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Reminder why we don't have 10 bans yet, despite promises

Deep Terror Nami··121 votes·6,184 views

We're still planning to look into 10 bans once the new client's out (changes needed to champ select for extra bans would be made in that, not the old client). I think it's quite likely we move to a 10 ban system, though that's not guaranteed yet. Assuming we do go to 10 bans it's also possible Pro games and regular games might make the change at somewhat separated times (different workflows for draft matchmaking games versus tournament draft in custom games which is what Pro uses).

http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/99Oykczu-so-about-10-bans?comment=0005

Take special note of this part;

once the new client's out

That means the new client needs to leave Beta and release, completely replacing the old client to where we can no longer use it. If they change the ban system before that they'll have to take resources out of the LCU and put it into the old client that will just get thrown out very soon, just like if they released a skin for a champion that would be remade for a rework in a few months (or years, Yorick).

Keep calm, and just stay up to date on the latest League Client Update news.

Additional confirmation of 10 bans on GC's stream here

58 Comments

duckarp39 votes

Take special note of this part:

though that's not guaranteed yet

They promised only to look into it, not to immediately implement the feature. Also the client isn't finished yet, it's still just a beta release.

ModKnightsKemplar2 votes

Both sides important.

But to me, it remains MOST important that Meddler wants 10 bans. That means it will very likely happen eventually. It's just not something they can spend resources on. I appreciate your comment, because deep terror nami left the "not guaranteed" part out. But I side with them on optimism.

DrCyanide3 votes

One thing that we do think will help, at least for esports and other forms of organized play, is expanding the number of bans to 5 per team, and having these bans made in two rounds. We think ban changes will make it easier for players to clip off the ends of the bell curve. The S-tier champions will dominate less and hopefully more of the A and B champions will get more regular play. While we don’t have a time frame yet, more bans is something we are actively working on.

http://nexus.leagueoflegends.com/2016/12/dev-on-champ-diversity/

10 bans is coming, that's all but guaranteed at this point.

Final Spark Lux7 votes

Hmm. Now that I think about it, it takes long enough for some people to get through 6 bans. I wonder how that's gonna effect queue / game start times

Edit: Your name really makes me wanna play Subnautica

Deep Terror Nami7 votes

They would have all bans happen at the same time, actually reducing the time spent in champ select.

Final Spark Lux3 votes

Oh good point. I didn't even think about the fact that everyone would get one. That would be so nice.

Glory ln Death7 votes

Wouldn't having all bans simultaneously take away from some of the strategy of banning? Being able to guess the enemy's plan based on their bans and change your bans accordingly?

I feel like setting it up similar to champ selection would be better - 1 person on the first team bans, then 2 on the other team ban simultaneously, then 2 on the first team, etc. The timing wouldn't even have to change that way.

Venomar4 votes

Eh, for most of solo Q much of this is lost. You ban what's strong, you ban what you don't want to face, and that's pretty much it.

Besides you can't ban around thier bans, what they ban has nothing to do with thier inevitable comp choice usually. If someone bans Jayce it doesn't mean they're absolutely 100% going to pick a zed or a Ryze, it could just mean "fuck jayce".

My worst win rate is against jayce, like 11%. So regardless of what I play I usually toss him a complimentary fuck you, even if I play Nautilus or poppy or something, I just don't want to see him, period.

Suspicious Xebra5 votes

it could just mean "fuck jayce"

Most of my bans are based in this thought process

Deep Terror Nami3 votes

I think they brought that up for pro matches, having a draft ban instead of simultaneous; outside of extremely high elo where you see a few people frequently, and pro matches where they know what the opponent typically uses, there is negligible or no strategy to ban phase except "Ban what I dislike or what's popular".

