Boards›Gameplay

Karma mini-rework concept, take 3

jocomotion··1 votes·799 views

Check out these ones then come back for the pole, I don't think I have it in me to do a fourth. Take 1: https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/p3XmvjE4-karmas-balancing Take 2: https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/LGUBzT0O-karma-update-take-two

I've done two other ideas for A rework, #1 is a version that mostly relies on Karma taking advantage of key situations rather than consistently outputting damage. Try #2 Focused more on Karma as an enchanter and battle mage, but kept both separate, try # 3 is solely for battle mage fans.

Passive: Retribution [new]

  • Karma gains a stack of retribution for shielding/healing herself and allied champions
  • Karma's abilities and auto attacks consume stacks of retribution.
  • Auto attacks consume one stack.
  • Stacks deal an additional 20 (+5 per level) (+15% AP) magic damage to enemy champions hit.
  • Karma can hold up to 5 stacks of retribution.

Q: Inner flame [nerf]

  • Karma releases spiritual fire in a line in front of her dealing 80/125/170/215 /260 (+60% AP)> 80/115/150/185/220 (+50%AP) magic damage in a small area, and slowing all enemies hit by 25%.
  • Karma's Inner flame only consumes one stack of retribution, but deals the bonus damage to all targets hit.
  • Mana cost reduced to 55 mana at all ranks from 50/55/60/65/70

RQ: Soulflare [Change]

  • Karma lets charges the magical energy in the earth below her feet, causing a nova to erupt after a 1 second channel damaging all enemies in an 250 400/450/500/550 radius around the target area, dealing Inner flame's magic damage plus an additional 25/75/125/175 (+30%AP) magic damage, slowing all enemies by 50/65/80%, and leaving behind a detonation zone.
  • Pretty big range
  • After 1.5 seconds the detonation zone exploads, dealing 50/150/250/350 (+ 60% AP) magic damage

W: Focused Resolve [buff]

  • Karma connects to an ally or enemy champion, doesn't use up Retribution stacks
  • Enemy: Karma tethers to an enemy champion for up to 5 seconds dealing 15/22.5/30/37.5/45 (+10% AP) magic damage per half second, 150/225/300/375/450 (+100% AP) max, and roots the target for 1/1.25/1.5/1.75/2 seconds at the end of the durration
  • Karma can end the tether effect early after only two seconds. Doing so will root the tethered enemy, but only deal half of the remaining DOT.
  • Karma gains 5/10/15/20/25% spell vamp against the tethered enemy.
  • Ally: Karma heals her ally for 5/10/15/20/25 (+8% AP) health per half second for up to 5 seconds, and heals for an additional 1% per 1% missing HP, Maximum of 100/200/300/400/500 (100% AP) if they're at 1HP the entire heal durration.
  • Karma receives any bonuses the ally gains at 30/40/50/60/70% effectiveness (including said heal) once the tether breaks
  • Karma can re-activate the tether after 2 seconds, gaining all positive bonuses, but also reducing the remaining healing by half.
  • Cool down increased from 12 at all ranks to 16/15/14/13/12
  • Mana cost increased from 50/55/60/65/70 to 65/70/75/80/85

RW: Revitalize [change... nerf to tank, buff to AP and supp]

  • Karma creates a circle at a target location for 5/6/7/8 seconds, still doesn't use Retribution stacks
  • The circle deals focused resolve's damage to enemies inside plus an additional 15/22.5/30/37.5 (+2.5% AP) per half second
  • The circle heals Karma's allies for an additional 10/15/20/25 (+1.5% AP) Per half second
  • Karma heals for 30% of the health allies gain, Karma heals for 30% of all damage enemies within the circle take.

