How does azir get nerfed that fast but lucian continues to be a overpowered champ for this long
? An adc has a 30% bann rate. Imagine that.. Oh wait
79 Comments
Kaioko17 votesBan rate does not equal being overpowered. Also Lucian is getting a nerf with the same patch as Azir. Finally Lucian wasn't overpowered until they gave him a more powerful ulti and the change in ADC items to benefit him with the ease of access to CDR.
Defended6 votesBan rate does not equal being overpowered. Also Lucian is getting a nerf with the same patch as Azir. Finally Lucian wasn't overpowered until they gave him a more powerful ulti and the change in ADC items to benefit him with the ease of access to CDR.
Bann rate indeed correlates with power
Lucian isnt getting a nerf. 5 off piercing light isnt the reason hes broken nor will that balance him.
They reverted the Q passthrough also.
And hes been overpowered and the to go too adc since i started playing 7 months ago
Sightless663 votesThey reverted the Q passthrough also.
No they didn't. That's still on the PBE right now, alongside a 0 - 20% decrease in the AD scaling and a decrease in W range.
Narasimha12 votesBann rate indeed correlates with power
Wrong, Ban rate correlates with perceived power
Prime example, Darius remained banned for over a month after his nerfs, when literally all evidence pointed to his winrate dropping steadily.
Spoofghoul8 votesAnd sometimes banrate corresponds with champions being flat out unfun to play against
yasuo & fizz for example
DarthSpectrum6 votesFrustration also plays a huge role in ban rate.
Players banned champions such as 
, 
, or 
even in situations in which they will not be that strong.
Lucian is just highly annoying to deal with without the appropriate tools. He either needs to be locked down with targeted CC or shut down with targeted burst damage.
A lot of the popular champions such as 
, 
. or 
can deal with Lucian, but it is a hassle to be forced to play them.
DesolationKaizer3 votesBonus AD scaling lowered to 60/70/80/90/100% from 60/75/90/105/120%.
Idk, that seems pretty substantial to me.
Defended1 votesBonus AD scaling lowered to 60/70/80/90/100% from 60/75/90/105/120%.
Idk, that seems pretty substantial to me.
Please dont fucking post if you play lucian.
Yorukin2 votesHeavens forbid that someone on the internet provides a different point of view on an argument.
DesolationKaizer1 votesBut I don't really play him often? Why does that even matter? And you need chill out with that hostility buddy. No one is going to take you seriously if you act like an insufferable jack ass when someone makes what could possibly be a fair point in opposition to your beliefs.
Big Lincoln3 votesLucian was overpowered in season 4 too, whenever he's good he ends up a top pick
personally I think he's a problem champion, he never seems to be anything but awful or overwhelming
Madra3 votes[{quoted}](name=Big Lincoln,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9pxo8Ij,comment-id=00000001,timestamp=2016-05-26T17:19:40.475+0000)
Lucian was overpowered in season 4 too, whenever he's good he ends up a top pick
personally I think he's a problem champion, he never seems to be anything but awful or overwhelming
Lucian's design as a more ability focused ADC gives him an early game advantage over ADC's that rely more on autos; but his maneuverability gives him an advantage over ADCs that rely on hitting skill shots and abilities. The fact that his abilities scale with AD and enhance his autos helps him scale well at all stages of the game. The fact that he could poke from 1100 while being able to punish extremely hard with his dash was problematic. Hopefully the changes will give Lucian's opponents more of a fighting chance to come out even from the lane.
Troll for Trump2 votesHm
kjuu2 votesIf you look at Lucian's laning stats, he's a HUGE lane bully: http://www.matchup.gg/champion/Lucian/ You can click into the list of "counters" to see specific stats on gold, cs, etc., but basically the only adc that comes out ahead in lane vs. Luc is Draven.
Luc's game win rate is a little more modest, but these stats (from high-elo ranked games) do make it look like he sets his opponents behind significantly in the early- to mid-game, which makes the rest of the game that much harder.
EcchiOtakuTM8 votesBan only means the play rate would be higher, it doesn't mean anything for if a champion is op or not.
But yes lucian does need nerfing his win rate is 52% while his play rate is 50% and for such a high play rate hiw win rate should be 46-48% not 52%
LSmaster162 votesHigh play rate doesn't mean low winrate, low avg games means low winrate. Lucian is 5th for ADCs in terms of average games played. Not that he doesn't need a few nerfs but its not as huge a problem as you're saying it is.
Defended3 votesHigh play rate doesn't mean low winrate, low avg games means low winrate. Lucian is 5th for ADCs in terms of average games played. Not that he doesn't need a few nerfs but its not as huge a problem as you're saying it is.
Lucian has the #1 Play rate and #1 for ADCs in terms of average games played. Not 5th. The hell you talking about
LSmaster161 votesWe're probably using different sites, I should have mentioned this was from champion.gg which is diamond plus elo.
