Wanna know why people will always blame Assassin type of champions?

Macilento·Jan 20, 2016·7 votes·996 views

People will never admit when they got outplayed. Is that simple. Sad but true.

Sometimes you gotta sit back and say" damn, that dude pulled of some moves, i couldn't react to it"

Instead of: " Yeah gg wp op champ"

Outplaying is what all assassin champs must do in order to be good. Outplaying also means you need be good at playing them. It's really easy to say "Oh look Lee Sin is so op wtf", then if you try lee sin yourself without any expewrience you'll see that you cannot do jack, because that's what these type of champs requires.

40 Comments

WoodakoodashoodaJan 20, 201611 votes

People do not enjoy fighting champions who are capable of killing you in literally a fraction of a second. People do not enjoy fighting champions who are capable of killing you as soon as they appear. People do not enjoy fighting champions who are capable of killing you before you even know what hit you.

What does an assassin do in order to be good? They must hide behind all forms of protection or end up killed. They must wait to strike a weak opponent at their moment of vulnerability. They must then retreat after having killed their target or targets unless the opposition is dead or has fled.

In short, an assassin must be the most hated bully on the playground who goes around terrorizing the children so long as no one is around who can stop them. An assassin must be precisely what the term "assassin" implies. Someone who sneaks around and cuts people down without making their presence known until it's too late.

It's really not hard to understand why people hate assassins. Their hatred has nothing to do with how well a person plays their champion. You can be the best ADC, mage, or even assassin possible, but that won't eliminate a decent assassin's chance of killing you in a split second. That is why people hate them.

If an assassin is going around killing people instantly or quickly, however, it doesn't really make them over powered. It simply means that the assassin is doing their job and managed to pick up enough kills to empower them.

MacilentoJan 20, 20163 votes

[{quoted}](name=Chocolate Frost,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=x0bM1G4f,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2016-01-20T14:37:02.446+0000)

People do not enjoy fighting champions who are capable of killing you in literally a fraction of a second. People do not enjoy fighting champions who are capable of killing you as soon as they appear. People do not enjoy fighting champions who are capable of killing you before you even know what hit you.

What does an assassin do in order to be good? They must hide behind all forms of protection or end up killed. They must wait to strike a weak opponent at their moment of vulnerability. They must then retreat after having killed their target or targets unless the opposition is dead or has fled.

In short, an assassin must be the most hated bully on the playground who goes around terrorizing the children so long as no one is around who can stop them. An assassin must be precisely what the term "assassin" implies. Someone who sneaks around and cuts people down without making their presence known until it's too late.

It's really not hard to understand why people hate assassins. Their hatred has nothing to do with how well a person plays their champion. You can be the best ADC, mage, or even assassin possible, but that won't eliminate a decent assassin's chance of killing you in a split second. That is why people hate them.

If an assassin is going around killing people instantly or quickly, however, it doesn't really make them over powered. It simply means that the assassin is doing their job and managed to pick up enough kills to empower them.

Apparently people don't like the truth tho and started downvoting me :D, Ridicolous honestly

DrCyanideJan 20, 20161 votes

There's also the fact that it's significantly harder to outplay someone on a champion like, say, Karthus, than it is to "outplay" on someone like Zed.

MacilentoJan 20, 20163 votes

{quoted}

There's also the fact that it's significantly harder to outplay someone on a champion like, say, Karthus, than it is to "outplay" on someone like Zed.

Outplay is not only relative to "1v1 midlane". If you as karthus engage on a 1v1 on Zed knowing that you are going to kill both zed and someone else on the team, you already outplayed Zed

darkmatchwaldoJan 20, 20162 votes

But these champions are NECESSARY to remove huge threats as fast as possible before they can dish out too much damage...

ScumbagZedJan 20, 20161 votes

{quoted}

But these champions are NECESSARY to remove huge threats as fast as possible before they can dish out too much damage...