**E: Inspire **

  • Karma shields herself or an ally for 70/95/120/145/170 (+ 50% AP) for 4 seconds granting a 40/45/50/55/60% movement speed buff.
  • [New] If Karma's shield breaks/fades and she has a stack of Retribution, the shield will explode, dealing damage equal to Retribution

RE: Defiance [change, nerfs team fights, buffs plays]

  • Karma shields the target ally for Inspire's Shield plus an additional 30/90/150/210 (+ 60% AP)> 45/120/195/270 (+75%AP) shield for four seconds and granting inspires movement speed buff.
  • If the shield expires and Karma has Retribution then the shield explodes dealing Retribution's damage
  • If the Target is under crowd control effects, the shield cleanses them

R: Mantra [change]

  • [Changed] Passive: Whenever Karma uses Retribution while Mantra's on cool down, reduce Mantra's cool down by 1/1.5/2/2.5 seconds
  • Active: Karma empowers her next ability.
  • [New] Resets Karma's ability cooldown

Post questions below, I'm curios to see some reactions.

2 Comments

Warden Karma2 votes

Hey there, just wanted to bump in and share some of my thoughts (gonna point out what I think might not work or I dont like).

Passive: Retribution [new]

Karma gains a stack of retribution for shielding/healing herself and allied champions
Karma's abilities and auto attacks consume stacks of retribution.
Auto attacks consume one stack.
Stacks deal an additional 20 (+5 per level) (+15% AP) magic damage to enemy champions hit.
Karma can hold up to 5 stacks of retribution.

This Passive emphisizes too much on a passive/defensive playstyle (its whole chain is set in motion based on defensive/responsive mechanism) . On top of that you could spam shields on allies outside of battle to stack up.

Q: Inner flame [nerf]

Karma releases spiritual fire in a line in front of her dealing 80/125/170/215 /260 (+60% AP)> 80/115/150/185/220 (+50%AP) magic damage in a small area, and slowing all enemies hit by 25%.
Karma's Inner flame only consumes one stack of retribution, but deals the bonus damage to all targets hit.
Mana cost reduced to 55 mana at all ranks from 50/55/60/65/70

I can pretty sure say that this wont be like by almost all mage Karma players. One get more damage out of Q with a Passive stack, but you need to have your shield up/stacks to do so. Q already doesnt feel very special and taking away guaranteed power from it to give it the possibility to deal a little more damage wouldnt feel great I suppose.

RQ: Soulflare [Change]

Karma lets charges the magical energy in the earth below her feet, causing a nova to erupt after a 1 second channel damaging all enemies in an 250 400/450/500/550 radius around the target area, dealing Inner flame's magic damage plus an additional 25/75/125/175 (+30%AP) magic damage, slowing all enemies by 50/65/80%, and leaving behind a detonation zone.
Pretty big range
After 1.5 seconds the detonation zone exploads, dealing 50/150/250/350 (+ 60% AP) magic damage

The problem I can see here is that a skillshot suddenly turn into a selfcast aoe ability, which might not feel intuitive. It would also ruin her poking identity, which at the moment is an important part of her.

W: Focused Resolve [buff]

Karma connects to an ally or enemy champion, doesn't use up Retribution stacks
Enemy: Karma tethers to an enemy champion for up to 5 seconds dealing 15/22.5/30/37.5/45 (+10% AP) magic damage per half second, 150/225/300/375/450 (+100% AP) max, and roots the target for 1/1.25/1.5/1.75/2 seconds at the end of the durration
Karma can end the tether effect early after only two seconds. Doing so will root the tethered enemy, but only deal half of the remaining DOT.
Karma gains 5/10/15/20/25% spell vamp against the tethered enemy.
Ally: Karma heals her ally for 5/10/15/20/25 (+8% AP) health per half second for up to 5 seconds, and heals for an additional 1% per 1% missing HP, Maximum of 100/200/300/400/500 (100% AP) if they're at 1HP the entire heal durration.
Karma receives any bonuses the ally gains at 30/40/50/60/70% effectiveness (including said heal) once the tether breaks
Karma can re-activate the tether after 2 seconds, gaining all positive bonuses, but also reducing the remaining healing by half.
Cool down increased from 12 at all ranks to 16/15/14/13/12
Mana cost increased from 50/55/60/65/70 to 65/70/75/80/85

So you can tether for 5 seconds, but you are getting the root after 2 if you want? I dont know... its either that the 5-second damage will be oppressive or useless as the tether breaks easily, which would make the 2-second version superior in almost all situations. Some kind of sharing seems fitting. Also why it doesnt use Passive stacks? Whats the use of a passive, which says "her abilities, but leaves out 1/3 of them?

