I made the suggestion for more Black Champs. 21 down votes in 6 hours.

Occams Raiser·Apr 21, 2015·6 votes·3,140 views

What a world we live in. Maybe I asked wrong. Seems like you can't acknowledge inequality anymore. I get tired of seeing black people have to cosplay as white champs with straight hair wigs every time I go to Comic-Con. Or You get the alternative. Oh look, the tenth Lucian. I don't think people understand what this does to our social psychology. Or maybe they do and it is all deliberate. I want to give the human race more credit than that.

Down votes, apathy, and racists jokes.... Hmmm. It's still pretty bad out there.

185 Comments

KrigjerApr 21, 201519 votes

I'm getting tired of seeing damn near every game have its forums overrun by people insisting that EVERYTHING needs representation. IN A FANTASY SETTING.

Yet I never see praise for when a game actually includes a certain element.

That said, I don't think champions should be created for the purposes of cosplay. I don't care about cosplay, or what race/gender/whatever a champion is. I want to enjoy their KIT, because GAMEPLAY matters to me more than feeling represented in a video game.

Occams RaiserApr 21, 20153 votes

Would you expect me to get up in arms over why there are no black people in a game based in feudal Japan? Only in fantasy\fairy tale land would I expect everything to be represented.
I don't see people patting men on the back for being a father to their children either.
Odds are you are white. If you are represented already why would you be expected to care about representation. People in a restaurant don't worry about starving.
If you are black I have so many more questions for you.

TeemoJenkinsApr 21, 201511 votes

[{quoted}](name=Occams Raiser,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=TeXyERLl,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2015-04-21T14:39:21.971+0000)

Would you expect me to get up in arms over why there are no black people in a game based in feudal Japan? Only in fantasy\fairy tale land would I expect everything to be represented.

I don't see people patting men on the back for being a father to their children either.

Odds are you are white. If you are represented already why would you be expected to care about representation. People in a restaurant don't worry about starving.

If you are black I have so many more questions for you.

The game has blue / green / purple / furry people... but because there's only one human character of potential African American descent, you're in a fit. The reason you were downvoted is because of one simple fact: This game is immensely diverse in race / color / creed - but because of a skin color you're unhappy? Ask yourself a simple question: Why does the majority disagree with me? Instead of asking that question you drop another flame thread.

You've made a decision; you want to be offended, and like all persons looking to be offended you will never be disappointed.

Occams RaiserApr 21, 20152 votes

This game is immensely diverse in** race** / color / creed - but because of a skin color you're unhappy?

I just got whiplash!

TeemoJenkinsApr 21, 20155 votes

[{quoted}](name=Occams Raiser,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=TeXyERLl,comment-id=0001000000000001,timestamp=2015-04-21T16:41:02.140+0000)

I just got whiplash!

Because you recognized how ignorant your argument is?

KrigjerApr 21, 20159 votes

[{quoted}](name=Occams Raiser,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=TeXyERLl,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2015-04-21T14:39:21.971+0000)

Would you expect me to get up in arms over why there are no black people in a game based in feudal Japan? Only in fantasy\fairy tale land would I expect everything to be represented.

I don't see people patting men on the back for being a father to their children either.

Odds are you are white. If you are represented already why would you be expected to care about representation. People in a restaurant don't worry about starving.

If you are black I have so many more questions for you.

League is based in Runeterra. For all you know, dark-skinned people are incredibly rare whereas purple bug-things are a dime a dozen. So I reiterate, stop expecting fantasy to try and represent everything under the sun.
This is an entirely different issue?
I'm a white female, and I constantly see other women demanding more 'strong female leader roles'. I'm sick of that too, so it just naturally crosses over to this 'issue' too.

I'm curious why so many people seem to get their enjoyment out of a video game based on whether their race or gender is or is not represented. Do you play Lucian because he's the only black man or do you play him because you actually enjoy his kit and playstyle?

Occams RaiserApr 21, 20154 votes

1> Your first argument: It is possible a company comprised of mostly white males (non blacks) created a work of fiction where dark skin people are a rarity. Touché. Did you ever notice white people are never under represented?

3> You don't like people that take strong stands on things you don't give a shit about? Is that the take-away?

Your last statement assumes that I think Riot is overtly racist. That is not the case. Human nature shows us that we gravitate towards what we best relate to by familiarity. They are merely lazy thinkers in this context.

