@Riot: Kayn shows something interesting about Divers and Assassins.

Raxistaicho··21 votes·1,234 views

They're really not so different on a superficial level despite being in completely different parts of the class system.

As a baseline, you need damage, a way to stick to your target, a way to get in, and a defensive tool to not die right away.

After that, you either need burst and flexibility, or durability and control.

18 Comments

SwiftKitten8816 votes

the difference is quite simple actually... divers have a way in but not usually a way out and are designed to stay in the fight. (like Diana has CC and shield to help her survive, and XinZhao has CC and a combat based heal) where as assassins usually have a way in but also a way out (Zed Talon ) but aren't designed to stay in a fight.

Grenadeslash1 votes

i think Yasuo is an example too like Kayn.

Blue Moon Wolf8 votes

They pretty much are anymore. Divers are slightly tankier assassins with no reliable escape tool (not counting Camille who breaks the rules on that). They really were not supposed to work like that. originally they were supposes to be less burst, more sustain for more dragged out fights, but with how lethality is now and how easy it is for them to get CC'd and blown up, they have pretty much been forced to become more bursty then they were in the past. So as of now, they are pretty much just Assassins, but with no reliable escape tools and more defensive tools to keep them alive after blowing up the ADC, long enough to go hide behind their team until it is time for them to clean up the after the Juggernauts and ADCs are finished with there fun.

Ralanr3 votes

In my experience, divers feel more bursty.

Sun Wu Ryuumoku3 votes

More Bursty than SA kayn u mean ???

anyway there so many different divers. Xin isn't so bursty, skarner either.

Ralanr5 votes

Eh, Pantheon and Vi are pretty bursty.

Sun Wu Ryuumoku2 votes

yeah, thats why i say there many different divers. But Kayn burst faster and hit harder than both of them when he go on the assassin road. Diana & Wukong burst faster tho.

Jacknife2 votes

Cut from the same cloth, but different clothes, eh? Interesting.

That makes me ask though, since diver... dive patterns are pretty similar across champions of the subclass, do assassins suffer from the same design flaw?

It Hertz When IP1 votes

It's not really a pattern. Assassins: Go in, dump all your damage, get out. Divers: Go in, dump all your damage, keep dumping until you die or the team fight ends. It's not a design flaw, it's the entire intent behind the classes. It's like noticing that a lot of marksmen are ranged, and asking if the rest share that design flaw.

Erockandroll2 votes

I kinda figured this out even Before Kayn. Kayn simply emphasized it by having his kit revolving around picking between the two. (All while not significantly changing his abilities.)

But in effect, the difference between Assassin and Diver are close enough that crossover can happen. All you really need is a change up in itemization. This was demonstrated with the Bruiser (Tank) builds for Ekko and Fizz. Their AP scaling builds would synergize with Lichbane. But that also allows them to synergize with Trinity force. And for some divers TF is all you really need for your base level of damage. (You might throw in BotRK for a bit of dueling power, but that would be it.) As a result, Ekko and Fizz's synergy with Sheen items allow them to fill multiple roles.

Athenes Lulu1 votes

Divers can't just hop/blink out immediately after getting in. Instead, they have tools to help them live longer so they don't get burst down immediately, while ideally, assassins should if they're not fast enough.

That is an ideal situation, of course.

DragonShea1 votes

Diver: Get in and stay in the fight. (More tanky)

Assassin: Get in and then GTFO (More Mobile and have disengage)

DuskDaUmbreon1 votes

I agree that this illustrates it so well. And people brought up Fizz and Ekko's tank builds. I just want to throw in a third example: Diana.

She has the kit of a bruiser: Dive in, burst one person, prevent escape (via E or R2/3/4/∞), and shield long enough to get at least one more person down. However, she was being played a lot like an assassin, with a lot of raw AP in her builds. People would just burst one target, then Zhonya's to burst the next one. Instead of going from assassin to bruiser like Ekko and Fizz did, she went from bruiser to assassin.

88329730DEL11 votes

[deleted]

Davaken1 votes

His ultimate makes it kinda delayed...

TheDevice1 votes

JarvanIV Best assassindiver in the game. Can assassinate multiple targets at the same time too

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