Youve said it perfectly

DreadlocksJan 20, 20161 votes

This is just an excuse if you ask me.. People hate champs like Yasuo LeeSin Riven Jax And they're fighters...

EcchiOtakuTMJan 20, 20161 votes

No actually yasuo isn't a fighter or assassin, he's a carry which means they can scale heavily on crit to take out an entire team if left untouched. Sadly riot got rid of the team and now some carries are in spots where they shouldn't be such as yi/tryn/gp/yasuo, only reason rengar isn't on the list is he can't take out more then 1 people(2 if really well played) unless just completely snowballing like other assassins.

While reason for lee sin is obvious cause he's over used people hate him ( I don't) the only reasonable nerf I could understand is lowering his base movement.

While jax it's just rageblade not jax himself, and riven use to be something cause of LW being effective vs squishies and tanks but she's underwhelming atm.

Although #12, 19, 20 would fix jax/riven

http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/yYBm9rXq-i-honestly-love-the-changes-placed-in-however-i-as-well-as-many-have-a-few-suggestions

DreadlocksJan 20, 20161 votes

No actually yasuo isn't a fighter or assassin, he's a carry

uw0tm8?

EcchiOtakuTMJan 20, 20161 votes

He's a carry, term which was perfect for how well they scaled with items especially crit until riot decided to remove it for some reason leaving the melee carries into subpar terms for their respective roles.

DreadlocksJan 21, 20161 votes

So that makes him not a fighter/assassin? rotfl. dAtL0G1cD03

IonianJan 20, 20166 votes

Ahri WR "outplayed" Akali anything she can possibly do "outplayed" Diana RW auto "outplayed" Fizz EWQ "outplayed" Katarina lel "outplayed" Kassadin anything "outplayed" Leblanc QR "outplayed" Rengar lel "outplayed" Talon anything "outplayed" Zed RE auto "outplayed"

Assassin is not even close to being the hardest type of champion to play. All of them have reliability in a way or another, and definitely all of them have mobility which makes them more forgiving. Some of them even have cc. Assassins are easy, and this is coming from an Ahri main.

MacilentoJan 20, 20163 votes

[{quoted}](name=If Ahri Was Real,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=x0bM1G4f,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2016-01-20T13:48:43.491+0000)

WR "outplayed" anything she can possibly do "outplayed" RW auto "outplayed" EWQ "outplayed" lel "outplayed" anything "outplayed" QR "outplayed" lel "outplayed" anything "outplayed" RE auto "outplayed"

Assassin is not even close to being the hardest type of champion to play. All of them have reliability in a way or another, and definitely all of them have mobility which makes them more forgiving. Some of them even have cc. Assassins are easy, and this is coming from an Ahri main.

Of course it depends on case by case scenario. I'm not talking about everyone. Rengar is a broken down mess in my opinion, And akali is toxic as well.

Most of the others you need to know what you are doing, especially when you start to get decent player against you

YrzenJan 20, 20165 votes

Just recently I played Leblanc for the first time in months. Keep in mind I was never good with Leblanc.

I just fed and fed and fed. My enemy mid laner was an Annie who claimed to have been lagging off her ass and I still fed her.

Come mid-late game though I could W over walls and QR the enemy Quinn. Throw in E if she was at full health and she would die without any chance to react to it. The chain didn't even need to go off for her to die.

Sometimes there's just nothing you can do to stop an assassin from killing you. No amount of skill can stop these things. You just have to lay back and accept a complete and total lack of counterplay. That being said, that doesn't make them unbalanced and I agree that there is way too much whining over things that shouldn't be whined about.

MacilentoJan 20, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Just recently I played Leblanc for the first time in months. Keep in mind I was never good with Leblanc.

I just fed and fed and fed. My enemy mid laner was an Annie who claimed to have been lagging off her ass and I still fed her.

Come mid-late game though I could W over walls and QR the enemy Quinn. Throw in E if she was at full health and she would die without any chance to react to it. The chain didn't even need to go off for her to die.

