Since Riot Has Given Up on AP Bruiser Items I Would Like to Throw Out a Few Ideas

Frosted Tips··7 votes·5,109 views
Quick Gameplay Thoughts: February 13

AP Phage

Amplifying Tome + Ruby Crystal + 315 gold = 1150 gold

25 AP 200 Health

Phage Passive

AP Trinity Force

AP Phage + Sheen + Stinger + 33 gold = 3333 gold

40 AP 40% AS 250 Health 250 Mana 5% Movement Speed 20% CDR

AP Black Cleaver

Needlessly Large Rod + Kindlegem + Dagger + = 3000 gold

70 AP 300 Health 20% AS

After using your ultimate ability for the next 20 seconds your basic attacks grant you stacks of Grace(Melee only)

Grace stacks up to 5 time granting the user 6% magic penetration per stack up to 30% and lasts the rest of the duration.

AP Sterak's

Blasting Wand + Negatron Cloak + Ruby Crystal + 830 gold = 2800 gold

40 AP 40 Magic Resist 300 Health

Passive(Melee only) - After receiving 50% of your maximum health in damage within 2 seconds remove all CC effects and gain a magic damage shield for 250-1100 based on level.

AP Maw

Seeker's Armguard + Amplifying Tome + Ruby Crystal + 1115 gold= 3050 gold

55 AP 45 Armor 250 Health

Passive(Melee only) - Once you are dropped to 30% health gain a shield of 450 for 2 seconds. and receive 10% lifesteal and spellvamp until out of combat.

What do you guys think and do you have any ideas?

26 Comments

heroikc12 votes

Though I'd love AP bruisers as much as the next guy (I want to play more Gragas), I don't think making direct comparison between items is the way to go...

Frosted Tips1 votes

I mean they still have different effects excluding the AP Trinity Force. I mainly used those comparison names to let you know the general idea of the item.

heroikc2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Frosted Tips,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=wAAWgx6e,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2019-02-18T16:16:27.622+0000)

I mean they still have different effects excluding the AP Trinity Force. I mainly used those comparison names to let you know the general idea of the item.

Maybe, but don't you think you're trying to mirror builds and effects a bit too much? I'd rather see more AP armor and MR items, or more builds that benefit tanky AP bruisers.

Frosted Tips1 votes

They maybe a little bit close. The main thing that I have come to understand while trying to think of AP Bruiser items is that tankier AP Bruiser items would benefit tanks far too much, so I tried to look for some heavier AP items that are more early game oriented. I think that these items would allow AP Bruisers to build tankier items after first and/or second iteming these items.

heroikc1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Frosted Tips,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=wAAWgx6e,comment-id=0001000000000000,timestamp=2019-02-18T16:26:45.619+0000)

They maybe a little but close. The main think that I have come to understand while trying to think of AP Bruiser items is that tankier AP Bruiser items would benefit tanks far too much, so I tried to look for some heavier AP items that are more early game oriented. I think that these items would allow AP Bruisers to build tankier items after first and/or second iteming these items.

True, that's a good start...

Alzon5 votes

Look, I’m in favor of a new AP item for bulky champions being added (in fact I play most of those champs), but you’re not helping anyone by simply writing out the comparisons everyone’s mind immediately makes just to farm upvotes off of the recent hotness of the subject. This isn’t even talking about how balanced they may or may not be, which will invariably become an issue with anything copied and pasted into a field where everything is different from the original environment.

Yes, that’s what you’ve done - you’ve copied and pasted these items with a few tweaks in an attempt to increase a little number on a profile page that rarely anyone checks. Good job.

Don’t throw us AP juggernaut players under the bus for your own narcissistic tendencies. Come up with something original next time.

Frosted Tips1 votes

I have yet to hear any criticism about what is wrong with these ideas and that is why I have posted these. Last time I posted and got any responses it was mainly about the other subjects that I posted about. I have posted many different items and these ones I have seen the least possible champions that could abuse them that are not supposed to use them. I would like to have legitament issues pointed out with the items I have suggested and then I could change up the idea to fix those issues. I also post these so that people are aware of Riot giving up on AP Bruisers and leaving them in a shit spot.

Alzon3 votes

Yikes, reading my own comment, especially the last paragraph, I was rather offput by how harsh I was. People can do some very dumb things when they’re passionate about something...

On that note, I apologize for my insensitivity. I should not have hit that “post” button. I will not remove my comment to prevent the downvotes it will invariably generate, because even if such a thing mattered to me, I at least try to own up to my mistakes.

However, even after realizing who you were, my original opinion of the lack of imagination in this post still stands. You may have put a decent amount of effort into it, but I know you’re better than this. You’ve been at this AP bruiser itemization thing for how long now?

I actually like the AP Sterak’s. I can’t debunk its balance, even if it is a tired concept. The other items all have glaring abuse cases that I’m sure you’re aware of.

