I hope Lissandra gets a new passive in Mage update

CHOPSTICKUHH·Mar 12, 2016·76 votes·4,724 views

It's just very useless late game, I'd say maybe it's a small benefit early game but other than that it does nothing for her

67 Comments

PhoggersMar 13, 201619 votes

As long as it isn't something like "Aspect of the True Ice" that stacks up 500 times. [slayer-jinx-wink]

KarKzzMar 13, 20161 votes

"Lissandra stack Aspect of the True ice every 3 basic attack on the same target."

Only Play DariusMar 12, 201617 votes

Well, the mana sustain from her passive is about half of what makes her one of the few mages viable in top lane. If you get a new passive, you might end up restricting her to mid. Not that this is an issue for everyone, but something to keep in mind.

As far as passive ideas, maybe a mage version of Ashe. All her abilities have slows attached so there's already a start, all abilities have increased damage on slowed targets and maybe the slow/damage can stack a couple of times.

SaiannaMar 12, 201615 votes

I disagree. What makes her decent top laner is her "natural" build path with decent amount of health along with her CC and escapes.

This passive has nothing in common with how well she does on TOP. 1 free spell every 18s~~ isn't worth having her mana regen cut in half. And then because of this 1 free spell her abilities cost a FRIGGIN TON of mana

Spammable Q for 85 mana.........................

SquarefighterMar 12, 20164 votes

except that the passive ticks one second off for every cc'd enemy, including minions. So it's not a free spell every 18 seconds, it's a free spell every 14ish seconds. That's not bad at all. Her passive may not feel great, but it actually goes a long way and is absolutely a big part of why she does well top.

Voluug13Mar 12, 20162 votes

Not to mention her passive in toplane works way better with W since most toplaners are melee so you end up using it WAY more often, resulting in less cd because melee+minions.

AudiomancyMar 13, 20162 votes

Except Lissandra's only AoE CC outside of her ult is W. Which is practically melee.

IcyPepperMar 13, 20166 votes

Can't they just put in some kind of mana refund passive on Lissandra similar to Annie and Kalista's Q and E, respectively?

Not enough to break her, and any compensation nerfs if necessary, to add a different passive

Neo CyrusMar 13, 20162 votes

That's false as it's taken directly out of her mana pool and regeneration. As it's not a real passive, if she didn't have that passive she'd have more mana and regen equaling out to roughly the same sustain.

Nanuk PihoqahiakMar 12, 20167 votes

I don't think it's interesting design to give a champion spammable spells / high mana costs and then give them a passive that allows them to alleviate it through conservative gameplay. She's definitely a character that would not only benefit from a new passive, but might actually benefit from a small rework due to how linear her kit is.

CHOPSTICKUHHMar 12, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Nanuk Pihoqahiak,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=v3eeAMLM,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2016-03-12T12:37:43.150+0000)

I don't think it's interesting design to give a champion spammable spells / high mana costs and then give them a passive that allows them to alleviate it through conservative. gameplay. She's definitely a character that would not only benefit from a new passive, but might actually benefit from a small rework due to how linear her kit is.

Ya other than her passive in not a fan of her Q

MohawkBirdMar 12, 20166 votes

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My Waifu VanillaMar 13, 20161 votes

The Diana Passive is intentional iirc. If Diana had that 20% bonus from passive and put into her base she would be a monster with Nashor's/Rageblade. The reason these items aren't so good on her now is because her base AS is bad so Riot gave her artifical "higher" AS to make the passive not feel useless.

Orianna's passive on the other hand makes no damn sense since she either out ranges her AA with abilities or doesn't want to deal with the "wind up" of her auto attack animation.

DJ Hatsune MikuMar 13, 20161 votes

There's nothing really wrong with a linear kit. She has a few simple spells and some mobility and means to sustain her mana which punishes spamming but rewards smarter play. She's a reliable utility mage that can be played as a squishy, diving assassin, a more traditional mid liner who helps peel and assist, or a bulky aura carrier who relies on her utility to see her team to victory. The simplicity is the best part of her kit.

CasterGilgameshMar 12, 20166 votes

it also literally doesn't thematically make sense on her...

