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Petition: About the current planned Evelynn Buffs

Xurreal··1 votes·610 views

TL:DR (COPIED FROM BELOW) Evelynn's value as an AP jungler is in a healthy spot right now. Her current form allows her the freedom to decide to forfeit a little bit of magic damage for the incorporation of physical damage in healthy trades of statistical power. Removing AP ratio from Whiplash entirely or giving it any scaling with AD will decrease her value as an AP jungler and remove the freedom to choose to go AD instead for the purposes that AD hybrid Evelynn serves.

You will also be creating more work for not only yourselves (balance team) but create more external frustration on her player-base (both new and experienced), slight frustration for some, heavy for others.

I just don't recommend it because it causes what should be a factor of choice to a factor of necessity and all the perks and caveats necessity brings with it. This is not a healthy impact for her value as an AP jungler

Hi. I pulled this reply from another thread. It's below.

[{quoted}](name=Malicious Metal,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A4XllQAw,comment-id=,timestamp=2017-10-27T07:42:22.996+0000)

https://www2.pic-upload.de/img/34177631/Bildschirmfoto2017-10-27um09.38.40.png

She'll have an easier time slipping back into stealth and reposition with that Passive and R change and the CD refund really rewards good plays.

What's really interesting though is Whiplash's change to a total AD ratio. Meaning that item 3146 is actually a really viable strategy once again.

What I want to talk about today is the current Evelynn vs Evelynn with these planned changes. I don't think that it is a great idea to convert Whiplash back to 0 - Any% AD. Here is my reasoning.

Currently, the generally accepted as optimal runepage contains M.Pen Marks. The choice is there to go with AD runes depending on the combination of the match-up/intended build. The above quote is a prelude to what I believe will become the catalyst for what the old Evelynn's meta runepage was.

I will not lie. It was great to enjoy playing Hybridized Evelynn, being able to go back and forth from many various different builds, but to be 100% candid with you, that was often a choice I didn't make. Evelynn's usefulness as an AP jungler in a jungle that is dominated by AD champions is irrefutable. The fact that current Evelynn has only AP scaling is what puts her into that niche as a compliment to AD mids: Provided she can scale along side the game well, she will be able to support all of the lanes efficiently unless there is an AP heavy allied-lane. I feel this is a healthy relationship at current and should be preserved. It does impact one's decision to roll with an AD or Tanky Bruiser build, but less so with AP builds

As another point of discussion, AD runes are a great choice when deciding to go the Hextech Gunblade routeitem 3146

The choice is there and very beneficial to Hybrid style Evelynn as she is at current, since she is not balanced around it and having that extra 9 AD while building the recipe comes in handy for THAT BUILD PATH. It is suitable to the runepage.

Going through with this change will mess everything up. You know that someone will mix M.pen and Ar.Pen builds combined with lethality, and you are going to have to lean towards balancing around the insane burst and sustained damage that build will put out and/or modify more items to not be abused by fringe cases as it was with Evelynn in the past.

I'm recalling item 3116 item 3152 (R.I.P. Sword of the Occult [no image available] ect.

I am petitioning Riot Balance to consider the long term effects of decisions that were unavoidable in the past (in particular, the year 2011 a.k.a. Disabled Evelynn). Evelynn's damage on her only form of effect hard/soft cc will have to be adjusted to account for giving Whiplash ?% AD ratios, and I have a feeling that is going to keep folks interested in Evelynn not quite able to grasp her like they would other champs who haven't been overhauled several times in the past. (If you want to be a Janna main, she is rarely altered severely and you can hold to her learning curve at the average pace, but mastering Evelynn has been a long long roller-coaster. I can sympathize with Azir Azir and I'm a Kassadin fan myself.)

My bottom line is this...

Evelynn's value as an AP jungler is in a healthy spot right now. Her current form allows her the freedom to decide to forfeit a little bit of magic damage for the incorporation of physical damage in healthy trades of statistical power. Removing AP ratio from Whiplash entirely or giving it any scaling with AD will decrease her value as an AP jungler and remove the freedom to choose to go AD instead for the purposes that AD hybrid Evelynn serves.

You will also be creating more work for not only yourselves (balance team) but create more external frustration on her player-base (both new and experienced), slight frustration for some, heavy for others.

I just don't recommend it because it causes what should be a factor of choice to a factor of necessity and all the perks and caveats necessity brings with it. This is not a healthy impact for her value as an AP jungler

EDIT: I also want to point out that Evelynn's clear speeds will be effected as well. Especially while Hatespike is at level 1. I understand Hatespike is not being adjusted, but in the old days, the numbers read out in a way that her damage output was less than it is now with both AD marks and AP Q's and Glyphs.

With the most used Runes and Masteries the attempted Level 1 Ranked 1 damage dealt was around 55 per Hatespike coming to 220 attempted magic damage per cast.

With the most used Runes and Masteries, the current Evelynn's Hatespike's attempted Level 1 Ranked 1 damage dealt is around comes out to around

1st 34 2nd 51 = 17 +34 3rd 51 = 17 +34 4th 51 = 17 +34

coming to around 187 attempted magic damage dealt per cast (against the same target and not to all). This magic damage, however, is generally boosted due to the accepted M.Pen marks and their usefulness as an early game dps aid.

Adjusting for that M.Pen differential, her status at the end of a few clears will be apparent when her passive activates (will she need to regen? if so, how long? how is her mana? how does this alter her progression through the power curve? How does this affect her peak on the power curve? the fall off chart? ect.)