TeCoolMage1 votes

I'd say 1 > 3 > 1 > 1 > 3 > 1 is better (rather than 1 > 2 > 2 > 2 > 2 > 1 like I think you said). Of course this only applies in pro play and assumes they try to predict each other's comp based on bans. Alternatively, 1 > 3 > 2 > 1 > 2 > 1 if team 2 is punished too much

x(y) x is amount of ban that turn, y is amount of bans from the enemy team in total (the amount of bans you draw information from)

1(0) > 2(1) > 2(2) > 2(3) > 2(4) > 2(5) > 0(5) vs 1(0) > 3(1) > 1(3) > 1(2) > 3(4) > 1(5) > 0(5)

Justification is that the first ban is made with less information, so to compensate the team that bans second has 1 less ban to work with on their turn each time

Team 1 (T1) Team 2 (T2)

T2 makes no bans on 0 bans T1 bans 1 based on 0 bans T2 bans 3 based on 1 ban T1 bans 1 based on 3 bans T2 bans 1 based on 2 bans T1 bans 3 based on 4 bans T2 bans 1 based on 5 bans T1 makes no bans on 5 bans

T1 bans earlier to they have 1 'guess' ban where they have 0 info. T2 uses more bans earlier so they reveal more info, T1 bases 3 of their bans from 4 of T2s bans

Then, picks go in the same amounts with T2 and T1 swapping.

T2 picks first so they ALWAYS pressure ONE power pick ban from T1, but T1 gets 3 picks immediately after so they pressure with potentially 3 power picks or 3 counter picks to a single power pick. T2 then gets 1 mediocre champion or a counter pick, T1 gets 1 mediocre champion or counter pick, T2 gets 3 counter picks or mediocre/comp champions, T1 gets 1 overall comp counterpick or whatever is left after 10 bans and 9 picks.

PiVoRx5 votes

The real reason is that Leblanc LeeSin Yasuo Vayne Khazix Zac wont see a daylight again.

CarameI Frappe5 votes

{quoted}

The real reason is that Leblanc LeeSin Yasuo Vayne Khazix Zac wont see a daylight again.

And this is bad because ....? XD

PiVoRx2 votes

Its not bad for us, its bad for Riot. Same as S6 solo queue that didnt appeared cause it would kill dynamic.

Leblancs Boob7 votes

There's something inherently wrong with the champion if it gets 100% banned. Most champions like Zac/Kha/etc. rotate out of popularity and plummet in banrate when that happens. Champs like Yasuo/Lee get banned no matter what. If that many people think they deserve to be banned out of existence I say let it be.

JavelinJoe5 votes

Sadly, they have a get out of jail free card

though that's not guaranteed yet

So if they end up not adding the 4 bans, they technically cant be blamed.

That being said, I really hope they do deliver and change it to 10 bans.

NoSkillWrecking4 votes

Yep just calm down guys, we have a CHANCE of getting them halfway through the next year.

God Ranked looks painful if I'm going to have to see almost the exact same stupidly designed shit all the time like in Blind Pick.

Alex h87213 votes

Wow. Whats too bad is that the "new client" is a flashy turd full of bugs.

Biggest one I can think of? There is NO "REJOIN GAME" option if you get disconnected Have been both afk penalized and flat out unable to play the game because of this.

But "IT LOOKS SO COOL"

thanks riot for putting flashy garbage over functionality.

captainkaiger5 votes

Then just use legacy client until they get it ironed out. Nothing from stopping you from using it

Xonra1 votes

You say that, but I can't even initiate the old client anymore, and know plenty others having the same issue.

Once the new client was installed, I was able to still use the old file to use the old client, but nothing I do will make it work rather suddenly the past couple of weeks and the new client is all that will work for some reason.

It is part of why I haven't played much in almost a month, the new client is a cluster**** of bugs and issues (have to stare blankly at champ select to not miss banning for example).

captainkaiger1 votes

They leave you an option at the bottom of the new client "Launch Legacy Client". I just hit that every time. I've been playing too long with the old client to readily accept the new one after a three month hiatus

TeCoolMage1 votes

That doesn't make any sense, if you have a 3 month hiatus you have to relearn the old client unlike people who never left, they already know the client. It's better now than later, you're just getting used to a client that's already going out soon...

DrCyanide1 votes

I've seen the rejoin game button when my game closed, but I didn't try closing out of everything.

Wiggle Dat Butt3 votes

Lol, GD is so damn funny. They idolize this toxic clown DTN like he actually does something useful, when all he does is copy pasta information that is readily available. The guy had his arbiter status removed for being toxic, even though he was Riot's #1 "YES MAN" who always agreed with them no matter what they did.

