"OMG YASUO IS OVERLOADED!!! NERF NERF AIAJFOAFJAWHF@#!A"

AninLegions777·Apr 12, 2017·3 votes·683 views

Meanwhile is sitting right across Gragas' bar sipping her Lady ale. She has a passive that grants bonus MS to her allies. A Q that knocks up. W that gives her bonus MS, Deals damage and slows. An E that can shield even turrets and gives bonus AD. An R that knocks back enemies and heals her teammates. This champs has been comfortably above 50% winrate for many seasons even when support mages became a thing. But nope, circlejerk about Yasuo that is constantly dumpstered by any competent team. Pfft.

18 Comments

BlackFluxApr 12, 20172 votes

Uh...bad example. I think it's been made abundantly clear people don't care about support champion stats. apart from (to an extent) Ivern

AninLegions777Apr 13, 20171 votes

Lool sure m8. That's why people don't care that lulu has a 70% banrate, riggggggggght?

BlackFluxApr 13, 20171 votes

forgot about her...well,AND lulu. but you don't see frequent long rant posts about supports apart form lulu, ivern and maybe some other champ http://champion.gg/champion/Lulu/Support and where are you looking? her ban rate is pretty high but obviously your only looking at a really high elo and it's been made extremely clear a lot of people don't even like support,but my point is just you should use a more common champion that people use a lot more in a popular role,you don't see people complaining (again. constantly. like Ahri 's win rate) about fiddlesticks midde when its the like the #1 highest win rate middle but it only has a like .38% play rate jannas win rate is pretty high,sure but its not like people are going to flock around going OMG OP OP SUPPORTS THE REAL CARRY RITO NERF THIS but more on how supports can't doing anything and are super boring to play in short:maybe use something more direct rather then a E bot support [slayer-jinx-wink] use...I don't know. Caitlyn . Graves . somebody with a high win rate but not stuck as bot lane support which I guess makes Ivern an example

The WhamboozlerApr 13, 20172 votes

Yasuo gets ahead... snowballs hard and can carry his team.

Janna gets ahead... and gets raged at by her adc for stealing kills.

Which one do you feel annoys people more? Fed Yasuo ( and the man is very snowbally) is a beast that will shit on your team. Fed Janna can't carry shit and at best can protect her carries really well and hope they're worth a damn.

chipndip1Apr 13, 20171 votes

But Janna wins more than Yasuo...so which SHOULD you be annoyed by more? That's kind of the point.

The WhamboozlerApr 14, 20171 votes

I am more annoyed by the one killing me and spamming his mastery. This is not even in question.

But hell... allow ME a question. Which would you rather see on your team? Someone picks Yasuo and you brace yourself... as a lot of Yasuo feed like mad, and the rest tend to snowball and carry. Regardless of which one you have, odds are he's gonna have a bigger ego than Draven and think the team revolves around him and only he can carry. He'll BM if he's winning, rage if he's losing and be an insufferable twat most of the game.

If someone picks Janna tho, I feel SAFER. Because this is one person on our team who understands that teamwork is a good thing and that all five of us do not need to be the damned carry. Janna is good at NOTHING but defending her team and being a team player that saves lives and counters engages. Odds are she won't be trying to KS the midlaner or neglecting to build sightstone because she wanted to rush more damage. Now, Janna can be as toxic as anyone else... but toxic jerkoffs tend not to pick supports.

AninLegions777Apr 14, 20171 votes

Yasuo gets destroyed because he's squishy AF. Which explains his uselessness in high elo. Janna on the other hand can peel for herself and for her team. She's WAYYYYY too spammy. Yasuo has mobility? Hahah. You haven't fcking seen the 500 MS janna that's impossible to catch. 3 items and she's 45% CDR. Shield on 6 second CD. Try to force engage? Good luck. Almost killing her team? Good luck. Peel, Peel, Peel. And unlike Yasuo, you can't just focus her because she'll ult and leave your team scattered. She's frustrating and her kit is overloaded. It isn't even up for discussion. Higher winrate:pickrate ratio for supports and not just this season.

The WhamboozlerApr 16, 20171 votes

I'm sorry... I'm sure you are attempting to make a point somehow and just really bad at it but...

You're comparing Janna and YASUO and you are choosing to focus on cooldowns and spamminess? And you are calling JANNA on being more obnoxious in this department. Yasuo has ONE spell with a semi-lengthly cooldown. ONE. His Q and E spam are legendary and his ult is nearly always up when he needs it. You must be drunk man. This is like complaining about Caitlyn having long range.... compared to XERATH. Yasuo's cooldowns are so non-existant that he's trash tier in URF because he is already playing as if he's in URF all the damned time. He has no mana and very low cooldowns.

Try another one.