Their meeting: We need a new champion. How bout a dragon. How bout a Yordle. No, a goblin. Lets do DragonKnight. I like it!

When you think of a man in suit of armor, do you think of dreads coming out the back of the helmet? You are not racist just because your association to knight in shining armor is a white guy. **I don't think of a black guy first either. ** But I was raised in America.

Sinister SnailApr 21, 20153 votes

[{quoted}](name=Occams Raiser,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=TeXyERLl,comment-id=0001000000010000,timestamp=2015-04-21T15:46:00.411+0000)

1> Your first argument: It is possible a company comprised of mostly white males (non blacks) created a work of fiction where dark skin people are a rarity. Touché. Did you ever notice white people are never under represented?

3> You don't like people that take strong stands on things you don't give a shit about? Is that the take-away?

Your last statement assumes that I think Riot is overtly racist. That is not the case. Human nature shows us that we gravitate towards what we best relate to by familiarity. They are merely lazy thinkers in this context.

Their meeting: We need a new champion. How bout a dragon. How bout a Yordle. No, a goblin. Lets do DragonKnight. I like it!

When you think of a man in suit of armor, do you think of dreads coming out the back of the helmet? You are not racist just because your association to knight in shining armor is a white guy. **I don't think of a black guy first either. ** But I was raised in America.

No, I don't think a guy has to have dreads coming out of his helmet for him to be black. That's racist. Why is skin color even important for such a character?

It's like the discussion on TF2 Pyro's gender. The only people who care are looking for a reason to be offended: the rest of us are happy to be playing as a badass pyromaniac.

Occams RaiserApr 21, 20153 votes

You missed the point on the dreads comment.

Why is skin color even important for such a character?

Its not important TO the character. Its Important for people to see positive representations of themselves reflected in a civilization they helped build. If that is not an objective truth for you, you will never get it.

Race is not like the Pyro in TF2

Sinister SnailApr 21, 20154 votes

[{quoted}](name=Occams Raiser,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=TeXyERLl,comment-id=000100000001000000000000,timestamp=2015-04-21T17:49:58.945+0000)

You missed the point on the dreads comment.

Its not important TO the character. Its Important for people to see positive representations of themselves reflected in a civilization they helped build. If that is not an objective truth for you, you will never get it.

Race is not like the Pyro in TF2

I'm all for empowerment, and if someone feels shitty because of their skin color, of course it's important for there to be positive role models. But every video game or other piece of media is not obligated to have a diverse cast to accommodate such people. If they do, good for them, but it's stupid to deride those that lack ethic variety. Should I get up in arms if a game has an exclusively African American cast? No. As long as the developers are not intentionally sending a message that, in real life, one race is superior to another or whatever, it's silly to get mad at them for the diversity or lack thereof in their game.

Laughing FishApr 22, 20153 votes

When you think of a man in suit of armor, do you think of dreads coming out the back of the helmet? You are not racist just because your association to knight in shining armor is a white guy. I don't think of a black guy first either. But I was raised in America.

You do know that knights were European right? And Europeans as a whole are a mostly Caucasian bunch. That is not racist, that is fact. When I picture a Samurai, I don't picture a white guy. Why? Because the Samurai were Japanese.

Occams RaiserApr 22, 20151 votes

You are quote mining. That is intellectually disingenuous. And you are agreeing with on top of it.

Laughing FishApr 22, 20152 votes

I am certainly not agreeing with you. You are saying the only reason one would picture a white man when they think of a knight is because they were raised in America. But the fact is the knights were real people, and anyone with any understanding of history knows that knights were white. I would further argue that by grouping all Americans (one of the most diverse cultural group on Earth) into a single mindset is the epitome of ignorance, and shows that you are the one that lacks cultural sensitivity.

Occams RaiserApr 22, 20151 votes

You do know that knights were European right? And Europeans as a whole are a mostly Caucasian bunch. That is not racist, that is fact

I said that.

When I picture a Samurai, I don't picture a white guy. Why? Because the Samurai were Japanese.

I said that. You are just using different word than I did.

You misunderstood. I am explaining that when we choose archetypes they inherently have race attached to most of them. I don't like to wait on whites to include us without guidance cause we always get bushman, witchdoctor, voodoo priestess, or obnoxious hoodlum of the appropriate era. People are more likely to choose archetypes that they relate to, then the ones that they think are bad ass, then the ones they think other people will find bad ass.