Frosted Tips1 votes

I think that I might take a look into the aP Trinity Force and the AP Maw and try to change then up a bit. It may take a day or so, but yeah looking at them again I see very little uniqueness and they should definitely offer different passives then they currently do.

Z3Sleeper5 votes

After receiving 50% of your maximum health in damage within 2 seconds

#remove all CC effects

and gain a magic damage shield for 250-1100 based on level.

U wut m8

The DrBonjigollo2 votes

Obligatory common argument, what's stopping the likes of EkkoFizz from taking these items? Just putting that there because someone else will. People talk about that but as someone who usually plays ap assassins, I'd much rather a bruiser build choice that doesn't gimp my damage when there's no one for me to assassinate.

On the other hand I can see how these would be much better for Mordekaiser, specifically ap Phage, Cleaver and Maw but he's getting reworked soon so they could end up useless down the road. Some of the other proposed items might be a touch too strong in the hands of Sylas namely ap steraks. Also Ap Maw could potentially be a must buy for Ap assassins especially Ekko which imo would be great for times where you get cc'd and can't R or you don't have the mana to R but you can Q/E.

Frosted Tips1 votes

Ekko and Fizz are definitely the two most commonly discussed about abusing AP Bruiser items since we have seen them build tank before and decimate the game. I think if they were seen to abuse these items too much it may be beneficial to target balance them by reducing base damages and adding scaling like they have done in the past.

If you read the link Meddler admits that the team is forced to add more power to the kits of AP Bruisers like Sylas because they lack itemization, so pretty much all AP Bruisers would need to be looked into once the items would be announced.

Ekko definitely would abuse the item like that and with the first point I made I think that if the AP ratios and base damage were slightly touched on him it could make the item less viable on him since it offers about 25 less AP than any other item he usually builds.

Infernape1 votes

If anything I think it's a good thing. Ekko doesn't have the kit of an assassin and doesn't play like one. He plays more like a fighter than a straight up assassin. Riot could easily retool Ekko into an AP fighter.

Craktite2 votes

Why so much melee only?

Frosted Tips4 votes

Mages and Battle Mages. They would abuse everything and it is much easier to just make them Melee only then try to make items that mages and Tanks can't abuse.

Craktite2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Frosted Tips,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=wAAWgx6e,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2019-02-18T17:05:15.459+0000)

Mages and Battle Mages. They would abuse everything and it is much easier to just make them Melee only then try to make items that mages and Tanks can't abuse.

I think Battle mage = ap bruiser no? Maybe a mistake from my part (I think about Swain). (And AD maw can be use on ranged champ !)

Frosted Tips4 votes

Battle mages =/= AP Bruisers. AP Bruisers are mainly melee and are less about being mid range and more about being in the face of the enemy. Here are examples of both:

Battle Mages - Karthus Lissandra Swain Vladimir

AP Bruisers - Chogath Diana Elise Galio Gragas Mordekaiser Sylas

Oksanaandjoy1 votes

Singed

On My Kill List1 votes

{quoted}

Why so much melee only?

fuck ranged

TyroneWatermelon1 votes

As if mages need any more magic pen. void staff alone makes tanks useless

Frosted Tips1 votes

This is not for mages hence why it is melee only. Building Void on a Fighter is like building Last Whisperer items on Darius.

TyroneWatermelon1 votes

He already has free last whisper from his E passive, coupled with conQ and 1k true damage ult and resets, he doesn't even need to consider it.

Also tell me which "Fighter" that is also AP relies more on attack speed DPS than bursting down a squishy and his entire family. all of them can easily build void staff to instantly delete 40% of all MR an enemy champions has and will have. why would they prefer to stack 30% pen over 5 autoattacks after casting their ultimate which is their trademark burst instead? and for what, some HP and attack speed? In this cancerous burst and high damage meta that Riot will never change, non burst melee ap fighters can never work

Frosted Tips1 votes

Well the champions that would build these items are looked at currently as mostly either assassins or tanks since they can not build fighter because the items do not exist. If you clicked the link on my post Meddler even said that since these AP fighter like Diana Elise Galio Gragas Mordekaiser Sylas don't have items they have to add higher than normal power to their kits so they can survive with either a full AP of a full tank build.

Let me give you a different fighter then instead of Darius. What about Illoai? Why she would be absolute garbage if Cleaver didnt exist and she had to run a Last Whisperer item for penetration.

TyroneWatermelon1 votes

I've read everything you linked, nothing was changed, they did it for years with gragas diana and mordekaiser.

Illaoi - she was designed with black cleaver in mind, and her w was changed to deal better with tanks.

astralwit1 votes

I too would like better AP bruiser itemization but we may need to delete Kass when that happens.

Elewd1 votes

the proposed stuff in OP has less ap than what kass normally builds, by a lot. He wouldn't build bruiser he'd still go assassin, or if he went bruiser he wouldn't burst people as fast and need to stic to people and auto a lot.

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