Boards›Player Behavior

prisoners island

scazzman··2 votes·673 views

i know riot says they wont do it, but i feel like it might be time to abandon permabans in favor of a prisoners island system and here's why

  • prisoners island already exists, its called pre 30. I played a few games at low level, and MY GOD! maybe 1 in 10 players is legitimately a newbie, its mostly either bots, permabanned players on smurf account number 31459, or a dedicated troll account,with the occasional newbie thrown in. at least with a prisoners island concept, you're no longer affecting new players as badly.

  • "we want to encourage reform" Lets face it. toxic players don't care about "getting better", they care about not getting banned. even if they're no longer getting punished, they're still the same person mentally, they've just learned not to type in chat,and in the case of intentional feeders and trolls, theyve learned to troll in ways that don't look obvious, such as afk farming/pretending to simply be bad at the game,

  • black market accounts permabans create a market for banned players wishing to get back into ranked without leveling up to 30. which results in more bots, hacked accounts, ect.

  • neutral and "positive" players are becoming afraid of the chat. /mute allers have taken over the game, and with the new ping mute coming out, its going to get even worse,

  • non toxics are able to enjoy the game, and everyone is able to keep their account, which i think would have a positive effect overall.

  • it would FINALLY prove to the community that riot isnt milking banned players to the last dollar

19 Comments

Sarutobi6 votes

  1. Thats not a good thing, mainly because it takes away from actual new players. So why would you consider this a good thing?

  2. Most people who get punished the first time usually reform and its thank to Riot understanding about reforming players. Just because some dont want to reform, doesnt mean we should get rid of it all together.

  3. Those accounts for the most part get ban because more often than not they were leveled up by means of cheating (usually scripting)

  4. I would consider myself a positive player, and im not afraid to use the chat. So im not sure what the point of this is trying to make.

  5. Is actually a bad thing. You are basically saying telling people you can break any rules in this game and never get any punishment. The truth of the matter is that the Account is something cherished. The whole point of a punishment is just that.

  6. Considering most people who play this game rarely even buy RP, especially now that Hextech is a thing, im not sure i understand your point. I would assume most people who do get ban wouldnt be buying RP in the first place, so how exactly can you say they are trying to milk money? This game doesnt even require you to buy anything.

Muahahahha1 votes

Threads in this forum branch are either ignored pruned or down voted into hell and its always the same people against the ideas

at this point when i see -X down votes i'm beginning to think its just admins trying to AstroTurf, and the ideas are not actually bad, and the detractors don't actually argue against them they just word salad like you just did

The current system is not working regardless of the ideas being suggested

AeroWaffle7 votes

at this point when i see -X down votes i'm beginning to think its just admins trying to AstroTurf

Why can't you accept that some people may not like certain ideas? Claiming that it's all a conspiracy doesn't help any argument you make.

Muahahahha1 votes

I can accept it, its just the same people down-voting every time

like you

even the game Talos Principle talked abou admin astro turfing, and its a well known fact that the cia subverts every internet forum they can get a mole into not even memeing here

AeroWaffle6 votes

Claiming that it's all a conspiracy doesn't help any argument you make.

ModPrandine7 votes

{quoted}

I can accept it, its just the same people down-voting every time

like you

even the game Talos Principle talked abou admin astro turfing, and its a well known fact that the cia subverts every internet forum they can get a mole into not even memeing here

Typically in the PB&M forum posts get downvoted if they're an idea that's been discussed to death, is a low effort post and/or it's someone whose known to make low-effort posts and/or lash out at anyone who doesn't share their exact same viewpoints. It's hard to have a conversation with someone if that person is intentionally being difficult to have a conversation with.

That said, there are a couple of threads in this forum that have gotten quite a bit of upvotes, usually because:

  1. The idea presented was fair and reasonable.
  2. The presenter doesn't start yelling and raging at others when met with [reasonable/respectful] disagreement.
Muahahahha1 votes

the same people over and over again downvote ideas they don't like

they don't even discuss them

and most of the time the up-voted ones say the same thing but just get lucky early with up-votes from randos and the herd follows

the biggest upvote i've seen wasn't even the op, it was deep in the thread where the authoritarians where to lazy to look

ModPrandine6 votes

{quoted}

the same people over and over again downvote ideas they don't like

they don't even discuss them

and most of the time the up-voted ones say the same thing but just get lucky early with up-votes from randos and the herd follows

the biggest upvote i've seen wasn't even the op, it was deep in the thread where the authoritarians where to lazy to look

We have no way of knowing who downvotes or upvotes our posts for sure: we can only make guesses as to who we think it is, and sometimes in threads a poster has already said what needed to be said in there, so that post would naturally get a few upvotes from others who generally agree with the sentiment to avoid clogging up the thread further with needless posts.

Also, I specifically said "threads" in my original post here: if you sort by "Best" you can see a couple of threads with a high amount of upvotes. As for the same people downvoting, from my experience in the PB&M forum it's usually regulars of often two sides of the coin:

Heads: People who generally agree with Riot's stance on behavior and usually want to help them improve the system for the better. Tails: People who generally disagree with Riot's stance on behavior and usually want Riot to allow them to act however they want with no consequences for their behavior. In-between: People who may be on the fence about certain topics related to behavior.

Each forum has its own group of regulars, and for this forum specifically (PBM) you can usually tell which side of the coin certain people are on.

