defending the objective that their team is frantically pinging for help at.
Xidphel1 votesWell now you're just making excuses.
Gamer Life1 votesWell now you're just making excuses.
Its not an excuse. it answer what been said
Xidphel1 votesSame as how everyone else's replies are not excuses.
Gamer Life1 votesSame as how everyone else's replies are not excuses.
not arguing with you but its not its completely diffrent
Xidphel1 votes
Imperial Pandaa1 votesYou mean the ban they reverted and used to help define that they won't force a meta?
Ph03n1xb1rd1 votesOkay, so "Choosing to do something that you (or even the rest of the team) feels is suboptimal is not the same as intentionally trying to lose.". Running down mid all the time and hitting the tower is just a suboptimal way of pushing, right? So this is not considered inting? Where do you draw the line?
ModThe Djinn1 votesOkay, so "Choosing to do something that you (or even the rest of the team) feels is suboptimal is not the same as intentionally trying to lose.". Running down mid all the time and hitting the tower is just a suboptimal way of pushing, right? So this is not considered inting? Where do you draw the line?
This is why defining "inting" is difficult. There's a sliding scale of "you must do what the majority want/build what the majority want/play what the majority want" to "you can do anything other than build all tears and towerdive."
The answer is that I don't have a set answer for you. Running down mid and smacking a tower and dying is inting, yes, but not joining a teamfight because you feel taking another objective is more important is NOT inting, even if your team disagrees. In the middle is a lot of grey area that is, frankly, impossible to tell, since a lot of it is based on player motivation and player thoughts/strategy.
Is a Singed AFK-pushing top inting? Can be. But it can also win a game as a serious strategic decision.
Ph03n1xb1rd1 votesIgnoring one teamfight might be not inting, but constantly ignoring teamfights resulting your team effectively playing 4v5, giving the enemy XP and gold advantage, and in the end inevitably lose the game IS INTING.
A Singed AFK pushing top, and not being able to run away, but always dying on top, when somebody comes to stop him IS INTING, getting objectives, while the rest is the team is strong enough to stall, is OK.
Most of the inters do NOT int with only one action, but consistently do stupid things. IDK what do you get for trying to simplify inting only to a single action (which is not true in more than 90% of inters). Nobody will get banned for making one mistake. But consistently doing stupid shit can not be defended by any logic. Obviously you can bring "hard to decide" examples which are a very small part of the inting cases. OFC there are expections for flaming too, yet Rito can handle that (questionably..)
Jo0o4 votesSounds to me like you just want to be able to punish people for not playing well and/or agreeing with you.
Gamer Life1 votesSounds to me like you just want to be able to punish people for not playing well and/or agreeing with you.
Not about if people are bad or not, that isnt what being said here
It about people who just dont want to listen or do what the team are doing and they just end up dieing over and over again. If people are bad at game then they are bad put people who are throwing the game should be punished
Jo0o4 votesLack of map/chat awareness and bad decision-making are parts of being bad, not trolling. And your own opinions and requests made of your teammates aren't necessarily true.
Know how often a pure split-push champ like Tryndamere or Yorick gets flamed for not helping out in team fights?
Gamer Life1 votesLack of map/chat awareness and bad decision-making are parts of being bad, not trolling. And your own opinions and requests made of your teammates aren't necessarily true.
Know how often a pure split-push champ like Tryndamere or Yorick gets flamed for not helping out in team fights?
I am talking about champ like 
as they are build as split pushes. why am I having to repeat my self
Jo0o4 votesDude, all the Rioter said to you was that you can't impose strategic requirements on your teammates, and you can't do anything about them muting or ignoring you.
Accept that you can't micro-manage other humans and move on.
Gamer Life1 votesDude, all the Rioter said to you was that you can't impose strategic requirements on your teammates, and you can't do anything about them muting or ignoring you.
Accept that you can't micro-manage other humans and move on.
Am not explain to you anymore because you dont have a clue mate
Imperial Pandaa1 votesThat could be because what you are saying isn't clear. The example you just gave the other guy is probably the clearest one you've made.
Gamer Life1 votes[{quoted}](name=Imperial Pandaa,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=aEEKdBll,comment-id=0000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-02-09T20:40:29.547+0000)
That could be because what you are saying isn't clear. The example you just gave the other guy is probably the clearest one you've made.
I didnt no I had to draw a diagram for people. Its a simple thing
Imperial Pandaa4 votesWhen your statement is "Riot doesn't want you to play as a team in a team game?" and then provide 0 examples, it is as clear as mud. That could have been someone split pushing, a support roaming out of lane and leaving adc for a moment, or someone clearing farm in a lane real quick. All of these still are teamwork.
In the example you finally gave clearly "we were holding off enemy as 4 and the 5th player was in jungle farming. Not backing as their 5th began pushing another lane." Yes, it looks bad but the question is why were they doing that? Were they getting a buff to help engage with? Were they trying to get gold to buy an item? If the answer to either of those were yes, than it is still for the team.
You don't need a diagram, you just need to actually not be vague.
Jo0o5 votesDon't worry, I understand you just fine.
Gamer Life1 votesno you dont
Jo0o5 votesNo, I think I do.
You're frustrated because you've encountered players that don't listen to your pings or chat, don't properly group, and otherwise fail to follow your shotcalls. However, your calls are not infallible, and your teammates are not required to follow them, regardless of whether or not they were the "correct" call to make in a given situation.
It's unreasonable to suggest that an individual be punished or banned for such behavior, because at the end of the day it's simply being bad.
Gamer Life1 votesNo, I think I do.
You're frustrated because you've encountered players that don't listen to your pings or chat, don't properly group, and otherwise fail to follow your shotcalls. However, your calls are not infallible, and your teammates are not required to follow them, regardless of whether or not they were the "correct" call to make in a given situation.
It's unreasonable to suggest that an individual be punished or banned for such behavior, because at the end of the day it's simply being bad.
There u are wrong I explain in other reply
Jo0o3 votesThen maybe you should go back to the EUW boards and try this post in whatever your first language is, because it's fucking impossible to figure out what you're saying.
Modi3 votesPut more simply: you are not the designated shot caller. There is no requirement for them to do as you dictate.
