After studying countless champions, There are THREE concepts that can never be balanced.

Defended··4 votes·1,419 views
  1. Opposite scaling.

What is opposite scaling? It's when you build an item that gives you the opposite effect,

Such as Ryze Builds frozen heart, Hits harder. Buys a tear ( an item that makes you stronger once completeled ) But scales when he buys it.

Scaling off ''mana''. What is ryzes bann rate in the LCS summer split atm? Around 85%. Whats his win rate? Pretty high :].

Yes his kit is completely weird and lacks counterplay but it wouldnt be such an issue if he didnt do such high damage with magic pen also involved. Basically he builds defensive items and gains power.

Vladimir Builds Spirit visage, Hits harder.

Volibear ''I built tank but can kill your adc faster than an assassin can''. These boards are FILLED with volibear complaint threads. Hes sitting at what a nice 54% win rate and its been about 2 months i think like that.

Now this falls into the other problem too. ''I build tank but do more damage then you'' This is usually a kit thing such as kindred and graves.

Point being is building certain defensive items gives you an additional opposite effect of power. Which is extremely unhealthy.

  1. Invisibility

How many threads/nerfs/banns have been made to Rengar Shaco Evelynn Twitch

Here is a thread where Meddler posts about rengar http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/rnTcz9fg-riot-is-rengar-really-getting-reworked-at-end-of-season?comment=00010000000000010001

Invisibility in League will NEVER be balanced. its not a ''buy a pink and ur good'' Yes this is true in certain situations

but the whole problem isnt buying a pink, its ''The whole other team has to completely change the way they play the game (all 5) for 1 person on the other team''.

Invisbility lacks counterplay in itself, I dont mind some of these champs but im basing my results on complains from a lot of reviews.

Remember Evelynn? What happened to her? :]

Remember shaco? Still banned in high elo streams.

Rengar? Being talked about by Meddler saying he needs a nerf

Twitch? Also talked about. His Ult has the ability to piece any squishy faster then zed can.

Not saying Twitch is broken but the aspect of invisibility is just not fair in itself.

  1. Small Risk High Reward

This section is basically champions that have little risk but for some reason gain a fuck ton of rewards for it.

Ekko. ''Let me completely fuck up in which id die if i was almost any other champion in the game but i can just press R while continually hitting your adc for bruiser type damage''

Kindred ''Oh my team is dying? Let me press R and force the enemy team to either get inside for the heal or back off''

Trundle ''I built a tiamat but can tank anything now because i pressed R''

Ezreal ''Got caught out? Its ok i got another flash''

Swain ''lol bruv try to kill me''

Blitzcrank ''Doesnt matter how bad i am. I pressed Q one time and we got baron + 3 towers + inhibs ''

Annie ''i have a skill that is an AOE, Does 40-50% of your health upon impact, then continually hits you with 250% movement speed for about 10% an auto with a burn effect... All because i pressed one Button''

Garen Garen is just the definition of a ''braindead champ''. Lacks any counterplay, Has a Juggernaut Follow up thread saying by 2 Rioters that Garen himself Lacks almost any form of counterplay.

''I silenced you and pressed R'' Boom you're dead.

Now this is NOT to diss anyones champion. Im not saying kindred is EASY to play. Im not saying she requires no skill. Im saying that these champions have something in their kit that makes their reward for using it too high.

Such as Annie. Lets talk about the skill difference.

Annie bot mains Annie. He presses R and kills 3 people.

Faker who has played Cass has to be mechanically skilled beyond measure to accomplish the same thing.

Ekko. Ekko makes a shit ton of positioning mistakes that anyone would die if they were in that situation even said tanks, but presses R and its fine.

Ezreal broken? No but why is an ADC actually killing Assassins. Ive watched plenty of high elo (d1+) streams where zed / kassadin DIE trying to kill an ezreal. And these are mid mains im watching.

Ive watched Berg completely melt from the IBG build, as zed.

These are just my opinions, I read the boards all the time and read peoples complaints. And i think i can say that the 3 aspects of unbalancing in any game comes down to these 3..

Of course there are champions that just do too much fucking damage like Zac for example mixed with CCs out the ass. But that can fall into opposite scaling.

42 Comments

Mecha MaIphite4 votes

Annie bot mains Annie. He presses R and kills 3 people.