I remember that Riot didn't ban a guy who actually threatened to murder me, my family, and my cat Mr. Snuffles, while using homophobic and racist language, and DTN said it was justified that he wasn't perma'd or punished at all simply because the system didn't ban him. I'm just glad Riot saw through his charade and kicked him off the arbiter squad! So toxic!

Deep Terror Nami9 votes

What really happened;

https://i.gyazo.com/2784af02eedf686073aad78ebd128aae.png https://i.gyazo.com/ca1cb66f9ebee07f7ba67563bfe32f56.png

http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/player-behavior-moderation/UtUzffEv-riot-we-should-have-0-tolerance-against-players-encouring-others-to-commit-suicide?comment=000200070000000000000000

LordSirChipmunk2 votes

10 seems like too much for me. The only champion that I hate with a passion is Yasuo, so I only need 3 bans, or 5 at maximum.

Supreme Senpai693 votes

But what if you're a part of the 40% that doesn't ban?

LordSirChipmunk1 votes

It's kind of about team communication; deciding on the 3 most important dudes to ban. Besides, as much as I hate Yasuo, champions like him would never be played if we had 10 bans. He'd be banned nearly every game. As much as I hate the champion, we must all consider the fact that certain champions would be impossible to main. there's about a 50% ban rate on Yasuo right now, without the increased ban number. Do you want your own main to be banned in possibly 70% of all games? Don't even get me started on Rengar's ridiculous ban rate.

Supreme Senpai691 votes

If Yauso is permabanned, doesn't that speak about players' frustration with him? Hopefully that would finally get him a rework. If you main something that is banned 100% of the time, maybe pick a new main that is less cancerous to go against? Like that would suck yea, but why is it our problem that the champion you main happens to be frustration incarnate.

Then the Yasuo mains will pressure Riot for some changes as well, and boom. Everyone is happy.

Eeyore2 votes

They also won't be implemented opt-out-of-roles until the new client comes out, because it's not a backwards compatible feature.

Deep Terror Nami3 votes

That's not why we don't have that yet. They tried it on the BR server and it made queue times unbearable, so they scrapped the idea entirely.

Eeyore1 votes

How bad are the queue times already on BR that not having auto-fill for one role per player makes it unbearable? :(

Doozku1 votes

The point of autofill was because no one played support. With the new system, everyone would just block support and now we are worse off then before.

Blainezy1 votes

Altthough, that's odd because they said they would never remove the old client so people could choose. So the old client would have to be able to use 10 bans.

Alex h87212 votes

{quoted}

Altthough, that's odd because they said they would never remove the old client so people could choose. So the old client would have to be able to withhold 10 bans.

God I hope you are right about this. Because the new client is straight garbage.

Ztoka1 votes

Quite likely doesn't promise or guarantee anything. Looks like it has potential/promise but nothing was promised.

PlanetWarwick1 votes

K

ThwartinMaPlans1 votes

why not just 8 whys it gta be 6 to 10.

Covert Ops Gnar1 votes

e

2Charmnot2Charm1 votes

The people who are complaining about 10 bans bot being a thing the next patch after they said they were thinking about it is the same people who only read the parts they want to see.

JaySun3261 votes

Testttttttt

bushi6661 votes

Stop whining, champ select is long enough already.

Deep Terror Nami4 votes

If you're telling me to stop whining, I'm not. That doesn't make any sense. Champ select will be shorter with 10 bans because they will be done simultaneously.

Dextix LT1 votes

Wait, you actually trusted Riots promises?

http://media.lolusercontent.com/api/embedly/1/image/resize?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia2.giga.de%2F2014%2F11%2FSerious.gif&key=a45e967db0914c7fb472fd4381e6c85b&width=425

TeCoolMage1 votes

replays

Dextix LT1 votes

After how long?

TeCoolMage1 votes

still went out. They never said "We'll make it in 1 hr lelelel"

TeCoolMage1 votes

azir future rework 10 bans confirmed azir skin coming up reminder that updating something that's going to be reworked/replaced is inefficient

rito pls. Stop messing with our brains

forbiddenking71 votes

Why don't they have it be, each team bans two each team picks two champs and the each team bans 3 and picks three. You would see a better champ rotation and see how well the can adapt a strategy in competitive play.

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