Do you think game creators think we want another witchdoctor or do they? It's nice that they came out the gate with Lucian. I don't think they are racist. They are normal. When I say being born in America makes you racist, I mean passively not overtly. IF you ask many black people, they feel better doing business with whites over there own. They might not tell you out right cause it is frank discussion that most of us don't share with outsiders. Other immigrants try to keep their money in their own communities first.

Context is everything.

Laughing FishApr 22, 20155 votes

When I say being born in America makes you racist, I mean passively not overtly.

There it is again. Cultural insensitivity at its finest. The only person here saying anything remotely offensive or insensitive is you.

TrylobyteApr 22, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=Occams Raiser,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=TeXyERLl,comment-id=00010000000100000001000000000000,timestamp=2015-04-22T15:13:47.969+0000) When I say being born in America makes you racist, I mean passively not overtly.

Wow. For someone claiming to campaign against racism and prejudice, I am rather surprised you'd say 'Every American is racist.' Bonus points if you're American yourself, since you'd be calling yourself racist too. That's not shooting yourself in the foot, that's targeting yourself with a guided missile.

Laughing FishApr 21, 201512 votes

http://www.reactiongifs.com/r/facepalm.gif

TrylobyteApr 21, 201511 votes

Well, if you want to make it an issue that there's only one black champion...

...there are no confirmed gay champions. ...there are no confirmed lesbian champions (though Vi x Caitlyn is hinted as canon). ...there are no bisexual champions we know of. ...there are no transgendered champions. ...there are only 42 female champions out of 124, a mere third. ...female champions are overwhelmingly put into the most fragile, delicate roles (support and ADC). ...female champions have overwhelmingly fanservice-laden attire. ...the only religiously-themed champions are from Christian iconography. ...the only obviously Arabic champion is evil. ...there are five child champions (Annie, Amumu, Gnar, Nunu, Kog'maw) you can inflict violence upon. ...there are only two elderly champions.

But where's all the outcry about these inequalities and injustices? There isn't any, because the game doesn't have to, and in fact shouldn't, reflect real life demographics. It's a fantasy world.

Linna Excel nails it above. Making champions black for the sake of having black champions just doesn't fly, no more than the 'scythe-wielding loli' concept did a year or two ago. If the only major element of that champions identity is 'I am black' or 'I am a loli with a scythe' not many people are going to like it because there's nothing to it. Put some meat on the bones of the concept and we might be more supportive.

That said, Riot does have a history of attempting to do this. We asked, where is our female tank? We got Leona. We asked, where is our black champion? We got Lucian. We asked, where is our monster that doesn't speak English? We got Rek'sai. But Riot just can't keep doing it all the time. Give 'em some help. Come up with a good, solid, well-thought idea and the community will support it a lot faster than if you just sit back and passively accuse Riot (and anyone who disagrees with you) of being racist.

AkeydelApr 21, 20152 votes

...there are no transgendered champions.

None LABELED as trans. With the current state of the lore, anything's possible

...the only religiously-themed champions are from Christian iconography. ...the only obviously Arabic champion is evil.

I'm genuinely confused, as to who you're referencing. There really isnt any (real world) religious affiliation, or representation. Plus there are several "arabic" champions (if you include champs from Shurima). Who were you specifically talking about?

...there are five child champions (Annie, Amumu, Gnar, Nunu, Kog'maw)

Just for completion: KogMaw , while short, isn't a child.

TrylobyteApr 21, 20154 votes

{quoted}

...the only religiously-themed champions are from Christian iconography. ...the only obviously Arabic champion is evil.

I'm genuinely confused, as to who you're referencing. There really isnt any (real world) religious affiliation, or representation. Plus there are several "arabic" champions (if you include champs from Shurima). Who were you specifically talking about?

Christian iconography is a reference to Kayle Morgana who not only resemble classical interpretations of angels, but whose backstory is loosely based off the tale of St. Michael the Archangel and Satan. I am aware that angels are also a thing in Judaism and Islam (as all three are based in the same general belief system and are in fact extensions of each other) but the classical vision of angels is tied pretty closely to Christianity.

The only 'obviously Arabic' character would be Malzahar . Shurima, a desert empire with a grand capital city, an empire full of slaves, and its animal-headed ~~gods~~ Ascended is based more generally off Ancient Egypt than Middle Eastern cultures. Further research shows you are, however, correct that Egyptians are still considered Arabic - My bad! You win this one.