Sometimes there's just nothing you can do to stop an assassin from killing you. No amount of skill can stop these things. You just have to lay back and accept a complete and total lack of counterplay. That being said, that doesn't make them unbalanced and I agree that there is way too much whining over things that shouldn't be whined about.

It depends case by case. O course when you start to get item, 1 full combo is all you need to kill someone. But as you said yourself you just fed mid because you were not in practice with LB.

I'm not talking about who is stronger and who is not, i'm just saying that in general, people will always look at this type of champion and says it's broken.

THe only real assassin i play is Ekko (not that i'm super good on it) and if it happen that 1 game i get fed it will always be "Champion op Bullshi ultimate" instead of the skill of the player

EcchiOtakuTMJan 20, 20161 votes

Rengar is only strong because he's an assassin with carry-like scalings due to how well he uses crit.

Rinky DinkyJan 21, 20161 votes

They are easy at face value, but are hilariously stronger in the hands of a assassin main.

That's the difference

TrylobyteJan 20, 20164 votes

People don't like dying when there's absolutely nothing they can do to prevent it, especially if there's relatively little risk associated with the attempt. Assassins rely on the principle of killing an enemy before they can do anything about it, so they start with half the hate-inducing problem right there. it's when they can have relatively little risk in making an assassination attempt that really drives people crazy since no amount of skill helps against someone that's either going to instakill you from fog of war or fail to do so then disappear where you can't pursue them and try again in 30 seconds, something high-mobility assassins specialize in.

DreadlocksJan 20, 20161 votes

People just hate losing in general.

MacilentoJan 20, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=We Rektum,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=x0bM1G4f,comment-id=00060000,timestamp=2016-01-20T15:39:56.151+0000)

People just hate losing in general.

Hating to lose is normal. Not recognizing when someone is just better then you making up excuses is pathetic

DreadlocksJan 20, 20161 votes

which is legit 90% of the community?

ProficiencyJan 20, 20162 votes

I think many argue that the problem isnt the skill floor on champions, but that skill ceiling is high in terms of power. As in once you master it, you appear op. Im not saying its true, but, i think that is one of the more valid arguments

MacilentoJan 20, 20161 votes

{quoted}

I think many argue that the problem isnt the skill floor on champions, but that skill ceiling is high in terms of power. As in once you master it, you appear op. Im not saying its true, but, i think that is one of the more valid arguments

It depends on the champion certainly, but in general, people jsut hate to admit that they are inferior to the opponent and just call out for "OP here, OP there" :D

It's getting old

WoodakoodashoodaJan 20, 20162 votes

Why should people insult themselves? Why should we be expected to devalue ourselves? There are too many people insulting others and devaluing them already.

Maximum MordeJan 20, 20162 votes

{quoted}

damn, that dude pulled of some moves, i couldn't react to it"

This right here is what makes them bullshit and anti-fun. When it doesn't matter if you are at your keyboard or not, why should you be?

When some champions can do this, it's LC$BIGPLAY$ and accepted, but when others can they get nerfed into oblivion. Where is the consistency?

MacilentoJan 20, 20162 votes

[{quoted}](name=Maximum Morde,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=x0bM1G4f,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2016-01-20T14:45:00.164+0000)

This right here is what makes them bullshit and anti-fun. When it doesn't matter if you are at your keyboard or not, why should you be?

When some champions can do this, it's LC$BIGPLAY$ and accepted, but when others can they get nerfed into oblivion. Where is the consistency?

That's just not true. It doesn't matter at all LCS big plays and all that stuff.

Of course it's not fun getting killed but that's what assassins do, and you have to be good to do it. YOu can try to say that you jsut have to "roflstomp the keybord" to get a pentakill with an assassn, but it's just not the truth.

Assassins also sacrifice other things like waveclear, cc, survaivabilty in order to be assassins. But those things does not matter right?