RE-EDIT: HOWEVER I WILL SAY

If your goal is to keep the new Evelynn feeling much more like the old Evelynn, this is a step in the right direction, and will be happy to utilize her Hybridized capabilities to their maximum.

[slayer-jinx-catface]

Thanks.

From someone who wants to climb with Evelynn and see her gain popularity among the player-base.

12 Comments

Iręlía2 votes

Lol

Yah, Ranger, One of the people who worked on the current eve has a 0% winrate on the champ. Stashu's isnt good either if I recal correctly.

The champ live is in a pitiful state. I read all taht and still dont get your point about AD scaling on the e? Its there to try other items, but Her base AD is a buff to her flat damage. You cant go lower. Its essentially her new "flat damage on e" but instead can scale with other items. Shes all around more flexible and still does just about 100% ap damage. Shes still not hybrid. No where near like old eve. She finally is starting to have a 50% winrate I think on the pbe, Having a reason to build GB gives her some sustain for diving the carry and living if she doesnt have R.

There is no argument against an AD ratio on Eve's E.

Paroe1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Q The Keg,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=u2qkeKBo,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2017-10-27T22:45:13.449+0000)

Lol

Yah, Ranger, One of the people who worked on the current eve has a 0% winrate on the champ. Stashu's isnt good either if I recal correctly.

The champ live is in a pitiful state. I read all taht and still dont get your point about AD scaling on the e? Its there to try other items, but Her base AD is a buff to her flat damage. You cant go lower. Its essentially her new "flat damage on e" but instead can scale with other items. Shes all around more flexible and still does just about 100% ap damage. Shes still not hybrid. No where near like old eve. She finally is starting to have a 50% winrate I think on the pbe, Having a reason to build GB gives her some sustain for diving the carry and living if she doesnt have R.

There is no argument against an AD ratio on Eve's E.

Except for the fact that eve relying on gun blade means that when it gets nerfed eve is going to be worse again.

Honestly the ACTUAL problem is people are flat refusing to learn the new eve, and are trying to play her the same way they did pre-relaunch. Yes she has problems... But those problems are mostly her E not being a proper engage and her stealth detection being really small.

Iręlía2 votes

Da faq do you mean? Ive been playing her non stop on live since release and also on PBE. PBE is leagues better. And no, just cause a core items gets nerfed doesnt mean you toss it. Rylais got nerfed way back and Aurelion SOl barely batted an eye at it honestly.

I trust Riot's judgement more than yours. they dont always get it right the first time and thats ok, but they usually correct what they think is wrong, and they usually pull through. Same with these eve changes.

Your argument is one that has been made many times by other people and there are enough examples to see why its flawed logic.

Xurreal1 votes

Coolies. It says a lot about their intentions if they are really able to maintain a similar feel with her so well.

Xurreal1 votes

[Bump due to edits]

Xurreal1 votes

Wait a second... what?

Lol, I use Ravage/Whiplash as a finisher (especially if the ult is down).

It feels like she just popped Dark Frenzy.

[cass-cry]

Gotta go fast.

KindredAndWolf1 votes

Im sorry but i personally wish they would add AD to her entire kit and make her a hybrid again. She should do MIXED damage on all of her abilities instead of just ad or ap. Besides, her current kit scaling is decreasing her value as an AD jungler and that totally needs to be fixed. She should be an ad or ap jungler, she should be dealing mixed damage. More magic damage if you build ap, more AD if you build ad. I NEVER played old eve full ap and I'll never play New Eve full ap either. Im waiting on those sweet sweeeeeeet ad ratios. Im ready for this champ to not be such a pansy and give her the ability to go the fuck in when she feels like it.

KindredAndWolf1 votes

{quoted}

Im sorry but i personally wish they would add AD to her entire kit and make her a hybrid again. She should do MIXED damage on all of her abilities instead of just ad or ap. Besides, her current kit scaling is decreasing her value as an AD jungler and that totally needs to be fixed. She should be an ad or ap jungler, she should be dealing mixed damage. More magic damage if you build ap, more AD if you build ad. I NEVER played old eve full ap and I'll never play New Eve full ap either. Im waiting on those sweet sweeeeeeet ad ratios. Im ready for this champ to not be such a pansy and give her the ability to go the fuck in when she feels like it.

Edit: since you guys LOVE down votes why don't you bring your opinion about ad ratios and ap eve degradation to the r/Evemains boards. You'd get PLENTY of love there. Btw, it doesn't seem that anyone on the boards shares your sentiment either. Nobody but you guys want Eve to be a shaco 2.0 peace and good luck with your endeavors. You're opinion is valuable to someone i'm sure, but to me, you're the enemy to the cause. Since im sure you guys loved Eve before the rework ive refrained from cursing you guys out and showing you how (nice way to say this...) much you guys are being "silly geese". Peace

Xurreal1 votes

Lol I am asking to consider the long-term effects. I'm not saying they should never do it. In the past the execution has caused backlash. That's all.

BattleToilet1 votes

Riot butchered evelynn. Only noob Evelynn players defend this atrocity.

Xurreal1 votes

It is very clear that people hate Evelynn and her fan base and always have.

Xurreal1 votes

Please lock thread.

Reasoning: Only inflammatory remarks are being praised and actual content is being denied consideration.

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