Just for completion: , while short, isn't a child.

While not explicitly stated to be a child, Koggers is small, has a child-like mindset, a certain innocent quality, and likes to talk about his 'daddy.' He also follows Malzahar around in a puppy-like fashion. So he's generally thought to be a child so far as Void-monsters go.

SirsirApr 21, 201510 votes

I'm tired of various so called 'civil rights' groups (or persons, in this case) stirring shit that doesn't exist. No one cares that there aren't tons of black champs because no one cares about skin color. Isn't that what you want?

Occams RaiserApr 21, 20154 votes

No one cares that there aren't tons of black champs because no one cares about skin color.

Are trying to convince me or you? I'm black so I know that isn't true.

warpenguin555Apr 21, 20153 votes

[{quoted}](name=Occams Raiser,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=TeXyERLl,comment-id=00060000,timestamp=2015-04-21T15:59:42.897+0000)

Are trying to convince me or you? I'm black so I know that isn't true.

oh sorry only you and that other guy that posts like 4 paragraph care. Better now?

warpenguin555Apr 21, 20157 votes

OK. the reason why you were downvoted is because nobody like the people who pay attention to race in games. at all. At this rate we are getting a forum race war... what fun.

Also you forgot that there is only 1 Asian, Russian, and French champion each. Maybe they are offended.

There is actually a place where you can get this out, its called tumblr. Please spare us who hate the race is all that matters people and go there.

MyrddinApr 21, 20156 votes

But you have black alistar, what more could you want

yellowbricksApr 21, 20155 votes

People downvote because you shouldn't try to inject politics into video games. Riot made one black champ out of 120 something, it isn't some grand scheme to oppress black people, it's because in a fantasy setting, there's so much more you can do than just make boring humans all the time. But nope, here comes the social justice police, you're in violation of ordinance 50043a failure to equally represent any and all groups that exist in the universe including the ones we don't even know about.

You know the phrase "go with what you know"? Because it's a true saying, white people know themselves, so they're more inclined to make characters in their image, rather than try to capture the essence of another culture and miss lots of stuff and get a bunch of people jumping down their throats for it.

My question is, if under representation in video games upsets you so much, why aren't you making your own game with a black protagonist? It'd make a lot more of a difference than sitting on a forum whining at a company to cater to your needs. Go and learn one of the myriad game engines that exist nowadays and get cracking, or form a team with other like minded individuals.

Occams RaiserApr 21, 20152 votes

Allow me to highlight the implicit racism.

People downvote because you shouldn't try to inject politics into video games. Riot made one black champ out of 120 something, it isn't some grand scheme to oppress black people, it's because in a fantasy setting, there's so much more you can do than just make boring humans all the time. But nope, here comes the social justice police, you're in violation of ordinance 50043a failure to equally represent any and all groups that exist in the universe including the ones we don't even know about.

You know the phrase "go with what you know"? Because it's a true saying, white people know themselves, so they're more inclined to make characters in their image, rather than try to capture the essence of another culture and miss lots of stuff and get a bunch of people jumping down their throats for it.

My question is, if under representation in video games upsets you so much,** why aren't you making your own game with a black protagonist?** It'd make a lot more of a difference than sitting on a forum whining at a company to cater to your needs. Go and learn one of the myriad game engines that exist nowadays and get cracking, or form a team with other like minded individuals.

The one good thing you said: Riot needs help diversifying their employees. Apparently they are having trouble finding the black programmers, artists, and writers. That is the reason why they don't have black characters? They fear misrepresenting them. I suggest they start making real world diversity and I'll give a shout when they get to blackface and minstrel shows.

You aren't evil, you were just raised American.

Sinister SnailApr 21, 20158 votes

[{quoted}](name=Occams Raiser,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=TeXyERLl,comment-id=000b0000,timestamp=2015-04-21T16:56:00.006+0000)

Allow me to highlight the implicit racism.

The one good thing you said: Riot needs help diversifying their employees. Apparently they are having trouble finding the black programmers, artists, and writers. That is the reason why they don't have black characters? They fear misrepresenting them. I suggest they start making real world diversity and I'll give a shout when they get to blackface and minstrel shows.

You aren't evil, you were just raised American.

True equality is to not think about color. It's not "we should hire more black people/have more black champions to balance it out! Equal quantity=equal respect!" it's more "we should hire people and make champions, and not take skin color into consideration."