Faker who has played Cass has to be mechanically skilled beyond measure to accomplish the same thing.

Annie mains peak at around 56% winrate, while Cass mains peak at around 59%.

Defended2 votes

{quoted}

Annie mains peak at around 56% winrate, while Cass mains peak at around 59%.

Exactly. And how much more SKILLED do you have to be to be a good Cass player from a good annie player :] Thanks for proving my point.

Mecha MaIphite3 votes

What do you mean?

The whole point of that statistic is saying that Cassiopeia, while harder to play, is more rewarding to master than Annie. The downside of a lot of simple champions is that they're predictable. Champions with more mechanics, such as Cass, usually don't suffer from this drawback.

SwiftKitten882 votes

i actually agree with some of the points your making, Ryze is crazy strong in LCs but outside that he has the lowest winrate of any champ in the game

Vladimir was always weird... with the removal of spellvamp and his rework i still thing he is going through his post-rework balancing phase

invisibility is an issue yes, but only because of the "no pink trinkets" and the "1 pink per player" rule

rengar 1 shotting people is a different issue, and really isn't related to his stealth as much as people think

volibear.. yeah.. its a bad design i really cant argue with that

ekko i actaully feel is decently balanced, he went through a stage were he was pretty op and broken but he is much better now

blitz is balanced...

im sorry if you cant dodge his q

blitz pull, thresh hook, lee's q, nid spear, ahri charm.

they are all stright line skillshots that stop at the first target hit regardless of minion or champ

they are the hardest skills in the game to land and therefore landing one will usually get you or your teammate a kill.

this is balanced, there is TONS of counterplay.. stand behind minions, dodge it, bait it out

ez and trist i think are fine other than the fact that the skills cant be stopped one they are cast even if you cc them for example.. if ez is casting arcane shift and blits lands a pull on him before he shifts out, even though the pull hit him he will get out.

same for the channel of trist rocket jump if you try to cc her while she is jumping it wont work. granted you can cc her while she in in the air after she has left the ground

garen really is too strong against certain champs because of his silence and his movespeed buff and preventing people from escaping OR fighting because they cant use any abilities to fight OR dash away. but that can eaisly be fixed by changing his silence in some way, if riot ever wanted to actaully fix it

swain is just a mess right now..

annie's new tibber's runs WAY too fast but other than that its fine

trundle is fine,

kindrid migth have some issues after the new item 1419 but her ulti isn't one of them

other champs that i think are MUCH bigger issues are Zed and to a lesser degree Yasuo

it donest matter how much they nerf zed, as long as has the ability to bully EVERY lane opponent out of lane, farm for free and force the oppoent to build defensively and forfeit the mana regen items they need to build in order to stay in lane and trade him.. he will NEVER be balanced. plus the free escape to boot makes him near impossible to gank

idk why riot keeps nerfing zed's damage.. his DAMAGE isnt his issue. its the ability to completly dominate the lane, force you to either back or die and at the same time being next to impossible to gank, and never really having to go back himself.

yasuo has a similar issue, again because the lack of needing mana and never having to back unless its for damage reasons. he isn't as dominant in lane and wont always be ahead like zed will.

but unlike zed dominating lane and then falling off later.

yasuo donest NEED to dominate lane.. as soon as he gets a certain about of gold he pretty much becomes almost unbeatable

but the same issue with the lack of a mana requirement exists

ever since the removal of mana posts manaless champsion have really just been too dominant. it isnt as noticeable on the more balanced manaless champs.

but lack of the ability to regain mana effectively without basing really just tips the scale too far to these champs

Defended2 votes

{quoted}

i actually agree with some of the points your making, Ryze is crazy strong in LCs but outside that he has the lowest winrate of any champ in the game

Vladimir was always weird... with the removal of spellvamp and his rework i still thing he is going through his post-rework balancing phase

invisibility is an issue yes, but only because of the "no pink trinkets" and the "1 pink per player" rule

rengar 1 shotting people is a different issue, and really isn't related to his stealth as much as people think

volibear.. yeah.. its a bad design i really cant argue with that

ekko i actaully feel is decently balanced, he went through a stage were he was pretty op and broken but he is much better now

blitz is balanced...

