This soft reset wasn't so soft apparently

Xonra·Jan 22, 2015·33 votes·8,810 views

So I ended the season with 100 lp with first win in my promo to silver 4. I just went 7/3 in my promos and got put in bronze 2.

I wasn't bronze the entire Season 4....how the hell did it put me in bronze 2? That doesn't even make any sense. How can I start in Silver, go actually pretty good (7-3 is far from bad especially since I had won 5 in a row to end) and I still get played in bronze. How? Like this makes me not even want to bother playing.

tl:dr So demoralizing to do good (7-3 in promos is good) and get punished for it.

94 Comments

AzlerJan 22, 201516 votes

It is NOT the number of games you win, it is the quality of the PLAYERS you beat. If you win or lose to a team of 4 Bronze and 1 Plat, those 4 Bronze are going to affect your MMR more than that 1 Plat did.

Also, losses are going to hurt more than the amount that winning gains you. Why? Because of the belief that it would be better to be put in a slightly worse rank that you could easily climb out of due to you being better than to accidentally put you in a rank actually way out of your experience and you just drop anyways.

Lastly, the guy who said it a while ago was right, your first couple games matter more than your last ones. Your early ones pinpoint your MMR to where you should be, your later ones serve to fine-tune it. Basically put, if your 3 losses were against Bronze players then the game dropped your MMR hard, especially since it was in your first 5.

Riot has said this numerous times lol Honestly, it's smart, I myself would much rather quickly climb out of Bronze than get my ass handed to me in Plat until I'm knocked out or whatever.

Personally I'm waiting a week or two till the diversity of everyone playing has been spread a bit better, after all the people in Plat and above have likely already finished their placements.

XonraJan 22, 20152 votes

{quoted}

It is NOT the number of games you win, it is the quality of the PLAYERS you beat. If you win or lose to a team of 4 Bronze and 1 Plat, those 4 Bronze are going to affect your MMR more than that 1 Plat did.

Also, losses are going to hurt more than the amount that winning gains you. Why? Because of the belief that it would be better to be put in a slightly worse rank that you could easily climb out of due to you being better than to accidentally put you in a rank actually way out of your experience and you just drop anyways.

Lastly, the guy who said it a while ago was right, your first couple games matter more than your last ones. Your early ones pinpoint your MMR to where you should be, your later ones serve to fine-tune it. Basically put, if your 3 losses were against Bronze players then the game dropped your MMR hard, especially since it was in your first 5.

Riot has said this numerous times lol Honestly, it's smart, I myself would much rather quickly climb out of Bronze than get my ass handed to me in Plat until I'm knocked out or whatever.

Personally I'm waiting a week or two till the diversity of everyone playing has been spread a bit better, after all the people in Plat and above have likely already finished their placements.

That wouldn't make any sense since you wouldn't be put against plats in this case as most of the people playing were ranked last season, so I'd be matched against similar mmr people. Why would I be against a plat? My mmr isn't that high and theirs isn't that low. That would literally be the stupidest thing ever since non one I played with or against was above or below silver (I check before every game when I get into the loading screen. Nothing above silver 2 and nothing below silver 5 on or against me). If that is the case then Riot's match making effed me over because it didn't put me against any that would give me a chance not to completely be screwed over.

If I start 2-0 (which I did, so it is a complete lie to say that matter as I started 2-0 and yet...here we are)and I'm not against better opponents regardless then what does it matter if I go 10-0?. I won my first 2, then lost 2 (thanks afks) then won 5 in a row. Also if there is a specific set thing that sets everything why won't Riot come out and say that instead of being all hidden about it to the point where people have to say "I'm pretty sure it is this that matter" then someone else says something different. Everyone just guesses.

And why the hell would I want to climb out of bronze. I already did that, hence why I'm in (Or was in) silver. It is a big "fuck you" that I have to do it all over again for WINNING. That is nothing but giving you a middle finger. you win, get out of bronze, you win, get put in bronze. Yeah I don't know how you find that a good system. That is a system that basically makes it impossible to properly climb unless you are a smurf challenger player or something, which I'm not.

