Could we give Varus the Ashe treatment ?

Angelofchaos16x·May 21, 2015·66 votes·5,057 views

I feel like Varus could really use a Ashe treatment, where they would put his W to be his passive, and change his current passive a bit and put it in the W spot. He was never a hyper carry late game, so his passive was always kinda hard to proc, and now with the Tank meta ( Do not get me wrong, I like this way more then the Assassin meta, but I feel like some champs could get a pat on the back, and Varus is one) the later it goes, the sadder it gets ,since BORK is not a core item on him and is very much needed to melt the tanks that now are even better at the late game. Any ideas anyone wants to share ?

72 Comments

SageaceMay 21, 201530 votes

I personally never liked a Champion having a passive on an ability that could not be an activated ability (like Varus's W or Teemo's E). So I bump this.

Fried NoobMay 21, 20156 votes

So you would want Vayne's silver bolts to be her passive? Honestly, Ashe's old passive was kinda crap. Sure, it allowed level 1 cheese nonsense, but for the most part, it sucked. It neeed to go so why not just put her frost shot as a passive. Varus' passive is actually useful. Sure, it's a bit harder to activate late game, but in the early game it's useful. There is no need to move his W to his passive just so his W can become like Ashe's new skill.

Autrah FangMay 22, 20154 votes

[{quoted}](name=Fried Noob,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xPAEb6ac,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2015-05-21T21:03:33.271+0000)

So you would want Vayne's silver bolts to be her passive? Honestly, Ashe's old passive was kinda crap. Sure, it allowed level 1 cheese nonsense, but for the most part, it sucked. It neeed to go so why not just put her frost shot as a passive. Varus' passive is actually useful. Sure, it's a bit harder to activate late game, but in the early game it's useful. There is no need to move his W to his passive just so his W can become like Ashe's new skill.

so you're against Varus' W becoming his passive and switching his passive to his W, to where he'd be able to actually activate an ability to get the attack speed, rather than waiting for it to proc on kills?

Rew711May 22, 20152 votes

He would still need something more. His passive will do the same thing as his W did, but only getting so much AS is not enough, since Ashe gets bonus slow, Graves gets a slide movement, and Twitch can go invisible. I was thinking that it should deal true damage to make it more fun.

I also hate his ultimate. It deals no damage and only snares a enemy. Since it doesn't stun, nor does it have adequate ultimate length, it should deal 350/500/650 damage to the one hit. It will keep the passive to snare nearby enemies.

Why does Varus' ultimate have to be a poke. Ashe gets a long range stun, Graves gets a perma-blast, Ezreal gets a long range beam of damage, even Twitch gains more damage, more range, and bonus damage to those behind the target. I'm sick and tired of not wanting to use Varus' ultimate, unless a nearby enemy wants to run away.

It's hard enough for Varus, with his 330 MS. I don't even play Varus often, but I know that is not right.

He has:

No movement speed whatsoever, yet his Q slows him down.
His W can be useful, but is a waist of a ability, since it only buffs his Q by 100 damage.
His E is nice for team fights, but on his own, this can't even be used for a get away.
His passive gives him only 15% bonus AS for killing an opponent. Really?
His R is only good for team fights and is for some reason, close range.
His kit is weird, giving little for AD items, and nothing for AA.

I like that Riot will go and stop OP Kassadin Veigar and Irelia , while helping Sion Karma and Ashe . But, this is an easy fix for now. To just put his W and passive into two different positions.

Also, to finish my long rant; can't wait for Taric change, Warwick change, Ao Shin (or whoever he'll be), Poppy change, and Urgot change.

LankPantsMay 22, 20153 votes

He would still need something more. His passive will do the same thing as his W did, but only getting so much AS is not enough, since Ashe gets bonus slow, Graves gets a slide movement, and Twitch can go invisible. I was thinking that it should deal true damage to make it more fun.