im sorry if you cant dodge his q

blitz pull, thresh hook, lee's q, nid spear, ahri charm.

they are all stright line skillshots that stop at the first target hit regardless of minion or champ

they are the hardest skills in the game to land and therefore landing one will usually get you or your teammate a kill.

this is balanced, there is TONS of counterplay.. stand behind minions, dodge it, bait it out

ez and trist i think are fine other than the fact that the skills cant be stopped one they are cast even if you cc them for example.. if ez is casting arcane shift and blits lands a pull on him before he shifts out, even though the pull hit him he will get out.

same for the channel of trist rocket jump if you try to cc her while she is jumping it wont work. granted you can cc her while she in in the air after she has left the ground

garen really is too strong against certain champs because of his silence and his movespeed buff and preventing people from escaping OR fighting because they cant use any abilities to fight OR dash away. but that can eaisly be fixed by changing his silence in some way, if riot ever wanted to actaully fix it

swain is just a mess right now..

annie's new tibber's runs WAY too fast but other than that its fine

trundle is fine,

kindrid migth have some issues after the new item 1419 but her ulti isn't one of them

other champs that i think are MUCH bigger issues are Zed and to a lesser degree Yasuo

it donest matter how much they nerf zed, as long as has the ability to bully EVERY lane opponent out of lane, farm for free and force the oppoent to build defensively and forfeit the mana regen items they need to build in order to stay in lane and trade him.. he will NEVER be balanced. plus the free escape to boot makes him near impossible to gank

idk why riot keeps nerfing zed's damage.. his DAMAGE isnt his issue. its the ability to completly dominate the lane, force you to either back or die and at the same time being next to impossible to gank, and never really having to go back himself.

yasuo has a similar issue, again because the lack of needing mana and never having to back unless its for damage reasons. he isn't as dominant in lane and wont always be ahead like zed will.

but unlike zed dominating lane and then falling off later.

yasuo donest NEED to dominate lane.. as soon as he gets a certain about of gold he pretty much becomes almost unbeatable

but the same issue with the lack of a mana requirement exists

ever since the removal of mana posts manaless champsion have really just been too dominant. it isnt as noticeable on the more balanced manaless champs.

but lack of the ability to regain mana effectively without basing really just tips the scale too far to these champs

Thank you for agreeing on some points.

For the blitz thing, it wasent a ''can you dodge his Q issue'' it was more of how rewarding it is for the little risk he gives to use it.

Literally no risk high reward on blitzs Q. That was kinda what i ment, Just the reward for landing such a easy skill is so high.

Yeah i see what you're saying on ezreal and trist. I do too think its unfair ezreal can do that.

SwiftKitten881 votes

{quoted}

Thank you for agreeing on some points.

For the blitz thing, it wasent a ''can you dodge his Q issue'' it was more of how rewarding it is for the little risk he gives to use it.

Literally no risk high reward on blitzs Q. That was kinda what i ment, Just the reward for landing such a easy skill is so high.

Yeah i see what you're saying on ezreal and trist. I do too think its unfair ezreal can do that.

there is certainly risk in blitz's pull.. granted all the risk pretty much goes out the window late game when he has tons of mana and 45% cdr

but early game blitz pull is EXTREMELY mana intensive and has a pretty long cooldown.

im not going to deny that late game when blitz has tons of mana and 45% cdr and a maxed Q it has a pretty low cooldown and becuase he can chase really well he can certainly be an issue if you try to teamfight in an area without minion support.

at that point blitz really does lose a lot of his risk, and if he does land that pull on someone its proably going to be a 5v4 fight if u dont run. but even so.. blitz really doesn't add much to a teamfight after it starts, he can really only ulti once per fight (although with the new ulti change on pbe he may be able to get a second one off post 16) his knockup is good and on a pretty short cooldown. but when compared to other support like morgana, thresh, nami, janna, and even off meta support likeLux andKarma. blitz really isn't as useful as the others after the fight begins.

and if THEY start the fight as a 5v5 and not you catching them out and getting a easy pick then a 5v4, blitz really cant do much other than use hisitem 3800 or item 3069 to get the team out

AramsAreBest1 votes

So galio will never be balanced?

Defended1 votes

{quoted}

So galio will never be balanced?

