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@riot, can someone offer an explination?

usul1202··6 votes·731 views

So, I've been thinking about rune pages, and I'm honestly pretty confused. Why do they cost anything? They're more or less mandatory to do well in the game, and to play ranked without them is rank-suicide. I can understand them being a barrier of entry time wise, but lets be real. The last number i saw on it said that the 2 basic rune pages cost 18000 IP, not including extra rune pages to truly optimize. 18 thousand is a lot of IP. I'm not saying they should be free, but can someone explain to me why this still exists as an extremely time consuming barrier to keep people from playing on an even playing field?

(note: I'm pretty new to the game, and didn't learn about the necessity of runes till I was level 30. i have like, 60 normals wins or something like that. And those initial games hurt a lot, because i was matched with people with 500+ wins. They hit so much harder in lane that it was crazy to lane against them. now i have one rune page i really like, and another sub-optimal one, and i can feel the difference. the runes are mandatory to play well, which is the source of my confusion)

20 Comments

Deep Terror Nami2 votes

It's meant to be frustrating and hold you back and take up your IP. The purpose is to make you either A) Play more to get the IP you need, or B) Spend money on RP or Boosts so you can get them easier without sacrificing getting new champions. It's a win-win for Riot. If they wanted it otherwise they'd just unlock them the same way as Masteries.

usul12021 votes

That's the reason that I believe that they runes should still have a cost. However, when it has a negative, long term impact on gameplay that can effect other people in matchmaking, how effective/worth is it?

Raptamei2 votes

Heroes of the Storm does not have runes, making it much easier to unlock heroes.

I bet when HotS is released, Riot will have to make runes free.

Aerothal2 votes

{quoted}

Heroes of the Storm does not have runes, making it much easier to unlock heroes.

I bet when HotS is released, Riot will have to make runes free.

HotS isnt even in the same...League :P

usul12021 votes

While i can hope for as much, I see the games treating it with a different approach. If nothing else, no runes might show how cookie-cutter the champions become.

Runes give you an option to make a champion your own. Got your own little idea on how good scaling armor is versus flat on this champ versus that? Run it! but......... after you grind the IP for all 9 of them. every single time you want to try out a way to optimize or have fun with something off-meta like AS/AP/ManaRegen Shaco.

Aerothal1 votes

you wont get one!!!

Riot is already very slow to dish out Explanations.

But I have NEVER seen them give anyone an explination ever

usul12021 votes

Which is why i'm asking nicely, with reasonable commentary in my original post. People work for Riot, so I'm trying to treat them like people and have a discussion here. No rage, just a question and reasoning.

Aerothal1 votes

tbh though, i agree that the rune grind is awful. runes are way to pricey. its a financial incentive for Riot to keep the price up though. If you want to successfully level fast, you kind of have to spend $ on ip boosts.

usul12021 votes

It is, but like all things in business, if the price is too high, then a negative effect accrues. I'm arguing on the side that they have surpassed this point.

Kazaashi1 votes

They allow you to tweak your play and provide a bit more customization to your champs. Do you need a bit of extra survival on your first clear in the jungle? Slap some armor seals on there and see how that helps.

Other than that they are an IP sink. Since the game is F2P they have to monetize it somehow, and if you could just save your IP for champs only, They wouldn't have made any money. This is a throwback to when LoL was brand new. There are a lot more things to spend cash on now, so I bet we'll see a revamp of the Rune system soon. I think Riot has even said as much.

Kazaashi1 votes

{quoted}

They allow you to tweak your play and provide a bit more customization to your champs. Do you need a bit of extra survival on your first clear in the jungle? Slap some armor seals on there and see how that helps.

Other than that they are an IP sink. Since the game is F2P they have to monetize it somehow, and if you could just save your IP for champs only, They wouldn't have made any money. This is a throwback to when LoL was brand new and only champs, skins, and rune pages. There are a lot more things to spend cash on now, so I bet we'll see a revamp of the Rune system soon. I think Riot has even said as much.

usul12021 votes

That's the thing, is that the runes give you that customization. it allows for champs to make certain aspects of their game better. By keeping IP costs high, Riot reduces the ability to customize and specialize between champions.

The issue i have is that I don't believe that Riot makes enough off of rune costs for it to be worth. They cost player time and frustration, but not rp. Skins and champions (for those who refuse to wait) and wards and icons (except the 99,999 RP one) and rune pages even make them money. But how runes are currently set up is not based on money, but on time consumption.

Honestly, if prices dropped i think that a lot of IP would still go into runes. a lot more rune pages would be bought as well, because people would have the ability to specialize their rune pages and make more of them. I, and several friends whom i've spoken to on the topic, feel that the incentive to save up 6300 IP for a rune page isn't there, when you will probably spend more than that perfecting that rune page, delaying you 2 champions, who might just work with your generic page.