Saying "we should have equal black and white people" should make exactly as much sense as "we should have equal blue and brown eyed people." It's making a false dichotomy to make any judgements or decisions based on an aesthetic physical trait.

warpenguin555Apr 21, 20153 votes

{quoted}

True equality is to not think about color. It's not "we should hire more black people/have more black champions to balance it out! Equal quantity=equal respect!" it's more "we should hire people and make champions, and not take skin color into consideration."

Saying "we should have equal black and white people" should make exactly as much sense as "we should have equal blue and brown eyed people." It's making a false dichotomy to make any judgements or decisions based on an aesthetic physical trait.

THANK YOU! my brother upvoted you too, but he doesnt have an account so its invisible

Occams RaiserApr 22, 20151 votes

we should hire more black people/have more black champions to balance it out we should have equal black and white people

Who said this? You have taken something out of context.

True equality is realizing everyone is equal, in a social contract sense, despite having differences. I don't know what color you are but saying you are going to ignore an objective part of reality.... patronizing and ridiculous.

When you shut off the part of your human existence where instinctive behavior lies should we still consider you a human? You have robot like partitions and switches that you think we can all flip on and off.

Sinister SnailApr 22, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=Occams Raiser,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=TeXyERLl,comment-id=000b000000000001,timestamp=2015-04-22T00:15:19.168+0000)

Who said this? You have taken something out of context.

Here, in one of your posts earlier:

The one good thing you said: Riot needs help diversifying their employees. Apparently they are having trouble finding the black programmers, artists, and writers. That is the reason why they don't have black characters? They fear misrepresenting them. I suggest they start making real world diversity and I'll give a shout when they get to blackface and minstrel shows.

This looks like you're suggesting Riot needs to adjust their hiring to include more black people. You may have intended something else, but that's what it sounds like.

True equality is realizing everyone is equal, in a social contract sense, despite having differences.

I can jive with that. The social contract refers to the unspoken agreement between the state and its subjects, not sure what that has to do with anything, but yeah.

The thing I don't think is being well communicated is the application. It seems like a good idea to ask for different ethnicities to be represented numerically equally. But, when you think about it, that necessitates you looking at skin color, and taking that into consideration when making decisions. Going back to employment, imagine hearing this at an interview. "We are pleased to accept your job application, and a contributing factor of that is because you are black, and we are short on black people. It looks bad."

That's why I'm saying skin color should be ignored.

I don't know what color you are but saying you are going to ignore an objective part of reality.... patronizing and ridiculous. When you shut off the part of your human existence where instinctive behavior lies should we still consider you a human? You have robot like partitions and switches that you think we can all flip on and off.

It's the same way I don't make choices based on people's eye color. It's real, yeah, but a non-factor for any logical decision making. Yeah, I can switch off/ignore the stupid/fallacious/instinctive/reptilian/racist/tribal/hunter-gatherer part of my brain. Pretty sure that doesn't make me less of a person.

Please don't pull the 'we're only human' card. People have been shits and saints, and there's no reason we can't try hard to be the latter instead of defaulting to the former.

DaenApr 21, 20152 votes

Riot needs help diversifying their employees. Apparently they are having trouble finding the black programmers, artists, and writers.

Riot should be hiring the best people for the job, regardless of skin tone or ethnicity. There are actually specific laws against what you are suggesting because it is basically the definition of discrimination.

I would love to understand why you feel a private company has to perfectly represent the proportions of real-world society in their products. It is completely up to Riot what sorts of characters they would like to create, and it just so happens that light-skinned characters are more prevalent.

Here's a thought: What if light-skinned characters are just straight up easier to see and recognize during gameplay? If this is the case, there is literally zero racial implication here; it's just the most effective tool for the job. If I wanted to make a solar panel, I would want it to be as dark as possible to absorb light. I don't need to have an equal number of light-colored solar panels, that would be silly and counterproductive.

Occams RaiserApr 22, 20151 votes

Riot should be hiring the best people for the job, regardless of skin tone or ethnicity.

I didn't actually suggest otherwise.

I would love to understand why you feel a private company has to perfectly represent the proportions of real-world society in their products.

I don't.

Everything else you said I dismiss because its things that have been said in the past. Not about video games in particular but the ribbon that run through it is the same.

DaenApr 23, 20151 votes

Everything else you said I dismiss because its things that have been said in the past.

Let me get this straight - You are dismissing almost my entire comment because it corroborates what other people have said?