Not really, his W is already quite a powerful skill. Gaining his W as a passive would give him a super-powerful early game since he can invest heavily into his Q. I imagine his W would gain other effects, but I don't necessarily think true damage would be the correct direction to move him in, I'd look at giving him bonus MS when he attacks a target with his W active as an example of a possible change.

I also hate his ultimate. It deals no damage and only snares a enemy. Since it doesn't stun, nor does it have adequate ultimate length, it should deal 350/500/650 damage to the one hit. It will keep the passive to snare nearby enemies.

Varus's ult does less damage than the only other comparable ult (Ashe's) because Varus has 4 damaging abilities. He gets more reliable ways of laying down similar damage that are less cooldown gated. It also snares rather than stunning because of the AOE potential it has, it's main use is to force the enemy team to split up, kind of like a soft Janna ult.

Why does Varus' ultimate have to be a poke. Ashe gets a long range stun, Graves gets a perma-blast, Ezreal gets a long range beam of damage, even Twitch gains more damage, more range, and bonus damage to those behind the target. I'm sick and tired of not wanting to use Varus' ultimate, unless a nearby enemy wants to run away.

Varus's ult isn't poke in any way shape or form. It's one of the two most powerful engage ultimates out of the pool of ADC ultimates. Ironically you listed a poke ultimate, Ez's ult is mostly used for poking the enemy team down.

It's hard enough for Varus, with his 330 MS. I don't even play Varus often, but I know that is not right.

330 MS makes him tied for the fourth quickest ADC. The only three ADCs with more MS than Varus are Sivir, Quinn and Urgot and they all only have 5 MS more than Varus.

No movement speed whatsoever, yet his Q slows him down.

His Q slows him down because it's one of the longest range abilities any ADC has. Caitlyn's Q completely stops her movement for the animation and is a similar sort of ability.

His W can be useful, but is a waist of a ability, since it only buffs his Q by 100 damage.

In order for 1 stack W do less 100 base damage at rank 5 you have to be attacking a target with under 2000 HP, in order for 3 stack W to do less than 100 damage it's 666 HP.

His E is nice for team fights, but on his own, this can't even be used for a get away.

His E is an interesting ability. It's an area where he may need some small buffs but over all I feel like it's main use on his kit at the moment isn't to get away, but rather to quickly proc his W without having to charge Q.

His passive gives him only 15% bonus AS for killing an opponent. Really?

20% on a creep and 40% on a champ, no idea where you're getting 15% from. 40% AS really isn't that bad as a passive, if he could have access to it more it would be really good, it is over 1000 gold worth of attack speed after all.

His R is only good for team fights and is for some reason, close range.

His ult is meant to be good for teamfights and ganks. It might need a little increase to it's range but it's really not a low range spell. It has around the same range as Ez Q, which is considered as quite a long ranged spell.

His kit is weird, giving little for AD items, and nothing for AA.

His Kit greatly rewards attacking, by attacking he stacks his W onto a target effectively granting him a bonus 26+5% magic damage on every auto assuming you're able to proc the stacks. He also has a 100% ratio on his fully charged arrow, which has a long range and short CD meaning building AD on him really helps out his poke.

Rew711May 22, 20151 votes

Your first statement is off. I should had explained better but the thing I was talking about was not the W getting a bonus. I was talking as if the W was now the passive and his passive was the W, just with an active.

Now that his W is an AS buff, I was asking for something to go with it while it's active, like all the others I'd mentioned.

Since his Passive sends out rends, I thought it was enough as it was.

Ez's ult is mostly used for poking the enemy team down.

True, it does deal less damage for every enemy it passes through, but that first bit of damage is no poke.

There are also, technically 4 more champions with better MS than Varun. Draven (with E), Miss Fortune (passive), and Twitch (+Q), and Jinx (passive works on assists, towers, and inhibitors). But, you are right though, he just feels slower than most.

His blight really needs to be his passive, I just hope we agree on that.

I also wish for a 0.1 faster attack animation... but, that may be much to ask for.

His AS passive, also, doesn't give what it needs for tower kills, inhibitor kills, and why is the duration so short? I'd rather it be an ability I could use. Like TF's.

