Boards›[ARCHIVED] Miscellaneous

On Junglers

FarRockBF··12 votes·1,752 views

JUNGLER:

  1. I strongly agree that if someone loses lane and blame the jungler said person is a moron. Ward and play safe, stop blaming others.

  2. The jungle is hard jungle should definitely farm first, gank second.

  3. Jungle priority should be: Map objectives > Jungle camps > Ganks

I agree with all of this. Jungle is my secondary role; I feel the pain of the new jungle. However, some junglers (in lower ELO) completely ignore lanes, either because they just have bad map awareness or are scared of the opposing laner/jungler. So they constantly gank mid and bot but don't touch top lane.

Top laner should not lose lane because of this, but the jungler SHOULD at one point visit top lane (or bot lane, whatever). I hate when people on boards put a halo on support and junglers just cause they are not popular roles and assume they are always right. There are crappy supports and junglers out there. Stop defending ALL junglers.

TL;DR: Win your lane, don't blame jungler; but jungler should help at one point - it is one of his objectives.

21 Comments

coppinslinger8 votes

Top-lane is an island. I'll go top MAYBE for my first gank if the enemy is on top of our tower. Free kill is free if the enemy hands it to you.

After that, its more important to get your mid and bot-lane ahead. Junglers generally have only 1-2 opportunities to get a good gank off on either bot or mid during the lane-phase, so its important not to waste them. Getting your carries ahead makes it really easy to get dragons, then towers, and then everything else after.

The only time I'll go top after is if the enemy is literally asking me to kill them, Dragon is down and my other laners are pushed-up OR have recalled. Even then its good to try and predict enemy ganks and try to counter-gank bot/mid instead of top.

Top-lane is played for the solo experience. If you are getting camped, then just ward your lane and stay safe. It's really easy to survive top on most champs. If you are playing Riven or Fiora or some other carry top, then that's on you. You signed up for the feast or famine experience. If you are playing a carry top, I expect you to know what you are doing and carry. If you can't outplay your laner or escape ganks on those champs, DON'T PLAY THEM. And don't spam ping me to gank your lane when you are 3 levels and 3 kills behind your enemy top-laner for gods-sakes. That's a double-kill waiting to happen for the enemy top.

Orangesilk6 votes

No, not the toplane, if your toplaner is blaming the jungle he's a bad toplaner.

Toplane is a lane that's far away from the main objectives and has little importance on the early game. The toplaners job is to crush his lane and create so much pressure there he FORCES the enemy jungler to go top, instead of ganking the actually important lanes. If you see the enemy jungler is ganking top, don't try to save him, good toplaners ward and can save their own asses. Instead make use of the fact the enemy jungler just went to the other side of the map, and start pressuring mid and bot, which are the relevant lanes.

This is why toplaners are often seen splitpushing, they want to draw team aggro towards the irrelevant side of the map and give the rest of the team better chances at acquiring objectives or pushing towers. This is why you should bring a champion with escapes to the toplane, to lure the enemy jungler up there yet deny him of any kills. This is why you WARD.

FarRockBF2 votes

{quoted}

No, not the toplane, if your toplaner is blaming the jungle he's a bad toplaner.

Of course, I agree with you! Certainly early game top lane is lowest priority but the jungler should show top at SOME point. Letting the enemy top laner know you will never come is a recipe for disaster (top laner is free to constantly push to turret, etc.)

Still, your premise is absolutely correct. You should never die in lane and if you do it is NOT your jungler's fault it is yours.

Orangesilk1 votes

Usually junglers start botlane buff and gank top lvl 3, this is in order to allow their laner to snowball and do the aforementioned aggro draw. A lvl 9 toplane gank is one of the most dangerous things a jungler can do, you open up your relevant lanes and your dragon. You may be either a) risking yourself a lot because most toplaners are fantastic duelists and can easily take on the jungler and retreat if ahead or b) wasting your time because there's another subset of toplaners stupidly tanky enough to just walk back to their turret while being attacked by the enemy laner and the jungler.

An important thing about the toplane is that most people who go up there can either hold up a turret 1v2 on their on, or build tanky enough to be impossible to dive,

pandaleon1 votes

Normally unless, I have a top laner I know WILL suffer in the match up regardless of their own ability, I generally don't gank top unless:

a) The enemy top laner is playing recklessly with his hp, wave and, no vision cover.

c) Dragon is down and vision is acceptably covered at lower jungle (wolf, scudds, our support with SS, and/or team actually buying pinks) so i can afford to camp top.

or

b) I need to get his turret for the team.

PlayingOnATrain2 votes

You are partially correct. Jungler has one real goal: create map pressure. They do need to farm all they can to build up strength and make that pressure greater, but yes jungler should definitely create lane pressure.

BronzeVOnly1 votes

{quoted}

You are partially correct. Jungler has one real goal: create map pressure. They do need to farm all they can to build up strength and make that pressure greater, but yes jungler should definitely create lane pressure.

Pressure *and *Presence.

Silents4291 votes

Because this post isn't thirsty for points.