Maximum MordeJan 20, 20163 votes

{quoted}

Assassins also sacrifice other things like waveclear, cc, survaivabilty in order to be assassins.

Fizz - Has waveclear, cc (slow on two abilities and a knockup), and very high survivability through passive and mobility.

Ahri - Has waveclear, cc on charm, and very high survivability through sustain, ms boost, and mobility.

LeBlanc - Has waveclear, cc root, and very high survivability through mobility.

Rengar - Jungle clear speed is pretty good so you can't really say he doesn't clear. CC root/Slow, and pretty good survivability with built in sustain and sometimes a bruiser build.

Diana - Has waveclear, minimal CC through displacement but it still exists, and good survivability through shield and standard build providing some decent defensive stats.

Talon - Has waveclear, pretty minimal short slow cc, still counts, but poor survivability.

Zed - Has really good waveclear, very minimal cc like Talon through a short slow, and very high survivability through mobility.

Akali - Worst waveclear of the bunch, like Talon and Zed has minimal cc through a slow, she has pretty decent survivability through stealth, and high levels of built in sustain.

I'm sure I missed some assassins but most of these seem to have all of the above in some amount.

MacilentoJan 20, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Maximum Morde,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=x0bM1G4f,comment-id=000400000000,timestamp=2016-01-20T15:09:55.456+0000)

Fizz - Has waveclear, cc (slow on two abilities and a knockup), and very high survivability through passive and mobility.

Ahri - Has waveclear, cc on charm, and very high survivability through sustain, ms boost, and mobility.

LeBlanc - Has waveclear, cc root, and very high survivability through mobility.

Rengar - Jungle clear speed is pretty good so you can't really say he doesn't clear. CC root/Slow, and pretty good survivability with built in sustain and sometimes a bruiser build.

Diana - Has waveclear, minimal CC through displacement but it still exists, and good survivability through shield and standard build providing some decent defensive stats.

Talon - Has waveclear, pretty minimal short slow cc, still counts, but poor survivability.

Zed - Has really good waveclear, very minimal cc like Talon through a short slow, and very high survivability through mobility.

Akali - Worst waveclear of the bunch, like Talon and Zed has minimal cc through a slow, she has pretty decent survivability through stealth, and high levels of built in sustain.

I'm sure I missed some assassins but most of these seem to have all of the above in some amount.

Survaivability thorugh mobility. kk

SURVAIVABILITY =/= Mobility.

Skarner HAs survaviability AND Mobility. So does Hecarim. Assasin do not have SUrvaviability and DO NOT have Strong CCin their kits.

EcchiOtakuTMJan 20, 20161 votes

Diana actually has survivability and strong cc, she's more of a bruiser tbh but nothing to complain about.

The Queen ViperJan 20, 20162 votes

{quoted}

Sometimes you gotta sit back and say" damn, that dude pulled of some moves, i couldn't react to it"

The problem with assassins in PVP usually is, regardless of the game, that they are more or less designed that way.

You couldn't react because there never were an opportunity for you to do so in the first place.

They are the very definition of "feast or famine" type of champions.

{quoted}

Outplaying is what all assassin champs must do in order to be good.

It's not hard to outplay people when you have the most mobility and burst dmg in the game.

{quoted}

Outplaying also means you need be good at playing them.

No, you don't. The stronger a champ is by default, the less skill you need with them.

MacilentoJan 20, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Snake on bush,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=x0bM1G4f,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2016-01-20T14:52:02.366+0000)

The problem with assassins in PVP usually is, regardless of the game, that they are more or less designed that way.

You couldn't react because there never were an opportunity for you to do so in the first place.

They are the very definition of "feast or famine" type of champions.

It's not hard to outplay people when you have the most mobility and burst dmg in the game.

No, you don't. The stronger a champ is by default, the less skill you need with them.