Im sorry for you to read the whole thing in a minute and leave a 6 word reply, Means you're trolling.

Get the fuck out the thread if you have nothing constructive to say.

Shynkle3 votes

He was making a legitimate counterclaim to your "opposite scalings". I fail to see how him pointing something out constitutes trolling just because it was a short response.

Defended1 votes

{quoted}

He was making a legitimate counterclaim to your "opposite scalings". I fail to see how him pointing something out constitutes trolling just because it was a short response.

You cannot Counterclaim by saying ''they used to be'' when the fact is that ''they still are''

Counterclaimed my ass. You mean stated false information

Shynkle2 votes

Pardon? Who said "they used to be"? He literally asked a legitimate question against a point you made. Do you have trouble answering questions without getting aggressive or what?

Defended1 votes

{quoted}

Pardon? Who said "they used to be"? He literally asked a legitimate question against a point you made. Do you have trouble answering questions without getting aggressive or what?

Did you have a reply regarding the topic? If not id appreciate you not replying.

Shynkle4 votes

So not only did you completely talk about something wrong, you completely disregard my totally viable point against you. You sir, are the troll here.

Defended1 votes

{quoted}

So not only did you completely talk about something wrong, you completely disregard my totally viable point against you. You sir, are the troll here.

Then dont reply and leave.. Lol

Shynkle3 votes

Now why would I do that when I can continue to tell you how wrong you are?

Defended1 votes

{quoted}

Now why would I do that when I can continue to tell you how wrong you are?

I once was told that ''If you argue with an idiot, you immediately lose''

Since im a troll then.. guess i win the argument

AramsAreBest3 votes

It was a genuine question to your claim. I see you're acting like a child though.

Defended1 votes

{quoted}

It was a genuine question to your claim. I see you're acting like a child though.

If someone writes that much and another person gives a extremely short sentence, No it usually means not to reply especially if you replied after all that in 1 minute.

But here

Yeah, it is unfair. If we both have a dollar and go to the same store. You get 2 pieces of candy and i Got 4 pieces of candy.

How is that fair?

You built abyssal scepter and got 60 MR 60 AP 10% cdr

I built abyssal scepter and got 60 MR 90 AP 10% cdr

No. Its not something ''easy'' to balance. That was my whole point. Even Galio hit a 60% win rate twice in this month.

It shows for itself. How many champions with opposite scaling have a balanced win rate? None.

Madra1 votes

{quoted}

So galio will never be balanced?

While Galio gains additional damage for building MR, it's only a percentage of a percentage. It's not like his kit comes with % health damage scaling, attack speed steroids, or an execute mechanic for low health targets. Galio's two damaging abilities are both skill shots and his ult is interrupted by CC and at champ select by Udyr and Blitzcrank.

DrDiaga1 votes

I trust you.

Leblancs Boob1 votes

I agree with the stealth part. Stealth in itself is not necessarily a bad mechanic but it only really makes thematic sense to put stealth on assassins who already have insane burst potential. That high burst out of stealth generally leads to very little counterplay and hardly any window of opportunity to react. Champions like Eve and Rengar most specifically have been historically impossible to balance because of this.

PhantomGG1 votes

{quoted}

I agree with the stealth part. Stealth in itself is not necessarily a bad mechanic but it only really makes thematic sense to put stealth on assassins who already have insane burst potential. That high burst out of stealth generally leads to very little counterplay and hardly any window of opportunity to react. Champions like Eve and Rengar most specifically have been historically impossible to balance because of this.

Do note though almost every champion who has a stealth also has no dash

Rengar: has a jump that is reliant on bushes and his ultimate, but can only be used as engage

Eveleyn: she can go fast, but with the ammount of stuns and slows in this game, that only gets you so far

Twitch: Takes a while to channel, and unlike Shaco, he does not dash or blink, so if you throw down a pink he will still be within a arms reach to kill

Talon: Is given away by the fact you can hear the sound effect and see the start point of his blades

Akali: you know where she is, unless she does a clevor, stealth into bush/flash play

The only person with a truley effective stealth ability in my opinion would be Shaco

Defended1 votes

{quoted}

Do note though almost every champion who has a stealth also has no dash

Rengar: has a jump that is reliant on bushes and his ultimate, but can only be used as engage