That last part, I don't know why, makes me want to take him mid.

LankPantsMay 23, 20151 votes

Your first statement is off. I should had explained better but the thing I was talking about was not the W getting a bonus. I was talking as if the W was now the passive and his passive was the W, just with an active.

Now that his W is an AS buff, I was asking for something to go with it while it's active, like all the others I'd mentioned.

Since his Passive sends out rends, I thought it was enough as it was.

I'd agree with that, it just wasn't entirely clear in your earlier post. That's why I suggested the bonus MS on hit while his W was active.

True, it does deal less damage for every enemy it passes through, but that first bit of damage is no poke.

Poke has nothing to do with the level of damage that an ability does, or even its range but rather the level of commitment to a possible fight. Ez's ult can definitely be used as poke since you can fire it off from a long range just for its damage. By comparison Varus's ult is really bad poke as hit has a great importance to the rest of his kit and low damage, meaning it's really bad if no-one commits to it.

There are also, technically 4 more champions with better MS than Varun. Draven (with E), Miss Fortune (passive), and Twitch (+Q), and Jinx (passive works on assists, towers, and inhibitors). But, you are right though, he just feels slower than most.

But they all give up abilities for their movespeed. Varus's base movespeed is as good as or better than every champ you listed.

His blight really needs to be his passive, I just hope we agree on that.

His current passive would be 100% fine if he had an easy way to proc it and some small buffs to the passive itself. If the passive was buffed up to 25% on creep kill and 50% on champ kill and procing blight activated the creep kill component I think that his current passive would be fine.

His AS passive, also, doesn't give what it needs for tower kills, inhibitor kills, and why is the duration so short? I'd rather it be an ability I could use. Like TF's.

TF's passive is actually much worse than Varus's until he kills upwards of 250 creeps, 40% attack speed is worth a lot of gold.

iamleburkMay 22, 20151 votes

Getting MS for attacking the enemy seems too similar to vayne passive/jinx passive. I think Varus should be a sustain based marksmen, because im pretty sure he was related to Aatrox lore-wise. Like keep him squishy af but give one of his abilities a self healing effect (maybe his R) and then his new W give some crazy lifesteal for 5 seconds.

LankPantsMay 23, 20151 votes

Getting MS for attacking the enemy seems too similar to vayne passive/jinx passive.

Neither Vayne nor Jinx get MS from actually attacking an enemy.

Like keep him squishy af but give one of his abilities a self healing effect (maybe his R) and then his new W give some crazy lifesteal for 5 seconds.

There's very good reasons why a ranged character shouldn't have strong built in sustain, Vladimir actually exemplifies them. It creates a character who you cannot poke out of lane ever, as you can't effectively zone them away from CS so they will end up healing up.

iamleburkMay 23, 20151 votes

Yes, i said similar. They both reward MS for being aggressive.

But the problem with vlad is that he is also pretty tanky so he cant be dove on/assasinated. Varus using a typical ADC build would be squishy enough to still get 100-0 by burst, unlike Vlad. Vlad has his own counterplay through health costs and weakish early game, but those wont work for an ADC. This would make varus really strong against poke comps but weak against dive comps. Also the mana cost on his sudden sustain would have to be significant.

kile147May 22, 20155 votes

Actually making Vayne's silver bolts a passive could be nice because then you couldn't just power level it right away

TheXtractorMay 22, 20154 votes

power leveling it right away would only hinder you in laning phase so its not the best idea either :P you won't face big hp tanks at level 9 so no need to rush silver bolts really.

kile147May 22, 20151 votes

It has a decent base damage too (ranges from 20-60 true damage with the percentage on top of that) and since you don't build a lot of AD on Vayne early to take advantage of the bonus damage from tumble, leveling silver bolts is probably the best way to go.

TheXtractorMay 22, 20154 votes

The base damage is pretty decent indeed but with the tumble leveling comes also the cooldown (6 seconds down to 2 at level 5) which is quite the impact, and early game you won't have as much attack speed so getting 3 attacks off is a pretty heavy investment.