Some of us are still getting better and when you get your ass kicked back down to a lower division than you've ever even been (I've never been lower than Bronze 1 yet I got put in Bronze 2...yeah that makes sense) in for winning games you don't want to bother trying because you climb and end up worse for it. Makes a lot of sense.

SKT T1 WinJan 22, 20152 votes

you don't start where you left off, thats the whole point off the reset. Challenger players get put to plat 1, thats a whole divisional gap plus some. Last season i was plat 5 in pre-season and i got placed gold 4 after going 5-5. Did i whine no, i got plat again pretty fast because of the mmr reset gained lp fast. I finished this season diamond 5 and went 6-4 and got placed plat 1,so most likely i beat the higher diamonds and challenger players i came up against (didn't bother asking what elo people where). If i got placed plat 4 i wouldn't have whined i'd just climb again, i went form plat 5 to diamond 5 in a week anywho

UnpoeticJan 22, 20153 votes

why should we even be punished for this? its a totally random pug. I dont get to choose who I vs, or see. and honestly why the hell should I be punished for having botch games. I mean I lost 3 times due to things out of my control. 1. afker 2. another afker because they got pouty 3. someone who didnt listen to team mates and lost the entire game when we had huge lead.

Tis a nice dayJan 22, 20153 votes

And so does your opponents.

It's an imperfect system pitting imperfect players against each other to imperfectly gauge everyone's strengths.

There's no such thing as a perfect system that will be able to take into account every issue that comes your way.

Ahri LoveJan 23, 20151 votes

If you say the early games matter more - I won my first 4 games, lost one, won another, then lost the rest.... I was s5 and got put in bronze 5 - ive never been below silver 5

Insane Big PeteJan 22, 20159 votes

won 8/10 of my provison bronze V yeah wp riot

Stark6000Jan 22, 20153 votes

[{quoted}](name=Insane Big Peter,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=941VE4m3,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2015-01-22T06:04:49.535+0000)

won 8/10 of my provison bronze V yeah wp riot

that is fucking absurd

AetherKingdomJan 22, 20152 votes

inb4 you were bronze 4 before

DuobyteJan 22, 201510 votes

what a lie. Just checked your match history and you won 4 out of 10 matches. Sadly people believe anything on the interwebz

AbodyHUN666Jan 22, 20152 votes

#rekt

Samus FrostJan 23, 20151 votes

{quoted}

what a lie. Just checked your match history and you won 4 out of 10 matches. Sadly people believe anything on the interwebz

I did go 8/10 in my matches and didn't get any higher that what I was before the reset. All the qualifications did was take away my LP so right now I have to try again to get back into the promo series that I was in just yesterday.

DuobyteJan 23, 20151 votes

I didnt say anything about you. Well this IS a reset. I saw voyboy going 7-3 or 8-2 and he was places in plat I from challanger. My comment was towards big peter

AerothalJan 22, 20158 votes

I was placed in Bronze 2 last season. Took me 25 games to get to silver. Those were actually fun games. If you don't belong in Bronze, you wont stay long. idk what the big deal is, honestly. just suck it up and play your best!

AbodyHUN666Jan 22, 20152 votes

Last year I only won 2 or 3 games in the placements due to those crazy ddos events, so many games were "loss forgiven" which apparently doesn't count as a win. I was put to B5, from mid silver, but after my promo I jumped 2 ranks instantly. It was quite easy to get back to my previous rank.

AzhiokJan 22, 20158 votes

I don't understand why some of yall are sooo fixated on your rank. Like if you are in silver the game becomes more fun? And gold is even more fun? Then Plat+ to diamond must be lol heaven? Where everyone has perfect Kda everygame?... No, lemme give you "A for effort" generational kids a reality check. The skill gaps for each tier is painfully noticeable. Trust me if your in bronze/silv-gold or w.E you are placed in is because you are where u belong.

