Epiphany! All maps and modes should be ranked.

Plasma Servant·Dec 27, 2015·3 votes·822 views

The problem of having people saying "it's only ____" might go away naturally if every mode/map were a ranked mode. Remove the bigotry Riot! All modes should be ranked!

33 Comments

AyRe CoNteMpTDec 27, 20153 votes

accept this: its only ___

Plasma ServantDec 27, 20152 votes

Then also accept "It's only ranked" ... i.e., it is only a game.

AyRe CoNteMpTDec 27, 20151 votes

well ranked is the competitive mode which isnt a game anymore, its a competition. its like when you have a noob soccer match with your friends in the park, its just a game. but when you play in a league even if its the lowest shit league, its still competition and people (mostly) still play there to improve their skills and compete against other players.

Plasma ServantDec 28, 20152 votes

All games are competitive if you play them "against" anyone else. Bridge, poker, tennis, hop-scotch even. If you are playing against someone else, it is competitive. So I don't really think that argument holds up. What games are not competitive?

AyRe CoNteMpTDec 28, 20152 votes

even tho in normals, both parties play to win the game in a broader sense, not all players agree that winning the game is the mutual force that drives them to play the game. some people just want to "play" and have fun assassinating people or farming or splitpushing or doing whatever. they just want to play around. they somewhat stick to the rules but their goal is not winning the game.

like when you were a kid and played age of empires against a friend but didnt try to crush him but build a super big kingdom and send armies against eachother and shit. its still "competition" because you play "against" someone but you really just do your own shit.

competition is a mindset and since normals are not branded as competitive play but casual play for people whose main goal is not to climb and improve but to enjoy their free time.

ranked tho is branded as the competitive mode in which you play to RANK UP against others. you play for LP which one side gains and the other side loses. only one team can gain LP and thus, its a direct competition for points and everyone who plays ranked at least in some way agrees that he wants to win the game (ofc then there are trolls and such...)

also, there can be competitions where you dont directly compete against someone. for example, 100 meter sprint is not a direct competition but an indirect one. also, you can sprint 100 meters without having a competitive mindset. this sould make it clear that competition is always a mindset and normals simply are not competitive for people. accept it.

Plasma ServantDec 29, 20152 votes

Might I say that playing a game were there is a winner and loser is competitive regardless. It is the mindset that "it is only ___" that stinks for those that want that same level of competition but in every other map (not just rift). The idea that someone is just playing around is what play AI is for ... but even there nobody should play with the idea of not caring what others think. If you really want to just play around, that is exactly what custom games are for. You don't have anyone else in the game other than those that you invite and they are there because, hopefully, you have told them what it is about and what you intend to do.

So if you are "just goofing off" then do so in custom where you aren't hurting anyone else's enjoyment.

So other than custom (and AI) it should all be ranked so it is clear that if you screw around, you are hurting yourself, and that if you are being unsportsman-like, it will be taken seriously.

AyRe CoNteMpTDec 29, 20151 votes

so you had competitive mentality when playing hide and seek as a kid? you were like super tryharding instead of just enjoying it?

why dont you just play ranked? i mean sure there is no aram ranked and no dominion ranked but if you enjoy playing these modes, that are not balanced nor designed to be competitive, then why do you want to force competition into them?

if you want competition, play ranked. seriously, i must consider you are not smart enough to understand the concept.

Plasma ServantDec 29, 20152 votes

so you had competitive mentality when playing hide and seek as a kid? you were like super tryharding instead of just enjoying it?

Oh yeah. If I were playing, I played to win.

why dont you just play ranked?

Because the rift is boring? I really don't like the rift as a mode. I really like Howling Abyss (and even more with blind pick).

H.A. rocks. When you get a group of 10 people that treat it seriously, it is the most fun you can have with your clothes on.

If I only had the rift to play, I'd have quit league years ago.