SpecterVonBarenMar 12, 20164 votes

You know, there was actually a brief time where her passive was good when Riot changed how mana regen worked on items.

kaltenashesMar 12, 20164 votes

Zyra RIOT PRETTY PLEASE, LOVE ME, PLEASSSEEEE

Monkey D LuffyMar 12, 20163 votes

Not everyone is meant to be strong late... Some people have literally useless passives late game... Like Varus if he has 2.50 AS... there are more.

WestonbirtMar 13, 20161 votes

Zilean

ArakadiaMar 13, 20162 votes

TwistedFate

My Waifu VanillaMar 13, 20161 votes

Draven

BlitzidiousMar 13, 20161 votes

Singed

(Extremely lackluster and is primarily just a noob trap.)

My Waifu VanillaMar 13, 20161 votes

Heimerdinger best passive NA

BlitzidiousMar 13, 20161 votes

Full hp regen build. OP

morris1Mar 13, 20161 votes

Talon

Suicide MemeMar 12, 20162 votes

Lissandra's passive isn't that bad number-wise, it's just more hidden power. It gives about 23 per 5 second if you use your q when your passive is up, not including the cooldown reduction from her cc.

Unstoppable MonkMar 13, 20162 votes

Or they could just make it scale off of so you get like a free spell every 3 seconds or something late game.

KnalxzMar 13, 20162 votes

I don't exactly see how getting a free manaless spell is useless at any stage in the game.

SpongebobIsLifeMar 13, 20163 votes

bc as the game goes on, mana becomes more irrelevant.

KnalxzMar 13, 20164 votes

Yes but that doesn't stop it from being the blood of your abilities. Without mana most champions are no more then body shields. It might not seem like it's making an impact but when you can cast your ultimate free of costs despite fighting in a prolonged battle there isn't much else to be said.

If you count the amount of mana she uses to her abilities, to the cooldowns of them and her passive Lissandra basically gets a free mana pot with each usage of her passive. Early, Mid or Late game that's a good thing.

On top of that not every passive has to be useful at all stages of the game. Trading late game destruction for unrivaled early game power is a fair trade.

SpongebobIsLifeMar 13, 20161 votes

well the thing is, one of the main reasons why its such a weak passive is because it's there to help lissandra get through the laning phase because her mana costs are extremely high, but the thing that's weird is in order to charge your passive, you have to expend a lot of mana, basically her passive counteracts her kit, which is riot aggress that she needs a new one.

SnowFallMar 12, 20161 votes

Xerath too, I miss his bonus armor from passive

My Waifu VanillaMar 13, 20161 votes

Man idc about bonus armor from passive, give me that free pen from W lol.

GreenLoreMar 12, 20161 votes

Since she isn't listed as one of the 6 mages to get a rework,she likely won't get a new passive.

CHOPSTICKUHHMar 12, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Since she isn't listed as one of the 6 mages to get a rework,she likely won't get a new passive.

During the marksmen update there were only 6 listed and the other marksmen still got some kind of little tweak, extralegal got a little tweak with the marksmen patch I doubt they will only work on the 6 listed mages, they will definitely poke around the others

GreenLoreMar 12, 20161 votes

Yeah,but those little tweaks basically consisted of adjusting their cooldowns,damage,etc. None of the other marksman got any new abilities.

TeCoolMageMar 12, 20161 votes

Wasn't Ashe given a mini mini rework at around that time?

StillnameMar 13, 20161 votes

Her only change was to make her passive not count as a crit to adjust for the no longer existent mastery. She had received a mini-rework but that was before the season ended.

TeCoolMageMar 13, 20161 votes

V5.22:

Stats Base attack damage increased to 56.51 from 51.89. Attack damage growth reduced to 2.26 from 2.85. Base mana increased to 280 from 231.8. Mana growth reduced to 32 from 35.

Frost Shot Slow icon Slow reduced to 5 - 25% (based on level) from 5 - 35% (based on level). REMOVED: Critical strike icon On-crit effects against Frosted targets. NEW EFFECT - CRITICAL SLOW: Ashe now has a 1% chance per 1% of her critical strike chance to double Frost Shot's Slow icon slow to 10 - 50% (based on level) and trigger Critical strike icon On-crit effects. The slow decays to the standard amount over the duration.

Volley will always trigger the enhanced slow versus champions.