RW: Revitalize [change... nerf to tank, buff to AP and supp]

Karma creates a circle at a target location for 5/6/7/8 seconds, still doesn't use Retribution stacks
The circle deals focused resolve's damage to enemies inside plus an additional 15/22.5/30/37.5 (+2.5% AP) per half second
The circle heals Karma's allies for an additional 10/15/20/25 (+1.5% AP) Per half second
Karma heals for 30% of the health allies gain, Karma heals for 30% of all damage enemies within the circle take.

The last part would make her very strong when your team is clustered and since that needs to be balanced, the tether might be useless if you have no allies or only a few around you.

E: Inspire

Karma shields herself or an ally for 70/95/120/145/170 (+ 50% AP) for 4 seconds granting a 40/45/50/55/60% movement speed buff.
[New] If Karma's shield breaks/fades and she has a stack of Retribution, the shield will explode, dealing damage equal to Retribution

Shieldbreakdamage can be something on Karma, however this one will need to have a good indicator that enemies will know whether or not it could damage them.

RE: Defiance [change, nerfs team fights, buffs plays]

Karma shields the target ally for Inspire's Shield plus an additional 30/90/150/210 (+ 60% AP)> 45/120/195/270 (+75%AP) shield for four seconds and granting inspires movement speed buff.
If the shield expires and Karma has Retribution then the shield explodes dealing Retribution's damage
If the Target is under crowd control effects, the shield cleanses them

Cleanse is very strong and I opted once to put something like that on the tether (unsure if that should be something Karma should be able to). It would make her RE more single unit protection focused; it would kinda swap places with RW.

R: Mantra [change]

[Changed] Passive: Whenever Karma uses Retribution while Mantra's on cool down, reduce Mantra's cool down by 1/1.5/2/2.5 seconds
Active: Karma empowers her next ability.
[New] Resets Karma's ability cooldown

It shouldnt reset Karma's abilities because that is a major counterplay and something you need to learn: managing your abilities. Its more important on Karma than on most others, because the cooldown of her ultimates are not only shared, but her ultimate also shares the cooldown with her basic abilities.

jocomotion1 votes

Thanks for the feedback! Let me clear up some things first: I see what you mean with the passive interactions, originally I had Karma gain a stack of this passive whenever she stayed in combat every few seconds, but then I realized that would mean if enemies ever poked karma they’d give her a free stack, but honestly I’m not too fond of the alternative I settled on, so I’m willing to hear other options.

As for the RQ. it’s ranged like Q but it erupts from the ground, similar to Brands pillar of fire, but with more area and a longer delay. I can see why you thought it was self cast though, my wording is a bit awkward.

And finally with the Ult there’s something I didn’t mention, I bugged each of Karma’s ultra abilities in order to make her ultimate feel more like an ultimate, but by doing so I had to bring down the CDR she gets on her current passive (and I planned to up the Mantra cooldown overall as well). To compensate for this I wanted a reset mechanic for Karma to play around.

I agree with your position on Q, but this was to make landing less aggressive overall, and as you pointed out with passive it’ll deal more damage, and as I said I don’t like the way the passive is rn.

More from Gameplay

3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay764 comments
7,167
votes
3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay156 comments
3,510
votes
UPVOTE FOR URF
Gameplay606 comments
2,440
votes
Yes plz.
Gameplay456 comments
1,721
votes
3 Refunds per season, up vote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay114 comments
1,716
votes
When is ANYONE at riot going to address the awful new player experience?
Gameplay634 comments
1,383
votes

More by jocomotion

Karma’s new bio is so much better than before
Story, Art, & Sound14 comments
33
votes
League's towers
Gameplay12 comments
23
votes
Every champion update in 10 words or less
Story, Art, & Sound12 comments
16
votes
Every Meta in a Nutshell
Gameplay41 comments
13
votes
The Rakan changes are pretty nice
Gameplay18 comments
12
votes
Tahm Kench changes from the perspective of someone who loves him
Concepts & Creations11 comments
9
votes