Defended3 votesWe're probably using different sites, I should have mentioned this was from champion.gg which is diamond plus elo.
Lucian still has #1 spot for average games played in Diamond + elo...
So still not sure why you said hes 5th when hes not ..
LSmaster162 votesWait, champion.gg? Also, just double checked and turns out that's for plat plus.
Neo Metalsonic2 votesNo it is only platinum+
You should just use bestbans.com because over there you can look up platinum and diamond by region. By region is far more important to be honest since only EUW, KR and NA matter from a competitive standpoint (the other servers are much less populated and contain less skilled players from my experience, master on EUNE is basically plat 2 or so on EUW). So there you get real stats filtered from the troll servers like BR and TR.
GayFluffyUnicorn1 voteschampion.gg is plat+... not diamond.
Mandang02 votesThat's not really true.
Galio currently has some super high winrate - do you think his winrate would remain as high if he was played as often as Lucian? If he was banned as often as Lucian?
LSmaster161 votesI don't play galio or mid lane but I'm guessing its because most of the high pickrate mid laners this patch are ap combined with the element of surprise you get from having that low of as play rate (below 1%). Also, ban rate shouldn't be effecting win rate.
Guy Fox Teemo5 votesThey are being nerfed on the same patch teh fuck you talkin about.
Troll for Trump3 votesHe's saying Luc has been dominant in the meta for a long time, without any nerfs, while Azir just recently popped into the spotlight, and gets shot down immediately the next patch
Guy Fox Teemo2 votesTheres a difference between Dominant and Popular, Lucian is a reliable Adc, but before a few patch wasn't really OP, kinda meh in fact, people just played him because he's a fun Adc and he's easy to play.
Troll for Trump2 votesUrgot ADC just surpassed Luc ROFL
He's been good for a while; It's like when Lee Sin and Riven were all over the place in s3. They would normally sit at about 50ish percent WR with a high playrate, but would sometimes spike up in winrates. Both needed nerfs, which they got.
Luc's winrate should consistently be at current Lee Sin's
Defended1 votes[{quoted}](name=Guy Fox Teemo,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9pxo8Ij,comment-id=000700000000,timestamp=2016-05-27T06:05:47.034+0000)
Theres a difference between Dominant and Popular, Lucian is a reliable Adc, but before a few patch wasn't really OP, kinda meh in fact, people just played him because he's a fun Adc and he's easy to play.
Lucian was never "meh". Never. He was the to go to adc this whole fucking season.
Of course though you pulled out the "hes fun" idiotic argument.. Stop
Gorgiolio1 votesLucian wasn't the go to ADC for the entire season, they were way better picks in the beginning. He's just come out as the most solid recently which has lead to him being picked all the time. He actually isn't even the strongest, I think jinx might make a resurgence again pretty soon idk. He's getting nerfed regardless. Besides, azir is constantly kept in check because the dude is a monster when you're actually good with him. Lucian is manageable.
legionnaire992 votesLucian is trash. I never lost in bot lane to him or maybe cait/ adc blitz supp counters him to hard idk always seem trash to me
Defended10 votesLucian is trash. I never lost in bot lane to him or maybe cait/ adc blitz supp counters him to hard idk always seem trash to me
''Lucian is trash''
Top pick in MSI 24%? bann rate in League Atm as an ADC 52% win rate with a 47% play rate Absolutely no counter Always a good choice for any team Riot admitting hes too strong atm
''Trash''
Then again you're silver 5..
legionnaire992 votesNever lost bot lane to a luc and btw jhin pick rate is higher and if I'm not wrong for gailo sej lol even ram has a better winrate and pick rate? whem it comes to add pick twitch or jinxs they have better winrate and less counters. Also mf hard counter luc
bulldoggamer2 votesLucain has a high win rate and a high play rate. That is generally a good sign of someone being OP (it means even the bad people are able to win on him). Jhin may have a higher pick rate (i doubt he does) but i can assure you he doesn't have nearly as high of win rate. Can you explain to me how MF hard counters Lucian? She has a worse laning phase, more expensive build path(and just a worse item path overall), is less mobile, less safe, lower burst, lower consistent damage, a self rooting ult (that does have a chance of higher teamfight damage), she has slightly more range, worse scaling, about the same utility, worse waveclear, and a lower skill ceiling. Lucian has no major weakness, therefor cannot have a counter, unless a champion is just stronger than him. And no ADC comes even close to Lucian's power right now.
legionnaire991 votesHow mf counter him 1 there both getting ghostblade and BC 2. mf out pokes Him and out damages him in late game team fights by just hitting R 3 but he is a better pusher so he has that ok her 4 luc is a snowballing adc like draven well most caster adc are better mid early game 5. He so easy to play vs as mf he keep one creep low and Q it when he get's near it
bulldoggamer1 votesWhy your points are wrong.