Like the great rockie said. You ain't where you are because of this guy or that guy. Cowards blame others. Can you imagine in a pro interview of any sport where they said the only reason they lost was because of someone else? Learn to be humble or the cold reality of life will.

In bronze to gold 1+ ppl make mistakes back and forth, when you get higher elo you get absolutely dumpstered for the tiniest mechanical / positional error. I'd be willing to bet my bottom dollar all you "bronze" but secretly Plat can't even perfectly c the first 3 creepisode waves in the game. Please do yourself and everyone else a favor. Be real. The only goal every person in solo q should be to get better. Not a stupid border and random numbers that say you are.

ClarroJan 22, 20156 votes

I was s3 last season and I got demoted to b2, 5/5 in promos with a 5 game win streak. Like wtf.

XonraJan 22, 20153 votes

[{quoted}](name=eG SexyClone,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=941VE4m3,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2015-01-22T04:55:00.034+0000)

I was s3 last season and I got demoted to b2, 5/5 in promos with a 5 game win streak. Like wtf.

yeah, I literally have no motivation to even bother after this. I don't know what Riot was thinking.

Persona 7Jan 22, 20155 votes

{quoted}

yeah, I literally have no motivation to even bother after this. I don't know what Riot was thinking.

same. I'm done. TIme has been wasted.

XonraJan 22, 20156 votes

[{quoted}](name=Potiron Maitre,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=941VE4m3,comment-id=000200000000,timestamp=2015-01-22T05:03:18.328+0000)

same. I'm done. TIme has been wasted.

Yup. Been playing since Season 2 but...this is garbage. I'll just have to suck it up and deal with the money I've spent. I'd get it if I sucked and went like 3-7, but 7-3 lol and I get punished and lowered.

This ranked system can go to hell honestly. Whoever thought this was a positive idea is dumb, I'm sorry to say as I usually don't, but this is literally the most stupid thing to happen to the rank system. Even if you go 10-0 you apparently still go down. Someone is an idiot. Sorry Riot if you read this but it's true.

Persona 7Jan 22, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Yup. Been playing since Season 2 but...this is garbage. I'll just have to suck it up and deal with the money I've spent. I'd get it if I sucked and went like 3-7, but 7-3 lol and I get punished and lowered.

This ranked system can go to hell honestly. Whoever thought this was a positive idea is dumb, I'm sorry to say as I usually don't, but this is literally the most stupid thing to happen to the rank system. Even if you go 10-0 you apparently still go down. Someone is an idiot. Sorry Riot if you read this but it's true.

I agree with you. Last season I was bad, but I improved with Ezreal this time, I carried the whole team with my 6 wins. I mean what is the point of the reset if one will have to do everything all over again. This game is not fun. NOT FUN AT ALL! I've only spent 20 bucks on this game so far. I can stop now.

XonraJan 22, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=Potiron Maitre,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=941VE4m3,comment-id=00020000000000000000,timestamp=2015-01-22T05:10:46.468+0000)

I agree with you. Last season I was bad, but I improved with Ezreal this time, I carried the whole team with my 6 wins. I mean what is the point of the reset if one will have to do everything all over again. This game is not fun. NOT FUN AT ALL! I've only spent 20 bucks on this game so far. I can stop now.

Wish I was in that boat. I've spent well over 800 since 2011. Lot of money down the toilet. Just nothing like improving and getting the big middle finger for it.

joebob48Jan 22, 20151 votes

lol. both of u guys dont seem to understand. your first games u lost as you both said, then both of u said u had wins later on in the 10 placements. since u lost ur first few games it dropped ur mmr significantly so that the wins didn't matter much, that is why ur so low in rank

XonraJan 23, 20151 votes

{quoted}

lol. both of u guys dont seem to understand. your first games u lost as you both said, then both of u said u had wins later on in the 10 placements. since u lost ur first few games it dropped ur mmr significantly so that the wins didn't matter much, that is why ur so low in rank

I'm not sure if you just aren't reading or just like reading your own posts.

