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Can you incentivize grouping? Selfsih game.

Crescent Dusk··1 votes·770 views

This game has so many mechanisms that wrongly incentivize selfish play, that several games I lose despite stomping my midlane and taking first two turrets mid often happens that I'm getting either top or bot lanes that just want to split push without vision while the enemy team is grouped, or the top/bot lane is your typical Riven/Draven player who thinks that because they are 4/1/2 that they somehow can push their lane on their own or invade a warded enemy jg and 1v3 the enemy.

Sometimes bot lane shits the bed, and instead of coming over to my mid lane as I tell them to swap lane as jg can babysit them easier in mid, the ADC decides that he must avoid all teamfights and turret defenses because "I'm behind and I need the farm". There won't be farm for you if the enemy groups as 5 and takes mid inhibitor while you can barely scrape the first turret in your lane.

This game encourages such selfish gameplay by the heavy punishment of grouping, be it setting people behind in exp if they group or massively reducing gold income if they don't group up as a 5 man and take turrets (which by the way is losing gold as well next patch).

Top lane get stomped in lane by a single first blood or successful gank? He can't ever get back in lane unless he goes AFK farm some unattended lane and the enemy is not active in punishing over extension. The obvious answer of a Darius getting bullied by a Teemo or Quinn would be for him to move and help middle or bot or go team up with the jungle and do something, yet this game sets him even further behind in exp and gold for doing the only option available to him as he can't ever fight back against a laner he's died once or twice to.

I've played Heroes of the Storm and it's night and day the mindset installed on players. It's made very clear to you that you should group and that objectives are a big deal. Sure, there's also split pushing, but the context is completely different as are the opportunity costs and effectiveness.

This game just feels awful because half the games you're begging people to take advantage of the gains they've made on opponents and push it as a group, and they'd just rather chase pointless kills and have our single tank split pushing while the rest of the team gets dismantled 4v5 without a frontline trying to defend turrets or contest dragons/baron. ADC's solo pushing for farm without vision and especially with an assassin mid/jungler on the match.

This game should take better strides toward rewarding grouping and cooperative play, not this current state in which every player is an island obsessed with their gold farm to the point where a jungler sees you getting dove under turret or the enemy bot lane taking down mid turret and he'd rather finish a camp over helping contest the turret assault or pushing a wave out.

5 Comments

Eedat2 votes

Uhhhhhh isnt what you're describing incentivizing grouping? "We lost because we didnt group" is actively punishing not playing together lol

Crescent Dusk1 votes

{quoted}

Uhhhhhh isnt what you're describing incentivizing grouping? "We lost because we didnt group" is actively punishing not playing together lol

Except some people don't care about the victory but about how much kills they personally netted. In one example I described with the Riven she had the most kills on the game, about 12 kills by minute 10, and she didn't seem phased about the possibility of losing because she kept split pushing without vision or suiciding into the enemy jungle without buying control wards or lenses. And she kept up this behavior despite the fact we started consistently losing mid turrets and inhibitors to full opponent team pushes.

Firebeard1 votes

Forgive me for not reading through the entire work. I had seen the title and think that Riot is inadvertently encouraging grouping via the new stats tab. When I was reviewing how I stacked up with the average player, I was at the average level when it came to other ADC's in my division when it came to roam dominance (how much you contribute to kills, deaths, and assists in other lanes at 15 minutes). While playing my more recent games, I was focusing more so on increasing that aspect of play, which meant pushing out and usually rotating mid with the jungler and support. This isn't always the case, but when it is effective, it usually moves into grouping earlier for herald, earlier tower takes, and some rotations to top lane, all of which encourage more grouped efforts. I think actively incentivizing any certain style of play is toxic towards players who enjoy playing in a different style. Doing things like showing stats encourage players to get better, usually in ways that benefit more than their kda.

The Highest Noon1 votes

I had to write-and then delete-and then write again this response because even though you're not really right about this, you're not necessarily wrong. Recent updates have prioritized AFK jungling if the jungler is ahead, but at the same time gives laners the opportunity to promote their own gains without worry of the jungler being an asshole. Then, there's that change which allowed players that are behind to gain a bit more than usual when they're co-laning with someone else (or something like that; I forget).

Those aside, it's not really beneficial to solo play instead of group, because a good group will always beat an incomplete one.

I agree, there does need to be some "incentive" to support teamwork. It's not that there's a significant benefit to not grouping, though.

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