Is Aatrox ever gonna get some love?

SIayton·Dec 2, 2014·11 votes·2,236 views

He's a really cool character but his kit has always been kind of in a weird spot for me. I'd love to see some of his stuff get reworked. It just feels like he needs too much itemization to really get going, and his passive, while cool in concept, isn't actually that good because he gets up with such low life / attack speed.

I'd love to see the threshhold on his W healing bonus raise with levels put into W. He'd probably be a much better jungler if he wasn't pretty much capped at half his max HP at all times.

Also, his ult just feels lack luster. I wish it did something else, although turning into a giant robot is kind of cool with his mech skin.

32 Comments

Toru ItaiDec 2, 201410 votes

i also feel like he needs something, but i don't think that W change is it. he was origionaly suposed to be a melee ADC right? what if, when he ulted, both sides of his W worked at the same time? this would give him teamfight survivability (Yii Q) and melee ADC level damage.

CaeziumDec 2, 20141 votes

It sounds like it'd definitely help him scale throughout the game, and isn't "boring".

Just he might need the base magic dmg on his ult lower because his W actually does a lot.

SS EnforcerDec 2, 20145 votes

He doesn't really need a kit rework, he needs a base stat boost i think in terms of Hp and/or defenses, beacuse in early, he is the most vulnerable champion to CC known.

SIaytonDec 2, 20141 votes

Yeah he is ridiculously squishy early on. Just more base health would help him a ton.

o9y9pcvBhdDec 3, 20141 votes

His base stats are soooo low for requiring health for abilities

YoellaDec 3, 20142 votes

he is the most vulnerable champion to CC known.

I love Aatrox, but sorry I have to be the devils advocate here, anyone with a resurrection after death, a ranged slow, and a leap is not the MOST vulnerable champion to CC. CC hurts Aatrox but it also hurts everybody else. I do think he should have some more health in put in his resurrection pool than he already does, and maybe a slight health boost too, but you can't try to tell me that he's the most vulnerable champion to CC early on. Not while he still has a free GA, leap, and a ranged slow.

SorisDynastyDec 2, 20142 votes

His passive nerfs back then (From 50% flat at full pool to scaling from 30% up to 55% at level 16) hurt him a lot, though justified. I personally feel like the scaling into endgame needs to be better. You barely have anything from the passive right now. At the point where you actually benefit from the higher AS, you're most likely not going to use it because it's going to be depleted. Either as tank or DD. If they'd do some tuning into his passive + some in comments mentioned base stats could get him back to a healthier state.

SIaytonDec 2, 20142 votes

QOL stuff I'd like to see:

Can't be knocked out of Q, maybe immune to CC for the duration? Its really annoying getting knocked out of it because of the long startup animation.

Bloodwell decays way slower.

Ult giving him defensive stats or tenacity or something would be nice considering you just wanna dive into their team and do it, or maybe it could steal health (and add it to his bloodwell as well) for each enemy hit, so he could ult after getting up from his passive and retain his usefulness.

If you have a full bloodwell, should revive with full health IMO. That or let it give him an attack speed buff that lasts for a little bit after he revives so he can retain his usefulness after he comes back to life. He's pretty garbo after he comes back to life right now. No health, no attack speed, nothing. Its so easy just to rekill him. Sions passive makes him look like a joke.

Not saying ALL of these should be applied, but just a few ideas.

NarasimhaDec 2, 20141 votes

Thats not QoL changes, those are straight up buffs. Very big difference.

More to the point, Aatrox is a... tricky champion, to say the least. He has to be purposefully undertuned, because his kit can make him neigh unkillable if given a chance.

CozarkianDec 2, 20141 votes

I think you are onto the right track, here are my thoughts.

Passive - Slow Decay (you hit the nail on the head) as compensation for his W nerf. With slower attack speed he builds blood well slower and heals himself slower (which means more time spent with W toggled off while blood well decays).

Q - cc immunity is too strong. If knocked out of the animation it should get a half cooldown and/or speed up the animation.

Ult - Those would be nice buffs, but I think it would be too strong. Also, tenacity combined with my W suggestion below would make him too much like Irelia with passive + E.

