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Little Idea to finaly end the "everyone needs flash" meta

Raoul·Jul 23, 2017·5 votes·494 views

1: Reduce the CD of flash, maybe even increase the range a bit, but it can no longer pass any terrain.

2: Using GHOST now gives your character the ability to walk through terrain for a short time (like 1 second) ONCE PER ACTIVATION. (Would work like that? Using Ghost gives you the buff, that only activates once you touch terrain, after that you have 1 second to walk through everything (like a ghost). When the second ends and you are still inside impassibe terrain, you get pushed out to the nearest possible point, like flash does when you would flash inside a wall.)

So what would that change? It would shift some of the insane power flash has to Ghost, while still keeping flash a good spell. Actually we could see more aggressive flash plays that way, since its no longer the "get out of jail free" card it is now, but still a strong summoner spell with offensive and defensive capability.

Ghost would now be the emergency escape Summoner, but since its not instant, it actually has counterplay.

That way Flash isnt a 100% must have any more and people can actually choose other summoner spells.

(Honestly, whats the deal with people defending the status quo so much they will flat out claim that a spell with a nearly 100% pickrate is balanced?)

21 Comments

Eternal TormentJul 23, 20172 votes

you ever Play singed? TP and ghost, never a flash.

RaoulJul 23, 20171 votes

Should we really ignore the obvious problem with Flash because like 2 or 3 out of 137 champions can do without it?

Eternal TormentJul 23, 20172 votes

flash is a non-issue, it is really balanced and fair. 5 minute cooldown, 400-ish range (i think), no damage-dealing and it becomes disabled if you are struck with any immobilization like root, stun, surpression, kalista R.

RaoulJul 23, 20171 votes

Ok, then explain why it has a nearly 100% pickrate if it is a spell that is balanced compared to other summoner spells.

archerno1Jul 23, 20172 votes

{quoted}

Ok, then explain why it has a nearly 100% pickrate if it is a spell that is balanced compared to other summoner spells.

Why not? It allows mobility. It allows escapes. It allows certain plays. It allows repositioning. It gives counterplay early to assassins who want to snowball. It counters mobility too.

RaoulJul 23, 20171 votes

And all of that in one spell is considered "balanced" to other summoner spells in your eyes? Ok, let me ask in another way. Would you feel that the overall power of summoner spells would be less balanced if my suggestion would be implemented into the game? (If you even read my suggestion..)

archerno1Jul 23, 20172 votes

{quoted}

And all of that in one spell is considered "balanced" to other summoner spells in your eyes?

Yes, because it all comes with 5 mins CD

RaoulJul 23, 20171 votes

Ok, let me ask in another way. Would you feel that the overall power of summoner spells would be less balanced if my suggestion would be implemented into the game? (If you even read my suggestion..)

archerno1Jul 23, 20172 votes

{quoted}

Should we really ignore the obvious problem with Flash because like 2 or 3 out of 137 champions can do without it?

Its not a problem. Boots are bought every game by almost every champion, is that a problem?

SEKAIJul 23, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Its not a problem. Boots are bought every game by almost every champion, is that a problem?

But there are different kinds of tier 2 boots.

No one is arguing against the usage of mobility summoner's, just like no one is having issues with boots. What people are having issues with is how different mobility summoner's are balanced unequally, with Flash clearly being mandatory for something like 98 percent of champs, that is clearly superior over Ghost or Teleport (loosely).

Do we like it when Ninja Tabi is mandantory? No we don't. This is kinda the same I would say.

RaoulJul 23, 20171 votes

I dont like that boots are a must have in this game either, but at least we get different options there...

SanctimoniousJul 23, 20172 votes

Flash is a non-issue. the game at this point is balanced around it.

RaoulJul 23, 20171 votes

Sry, but a spell that is chosen 10 times in nearly every game is not a non issue. And the game SHOULD NOT HAVE TO BE balanced around it. Thats why i didnt just say "get rid of the terrain passing" but "Shift that power to another spell", so its still there.