- Lucain builds ghost blade much better and MF is too crit reliant for it to be efficient.
- MF does have better poke, but lucain out trades her and does better sustain damage. Her late game damage is situationally higher, Lucain is going to live longer in almost every fight so he has a much more consistent window to do damage. 3 you actually are right on this one, one clap for you *clap
- Any ADC who builds ghostblade is fairly snowball reliant, but lucain is so safe that even when behind he can output a buttload of damage. And being strong on 1 or 2 items will give you a huge edge as an adc and make snowballing pretty easy. 5 You can't take player skill into account on this type of argument, MF is really easy to play against, the moment she uses q you dash in double shot q double shot and walk away. You can't make a player skill argument here because if we were to go off of skill ceiling lucain would win every time.
legionnaire991 votes1 BC makes up for it with lowering there armor with flat armor pin on ghost 2 there both high damage early but mf with her passive in that Q should win the trade throw in an E if needed ( I also run thunderlords on her so that helps) 3 4. How with this ALLOT of there power are in there's ults get a tank to stand in frount of luc and mf gets a free ult if she plays smart 5i do see what you mean here and her q auto hit harder with lovetap and higher base
bulldoggamer1 votes1 If Mf's ult is too reliant on crits to have Ghostblade BC be the better item build. You would Delay your IE way too long and your ult would lose tons of damage as a result. And the majority of your damage comes from your ult. If black cleaver stacked its armor shred on abilities and not just autos i could agree with that itemization on MF. But she doesn't auto enough for it to be effective. 2 If both are played perfectly MF will win early trades but Lucain will likely get lv 2 first and control the lane off of that. And lucain has better all in so he will have consistent kill pressure. 4 Like i've said, arguing player skill or specific situations isn't valid, because you can always come up with a situation where your champion wins. I can come up with a situation where an Urgot would beat an Azir. But that in no way means Urgot is the stronger champion. Lucain's power doesn't come from his ult. It come from being highly mobile with a consistently high damage output. His passive and his E are by far the best parts of his kit. Heck Lucain has one of the worst ults out of the ADC's it's a single target, directionally locked, skill shot, that does less damage than his basic spell/auto rotation. It also provides no utility. Put any other ADC ult instead of his and he instantly becomes stronger. Except possibly caitlyn.
I just want to let you know, i in no way mean that you can't or shouldn't play MF. She's clearly your favorite champion. If you have success against lucain with her great! Keep playing it and climb as high as you can. But even if you have success with her doesn't make her a a counter or a better champion from an objective standpoint. Being able to recognize what is strong, even if it isn't what you like to play, is a really good skill to have. That way you can adjust your playstyle around what is strong and you can win games.
legionnaire991 votesNo I hate adc and if I do I play graves I'm talking about there winrate a and games I seen
SpongebobIsLife2 votesLucian was completely balanced until about a week and a half Ago when the Korean build came to NA. Problem is the items, not luc.
Defended1 votesLucian was completely balanced until about a week and a half Ago when the Korean build came to NA. Problem is the items, not luc.
Except he wasent balanced and has been the #1 pick as an ADC for a reason... The korean build had nothing to do with it
SpongebobIsLife3 votesNot because he was overpowered. It is because he is the safest adc and has a very fun kit. Ez Had a play rate close to his at the time for the same reason. Another point, lee sin and thresh have the highest play rate in their respect roles, are they op too?
tooomine2 votesYes.
His kit is overloaded.
so is yas.
so is lee.
so is thresh.
so is ekko.
all OP.
SpongebobIsLife3 voteslol, there's no reasoning with boards.
Left Hook Larry1 votesBecause adcs cannot be OP lmfao.
But seriously, it's because the majority of people who bitch are adc mains which bitch about every champ except adcs
Defended3 votes[{quoted}](name=Savage Bear,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=A9pxo8Ij,comment-id=0009,timestamp=2016-05-26T22:51:15.345+0000)
Because adcs cannot be OP lmfao.
But seriously, it's because the majority of people who bitch are adc mains which bitch about every champ except adcs
Bitching? Bitching that an ADC is capable of doing the job of almost every adcs dream?
Mobility + burst + sustain + Great kiter + Great ult = Bitching?
Hardstuck G41 votesYes, Lucian is overpowered. Yes, he's a strong. But he's strong because of recent changes in S6, and honestly, there are other champions who can stomp all over a Lucian. Caitlyn, for instance, abuses Lucian like no other champion due to him having the shortest ADC range in the game. Him having a high ban rate also does not make him overpowered, it just means people don't like him. Honestly, come back with a completely valid arguments, and take into account the incoming nerfs. Now, before you be a certified idiot and be toxic again, I'll take my leave
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