W - Let's remove the micromanaging. Make it a passive: Every third attack and does bonus damage or heals himself. If Aatrox has > 50% health, he does <bonus damage> and <loses health>. If Aatrox is below 50% health, he <heals>. Active: For the next <seconds>, this effect occurs on every attack instead of every 3rd attack. This adds strategy, Aatrox can decide between rapid heals or rapid damage while enemies can save cc for when Aatrox activates this ability.

Passive: It would be nice if during his revive animation, Aatrox could move at 50% MS (100% would make his tower dive + escape too strong).

SIaytonDec 4, 20141 votes

Hmm another idea for his ult. Maybe it could remove the threshold for the improved healing on W? Like for the duration he gets full heals from it no matter what his current health is.

Defensive stats when he ults kind of like Xin Zhao would be nice too since Aatrox's main goal is to just dive into the enemy team and start wailing. Hard to do though because he tends to be pretty squishy till late game, and even then you need a solid target to consistently auto to not die in an all out team fight.

Kowe The EwokDec 2, 20142 votes

I think Aatrox' main problem is that he doesn't have a clearly defined role. (Bruiser? Part time ADC? Tank?)

As long as he isn't pushed into a certain direction (=light rework) he will most likely feel underwhelming simply because the other szenario would be that he's simply too good at different roles.

A quick rework idea which'ld allow him to gain more power would be that his Q simply becomes a simple dash, gets a faster travelling time, receives a lower cooldown - but only knocks up if the enemies have been hit with E before.

SmokinSickStyleDec 2, 20142 votes

He needs his base stats buffed, his Q hp cost nerfed or removed (It doesn't make any sense at all to have hp costs lol.).

His ult should give full bloodwell when used or huge HP steal like his first ult (In PBE it used to deal max hp dmg AoE + flat HP 200-300-400+x per champion hit and the atk speed ofc).

The thing i don't understant is, lorewise i thought he'd buff his allies with his spells, maybe give his ultimate a passive that gives aura bonuses based on total kills\assists the team has? In the lore he's supposed to be a comeback champion yet his kit is just selfish, Old Sion ult had more "lore Aatrox feeling" than him.

Everytime i play him i can get fed early and unless my team is winning i barely get relevant as bruiser as i burn out too fast and deal no damage nor i have utility as you initiation tool is highly sensitive to CC.

PerishSoftlyDec 3, 20141 votes

His HP costs fill up his blood well which gives him more attackspeed which allows him to heal himself up faster You are rewarded for building tanky, as you fill up your blood well more with each skill that scales off of %current life. You gain incredible survivability with a good amount of lifesteal + SV. You do fantastic damage with high AS (W+R+BotRK/Devourer is quite enough AS) even if you don't have high AD. You have hybrid damage thanks to E and R.

o9y9pcvBhdDec 3, 20141 votes

You forgot that he is also one of the best scaling champions in this game ;)

SmokinSickStyleDec 3, 20141 votes

You what?

Best scaling champs?

Not even close, he's actually one of the weakest scaling, when compared to the raid boss monsters like Poppy, Trynda, Yi, Fagsuo, Irelia, Jax, Fiora and some other melee fighters.

He's only strong in the early levels because the enemy must kill you twice, much like anivia is a b!tch against assassins mid lane early game.

Best scaling champ LOL.

PraedoranDec 5, 20141 votes

When you account for his steroids and W's scaling, he -is- one of the best scaling champs for pure auto attack damage. His AS steroids also buff him for scaling with On-Hit items like BotRK / Wits End. However, in reality he is not a true scaling champion because unlike Yi, Fiora, Trynd, and a couple others you mentioned, he possesses no Invincibility moments. This means he can't build glass cannon like them and you'll never see a viable ADC build on him. He can work as a bruiser (1/2 Damage Items, then Tanky), but there are plenty of outclassing Bruisers like Irelia and Renekton in the top lane.

The only area he outclasses those dedicated bruisers is as a jungler, but he's very gold dependant at the same time. Overall I still love his kit, but the main drawback is he has more paths and versatility than others, but no mastery of any particular area.