SanctimoniousJul 23, 20171 votes

I think flash enables champions without dashes to make plays they otherwise couldn't do, and have a level of safety that otherwise wouldn't be possible. The thing about flash that makes it okay as a universal summoner is the amount of flexibility and context it has in several situations. A nerf to flash in this context would remove a lot of safety, and increase a lot of snowballing. To counteract your change, people would start playing safe for 20 minutes and play late game teamfight OHKO comps.

Ghost is actually problematic when strong as a movement summoner. It has the strongest aggressive playmaking when it comes to champions that lack the ability to stick to fights or require constant repositioning. Unlike flash which is used for instant catches, that lead to objectives or defensive maneuvers, this summoner spell is primarily an aggressive spell.

I'm not a big fan of this "Diversity." Ghost is already good in it's context, and flash in its. Champions who like ghost already take it, and champions who like flash keep it. I don't actually see anything worthwhile changing out of this besides snowballing.

TEA Nietzsche Jul 23, 20172 votes

{quoted}

Sry, but a spell that is chosen 10 times in nearly every game is not a non issue. And the game SHOULD NOT HAVE TO BE balanced around it. Thats why i didnt just say "get rid of the terrain passing" but "Shift that power to another spell", so its still there.

Why? It adds to the stability of the game - we have some many factors already (items, masteries, runes, champions releases/VGUs&GUs/nerfs&buffs, property changes of jgl/turrets/monsters/whatever and finally the 2nd summoner spell) - imagine the chaos if flash weren't mandatory anymore.

EVERYTHING would be affected. Many items (especially those who affect mobility in any way) would get so much stronger, runes&masteries would essentially have a whole new meaning and people have already commented about the effect it has on champions.

I think we can be sure that it would take 1 whole season to balance flash alone - completely without champion releases/VGUs or any other changes. You can't forget that it takes a while for pro players and others to find the best meta which means that every patch would create new problems. We'd have to sacrifice an entire season of potential changes and desperately needed updates only to make flash not be mandatory anymore. Huge sacrifices need to be worth it and the results of flash are uncertain.

You could have a philosophical discussion about whether LoL would be better off if flash had never existed/in a worse state (I do not think so btw) but practically it's impossible to nerf it significantly.

FrightningJul 23, 20172 votes

Without flash, immobile champions would become unplayably bad.

RaoulJul 23, 20172 votes

You didnt even read my post, did you?

FrightningJul 23, 20171 votes

Your Ghost is just a super-powered version of flash, more or less. It would just take over as the new default mobility summoner for most champions, and without being able to wall-hop, flash would become rarely if ever used. The reality of the game (and I saw this even back in season 1 when I was still learning and mobility was much rarer; legit Kassadin and LeBlanc were the only 'mobile' champions when I started), is that being able to hop walls is just too valuable to give up, what's more, it's scaling as an effect is better than linear the best thing to have with a dash is another dash, as it now gives you two ways, two cooldowns, which allow you to make dash-plays, (that's the 'linear' part) but also allows you to make combo-plays (flash+dash to reach that ADC 1000 units away who thinks he/she is safe back there). Now that we have many mobile champions (because people liked mobility and it adds to mechanical and tactical depth of the game greatly, and is a necessary counter to the ease of kiting with ranged champions), getting rid of flash would magnify their advantage because immobile champs would have 0 tools to match any wall-hopping mobility. By the way, back in season 1, Flash got nerfed a lot from what it used to be, and still kept getting picked more and more, as people learned why it was good. There was a LOT of discussion back then on what to do about flash being better than other summoner spells, and the realization was this: You can't nerf flash to be in line with the others without making it essentially useless, and buffing the others enough to really compete with flash would probably break the game in other ways (too much damage, healing, CC, whatever).

SkelenthJul 23, 20171 votes

I for once would actually like this change, unsure about the wall-walk though. I see the reasoning, but it's a shitload of power to have, even if it's just one second. Flash being by far the most dominant Summoner Spell definitely is an issue though.

RaoulJul 23, 20171 votes

At this point of the game, you cant just remove the "walk through terrain with a summoner spell" ability, since its sadly already too deep in the game.

Flash was the biggest mistake RIOT games made in this game. And yes, that includes relase Xin Zhao ^^.

LethalTempo JhinJul 23, 20171 votes

ehm.....

How about no?

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