Champion SkinMay 22, 20151 votes

It isn't that hard if you have mana AA + Q AA + E (to disengage and get the third silver bolt stack) Though of course that use quite a bit of mana and could leave you vulnerable with your E on cooldown

TheXtractorMay 22, 20152 votes

I do enjoy using that as harass combo but it is pretty mana intensive sadly. Mostly because 90 mana comdemn when vayne starts with like 230 mana so that that combo would cost basically half your mana at level 3 :P

MrBuffingtonMay 21, 20156 votes

I too like pressing buttons :3

DandymannMay 22, 20151 votes

{quoted}

I personally never liked a Champion having a passive on an ability that could not be an activated ability (like Varus's W or Teemo's E). So I bump this.

What makes it even worse for poor varus is that his W doesn't do anything on its own. Vayne's W and Teemo's E can be proc'd by only basic attacks if necessary, but Varus HAS to be able to use an ability to proc the staks on his W

MorsigilMay 21, 201515 votes

Varus carries by dishing out damage and controlling team fights simultaneously. He pokes, he roots the enemy team, and meanwhile he's dropping A-bombs on people.

The problem is his mana pool and regen. He can't sustain his harass, even with an item like essence reaver which seems like it was made just for him and this problem. While his Q ratios seem wow omg so good, even with 400 AD and last whisper you do negative damage on tanks and the guys in the back will take reduced damage or regen/heal/life steal it back the reduced damage relatively quickly.

What I would like to see is either A) Reduce the cost of his Q AND the time it takes to draw to full power and ungate the poke or B) Let him be a real hyper carry and reduce the bonus of his passive on minions, retain it on champs, and let it stack to a cap. The idea being that if you stack it on minions you can get it to 40% and then 1 champ kill takes you to 80%, or 80% from two champ kills.

LordGeovanniMay 22, 20151 votes

when people say mana costs cause they cant constantly poke its because certain champions arnt supposed to be poke centered you are supposed to try for sustained fights on them. like with jax people only know jax is a duelist that does better in longer fights because of his passive and his ults passive damage other wise people would be saying he has a mana problem too. if he could ever use his skills

CoolKnightSTMay 21, 20157 votes

If someone needs the Ashe treatment it's Teemo :

Passive: Toxic Shot
Now W active now large speedboost that declays over time.
E now mushrooms
R new ability Camouflage (maybe bit like rengar or something)

UnedibleMay 22, 20159 votes

{quoted}

If someone needs the treatment it's :

Passive: Toxic Shot

Now W active now large speedboost that declays over time.

E now mushrooms

R new ability Camouflage (maybe bit like rengar or something)

At that point, I'd scream everytime I'd see him.

DeusVultMay 22, 20153 votes

Having shrooms on a regular ability is worse than hitler

And Hitler was pretty evil

JayetoMay 22, 20151 votes

if they did that then his shrooms would be seen like cait's and nid's traps proving to be waaaaaaaay less of a threat.

LordGeovanniMay 22, 20151 votes

teemo is already impossible to catch now with more ways to screw you over if you happen to

khorneyMay 21, 20154 votes

befotre varus and ashe were the weakest adc in the game and they buffed ashe and now varus is the weakest adc in the game his harass is okay, ashe w beat varus q anyday of the weak, but varus has nothing really going for him, no escape unless u have ult then u may or may no tescape, extremely slow,

AkesgerothMay 22, 20153 votes

Varus has a passive?

Ariel the CruelMay 22, 20153 votes

It took residence in his W. Nobody is sure why.

MattAkhavanMay 21, 20152 votes

I think if varus got some lifesteal added to his passive it would make him really good. The whole idea, i think, is to snowballed 1 kill into many by giving you an attack speed steroid. So the life steal will help you get back some of that health you lost. A dangerous game passive would be cool too.

khorneyMay 21, 20151 votes

agreed i have been posting this sort of thing on the post for awhile now. varus is by far the weakest adc on the game , his passive is useless if he misses his ult then your screwed, if you didnt have to activate his w, ap varus would rape everyone in the game hell he does if he gets fed 100-0 anyone in the game in 2 secs. to me his q should count as a basic attack so you could proc tri force, i dont get ga when i play him i get hourglass instead to really really smash.