Ranger's Focus REMOVED: Cooldown. REMOVED: Cast Ranger's Focus at less than 5 Focus stacks. REMOVED: Volley and Enchanted Crystal Arrow.png Enchanted Crystal Arrow granting Focus stacks. Basic attacks only. REMOVED: 20% increase of Frost Shot's Slow icon Slow. Activation consumes all Focus stacks and Ashe will not generate stacks while the effect is active.

I'm not talking about her mini rework where she got free damage on slowed targets, I'm talking about the mini mini rework where her Q became purely based on attack speed (how long it takes to get 5 stacks) and not cooldown reduction.

I'm betting Lissandra can get a similar rework where all her basic abilities can be treated off cooldown and casted twice every 18 seconds, or something like that. Or maybe she can restore mana upon hitting the free ability, who knows.

GreenLoreMar 13, 20161 votes

No Ashes update came out several months before the marksman update.

TeCoolMageMar 13, 20161 votes

{quoted}

V5.22:

Stats Base attack damage increased to 56.51 from 51.89. Attack damage growth reduced to 2.26 from 2.85. Base mana increased to 280 from 231.8. Mana growth reduced to 32 from 35.

Frost Shot Slow icon Slow reduced to 5 - 25% (based on level) from 5 - 35% (based on level). REMOVED: Critical strike icon On-crit effects against Frosted targets. NEW EFFECT - CRITICAL SLOW: Ashe now has a 1% chance per 1% of her critical strike chance to double Frost Shot's Slow icon slow to 10 - 50% (based on level) and trigger Critical strike icon On-crit effects. The slow decays to the standard amount over the duration.

Volley will always trigger the enhanced slow versus champions.

Ranger's Focus REMOVED: Cooldown. REMOVED: Cast Ranger's Focus at less than 5 Focus stacks. REMOVED: Volley and Enchanted Crystal Arrow.png Enchanted Crystal Arrow granting Focus stacks. Basic attacks only. REMOVED: 20% increase of Frost Shot's Slow icon Slow. Activation consumes all Focus stacks and Ashe will not generate stacks while the effect is active.

I'm not talking about her mini rework where she got free damage on slowed targets, I'm talking about the mini mini rework where her Q became purely based on attack speed (how long it takes to get 5 stacks) and not cooldown reduction.

I'm betting Lissandra can get a similar rework where all her basic abilities can be treated off cooldown and casted twice every 18 seconds, or something like that. Or maybe she can restore mana upon hitting the free ability, who knows.

GreenLoreMar 13, 20161 votes

The thing is,that this isn't really a rework,its just some slight adjustments to her kit.

But yeah something of this scope would be possible,I thought you were talking about an entirely new passive with new effects and all.

My Waifu VanillaMar 13, 20164 votes

Twitch and Urgot got "big" changes for not being a part of the 6. Yeah, 1 ability change, but Twitch getting a reset and Urgot's ult being a lot better by switching resists to flat DR made both champions feel better.

C9 Scott Free Mar 12, 20161 votes

Just remember ita the same thing as Nunu passive except worse.

CatastropMar 13, 20161 votes

I don't care what Riot does with the passive, just keep the rest of her kit the same.

James WinterMar 13, 20161 votes

I love her passive...

NeameanMar 13, 20161 votes

since we talking about new passive I think Karma should get an additional passive because her current passive should be the passive to her ult.

PaladinNOMar 13, 20161 votes

I just find RoA to be pretty much essential on her. As Saianna says here: "Spammable Q for 85 mana...". Indeed so. It's either to have a large mana pool, or, well, melt.

I prefer building item 3027 , item 3157 , item 3165 , item 3001 , item 3151 and item 1311 (and item 3363 , item 2139 ) on Lissandra (not necessarily in that order ofc.).

Personally, I don't really care about her passive - it feels negligible, and, unless one predicts when it will go active and how much mana one have at any given point, and gauge the ability cooldowns and predict exactly which ability will be needed at exactly any given time (aka you have to above average interested in Lissandra and, I'd guess, a rather high rank to understand every game mechanic), it's rather useless.

FeathermaneMar 13, 20161 votes

And I hope this iteration of Soraka dies in a fire.

VexingRavenMar 13, 20161 votes

Well considering she's plenty strong right now I don't think she needs a better passive unless something else is nerfed, and do we really want Riot to break out the nerfbat?