SmokinSickStyleDec 3, 20141 votes

Yeah i forgot to put one thing, his blood well could be filled by doing damage with your AA, as the animation makes enemy bleed, they could make it that that blood that comes out of the enemy is stored into the blood well.

There wouldn't be any problem if there weren't champs like Irelia or Jax that scale MUCH better, are tankier, and have much more utility.

Defining Hybrid damage for just one spell and an ultimate isn't much of Hybrid in my opinion, by this logic over 50% of the champ pool is Hybrid.

A true Hybrid champion deals 2 kind of damages at the same time, like Kayle or Jax, they have constant AD and AP damage.

You aren't actually rewarded for building HP, 10% of current health when used at full hp is actually 10% of you Max one, which is HUGE, yeha you fill you BW faster? Wow, in a lategame fight that's hardly gonna save you, and besides once you revive you lose your only steroid, and since you are an AA reliant champion being forced to use BW actually weakens you more than you could imagine.

That passive is useful only from early-mid game where there are idiots that towerdive or when enemies don't have yet enough damage to kill you twice in skirmishes of 3-4 champs.

Pandemic PunchDec 2, 20141 votes

Maybe when Fredy retires.

AlphariteDec 2, 20141 votes

Aatrox's ult, thematically, makes sense IMO. While I believe he should get some buffs (he is so damn fun to play), it's unlikely as there are other champs who need it more.

EffectFXDec 3, 20141 votes

The only thing I want is for Aatrox's out of combat blood well decay to start after 8-10 seconds rather than 5 seconds.

I'm absolutely fine with the rest of his kit.

KingsgraveDec 3, 20141 votes

Honestly I think his passive needs to give AD instead of AS and his R would then give more AS to compensate. Right now he needs a lot of items to be even remotely decent because he gets a butt load of AS with nothing to use it with.

PerishSoftlyDec 3, 20141 votes

W maxed does 200 more PD every three attacks.

BotRK synergizes amazingly with his W kit.

KingsgraveDec 3, 20141 votes

W maxed does 200 more PD every three attacks.

BotRK synergizes amazingly with his W kit.

but then you have shit damage other than the 3rd hit and no real ability to land more than one 3rd hit

QuephaDec 3, 20141 votes

"we hate having high sustain champions in top lane like zac" "oh man guys check out aatrox he has health costs but he has a massive sustain on-hit to keep his health up and he has a revive passive!" "oh wait now he's just irelia with more cc, we better nerf him and forget this ever happened"

AzaerDec 3, 20141 votes

I just started playing him in some team builder. He kicks ass man, no complaints.

KevGatzDec 3, 20141 votes

Has anyone else tried him in the new jungle with the Devourer enchant? It seems like a good combination since it gives him a large amount of atkspd and dmg on hit.

SIaytonDec 4, 20141 votes

That's where I've been playing him. He's pretty good there, best he's ever been in the jungle, but it still feels like he ramps up a little too slow and he's a bit too squishy coming out of the jungle for ganks. He's great late game but so are the other melee carries. Best thing he has going for him is that his early ganks are actually pretty good if he doesn't die going for them, much better than the other melee carries.

JadeKnightblazerDec 3, 20141 votes

http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/2fEE54ZU-harrow-classick-ripviv-ohmikegoodness-state-of-aatrox-s5

Its been more then year+ since an Aatrox pass.

MinrogDec 3, 20141 votes

Against likely opponents he's too easy to shut down. You can't win trades and if you aren't able to auto you can't afford to pay for any of your abilities. Poppy has an easier laning phase than Aatrox and she's wayyyyy better lategame, too.

He can do all right if you get him 6,000 gold for a BotRK / second item. Just not like if that money was on a Jax instead. You can't go support role like Leona/Braum do to avoid the awful laning phase because all your abilities drain health and you don't get much auto-attacking there and you also need the money to be able to do anything.

Dunno how I would fix it, but they made him like a Mundo with no health regen. :/

Meep ManDec 3, 20141 votes

Aatrox is dangerous to work with. Buff him too much, he becomes a brick wall that throws the sledgehammer back at you. Buff him too little and he is left looking very lack luster. Next PBE patch or update, I hope they look into Aatrox.