Ariel the CruelMay 21, 20156 votes

While I like AP Varus (I've actually run him), I've felt he was flat worse than AP Kog. Other than trading long range and consistent damage for a root, what does Varus have that Kog doesn't simply do better?

khorneyMay 21, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=Ariel the Cruel,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xPAEb6ac,comment-id=00010001,timestamp=2015-05-21T21:13:01.034+0000)

While I like AP Varus (I've actually run him), I've felt he was flat worse than AP Kog. Other than trading long range and consistent damage for a root, what does Varus have that Kog doesn't simply do better?

instant nuking, ap varus gets fed kog cant do anything, a fed ap varus will 100-0 anychamp in the game, he is like vaynebut does way more damage. kog is meant for long range poking and harass ap varus is more of a assaassin all in

Ariel the CruelMay 21, 20152 votes

While I don't necessarily disagree, Varus' W is effectively +% max health on AA, which Kog also gets.

I'm just going to crunch some numbers (once I find the formula for attack speed timing) and re-post it here. I'm suspect Varus will have slightly higher damage (higher scaling), but I'm curious if the the margin is big enough to justify the loss of range and consistency.

JustMyBassCannonMay 21, 20151 votes

To be accurate, Kog'maw's W applies for 8 seconds, dealing 6% (+1% per 100 AP) max HP damage per hit. 3 attacks in a row is 18% (+3% per 100 AP) max HP bonus damage.

Varus' W applies marks that deal %HP damage when he casts spells, capping at 3 stacks. Each stack is worth 5% (+2% per 100 AP) max HP, or 15% (+6% per 100 AP) max HP damage, plus 78 (+75% AP) flat damage dealt by the attacks themselves.

In a straight comparison of base damage values, Kog'maw's W ends up higher damage output than Varus' W if the target has over 2600 HP, assuming they get the same number of attacks on the target. Once they bother with AP scaling, Varus overshoots Kog'maw.

In order for Kog'maw to guarantee he can land more attacks than Varus' %HP can deal, he needs ~1.9 AS (so he can get 16 attacks, because, at most, Varus can proc 15 attacks' worth of Blight with 5 spells, assuming proper CD rotation).

Varus' ends up being more bursty than Kog'maw, because it's dealt in chunks and proc'd with his spells, which deal additional burst.

Ariel the CruelMay 22, 20152 votes

Finally done! (no, it's not the only thing I've been doing this whole time.)

(Skip to the bottom if you don't care about the math)

Varus Q: 10/157 (1.0 AD) W: 10/26 (.25 AP) -- 5% (2% per 100 AP) max target health [max 3 stacks] E: 65/205 (0.6 AD) R: 150/350 (1.0 AP)

AD: 49-100 AS: 0.658 (51.0%) [+20%/40% passive]

Ability damage: [157+205+350+26(AA's)]+1.6(AD)+AP+[(0.25AP)AA's] = [712 + 26(AA's)] + 1.6(AD)+AP+[(0.25AP)AA's]

(I don't have the numbers for a fully charged Varus Q, so this is using minimum damage.)

Raw Damage: Total base value raw damage: 3) 300+790+160= 1250 [+15% target max health] 6) 600+868+160= 1628 [+30% target max health] 9) 900+946+160= 2006 [+45% target max health]

Total raw damage with 100 AP: 3) 1250+100+[25(AA's)=75]= 1425 [+21% target max health] 6) 1628+100+[25(AA's)=150]= 1878 [+42% target max health] 9) 2006+100+[25(AA's)=225]= 2331 [+63% target max health]

Total raw damage with 500 AP: 3) 1250+500+[125(AA's)=375]= 2125 [+45% target max health] 6) 1250+500+[125(AA's)=750]= 2500 [+90% target max health] 9) 1250+500+[125(AA's)=1125]= 2875 [+135% target max health]