FarRockBF1 votes

{quoted}

Because this post isn't thirsty for points.

This post is because my post that said the same thing in other words got +30 DOWNVOTES on the troll-jungle thread. I posted this hoping the boards world really isn't that dumb.

My post on that thread was:

  1. I was lane Annie vs Leblanc.
  2. I WON lane and have no complaints.
  3. Was MID lane.
  4. Jungler Garen (WTF?) did not even SHOW mid once the entire game.
  5. When I asked why he simply said "I'm Garen I have no CC and she's Leblanc she'll escape anyhow.

My point was simply not all junglers are saints. This guy was a troll for playing Garen jungle in ranked, and on top of that he was noob for not realizing that when my stun was up he could silence Leblanc for a free kill many times.

Silents4291 votes

And your very simple and basic post couldn't have been a reply to any of the several jungle threads related to this already made? You also missed 1 point, A jungler isn't required to gank a lane, its one of his objectives but he has others. But to quote what I said on another jungler post you could have just replied too.

I have come to the logical conclusion that everyone can agree with.

"Every Jungler is different, every jungler has slightly different rules on what is considered a gank or not, if you do not accept his terms, do not rely on him for help, it is not his fault if you lose lane EVEN IF the enemy jungler is helping them"

I find all to often people go back and forth about minion tax, whether blue should be given to the mid laner, and what a gank really is.

As a jungle main (Working on getting mained again for S5)

I minion tax because farming jungle is crap, and 1 minion you weren't going to hit is a fine way to pay me back since you won't say thank you anyway.

I don't give my second blue away to anyone, I don't care if you think your entitled, if you attempt to steal my buff, I will smite it, and then not help you. I will never give my buff away if your losing lane.

A gank to me, Is anything a jungler does in your lane that gives you an upper hand, Burning flashes, zoning the enemy, kills etc. I never minion tax on zoning.

I have learned over time, everyone on league is expecting something different from junglers, and all the laners have to do is ask them for help, or ask them for blue instead of acting like entitled brats thinking the jungler is their slave.

Junglers have to worry about not only their own jungle where they have no one watching their back.

They have to control buffs.

They have to keep vision around the map with scuttlecrabs.

They have to attempt to gank lanes which a lot of the time your ally makes a pain in the ass when they keep the lane pushed.

They have to work with a subpar version of their own champion because of how underleveled and farmed junglers usually are now.

They have to still farm too, or the jungle creeps XP is underscaled, or they don't make any gold.

The jungler role is not exclusive to just handing you buffs and aiding your lane.

(The jungler isn't a slave to laners we are all different and if a laner loses, it is their own damn fault)

FarRockBF1 votes

{quoted}

And your very simple and basic post couldn't have been a reply to any of the several jungle threads related to this already made? You also missed 1 point, A jungler isn't required to gank a lane, its one of his objectives but he has others.

Errr, did you even read my post? That is EXACTLY what I was saying.

Silents4291 votes

I did read your post. Twice now.

You were trying to label what a jungler should be doing, what his priorities **should ** be. How a jungler should gank top.

And its laughable how you thought junglers are shown as skilled people on boards, considering junglers and supports are the 2 most insulted roles in this game. (Yes I know you are implying junglers are viewed as skilled people)

Luxs Destiny1 votes

You do understand that, even if someone plays something OUT-OF-META, they aren't bad for playing it?

And that, as long as they're playing well and fulfilling their role (Jungle - be another player, another champion on the team, farm the jungle and earn gold) they're fine?

I'll play Quinn jungle, and I've been thinking of taking it into ranked. You think that's trolling, when Quinn is a normal ADC/Top lane, and most Attack Damage Carry/Marksman, as well as most Top Lane Tanks or Bruisers/Fighters can jungle? There's no harm in playing Garen jungle. The clear time, the silence, the executing ult. It's fine.

Your logic of the stun is fine - from your end. As soon as he's in there, you would have to stun or risk him wasting time. There was no way to guarantee a cc on LB or even a successful gank on her, because of her clone. There would always be a 50% chance that Garen would ult the clone, and even then - What about not getting the kill? Wasted time. Better spent farming.

Now, before you talk about lane pressure being created from the gank - That's not the point.

She would have escaped, and have that escape up in ~20 seconds. Which would, in turn, cause Garen to have to come back to apply pressure, if needed.

Don't expect everyone to follow your logic or read your mind - other people think differently.

Sirin Gioro1 votes

Just sharing my insight here: As a bot lane main, when I stomp my lane hard and mid is winning as well, the kills go like 13-2. We got 2 mid lane towers and 2 bot lane towers, and top lane is like... "Panth don't u dare take that CS" "OH FUK YOU" "hey look!" "what?" "ur nexus is falling" "oh fuk it, im top lane lololol" "oh wait i need to help my team to attack ur nexus too lata panth" "its ok i'll get ur turret"

Top lane is literally an island.