Didn't

Lose

First

Games

I've said this like 6 times.

I started 2-0, how is that hard to understand and where are you getting "your first games u lost as both said" when I literally never said that. You are completely making things up. I'm pretty sure my mmr wouldn't drop significantly from STARTING 2-0....seriously, why do I have to repeat this over and over and over? Starting to think people aren't even reading before responding. I Won my first two AND had wins later on. I won 2 - Lost 2 - Won 5 - Lost 1 7-3.

Do I need to repeat this a 7th time or is it sinking in now?

TyrantCelestiaJan 22, 20152 votes

haha i was silver 3 86 LP and 5 win 5 lose and now im bronze 2 0lp GG RIOT GG :D

XonraJan 22, 20155 votes

Just had a friend on my list in game that finished his last game since I posted....he only had 4 out of 10 wins. He went from Play to silver 5. He is seriously raging right now on steam.

I don't blame him.

I don't know what the hell Riot was thinking. I honestly don't even want to play anymore. I mean if I grind for what, 2 weeks I MIGHT be back to where I started. This is dumb as hell. I didn't expect to end up in gold or anything but I didn't expect to be lower than I started, that is the worst system idea they've had so far.

FadingSanityJan 22, 20155 votes

Went 5-5, and got de-ranked back to S4 from S1. All that work and effort I ever put into ranking up has literally just went down the drain.

Now I'm just staring at my client wondering If I should even bother trying to rank up anymore.....

What a fucking piss-off.

Ahri LoveJan 23, 20151 votes

thats not awful - I was s5 went 5-5 and got dropped to b5....

46106965_DELJan 22, 20155 votes

I just posted something similar, I went 8 of 10 in my promos and I was silver 5 last season. I ended up being put in bronze 4 which is complete crap. I am so done with wasting my time grinding out these b.s games.

Tina BallJan 22, 20155 votes

Man that's not even bad. Why are you crying? You have to climb like 3 divisions and your back to where you were

101100111000Jan 22, 20153 votes

Losing one of your first games automatically = silver in Riot logic. Don't even bother finishing if you lose one of them.

LearndingJan 22, 20153 votes

We have to understand Riot Games knows what they are doing. Copy Starcraft 2's system of ranking that was revolved around a 1v1 scenario and place it in a 5v5 environment.

Duchess of DeerJan 22, 20152 votes

except in starcraft 2 its only you and you can solo carry if you mircoro and macro well in league you can't stop your adc from impaling her/him self every 5 min

OnegarionJan 22, 20153 votes

Yea go talk to the plats that fell all the way to mid silver. Yours IS a soft reset compared to them.

XonraJan 22, 20152 votes

{quoted}

Yea go talk to the plats that fell all the way to mid silver. Yours IS a soft reset compared to them.

The coach/analyst for Team Liquid's challenger Team fell from Diamond to silver 3 (he was talking about it on twitter so I assume he wasn't lying as he seemed a touch salty about it).

Further proving this is the most effing stupid system and idea Riot has had.Let's just put everyone in Silver, don't worry guys, you'll get wrecked by diamond players for a week or so and completely have your mmr tanked while higher ranked players wreck you to go back to where they should be and frustrate you even further.

OnegarionJan 22, 20151 votes

It doesn't prove when you consider their algorithm. Its works like this. You take your MMR add the average MMR (its something around 1200). Then they divide that by 2 and thats your placement MMR.

So say you are a around my MMR for a Plat 5 1673. Lets say the average is 1200 to make it easy. so it equals out to roughly 1436 MMR. Thats a higher gold elo. So i go into my placements around that elo with other people that are just like me. Now the gains/loses are increased AND they bump you down a few notches as well, but give you higher LP gain in return once you seed. In theory you should make it back to where you were in no time.