Time to execute: 3 seconds for abilities Base value attack speed: lvl 18: 0.658+ 0.33558=0.768544 small passive: 0.768544+0.1316=0.900144 large passive: 0.768544+0.2632=1.031744

Total attacks per 3 seconds: 3) 2.305632 ; 2.700432 ; 3.095232 6) 4.611264 ; 5.400864 ; 6.190464 9) 6.916896 ; 8.101296 ; 9.285696

Kog'Maw Q: 80/280 (.5 AP) -- + 10/30% atk spd W: 6% (1% per 100 AP) E: 60/260 (0.7 AP) R: 160/320 (0.3 AP) (0.5 AD)

AD: 49-100 AS: 0.665 (45.1%)

Ability damage: 280+260+320(AA's/3)+(0.3AP)+(0.5AD)+1.2(AP) = 540+320+(0.3AP)+(0.5AD)+1.2(AP)

Raw Damage: Total Base value raw damage: 3) 300+320+150= 480 [+18% target max health] 6) 600+640+300= 1540 [+36% target max health] 9) 900+960+450= 2310 [+54% target max health]

Total raw damage with 100 AP: 3) 480+120+30= 630 [+21% target max health] 6) 1540+120+60= 1720 [42% target max health] 9) 2310+120+90= 2520 [+63% target max health]

Total raw damage with 500 AP: 3) 480+600+450= 1530 [+33% target max health] 6) 1540+600+900= 3040 [+66% target max health] 9) 2310+600+1350= 4260 [+99% target max health]

Time to execute: 3 seconds for abilities Base value attack speed: lvl 18: 0.665+0.299915+0.1995=1.154415

Total attacks per 3 seconds: 3) 3.463245 6) 6.92649 9) 10.389735

(Koggles is so much easier.)

Values assuming 3 AA's, then 6 AA's, then 9 AA's (so Varus can get in a full 3 proc roation). Abilities are used once per set; Kog's R is used once per 3 AA's. A 1 second cast time is assumed for all abilities (I don't have the actual values and comparativly it's not a big deal).

My brain just isn't cooperating to invert the attack speed values.

So based on this: it's worth noting that at 500 AP (estimated end game value) Varus' burst is noticably bigger but after the first 3 AA's it doesn't really matter who the attacker is, the victim is effectivly dead. The same is true at 100 AP; Varus does slightly more (at 3 and 6 AA's), but the victim is effectivly dead at 6 AA's. Another thing worth noting is Kog's overall higher attack speed. The only time Varus has more is early game when getting his big passive. Without Varus' passive, Kog's innate attack speed just makes a fool of him (Roughly, Varus gets 2 AA's for every 3 of Kog's). Thene there's still the matter of consistancy. AA's are point and click. If Varus missess any of his skill shots, his damage starts going down quick. Kog still has the advantage of range (though Varus actually has higer base range, Kog beats him with only 1 rank in his W).

All that said, it still comes down to personal preference and play style. They Both have near identical builds and end results. Kog has the advantage of range and consistancy, Varus has a psuedo-AoE root. Personally, I consider AP Kog's strengths to be more valuable than AP Varus'. Varus is still more fun though (that's why I have him unlocked and not Kog).

As with the last few times I did one of these comparisons, please note: This is not a perfect evaluation of realistic value. This assumes best case scenario and does not use a "perfect" item build (or any, in this case).

Champion SkinMay 22, 20151 votes

Kog also has an attack speed buff and an Armor/Mr shred in his Q which does improve his W (Though their attack speed is mostly the same if Varus killed a minion... though the buff only last 3 seconds while kog'maw attack speed buff is always active)

JustMyBassCannonMay 22, 20151 votes

Very true, and as Ariel already covered, it comes down to more of a playstyle preference, instead of either one being explicitly better. I did represent it a bit more in Varus' favor, while Ariel's math and everything takes into account more factors and is more objective.