ShadòwApr 13, 20171 votes

you're right, they should both be nerfed into the ground

The WhamboozlerApr 13, 20171 votes

You can't really nerf utility without rendering her useless tho.

Janna is strong because carries are carries and she is very good at keeping hers alive. She can't do crap on her own though. That is why Janna gets nothing NEAR the rage that Yas gets. When was the last time a Janna went 5/0 in lane against you and spammed her level 7 mastery?

ShadòwApr 13, 20171 votes

it's not her job to do that.

she just makes sure her carry does that without needing any skill apart from pressing a few buttons now and then.

The WhamboozlerApr 14, 20171 votes

I would play a thousand games against Janna before I would play one against one of these newer, more "balanced" champs that are always overloaded piles of stats and utility.

Janna does one thing. ONE thing. She peels. That's it. She peels and buffs her adc and holds their hand all game. (And wards, I guess, but EVERYONE can and should do that) She is one of the best peelers in the game. She does no damage, has nothing else to her and is basically just there to follow her carry around and keep him alive. Now, I'm sure that you're upset because you main Zed or Yasuo or something and are frustrated that her being there makes it hard to fly in and mash your face on the keys and delete the enemy's carry... but the fact that this is so freaking common is why Janna is so strong right now.

Let me try to explain. Lethality brought the reign of the bursty shitheads to the game. I mean, they were always there... but AD assassin types were EVERYWHERE under lethality. Lethality got nerfed, but the game is still all about the AD burst champs and that "Marksman in 2017 lol" meme didn't come from nowhere. Playing adc is like walking into a lion pit covered in raw meat. Bot is ganked and camped and tele-ganked and 4 man ganked and 5 man gangbanged all the freakin time. The adc's who are worth a crap these days are the evasive ones who can flee and hide from... pretty much everything on the enemy team. Everything on god's green earth kills them... even half the freaking supports out there! I mean... Brand, Zyra, Malz and so on are all supports now. Not only does this add a FIFTH damage threat gunning for the adc... but it usually means these murder supports are focusing on doing damage, not peeling or protecting their carry.

So is it really any shock that if someone picks an actual support who can counter assassins... and protects their carry to prevent them from feeding mercilessly and falling behind... that they tend to do well? The meta really favors Janna right now. It's not because she's OP. It's because the shit people are spamming is the shit she does well against. It's because defensive supports are good right now. Look at Lulu! A good part of her power is for the same reason. She's a beautiful counter to assassins and burst. Unlike Lulu however, janna does NOTHING ELSE. So calm the fuck down and let her do her thing. Or maybe mix up your picks a bit if you feel she's that big of a problem. Nothing is MAKING you play assassins and divers every game ya know.

ShadòwApr 14, 20171 votes

what pisses me off is that she does only that 1 job but way too good.

and exactly that is the problem. there is 0 depth in her kit. it's literally the only champion that you can blindly first time in Ranked and get away with it.

because she just has to focus on that 1 thing, being peeling, her skill floor/cap is by far the lowest of all champions.

you can get away with her by literally not interacting with the enemies at all but just standing next to/behind your carry and Shielding/Ulting.

They fixed that on Soraka by forcing her to interact with her enemies herself by having to hit Q.

but Janna is just too simple and does her job too good without requiring any skill at all.

and exactly that pisses me off on that champion.

The WhamboozlerApr 14, 20171 votes

Well you're welcome to your opinion man, but I feel like having champions like her is GOOD for the game. Not only is she a good support for new players, she is still viable in the highest of Elos. She CAN make good plays with her ult and knockups if you know what you're doing too. It's not like she's entirely brainless.

Now if you're just mad because you play a lot of the divers and assassins she counters.... well.... git gud. If I have to tolerate Yasuo and Zed existing while I'm trying to have fun playing keep-away as Lux , you have to deal with someone ruining your dive party once in a while. If you can't play around peel, then you're not much of an assassin. Or you're a lazy, selfish ass who just wants YOUR one trick to always work.

If you're not an assassin spammer and you just dislike her because she's got a high winrate.... um... why? Is she personally ruining your games by being useful? So few people even play "traditional" no damage peel supports (Lulu being the exception, since she's very meta and OP right now). Why so salty over Janna being good at the only thing she does if it's not boning you. You know what she CAN'T stop? Mages. Most of them, at least. Best Janna can do to stop a good Lux Viktor Xerath or Ziggs is shield and ult and hope the heal soaks up the damage they're tossing out from beyond her range. And ulting plants her in place to be blown up herself. It's not hard for mobile champs to dash around her Q either. There's ample counterplay to her one trick if you try and stop just facerolling in as a diver, getting pushed out and screaming "FUCKING OP!". Hell, something as simple as splitpushing is something she can't deal with. As a "support my team, useless on my own" champ, the less people she has with her the less useful she is. Take one of those AD diver schmucks and splitpush a lane. Odds are JANNA will not be the one to come and stop you. So you'll get your fight against a champ without her influence OR you'll get multiple people coming for you, which leaves your team alone 4v3 or even 4v2 to rip their team apart. Janna is no threat at all beyond just pushing you away or knocking you up briefly... she is NOT gonna save her team if the fight is that in your favor.

