Does it even matter how far you put Brand behind?

Nah, AP Maokai just uses his children.

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You said yourself that (better/buffed) ap ratios would let him kill squishes better. But those are just AP ratios. You still need AP for ratios to work. As a support-brand your options for AP are limited. Unless you are playing support-brand as noobs play nidalee/lux as supports (FYI: they play them like mages in botlane).

That being said: If Riot did smart and buffed his AP RATIOS while nerfing his BASE damage, they'd in turn PUSH HIM AWAY from botlane, because he would NEED AP to function at all and to do so he'd NEED GOLD and he'd definitely NOT get the GOLD with an ADC in the same lane.

Thus is my "Ap doesn't grow on trees". You don't get AP out of ass while being a support. You need to buy it. And supports are gold-starved 24/7 as fuck.

Now, you get what the fuck I was even talking about ;)?

"ap ratios would let him kill squishes better. But those are just AP ratios. You still need AP for ratios to work." -

You're not even making points here you are just stating facts

"If Riot did smart and buffed his AP RATIOS while nerfing his BASE damage, they'd in turn PUSH HIM AWAY from botlane" -

ok, this is a point that no one is contesting and one you should have started with by saying something along the lines of "Rather then adding damage to his passive they should have reduced it and added better ratios" because the nerfing of the passive wasn't already on the table you are presenting the buff to ap ratios without mentioning that this would be accompanied by nerfs to his passive. You also wanted me to deduce all this from "Ap doesn't grow on trees"

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If you tank all three of his basic abilities, allow his ultimate to bounce to you the maximum number of times, and stand in two passive procs, he'll kill you... maybe.

If that actually happens to you on a regular basis... congratulations you played yourself.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kpCQd_YaTT4

Rrrrighttt...

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Well yes, it's his passive that does most of the damage, at least for Brand support. Pretty much every argument I've seen is lower base and increase scaling, or revert passive dot to 2%.

lol his base damage has nothing to do with it. Brand just works really well with Liandry Rylai. His base damage is nowhere near the problem and actually his base damage gets outshined by alot of other mages. I think his scaling damage should be increased and item like Liandry should get nerfed and reduce his % burn by 1% atleast. But in all honesty Brand is not some top tier god champion he has a lot of problems due to range and being immobile so that's why you almost never see him in pro play or masters/challenger since it's also really easy to counter pick him. I think Brand can be annoying to play against but very easy to play against also because if you pick something like Leona Alistar Nami ect you have a 10x easier lane than he does.

But that's not what Eedat was responding to like... At all...

Consider this, say that a melee with 4000 health and some magic resist eats a full rotation from brand who has 400 AP and voidstaff, the passive would thus deal 24% of the melee's health before magic resist, so 960 health.

Adaptive would reduce the proc by 20%, down to 768.

Its a reduction in damage taken from brands passive by 192......which is something but.....is it really enough?

Brand still deals damage with his abilities and liandry, and off those only Liandry will see any damage reduction from the adaptive.

So lets say that Brand manages to keep the melee on fire for 5 seconds, since he always get liandry+rylai thats 5 seconds of losing 2% max health per second.

So 80 health per second up to 400, reduced by 20% down to 320.

So, in total adaptive helmet would roughly reduce the total damage by 272.......from the damn passive effects of Brand´s rotation, none of the direct damage was even counted so far, he would still deal 1088 damage with those passive effects alone to his 4000 health victim.

And with 40% CDR he can do it again four seconds later.

You made it abundantly clear that you felt it was useless for you would do no damage and die of marksmen anyway....but i just wanted to make sure you knew it wasnt even good against Brand anyway since that was uncertain^^