Champion SkinMay 22, 20151 votes

Well I certainly believe that Varus would be stronger early (Because Kog doesn't really have that great range early game and I believe that Varus probably has better burst and killing power in lane) and Kog might be slightly stronger late game thanks to his range (And % amor/mr shred isn't too bad either).. and having such a long range is incredibly strong especially if you have people to try to dive onto you and get to you... though of course if it isn't warded properly your range might get nullified by a flank

MattAkhavanMay 22, 20151 votes

Varus is a very strong 6 Offensive item ADC, in fact almost every adc is. If you are really struggling in the tank meta go 6 item adc and learn to position better in teamfights and you will almost always be able to 1v1 the bruiser / tank.

my 6 item build looks like this

item 3072 item 3046 item 3006 item 3035 item 3153 item 3031

BluePolarizerMay 22, 20152 votes

I saw from S4 that a Varus main said that 2nd IE is superior to Bork due to the way Varus scales with AD and Crit. with 2 IEs you crit 3/4 of all attacks, which is absolutely ludicrous in terms of DPS, while making your Q way stronger due to the 80 AD.

MattAkhavanMay 22, 20151 votes

You could, but bork synergies with blight, the same way why kog and vayne build bork because it has synergy with their % health. plus personally i would probably go with another pd for 90% crit chance rather than an extra 80 damage because crit is king .

in tank meta, health stacking is pretty common, so i think bork is better
you probably don't have enough mana to spam q, and have enough mana to peel for youself in an extended teamight. if varus can't use his spells he loses a ton of damage because his kit revolves around popping your blight.

Aych PiiMay 22, 20151 votes

It would be nigh impossible to move his W to his passive without ruining AP Varus. It wouldn't be horrible to see him get a new passive altogether, but I think W should remain as is.

largefishMay 22, 20151 votes

In defense of varus having a passive move on his W, moving his w to his passive would probably make AP and hybrid Varus totally useless, as it's the only ability really worth putting points into as AP. I think that keeping Varus's W the way it is is ok.

yoniameMay 22, 20151 votes

I play Varus often (A and S usually), but he is a balanced champion, he doesn't needs changes.

yoniameMay 22, 20151 votes

also his bortk is not needed, you can just build ap and atack speed and enjoy your triplekills

DandymannMay 22, 20151 votes

Maybe Varus could get a change in his W to instead of blowing stacks he would only have to build them. And maybe do something a little lore based? I propose that upon leveling his W, Varus's basic attacks begin to corrupt his enemy dark power for like 3 seconds, letting Varus gain bonus damage and lifesteal when he attacks them, stacking up to 10 times. At one or two stacks the damage is pretty insignificant, but when it reaches five, it begins doing bonus damage based of %max HP.

This change works really well on Varus because, as an ADC with zero escape (because that E totally doesn't count), he would be encouraged to start prolonged trades with enemy tanks because he can melt them down and keep healing, growing ever stronger as he feeds off of his enemies as he corrupts them from the inside out.

Plus, that would make some pretty SICK in-game art

AhhShucksMay 22, 20151 votes

This would be such an awesome ability.

badoogaMay 22, 20151 votes

How about this?

Passive: Now is old W passive Q: Unchanged W: Passive - Whenever a Blight Stack are consumed, Varus gains 2/3/5/7/8% attack speed for each stack consumed for 3 seconds. Active - Varus marks a target for 5, giving him increased attack damage when attacking that target. If the target is killed during this time, then Varus gains double the attack speed from his passive for 4 seconds. E: The only change I would make is that the slow is increased when the ability is targeted closer to him (for more self peel) or reduce the cast time. R: Unchanged

AxestsMay 22, 20151 votes

i feel he's stronger in tank meta -good at dueling -self peel -sustain counter -%hp damage

Shroom JunkieMay 23, 20151 votes

For a second I thought this was a "BUFF VARUS RITO" thread. Anyway, I think Varus's passive is just pretty stupid in general. But I think it should scale with level and be a lot lower if it is though.