AyRe CoNteMpTDec 30, 20151 votes

well i probably have the same mentality, thats why i always strive to compete against better people and improve myself. thats why i play league, thats why i play the rift and thats why i play ranked. i want to become better and eventually pro.

if ARAM is fun for you despite its randomness and imbalance (which prevents it from ever being more competitive than a diceroll) then just play and enjoy it but dont ask of it what it cannot be. do you know the game yahtzee? its where you have 5 dice and try to get specific combinations like full house and stuff. you play this game against other people so its "competitive" and you also need like 1% strategic understanding to play it so its not entirely luck, but man its IMPOSSIBLE to play that shit competitively. there are requirements for competition and being 99% luck based aint one of them.

so what im saying is

aram cant be truly competitive even if you tried. there are some aram tournaments you can participate in if you want the maximum competition but in the end, the best rift-players win these tournaments and not the only-aram nerds because man, the rift players are just better at the game. because they improve themsleves while you are jerking around.
there is some sort "rule" made by rito that normals are not competitive and there is mutual agreement that even if you should somewhat play to win, normals are not a competition. and they shouldnt be. they are the place for people to have matchmaking despite a non-competitive mindset.
the "real game" is on the rift and everything else is just a "funmap" of some sort. its not made to be balanced nor competitive and champions work differently on different maps with different rules, thus they can probably not be balanced for all of them at the same time (even tho they DID make it so that champions in 5on5 and 3on3 are different, but thats fucking stupid).

also, you got different items and such. also i really wonder why you say you "play to win" but you play a mode thats not made for that. like, you have half a competitive mindset but you dont want to compete. that makes no sense to me. its like saying you wished there was a flunkyball league because you love competitive ballgames but you just so happen to be a flunkyball player and you dont wanna play any other ballgame.

Plasma ServantDec 31, 20152 votes

the best rift-players win these tournaments and not the only-aram nerds because man

hmmmm ... so my winning in poro king at better than 60% rate and never playing rift ... how does that fit? I'd have to believe that H.A. only players are better at H.A. than rift only players. There are seldom times when the team I'm placed on loses and it isn't someone that either doesn't take it seriously, or they aren't playing for the team. (Easy to tell when someone is complaining that everyone else is should be supporting them as the adc, when there are 3 adc's on the team).

Both your points 2 & 3 essentially say the same thing ... that the ranked on the rift is the only competition. That is why I want all modes ranked. Then it all is competition and a lot more fun.

JorenciceDec 31, 20151 votes

I hope you own every single champion and never reroll. Or else I have no respect for you.

Plasma ServantDec 31, 20152 votes

well, I certainly am not going to buy champions with real money (i.e., don't look for me to spend money on rp to buy champions.) I own about 60-70 of them so far, and the only reason I rr is for the team (i.e., we have to have a balance of champions .. and I'll roll one I prefer to try for one that works better for the team).

Plasma ServantJan 1, 20162 votes

I hope you didn't go through and down vote all my posts all at once. If so, you launched an ad hominem attack. You don't like me, so you down vote everything I say not based on merit, but based on your personal preference. Everyone has a right to express their opinion ... even someone that has no logical argument and launches ad hominem attacks. But it is both childish, and has no basis in logic. Even if a real jerk says something that makes perfect sense, you don't attack what they say because you don't like them.

I don't attack people here for playing ranked ... even though with ranked only being on the rift and not including H.A. I think it boring and not worth my time. I still listen to what they say, and I don't try to shut them down. Only someone that is slime would do that.

Like I said, I hope it wasn't you.

AyRe CoNteMpTDec 31, 20151 votes

well i dont play HA. i have like 40 HA games since its release and i played two HA tournaments with my ranked team and we won one of them and the other one got into finals and ALL high-ranked teams were diamond+ ranked teams. there was no single "low elo" team that was only good in HA. its because when you are good at the game and you understand your champions powers and how to fight, even if you have no idea about playing the map, you will still be like diamond 5 in ranked just from being really good with the champion control and knowledge.

and as i said before: to make different maps competitive, you would have to balance them all too and that is impossible except if you make different adjustments for all the maps. they allready DID make some adjustments for other maps for example i think cho'gath is weaker in 3on3 or something. but theyy would need to overhault all the champions to make it balanced and thats just, well, nothing anyone would do. its like making a new game.

Plasma ServantJan 1, 20161 votes

Touraments on H.A.? I didn't know they even existed.