RogueWill1 votes

on 90% of the games if I only have time to gank 2 lanes I would take mid and bot, why? because they are more useful late game. Sometimes i even rather counter jungle than gank top. Is not that I have anything against top but even if you get it fed it won't have as much as impact as if you have your mid fed. I don't mind if top loses his lane (we can carry him) as long as the enemy top isn't as ridiculous fed as being able to solo 2 or 3 teammates on its own.

JØJł1 votes

I had a jungle game recently (I'm still learning how to jungle) I think I was doing pretty fine... I ganked mid first and got our mid laner first blood. Then my top lane died to riven.... I ganked bot and got them a kill which got them even more ahead. I tried to go top but the riven always had a ward up. So I went back into my jungle to get Gromp.... my top laner decides it's a great idea to go in on riven when I'm far away from him, and die to her for like the 5th time and say "wtf jung", not to mention I tried to ward for him, because he wasn't warding himself. I had to give up on helping top because she was /always/ warded and the enemy jungler started camping my mid laner. Suggestions on what I should have done?

Leadpaintchips1 votes

pray that riven didn't get fed even more, and try to negate a fed riven. . . which is tough. . .

JØJł1 votes

Lol she was too fed so we lost. I got melted so fast. we had like 4 drags while they only had 2.... still didnt help us against her lol.

Sugary Treats1 votes

If everyone just played -all- the roles once in awhile instead of just one or two they'd probably understand better but it's also on everyone to communicate and have good team strategy not just one player.

If you've got a 2v1 or 3v1 going on in one lane though and you're asking for help and no one helps then blaming someone else if you lose doesn't make you a bad player.

Top is top and if the enemy team pushes in a group on 1 person especially mid-late game you're not going to do much solo.

As for any lane being more or less important than another that's a changing dynamic on a game per game basis not necessarily a stagnant fact and the Jungler to do well should be able to respond to where they're needed and exploit weak spots for their own benefit as well.

Not helping top happens a lot and you can use the logic of increasing pressure elsewhere i.e. bottom lane to justify not helping top but if you lose pressure control top, any gains bottom are a stalemate or worse yet you don't get bottom and the enemy advances further top. I.E. what's the benefit of having greater pressure in one spot if you lose pressure elsewhere and is the jungler being effective by ignoring the enemy jungler?

You have to consider as well if the enemy jungle gets a kill(s) and starts to invade your jungle when you're trying to farm you can just end up giving them more free kills.

It seems like it's one of the most difficult roles because you have to balance a lot more and are usually behind in experience vs. lanes, Junglers just need to go where they're needed and not die going for a kill and feed the enemy team while keeping in touch with teammates and not try to be solo players doing whatever they feel like without telling anyone but that can go for any lane/position.

Yakas1 votes

And you are one of the people that separate bad from good junglers. Jungle is not a priority anymore. Tanking is. You will end up getting behind if you don't gank. So by not doing anything, your dragging your team down. Jungling is legitamitly the most important and most difficult role I have ever played.

I went into one game and because I knew how to ward and had a lot better experience than the other jungler, I dominated. He would gank, I would countergank. He would get buffs,then I would get free kills from ganks. I was so farmed up, I could 100 to 0 each person on there team, and I built 3 tank items that game.

So by blaming other lanes, you are at fault. They have a right to blame you because you are the difference between a win or loss especially early game.

ChrisB51 votes

Can we PLEASE add that lanes are capable of helping jungle if he is being counter jungled? If I happen to see my jungle being counter jungled, I ping and HELP. Lanes that do this win games. Lanes that don't... jungle gets fucked, falls behind... two choices:

  1. Help jungle, free kills, jungle stays ahead, good late game, happy win
  2. Don't help jungle, can't help back, falls behind, less useful, harder victory, no free counter jungle kill ):

More from [ARCHIVED] Miscellaneous

Open Letter to Parents of League of Legends Players
[ARCHIVED] Miscellaneous860 comments
2,611
votes
Rewards for positive play
[ARCHIVED] Miscellaneous19,712 comments
1,337
votes
I don't like Boards
[ARCHIVED] Miscellaneous324 comments
809
votes
STOP ALLOWING LEVEL 1 ACCOUNTS TO SEND FRIEND REQUESTS!!!
[ARCHIVED] Miscellaneous291 comments
679
votes
Wanting to do something special for an awesome friend. Riot, please help? <3
[ARCHIVED] Miscellaneous220 comments
614
votes
People that are telling others to kill themselves has to stop! Please help me get this noticed!
[ARCHIVED] Miscellaneous605 comments
600
votes

More by FarRockBF

Riot Please Revert This Change
[ARCHIVED] Miscellaneous39 comments
165
votes
Why The Balancing Team Suddenly Sucks:
Gameplay170 comments
151
votes
How To Deal With a Toxic Teammate
[ARCHIVED] Miscellaneous89 comments
105
votes
Upvote VS Downvote Threads
[ARCHIVED] Miscellaneous29 comments
104
votes
Vote me down - I agree with Phreak
Gameplay158 comments
98
votes
New Stat: AP Crit
[ARCHIVED] Miscellaneous75 comments
73
votes