Kazaashi1 votes

{quoted}

That's the thing, is that the runes give you that customization. it allows for champs to make certain aspects of their game better. By keeping IP costs high, Riot reduces the ability to customize and specialize between champions.

The issue i have is that I don't believe that Riot makes enough off of rune costs for it to be worth. They cost player time and frustration, but not rp. Skins and champions (for those who refuse to wait) and wards and icons (except the 99,999 RP one) and rune pages even make them money. But how runes are currently set up is not based on money, but on time consumption.

Honestly, if prices dropped i think that a lot of IP would still go into runes. a lot more rune pages would be bought as well, because people would have the ability to specialize their rune pages and make more of them. I, and several friends whom i've spoken to on the topic, feel that the incentive to save up 6300 IP for a rune page isn't there, when you will probably spend more than that perfecting that rune page, delaying you 2 champions, who might just work with your generic page.

Honestly, you only really need 2 pages. 1 for armor pen marks, the other for magic pen marks. The seals can be armor and the glyphs can be scaling MR for both. Add some % MS quints and you are good for 75% of the champs in the game.

Runes are an opportunity cost, instead of people just saving up their IP for champs, they can spend the IP on runes and buy RP to get the champs, or grind up more IP to get the champs. Its a win-win because riot either makes cash off one person, or keeps the other around to play with the people who do spend cash.

I think, now that there are a million things to drop cash on, Riot could just drop the cost of runes entirely and just make extra Rune pages only for sale for RP.

usul12021 votes

I disagree. Diana jungle optimally would have AP, AS, Armor, and magic pen. When playing Cass i would love to have some extra mana early to get that last E off. When playing Quinn my early game benefits so much more from ArPen than from AD, but then i also play riven and shaco and jax and sion who need the AD, so i'm forced to go AD. The number of rune pages bought would go up dramatically if people actually had runes to fill them.

Kazaashi1 votes

{quoted}

I disagree. Diana jungle optimally would have AP, AS, Armor, and magic pen. When playing Cass i would love to have some extra mana early to get that last E off. When playing Quinn my early game benefits so much more from ArPen than from AD, but then i also play riven and shaco and jax and sion who need the AD, so i'm forced to go AD. The number of rune pages bought would go up dramatically if people actually had runes to fill them.

That is why I said it will work for 75% of the champions, not all champions. Obviously you will want some AS for a jungle rune page. I don't agree with the optimal-ness of that Diana jungle page, but that is another discussion.

My point was that you don't need a ton of runes or pages to play the game effectively.

usul12021 votes

IDK. the listed champions are my favorites, so I am biased there. However, my point isn't related to that. The point of this is that the excessive rune prices prevent customization and interesting play through early game decisions through rune-based stats.

Edit: those first 2 mandatory pages are also incredibly painful to get. 18000 IP was the number i saw last. For even the base, considered mandatory, pages.

Kazaashi1 votes

{quoted}

IDK. the listed champions are my favorites, so I am biased there. However, my point isn't related to that. The point of this is that the excessive rune prices prevent customization and interesting play through early game decisions through rune-based stats.

Edit: those first 2 mandatory pages are also incredibly painful to get. 18000 IP was the number i saw last. For even the base, considered mandatory, pages.

I agree the prices are high, but I never felt they were not worth it.

That is only 18-36 games. You should play WAAAAAAAY more than that leveling up.

usul12021 votes

Can you tell me how the hell you're earning 500-1000 IP a game?!?!?! because in that case, sure, rune prices aren't that bad.

because at current levels, thats 180-360 games. for just the base rune pages, ignoring buying an extra one and runes to fill for niche champs like Diana , Ryze , Shaco , Quinn , Azir and the like.

Kazaashi2 votes

{quoted}

Can you tell me how the hell you're earning 500-1000 IP a game?!?!?! because in that case, sure, rune prices aren't that bad.

because at current levels, thats 180-360 games. for just the base rune pages, ignoring buying an extra one and runes to fill for niche champs like Diana , Ryze , Shaco , Quinn , Azir and the like.

LOL, Math fail. Its been a long day. :(

I have over 1500 games played and have all the runes I could want. I pretty much haven't had to buy runes since mid season 3 and I started playing late in season 2. Just save up all your IP for the runes themselves. You can get everything else through RP until you have the runes you need.

usul12021 votes

As a new player, its painful doing that initial grind. I'm not opposed to RP only things (that aren't mandatory like runes, AKA skins, icons, wards, first-week champs), but to not be able to optimally play for a long time on your mains because you're incapable of sticking with one kind of champion feels a little painful. (avoiding the word unfair here for it's connotations. painful isn't quite right either though. needless might work? excessive? I'm bad with words........)

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