Point is... play around a champion's strengths using some intelligence and skill. Crying about them being strong on the forums in the hopes of getting a nerf shows neither. If you want Riot to toss you easy wins and easy kills without the enemy having strong tools to fight back there's already a mode for that. Bots.

ShadòwApr 14, 20171 votes

i don't really agree that having champs like that is good for the game.

every champion should have multiple strengths and weaknesses, and not his whole power budged shipped into one strength. that would result in linear and boring kits and matches decided by champ select.

she is viable in high elo and low elo because she is basically a walking peel machine. when you have a ADC who needs peel, Janna can do exactly that and only that. the problem here is that i don't know what differs a good Janna player from a bad one.

I think that simply changing her kit in a way that forces her to actually interact with her enemies and rewards her for succeeding would create a more healthy kit.

even Riot said that they think it's bad when games are decided by only the champions you pick, and i agree with that. the way you play on the Rift should be the thing deciding over the game, not the fact that you picked a counter.

while good and bad matchups should always be a thing, there still should always be ways to play around them and have at least a chance to do something.

The WhamboozlerApr 16, 20171 votes

If you can't figure out a way around Janna man... I don't know what to tell you. I would say her only doing ONE thing well makes her very EASY to play around. Just don't mindlessly play to her strength and expect it to work.

She has strong disengage. Ok... so skirmish and feign engages to make her blow her ult "denying" you. Or force her group apart by splitpushing and kill the ones who aren't with her. Or blow her up with long-ranged poke and siege. Or coordinate your attack smart to CC HER and blow up the carry next to her before she can react. Or don't base your strat around going 100-0 on a carry in the first place. Jump one, drop them low and get blown out, then get work done while they're too low to pick a fight on you.... grab objectives and baron, she can't really stop those or control those well. If you're ahead enough her pushing you back once or twice doesn't actually do much to stop you, and there ARE more ways to get ahead than "dive their carries".

What you are asking isn't for her to have more counterplay. You are asking for hard-dive champs to have LESS counterplay. No one wants to change up their champ, their strategy or their tactics. They just wanna spam Zed, Kha'zix and Yasuo and go ham. Put a block in the path of that and they'll cry that it's unfair. Why can't I jump around in their team with impunity, killing people and being super-strong. It's not fair that someone out there makes what MY champ is strong at less than ideal. These are the same people who will argue to the people who play skill-shot based midlaners that Yasuo's windwall is fair and balanced and can be played around and to stop being annoyed by how easy it is for him to trivialize their efforts to fight him in the way that they are used to fighting others.

There ARE ways to play around Janna man. If you think she's a unstoppable beast that cannot be played around her winrate would be absurd. No. She is just 110% specialized in thwarting the most popular "tactic" in the game. She is good at stopping people from going in hard. The reason she has a good winrate is that there are a decent chunk of people out there who will repeatedly throw themselves face first at a wall rather than looking for a way around it. They'll try the same thing over and over and over again despite it failing and falling RIGHT into what she is good at doing, and they will not spend even a moment thinking "perhaps I should try something else.". She has a good winrate because of all these people here in this thread who would rather complain about her and ask nerf her so she is not able to stop them from using _their _ one trick. She has a good winrate because people are uncreative and lazy. Because damn it, they hopped in the game to pick Yasuo and dive into 4 people and they REFUSE to alter that plan in any way or think of a different approach.

In short... Janna has a higher than normal winrate because she thwarts the playstyle of dumb people too stubborn to change how they play around her. At least... in lower elos.

chipndip1Apr 13, 20172 votes

Because her job is to save her guys rather than kill yours, Janna can't be op or poorly designed?

The WhamboozlerApr 14, 20171 votes

Don't put words in my mouth.

That said... I actually don't think she's poorly designed. She is a utility bot that peels and that's about it. She can't push. She can't do damage. She can't really waveclear. She gave up nearly EVERYTHING for her skill at being the best peeler in the game. If peeling is so important to the game that this makes her "OP" or gives her a high winrate, the solution isn't to nerf her, it's to ask why peeling is so powerful and either add more peel champs or tweak the game as a whole to make other playstyles more valid. Don't take a champion who has ONE STRENGTH and demand that Riot tone down the only thing she's good at. That is how you make a champion into a useless pile of garbage.