I'd expect high ELO teams to do better than low ELO teams. Especially if they regularly play together. The mechanics of teamwork would be down. Apples and oranges from the sound of it.

Good players always seem to beat lesser, and pre-made teams tend to beat pick-ups. teamwork always wins over individual players "trying to have fun".

AyRe CoNteMpTJan 1, 20161 votes

there were some "serious aram teams" who have like 1000 aram games together and we still crushed them despite having never played aram before as a team because we just played better, individually and as a team. they were just not very good at knowing their zone and damage range even tho they played this map alot more. they didnt respect champions powerspikes at all and it was just a wild slugfest.

what im saying is: we were better not because we played together more (actually we played together only for a short time) but because we were better individually as players and we GOT better because we played a mode (ranked) that actually teaches you how to play the game while they jerked around in a funmap.

PIMPSMOOTHDec 27, 20151 votes

Ranked Aram, ranked Poro King, ranked Ascension, ranked All for One, rank Urf - BRING IT ON BOIS!

Not happening lol.

Plasma ServantDec 27, 20151 votes

Not happening lol.

Why not? Too many summoners that just aren't good enough?

PIMPSMOOTHDec 27, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=Plasma Servant,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=yUfnqymu,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2015-12-27T15:51:20.480+0000)

Why not? Too many summoners that just aren't good enough?

No.

Forcing every player into a ranked, try hard/baby raging experience will suck the fun out of the remaining game modes.

Plasma ServantDec 27, 20152 votes

What I would hope is that those that rage would quit. If it were all the same, and they can't take ranked as "it's only a game" then they would soon weary of it, and leave the rest of us alone.

try hard/baby raging experience will suck the fun out of the remaining game modes.

I'd rather everyone try hard, not raging. Cause when people don't try hard outside of ranked, it sucks the fun out of those modes for those that only play those modes.

PIMPSMOOTHDec 27, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Plasma Servant,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=yUfnqymu,comment-id=0001000000000000,timestamp=2015-12-27T18:50:57.423+0000)

What I would hope is that those that rage would quit. If it were all the same, and they can't take ranked as "it's only a game" then they would soon weary of it, and leave the rest of us alone.

My guess is that wouldn't happen.

What would happen imo is that toxic players who don't give two craps about Dominion or ARAM would just queue it up and do their trolling there knowing it would piss off those people who really were trying hard to win in those modes. Basically, you're opening a door for them to piss off more people across the board.

[{quoted}](name=Plasma Servant,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=yUfnqymu,comment-id=0001000000000000,timestamp=2015-12-27T18:50:57.423+0000) Cause when people don't try hard outside of ranked, it sucks the fun out of those modes for those that only play those modes.

Explain how not trying hard in ARAM ruins it for people who only play ARAM bc I don't really understand this.

Plasma ServantDec 28, 20152 votes

I'll quote you to answer your question....

Explain how not trying hard in ARAM ruins it for people who only play ARAM bc I don't really understand this.

You give the reason:

What would happen imo is that toxic players who don't give two craps about Dominion or ARAM would just queue it up and do their trolling there knowing it would piss off those people who really were trying hard to win in those modes.

That last statement in the second quote "you're opening a door for them to piss off more people" ... that door is already open. For those that only play ARAM, the trolls come in and ruin games. They don't try hard and when challenged say "It's only ARAM". The door is wide open already.

PIMPSMOOTHDec 28, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Plasma Servant,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=yUfnqymu,comment-id=000100000000000000000000,timestamp=2015-12-28T00:10:00.347+0000)

I'll quote you to answer your question....

You give the reason:

That last statement in the second quote "you're opening a door for them to piss off more people" ... that door is already open. For those that only play ARAM, the trolls come in and ruin games. They don't try hard and when challenged say "It's only ARAM". The door is wide open already.

Quoting me didn't answer my question because ARAM/Dominion don't offer a ranked mode.

Trolls causing losses now in ARAM/Dominion aren't affecting individual ladder points, individual promotion series and individuals trying to attain season rewards - their damage is limited.

Make all modes ranked and the door is really open.