Muahahahha1 votes

but when it comes to "Head's" they don't even post ideas, and they group vote before the posts are even few min old, and you know once a value is shown the herd will follow

"Head's" are obviously un-apologetically carrying water for Riot, its shameful

ModPrandine5 votes

{quoted}

but when it comes to "Head's" they don't even post ideas, and they group vote before the posts are even few min old, and you know once a value is shown the herd will follow

Like I said before sometimes one post is better than 10 if the one post already says everything that needed to be said well enough.

"Head's" are obviously un-apologetically carrying water for Riot, its shameful

I disagree: just because allot of people agree with Riot's general stance on behavior doesn't mean that they agree with every single one of Riot's decisions. For example, I agree with Riot that poor behavior needs to be punished while good behavior needs to be rewarded, but I disagree with their decision to remove Dominion as a permanent game mode as that was a mode that I really enjoyed playing.

As a side note, comments like that do nothing to facilitate civil discussion and only give people the impression (keyword: impression) that you're only looking for Yesman answers as responses to your posts.

ModUlanopo5 votes

{quoted}

Threads in this forum branch are either ignored pruned or down voted into hell and its always the same people against the ideas

at this point when i see -X down votes i'm beginning to think its just admins trying to AstroTurf, and the ideas are not actually bad, and the detractors don't actually argue against them they just word salad like you just did

The current system is not working regardless of the ideas being suggested

I don't generally vote on threads or comments as it might be seen as a conflict with my responsibilities as an Arbiter.

http://i.imgur.com/nuVhlET.png[/img]

You should probably consider whether it's just the community disagreeing with someone. No astroturfing conspiracy required.

scazzman1 votes

{quoted}

I don't generally vote on threads or comments as it might be seen as a conflict with my responsibilities as an Arbiter.

http://i.imgur.com/nuVhlET.png[/img]

You should probably consider whether it's just the community disagreeing with someone. No astroturfing conspiracy required.

i honestly think the downvote system is unhealthy for the boards in general. and no. im not just saying this because im getting downvoted. i feel like it should be replaced with a "like" system, or eliminated altogether, either that or make it so someone has to actually comment before voting

ModUlanopo1 votes

i honestly think the downvote system is unhealthy for the boards in general.

Removing downvotes or votes altogether are things we have considered.

scazzman1 votes

{quoted}

Removing downvotes or votes altogether are things we have considered.

and why havent you?

scazzman1 votes

{quoted}

  1. Thats not a good thing, mainly because it takes away from actual new players. So why would you consider this a good thing?

  2. Most people who get punished the first time usually reform and its thank to Riot understanding about reforming players. Just because some dont want to reform, doesnt mean we should get rid of it all together.

  3. Those accounts for the most part get ban because more often than not they were leveled up by means of cheating (usually scripting)

  4. I would consider myself a positive player, and im not afraid to use the chat. So im not sure what the point of this is trying to make.

  5. Is actually a bad thing. You are basically saying telling people you can break any rules in this game and never get any punishment. The truth of the matter is that the Account is something cherished. The whole point of a punishment is just that.

  6. Considering most people who play this game rarely even buy RP, especially now that Hextech is a thing, im not sure i understand your point. I would assume most people who do get ban wouldnt be buying RP in the first place, so how exactly can you say they are trying to milk money? This game doesnt even require you to buy anything.

  1. I was saying the current system is a bad thing because it just encourages smurfing, by no longer permabanning for toxicity, you eliminate the need for permabanned players to make smurfs, and we can both admit that the new player experience is absolutely horrid.

  2. they don't "reform" they just either stop showing their toxicity, or stop getting caught, they're still toxic, theyre just no longer getting banned

  3. however they dont always get caught, and eliminating permabans would reduce the market for hacked or botted accounts

  4. you personally may not be afraid of the chat. but a good chunk of the playerbase either /mutes all or only types the "robot phrases" such as gg, drag up ect.

  5. theres a such thing as overkill

  6. even if not every permabanned player makes a smurf im sure enough of them do to make it worthwhile to try and gouge banned players for more money. even if thats not their intention. it sure fucking looks like it from a players perspective

EvilDustMan4 votes

{quoted}

  1. I was saying the current system is a bad thing because it just encourages smurfing, by no longer permabanning for toxicity, you eliminate the need for permabanned players to make smurfs, and we can both admit that the new player experience is absolutely horrid.

  2. they don't "reform" they just either stop showing their toxicity, or stop getting caught, they're still toxic, theyre just no longer getting banned

  3. however they dont always get caught, and eliminating permabans would reduce the market for hacked or botted accounts

  4. you personally may not be afraid of the chat. but a good chunk of the playerbase either /mutes all or only types the "robot phrases" such as gg, drag up ect.

  5. theres a such thing as overkill

  6. even if not every permabanned player makes a smurf im sure enough of them do to make it worthwhile to try and gouge banned players for more money. even if thats not their intention. it sure fucking looks like it from a players perspective

Implying people in the prisoners island won't just smurf.

scazzman1 votes

{quoted}

Implying people in the prisoners island won't just smurf.

But there would be less motivation to do so, especially if there were no indication of being in prisoners island

Umbral Regent2 votes

prisoners island already exists, its called pre 30.

You can't use pre-level 30 matches as leverage to Prisoner's Island, because Prisoner's Island is a form of punishment, imposed on those who actually committed a punishable offence. Pre-30 matches are a (with a scant few outlier cases) voluntary thing, not a punishment.

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