Occams RaiserApr 24, 20151 votes

Not in the context of this post.

Here's a thought: What if light-skinned characters are just straight up easier to see and recognize during gameplay? If this is the case, there is literally zero racial implication here; it's just the most effective tool for the job.

This stuff. There has been arguments made in history about difficulties being the reason why someone was chosen over someone else. Now we have technical difficulty arguments.

A lot of time a concept artist will start out with only blacks to rough out a silhouette. The character must be readable that way before they even worry about colors. Also, the likelihood of a character being all one color scale with out accents is low. In the case of League it doesn't even matter cause as long as the character is readable from other characters and the background it doesn't matter if he is as dark as Noob Saibot.

You don't know why your argument on fantasy vs real world equality is an odd one. Many have made on this thread. It has boggled me every time I see it. It is a made up lore. It isn't specific to any race or region and it takes elements from many archetypes and stories. If this was just a game about the monkey king we wouldn't be having this conversation.

Colgate GatorApr 21, 20154 votes

What, Karma doesn't have a dark skin enough to count or what am I missing here?

Colgate GatorApr 21, 20154 votes

[{quoted}](name=Occams Raiser,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=TeXyERLl,comment-id=00070000,timestamp=2015-04-21T17:11:25.923+0000)

No one thinks Karma is black. Not that I have ever seen when I googled "is Karma black?"

I don't really care if you think she is black, as it seems you only see black/not black, but I assure you, she isn't white, not that it matters, if I must be honest. There are many """non-white""" Champions, but people will always find a reason to complain about things.

Riot has zero obligation to cater to what you think is right. If they don't feel they have to make more "Black person archetype" kind of Champion for now, it's their own business, there are no racist implications in this, this is just how they have envisioned their own game.

There are many kinds and species of Champions in the ever-growing pool, and yet you focus on that asinine conclusion based on a Champions tone of skin, how shallow can you be?

[{quoted}](name=Occams Raiser,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=TeXyERLl,comment-id=000b0000,timestamp=2015-04-21T16:56:00.006+0000)

You aren't evil, you were just raised American.

I think the same thing as that "American" you just mentioned and I am Mexican. Judging by how you're answering to everyone who thinks differently from you, I'll only assume you're arguing for the sake of arguing.

Linna ExcelApr 21, 20153 votes

Maybe it's not what you are saying but how you are saying it. The other thread came off as negative and complaining.

Occams RaiserApr 21, 20151 votes

I can see that might be the perception. Could you lend a hand on rewording it for me? fresh eyes would help.

Linna ExcelApr 21, 20154 votes

My own thoughts of the matter is if you want to see a (insert description) character, you need to present the idea or question in a way that makes people want it or want to come up with ideas for it. Since riot likes themes and fantasies, I would try to think of themes of black characters in fiction or personalities on TV or in the movies.

Examples:

Are there any black superheroes that would make a good LOL fantasy theme, like Luke Cage, Cyborg, or Steel? Are there any actors or musicians you could base a character off of, like a military commander based on Danzel Washington or a funny tough guy like Ice Cube? Are there any historical or sports figures you could use? Maybe take a basketball icon such as Mike, Shaq, or Lebron or a defensive football linemen or linebacker. Are there any existing tropes that you don't normally associate with black people but would be an interesting take like Sir Hammerlock (british explorer). Are there any cultural themes that would make for an interesting new champion? Perhaps a Cajun chef (utility pyromancer).

I personally think that when riot finds the right idea for a second black champion, they'll do it. So for me the question is what is that right idea and how long is it going to take them to find it?

usul1202Apr 21, 20153 votes

I'm sorry, are you trying to tell me that runeterra has the exact same solar orbit as earth? Because the skin color black only exists on earth because earths tilt is a mere 23 degrees. were runterra to be tilted more, then there would be no black people on the planet. Your assumption that LoL has to work as earth does is odd, and quite frankly misplaced here. Its a fantasy game, it has no requirement to pay tribute to science.

Occams RaiserApr 21, 20151 votes

You put a lot of thought in this. Probably more than Riot did when creating the world. Your argument leaves me speechless. You are using the imaginary physics of a fantasy world to buttress a defense against an attack that I never made. Well done?

usul1202Apr 22, 20151 votes

I put as much though in it as i believed that the original post deserved. that being said, I am saying that this world's physics don't apply, and never claimed that you made an attack. Your reply is perfectly on par with your original post though.