XonraJan 22, 20152 votes

{quoted}

It doesn't prove when you consider their algorithm. Its works like this. You take your MMR add the average MMR (its something around 1200). Then they divide that by 2 and thats your placement MMR.

So say you are a around my MMR for a Plat 5 1673. Lets say the average is 1200 to make it easy. so it equals out to roughly 1436 MMR. Thats a higher gold elo. So i go into my placements around that elo with other people that are just like me. Now the gains/loses are increased AND they bump you down a few notches as well, but give you higher LP gain in return once you seed. In theory you should make it back to where you were in no time.

What magical place are you pulling these numbers from? I literally don't see one single place they state any of this. Every person seems to have a different theory on how you should start, or what mmr you start with etc. I've not seen Riot say any of this any where so I'm skeptical this isn't all assumption and hearsay.

OnegarionJan 22, 20152 votes

Well Riot won't say anything. They want to make sure people don't figure out MMR. My personal MMR is taken from OP.gg which seems to be one of the better estimates out there (lolkings is just so weird). The 1200 is roughly a silver elo according to OP.gg. and since most players are apart of which is roughly the average.

Overall it is a bit of guessing on my part and those numbers aren't perfect, but pay attention to peoples placements and it should show a pattern

Vegas DadJan 22, 20153 votes

I rally despise the soft resetws they are pointless they do nothing but lower EVERYONE rank that is it. So yeah you are b2 and last season you were s4 the master tier guy was dropped to plat....we all stay in the same place relative to each othr and nothing changes. Either they should do a full reset and let us rock ouit a truly fresh start new season, or just dont, this soft reset is truly worthless and accomplishes nothing but providing people false hope that a good start will get them anywhere. You can go 10 win in your promo and you will still be placed lower than you were because it isnt so much a soft reset as simply a scaling down of everyone ranks.

Big HansJan 22, 20153 votes

{quoted}

So I ended the season with 100 lp with first win in my promo to silver 4. I just went 7/3 in my promos and got put in bronze 2.

I wasn't bronze the entire Season 4....how the hell did it put me in bronze 2? That doesn't even make any sense. How can I start in Silver, go actually pretty good (7-3 is far from bad especially since I had won 5 in a row to end) and I still get played in bronze. How? Like this makes me not even want to bother playing.

tl:dr So demoralizing to do good (7-3 in promos is good) and get punished for it.

This is a case of you trying to replace Riots reality with your own. You are assuming a system works a specific way when it doesnt.

The idea of a rank reset is that you have to prove that you can climb the ladder again. The season is long enough that even if you can only play 10 games a month you will reach very close to your full potential.

AerothalJan 22, 20153 votes

so i just played my first two placements. I played like shit and lost both. I'm going to review those games later and write down my mistakes. losing the first two almost guarantees me a bronze ticket. I dont care though. I know i am better than bronze. its just a starting point.

CupkekJan 22, 20152 votes

Won 7/10 games, carried them really, and got placed in Bronze 4.

Was previously Silver 5 since placements in Season 4.

ImHerVoiceJan 22, 20152 votes

your mmr is shit. Thats why you got less. I dropped 5 placements and still got maximum possible seeding placement (plat 1)

EasyyyJan 22, 20152 votes

Get me some popcorn i love to watch people with low mmr rage.

ZyxcJan 22, 20152 votes

They keep you last placement from S4 so all the high ranked people no matter what they do they get placed in the same league. They could literally go 0/10 and not get knocked a tier. While my other account was placed in B5 climb to S2 and got placed in B2. So pretty much placements are shit now

RemunialJan 22, 20152 votes

This is not true at all.

CoCo BoEyJan 22, 20151 votes

From what I heard the first couple games count more then the last couple games? could be wrong but makes sense.

XonraJan 22, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=CoCo BoEy,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=941VE4m3,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2015-01-22T04:55:31.422+0000)

From what I heard the first couple games count more then the last couple games? could be wrong but makes sense.

I started 2-2 then won 5 in a row. I thought that was pretty good. Apparently not lol I get punished for winning 70%.