Eveleyn: she can go fast, but with the ammount of stuns and slows in this game, that only gets you so far

Twitch: Takes a while to channel, and unlike Shaco, he does not dash or blink, so if you throw down a pink he will still be within a arms reach to kill

Talon: Is given away by the fact you can hear the sound effect and see the start point of his blades

Akali: you know where she is, unless she does a clevor, stealth into bush/flash play

The only person with a truley effective stealth ability in my opinion would be Shaco

The post isnt about champions that have a ''dash''. That section has nothing relevent to champions with ''dashes''. The point of that section is to say there hasent been one champ with an invisiblity mechanic that has not caused excessive controversy on the boards. Every champ has their ''op'' moments but Rengar twitch shaco evelynn have had their ''breaking the game'' moments and still do.

PhantomGG1 votes

{quoted}

The post isnt about champions that have a ''dash''. That section has nothing relevent to champions with ''dashes''. The point of that section is to say there hasent been one champ with an invisiblity mechanic that has not caused excessive controversy on the boards. Every champ has their ''op'' moments but Rengar twitch shaco evelynn have had their ''breaking the game'' moments and still do.

the point of my post though is that all the champions who have stealth except one have the major weakness of being "all or nothing"

Frankly I hate posts like these for you can make a argument for every champion in the game A-Z in why they are all stupidly OP

Defended1 votes

{quoted}

the point of my post though is that all the champions who have stealth except one have the major weakness of being "all or nothing"

Frankly I hate posts like these for you can make a argument for every champion in the game A-Z in why they are all stupidly OP

Not having a dash doesnt mean much.

Evelynn Has a skill in which Evelynn breaks free from slows affecting her and gains a massive Movement Speed boost for a short duration.

Rengar If rengar ults and hops on you. You can flash + *insert any dash skill here * and he will still catch up to you. If hes good enough to catch someone because his insane movement speed burst then hes good enough to run away with it too.

Yes i agree with you. We can make a list A-Z for every champ as to why they are stupidly OP

But that is why i posted this. To show some of the most controversial champions all have one thing in common.

Caítlyn1 votes

Downvoted for the part about Ezreal

So ONE ADC out of what, 20? can kill an assassin? Thats unfair? Also you talk about Cass taking lots of skill but dont mention that for Ez. It requires a ton of skill and ZERO mistakes to 1v1 a Zed.

Defended1 votes

{quoted}

Downvoted for the part about Ezreal

So ONE ADC out of what, 20? can kill an assassin? Thats unfair? Also you talk about Cass taking lots of skill but dont mention that for Ez. It requires a ton of skill and ZERO mistakes to 1v1 a Zed.

''Downvoted because i disagree with one thing said out of like 70 sentences''

ok.

Yaśuo Main1 votes

Shaco has the same "4 kills is gg" thing, like Zed.

It's not his stealth. (unrelated reply)

Jalkan1 votes

After studying countless champions

Yeah, I'm sure.

CerealBoxOfDoom1 votes

most of this has been balanced at some point. I think you oversimplify everything

Defended1 votes

{quoted}

most of this has been balanced at some point. I think you oversimplify everything

Last i checked Ryze Vlad swain volibear all are still priority bans.

Last i checked Rengar and shaco are looking at nerfs in the near future according to Meddler

Last i checked the champions on the 3rd section are having threads about them on the daily and achieved a high win percentage

So no. I dont think you can say ''most of this has been balanced at some point'' When they are still issues ongoing right now.

CerealBoxOfDoom1 votes

{quoted}

Last i checked Ryze Vlad swain volibear all are still priority bans.

Last i checked Rengar and shaco are looking at nerfs in the near future according to Meddler

Last i checked the champions on the 3rd section are having threads about them on the daily and achieved a high win percentage

So no. I dont think you can say ''most of this has been balanced at some point'' When they are still issues ongoing right now.

Last I checked they weren't priority bans prior to this season

Last I checked you claimed to have been studying champs and based your info on far more than what exists this season

Last I checked having a lot of threads about a champ didn't mean anything except that they were frustrating for any reason, ESPECIALLY on this forum or its equivalents.