Outplaying doesn't mean only win a 1v1 in midlane. It means, managing your Cd and those of the enemies, using the fog of war to your advantage, finding suitable gank paths, Knowing to play defensivly and when not and a crpa ton of other things. Anything you do to get an advantage over an enemy is technically outplaying.

They need mobility and dmg in order to kill people, they sacrifice other things in return. Waveclear, CC, Survaivability. Those doesn't matter right?

You cannot react to a rengar killing you in0.2 seconds, sure. We can all agree with that. Do not tell me tho that you cannot stun a katarina at the right time, or zonyha , or Qss, or put a pink ward down .

Cerebral AbsenceJan 20, 20162 votes

+1. all the dislikes come from ADC players thinking of rengar :3

MacilentoJan 20, 20161 votes

{quoted}

+1. all the dislikes come from ADC players thinking of rengar :3

Yeah. Salltinessis real :P

Cerebral AbsenceJan 20, 20163 votes

justlolthings

Btw, @all the guys that rage if getting oneshot by assassins: They are outplaying you. So don't rage! They can only eliminate you that hard if they are a) fed b) better than you c) not getting countered by your team with CC/(Pink-)Wards/Grouping - maybe because your team has no peel and no tanks because you picked full AP/AD Jungle + Top + Support...

Please. Don't rage! if you get shoved, you are either bad, have a bad game/team or the enemies are just generally better than you. No need to salt around and cry "op Lee, fck rengar, sh!tty n00b fizz" and so on.

I bet in high(er) Elo (plat+) there are less, less guys whining...

#feelfreetodownvote

Woodsy2575Jan 20, 20161 votes

They don't like dying, and assassins are built only for that very reason, forget the other tradeoffs they have to make in waveclear and survivability, those things clearly don't matter

WalkingInACircleJan 20, 20161 votes

No, its because they're zero teamwork, zero strategy champions specifically designed to pad their own kda. And the tendency of their player base to brag about "muh muhcanics" if they ever manage to do exactly what their champion is designed to do. Which there is nothing actually difficult about.

GirardJan 20, 20161 votes

[deleted]

ScumbagZedJan 20, 20161 votes

{quoted}

I don't have a problem with Assassins as champions.

I DO have a problem with getting unimaginable amounts of damage from level 2 and on, and the fact that most people think Zed actually takes skill to play, at least right now. Zed with thunderlords, ignite, and an all-in ult can easily burst for upwards of 1k. Kassadin with thunderlords, ignite, and an all-in combo can easily burst for about 300 damage and then proceed to die.

I know this because I play , I fight a lot. From experience, Zed gets way too much poke and burst damage for doing little to nothing to actually earn it. Point and click ult, WQE, ignite and thunderlords proc can basically take anyone down regardless of his score.

That's just fact right now and it's totally unfair because there are only 2 things to do to counter him. Tank (implying that you're on a tank champion, Mundo, Volibear, etc.) or build a and pray to God that your flash is up, or that your team is their to lock down Zed, because the second you come out of stasis Zed will just proceed to Ignite you and then use his other abilities and burst you down.

** Zed is a fun champion, I get it, but as of right now he gets too much bang for his buck and it saddens me to think that an 0-2 Zed with a full combo thinks that they are outplaying someone at this current state of League. ** maybe has one too many dashes, because sadly there is no getting away from her if she findsf the game. Play around it.

Other than that, Assassins are totally fine by me. It's a type of champion in the game. High damage, high mobility players that SHOULD be very squishy as counterplay.

As a Zed main ( i am by no means good i just main him) i find that yes, thunderlords makes zed very strong but almost every champion in the game has some sort of cc to negate death mark or reduce it s damage, and WQE combos are pretty easy to dodge IF you are in position in lane. However, zed has a high skill cap and there is a potential to outplay your opponent hard. I think the problem with zed right now lies in Thunderlords and not the champion. Think back to pre thunderlords meta, zed was a weaker pick for assassins. :)