Occams RaiserApr 22, 20151 votes

I just naturally assumed that anything you said was in reference to something I said. Forgive me. Are you making a point or an observation. I will respond to a point but just read an observation. It kind of seems like you are making conversation. Which I am cool with.

You are trying to explain to me why a bunch of non-white guys would create a world with a sparse number of black people in it by using physics. I get the science but it's all arbitrary cause it is fiction. Why didn't you just say maybe there is only one black guy cause that's all they wanted?

BeatzBoyFTWApr 22, 20153 votes

Pretty sure after this thread, OP's next thread would be:

**120+ Champs, ONE gay guy. Really? Taric **

101100111000Apr 21, 20151 votes

At some point, I feel yoi're being stupid on purpose. There are literally 1-ofs in this game of anything you can think of.

There's only 1 dragon champion. Is Riot racist to dragons?

There's only 1 bear (2 if you count tibbers). Is Riot racist to bears? Maybe Zilean, but eh.

There's only 1 starchild. Is Riot racist to starchilldren?

ShmeckleMancerApr 21, 20152 votes

You surely see the difference yes? You surely can see the overwhelming white cast of HUMAN characters right? And I don't think he was saying Riot is racists, I think he was just wondering if there could maybe be more than one black champ.

101100111000Apr 21, 20152 votes

I can see that you're using a blanket generalization of white to try and further a point, when each character has a distinct background and historic influence to their character.

Fiora isn't just white, she's a snooty French fencer.

Braum feels like a giant Russian folk hero.

Caitlyn is a British investigator and police officer.

Xin Zhao and Yasuo aren't even white. They herald from Asian folklore and the like.

Of course we can have more "black" champions, which is just another blanket term. But we'll get them when a designer's creativity sees a design fit for one. Simply because they don't make one now doesn't mean that they're just flat out ignoring the individual group.

Edit: And another thing, we don't vote the op because he's demanding something unreasonable. I'd rather have a cast of 1 unique "black" character with good design then 4-5 with mehish design and character just for the sake of representation.

ShmeckleMancerApr 21, 20151 votes

Believe me I get that the "white" characters come from a diverse background, with different bits borrowed from different cultures. However some of these characters, are just white for the sake of being white. So why can't we have some characters be of different ethnicity for the sake of it? I'm not trying to white wash over the value of differences, I want more!

What i don't get is if the thread was, "Game needs more Void Champions" this discussion wouldn't be anywhere near the length that it's reached. Which means that the idea of having a more inclusive cast of Human characters is important.

To me it's even more important now, than when I woke up this morning. I didn't realize that so much of the community I spend so much time in is in such a bubble that the mention of diversity of Human characters (annoying i have to keep using the word Human) gets their collective panties in a bunch.

Like why downvote, or come up with bullshit like "well look at all the yordles"? Yeah well look at ALL the fucking yordles. Why try to fight a battle that ends up either exposing your racism, or your ignorance? Why is it so wrong for someone to think "Hey wouldn't it be cool if we had another black character in the game?" Why is it wrong for them to share it on a message board?

And to all the "Yeah but it should be about the Character not skin color" noise, uh fucking duh. Like it wasn't like the original poster was like, hey just give us generic black guy #241 (whatever that would be anyway). Of course he wants him to be fleshed out, cool, and with neat abilities and an original look. smacks head on keyboard

101100111000Apr 21, 20155 votes

The only places where I can see "white for the sake of being white" is even a remote issue would be in Demacia and Noxus, two nations whose representatives come from a very narrow circle of families (I.e. Crownguard) or positions of power, meaning that their inclusion in the League was brought about by their positions of leadership. Otherwise, it's a null point.

This thread only goes so far because the op instigates it further by tossing around posts left and right. Tue reason a "we need more Void champs" thread would die is because we literally just got a Void champion, and the roster of an invading alien force probably shouldn't be large to begin with. Therefore this argument is already invalid.

I get mad when people demand diversity because you're demanding designers and creative writers to just come up with stuff you want, and Noe what they see as a great character design. I don't support any petition to add more of any character, be it yordle, void, freljore, black, or otherwise because it runs contrary to the values of creative freedom Riot pushes forward.

It isn't wrong for people to think "wouldn't it be cool to have another black champion". It's wrong to criticize them for a lack of one specific representative group, imply racism like the op did in his original thread, them actively demand for more black champion representation.