So yes, I will say its been balanced at some point when they have issues now. If you don't want me to then don't cite the entirety of a champion or mechanics history as though its relevant to your "research"

Defended1 votes

{quoted}

Last I checked they weren't priority bans prior to this season

Last I checked you claimed to have been studying champs and based your info on far more than what exists this season

Last I checked having a lot of threads about a champ didn't mean anything except that they were frustrating for any reason, ESPECIALLY on this forum or its equivalents.

So yes, I will say its been balanced at some point when they have issues now. If you don't want me to then don't cite the entirety of a champion or mechanics history as though its relevant to your "research"

''Prior to this season''

Prior to this season vlad wasent building a spirit visage same with swain. Thats why they are banned now. Volibear and ryze have ALWAYS had this problem of opposite scaling thats why they've ALWAYS been constant bans. Ryze more than voli.

So your statement is completely false.

''Last i checked you claimed to have been studying champs and based your info on far more than what exists this season''

Im not sure what you even mean. Stick to the subject, You're just trying to argue.

''Last i checked having a lot of threads aout a champ didnt mean anything except that they were frustrating ''

What..?

I'm going to be an asshole and say this.

Child do you even do ranked games to know who is strong or not? Because from what i see all you do is one for all.

CerealBoxOfDoom1 votes

{quoted}

''Prior to this season''

Prior to this season vlad wasent building a spirit visage same with swain. Thats why they are banned now. Volibear and ryze have ALWAYS had this problem of opposite scaling thats why they've ALWAYS been constant bans. Ryze more than voli.

So your statement is completely false.

whether or not vlad built spirit visage prior to this season does not change the fact that you claim something cannot be balanced. Vlad has always been able to hit harder by building spirit visage. Vlad has not always been a priority ban.

The truth does not match your statements.

''Last i checked you claimed to have been studying champs and based your info on far more than what exists this season''

Im not sure what you even mean. Stick to the subject, You're just trying to argue.

I'm not just trying to argue. One moment you're saying this is based off study of one thing then you speak on another matter outside the scope of your supposed studies. But then you also make claims that are false when read straightforwardly.

''Last i checked having a lot of threads aout a champ didnt mean anything except that they were frustrating ''

What..?

Its exactly what it sounds like. The majority of people making these threads have no fucking clue what they are talking about and don't understand very basic things.

I'm going to be an asshole and say this.

Child do you even do ranked games to know who is strong or not? Because from what i see all you do is one for all.

Bitch, do you know how stupid it sounds when you ask something like that? "Herpderp, you played many games of a limited time game mode so you must not know what you are talking about in this conversation that doesn't even require any experience playing the game whatsoever."

Vlad is very rarely a must ban Recently the big issue with ryze wasn't that he was tanky and dealing damage, it was how often his shield was up and the fact he could lock you down 3 times in a row before you could go much further than 400 units without a dash. Poppy had the same issue but her's was just 6 seconds of lockdown.

Volibear wasn't an issue before this season. Not like amumu, but now voli is clearing too fast and outleveling early from what I understand and then he's also dealing not a lot of but enough damage like he and several other fighters and tanks always have. You argue that it has never been balanced, this is not the case. Voli was not a priority ban before now.

In voli's case it is very probably related to

mage synergy (mage rework) ghost (ghost buffs) jungle changes (monsters are tankier with less damage, perfect for voli) defensive items give better CDR options (since last season)

There's probably more too. Volibear shitting on carries has not always been a huge issue. He's always done it and for a long time it hasn't been a big enough problem to make him instaban. There is no ranked status that can change this fact.

Defended1 votes

{quoted}

whether or not vlad built spirit visage prior to this season does not change the fact that you claim something cannot be balanced. Vlad has always been able to hit harder by building spirit visage. Vlad has not always been a priority ban.

The truth does not match your statements.

I'm not just trying to argue. One moment you're saying this is based off study of one thing then you speak on another matter outside the scope of your supposed studies. But then you also make claims that are false when read straightforwardly.

Its exactly what it sounds like. The majority of people making these threads have no fucking clue what they are talking about and don't understand very basic things.

Bitch, do you know how stupid it sounds when you ask something like that? "Herpderp, you played many games of a limited time game mode so you must not know what you are talking about in this conversation that doesn't even require any experience playing the game whatsoever."