Plasma ServantDec 29, 20152 votes

You are thinking that they aren't ruining things for others because it doesn't affect rank ... I'm saying it ruins it for others that don't ever play ranked (there are plenty of them ... I have at least 30 - 40 people that are friends that will not play ranked ... some of whom will not play PVP at all because of the trolls that show up).

So what I'm saying is that if all modes were ranked, the complaints about people being less than sportsman would be taken seriously. Not trying would be as much of a reason to suspend someone in ARAM as it is anywhere else.

What I'm saying is for those that don't play ranked, the door is already wide open. The only way I think it would be shut is if the penalties for bad behavior were the same across the board. And it would level set the expectation that one does not go into any mode and just mess with people for no good reason (i.e., it's only ______).

JorenciceDec 31, 20151 votes

Yes how dare we not have fun in a video game....

Dear god man just accept that ARAM is a joke fun mode and move on.

You aram mains are weird its like 80% less strategy than the RIFT and yet you guys always are so proud about your ARAM winrate like its an actual accomplishment.

your dill kingJan 1, 20162 votes

I think you could accept that this guy disagrees with you ... so do I. All of league is a team game. It isn't about you. It isn't about you having fun all by yourself. It is about a team of people that play together with the objectives set by the game (destroy the enemy nexus or capture the flag in dominion). It isn't ever "a joke fun mode" for those that don't play it that way.

What I'd suggest is that if you really think of it that way, don't play it. Either that or assemble your own team of 5 and play it (I've done that on rift when I do play there ... but it is an agreed plan going in by everyone on the team). Of course you could play your own custom game as well ... but being courteous to others is basic to adult behavior ... I'd expect your attitude from someone that is 12.

If you don't like playing with others in mind, find a game that doesn't put you on a team. Regardless of ranked or not, nobody has a right to ruin someone else's fun because they don't want to play the stated goals (the stated goals are a social contract among the teammates).

Plasma ServantJan 1, 20161 votes

It isn't that anyone is telling you not to have fun, but what I was saying is don't ruin someone else's fun in a game because you won't play it properly.

And if it is 80% less strategy, then how is it that those that practice it have such higher win rates? It is different strategy ... and it certainly is more fun than the rift.

But turn this around ... suppose someone said "Just accept that ranked is a joke fun mode and move on." You'd probably be upset with them. Why can't you give others that value ARAM as much as you value ranked as much acceptance as what you want?

JorenciceJan 1, 20161 votes

Sigh... except aram actually is only a joke mode.

It used to be played on summoners rift and then riot made a map for it so people could have fun there.

But they said from day one they have no desire to balance a joke game mode meant to be played only every now and then.

Summoners rift IS leauge of legends. Riot has made it clear that they want nothing else messing with the player Base of the ACTUAL game.

Thus no ranked modes for any "joke modes"

I mean it's great you find it fun.

Plasma ServantJan 28, 20161 votes

Except that to those that have no interest in ranked or the rift, it is the only mode. It isn't a joke. Regardless of what riot intended.

ModKnightsKemplarDec 27, 20151 votes

They just won't recover funds on that...

This is a business issue as much as a game issue. There's a TON of support needed to provide a real, competitive environment in other modes. Riot's resources are limited. We see this over and over.

Plasma ServantDec 28, 20151 votes

How much of their support is geared toward changing things over and over again? New modes and "updates" that require new development (fiora, et al). If they kept things more static, they might not have as many problems, and can actually get things done properly. All the new items, new champions, etc. ... simplify can reduce those costs.

ModKnightsKemplarDec 28, 20151 votes

A fine model for other games, but League's model is to constantly evolve.

Asking for static LoL is the same as asking for it not to exist.

Go play DoTA if that's what you want, and I don't mean that in a dismissive, sarcastic way. A TON of people constantly ask why league isn't more like other games; if you want that, just go play the other games! It's already been done. This is new. And Riot likes it. It's not going to change.

Plasma ServantDec 29, 20151 votes

I'm not asking for purely static, but if having all maps ranked was a support cost issue, then the changes can be done one map at a time and still give them change, but put in more meat for all the maps over time.