Vlad is very rarely a must ban Recently the big issue with ryze wasn't that he was tanky and dealing damage, it was how often his shield was up and the fact he could lock you down 3 times in a row before you could go much further than 400 units without a dash. Poppy had the same issue but her's was just 6 seconds of lockdown.

Volibear wasn't an issue before this season. Not like amumu, but now voli is clearing too fast and outleveling early from what I understand and then he's also dealing not a lot of but enough damage like he and several other fighters and tanks always have. You argue that it has never been balanced, this is not the case. Voli was not a priority ban before now.

In voli's case it is very probably related to

mage synergy (mage rework) ghost (ghost buffs) jungle changes (monsters are tankier with less damage, perfect for voli) defensive items give better CDR options (since last season)

There's probably more too. Volibear shitting on carries has not always been a huge issue. He's always done it and for a long time it hasn't been a big enough problem to make him instaban. There is no ranked status that can change this fact.

If i see about 8 false statements in one paragraph i usually dont provide a counter argument

Sorry.

CerealBoxOfDoom1 votes

{quoted}

If i see about 8 false statements in one paragraph i usually dont provide a counter argument

Sorry.

Your original post is based on false and/or very misleading information.

There isn't really much counterarguement needed aside from evidence.

Vladmirs tournament history says you're full of shit

http://lol.gamepedia.com/Vladimir_-_The_Crimson_Reaper

volibears tournament history says you're full of shit

http://lol.gamepedia.com/Volibear_-_The_Thunder%27s_Roar

champion.gg says volibear's banrate in plat and above is 4-5% CURRENTLY and that's after going up.

http://champion.gg/champion/Volibear

but wait, lets plug voli's page into the wayback machine

https://web.archive.org/web/20150613070659/http://champion.gg/champion/Volibear

1 year ago around this date, June 13th, his banrate was 1-2% and his winrate was 52.15%

By the way notice how it doesn't take a rank in a moba game to do this. You aren't talking in terms that allow you to hide behind your videogames "child"

Defended1 votes

{quoted}

Your original post is based on false and/or very misleading information.

There isn't really much counterarguement needed aside from evidence.

Vladmirs tournament history says you're full of shit

http://lol.gamepedia.com/Vladimir_-_The_Crimson_Reaper

volibears tournament history says you're full of shit

http://lol.gamepedia.com/Volibear_-_The_Thunder%27s_Roar

champion.gg says volibear's banrate in plat and above is 4-5% CURRENTLY and that's after going up.

http://champion.gg/champion/Volibear

but wait, lets plug voli's page into the wayback machine

https://web.archive.org/web/20150613070659/http://champion.gg/champion/Volibear

1 year ago around this date, June 13th, his banrate was 1-2% and his winrate was 52.15%

By the way notice how it doesn't take a rank in a moba game to do this. You aren't talking in terms that allow you to hide behind your videogames "child"

im really not sure what you're trying to prove.

My thread was to say

''Hey opposite scaling isnt fair'' ''Every champ that has invisibility in its kit has caused excessive controversy''

and

''High reward low risk champions are extremely frustrating''

Do you agree/disagree with those? I really dont care where you're trying to go with this. Then again you find the need to post on all my threads.

Whomp3r1 votes

what blows my mind is why why they gvies tanks execute abilities like voli w and garen ult

Chicken Sailor2 votes

Garen and Volibear are not tanks. They are tanky fighters/juggernauts. They have a lot of damage because they have limited crowd control when compared to the likes of sion, sejuani, amumu, etc. And garen and voli are easily kitable in most scenarios.

Whomp3r1 votes

that makes more sense thanks :D

Madra1 votes

The fact that they haven't nerfed the Trundle ultimate when they nerfed the QSS blows my mind. I think you are spot on with the low risk/high reward section. After at least a year of being secret OP, Volibear is finally getting nerfed though; as is Vlad-showing a willingness by RIot to at least try to balance these concepts.

Defended1 votes

{quoted}

The fact that they haven't nerfed the Trundle ultimate when they nerfed the QSS blows my mind. I think you are spot on with the low risk/high reward section. After at least a year of being secret OP, Volibear is finally getting nerfed though; as is Vlad-showing a willingness by RIot to at least try to balance these concepts.

thank you. yeah trundles ult not sure why its not nerfed imo

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