Instead of reworking all of the juggernaut/divers

GigglesO··2 votes·326 views

We could just buff tank itemization/nerf damage itemization. The current issue with Divers/Juggernauts isn't the same issue that tanks have.

Tanks typically (should) have an issue of dealing damage, because they are high cc, and should be building tank. Issues typically arrive when these guys deal too much damage, or die too quickly without being able to get their cc off.

Divers on the other hand have no issue dealing damage, what they do have issues on is getting to their targets. While Items like Deadmans plate, and stereks can do a great job shrugging off some damage to try and get to the adc they seem to be falling a little short, which leaves juggernauts either building full damage, or full tank, and not being able to do their job of soaking damage while wading into the enemy team to get to the enemy adc.

Now if we were to buff tank itemization or nerf damage itemization, we would likely have to nerf some of the outlying tanks that have decent cc and mobility mao, sedj, zac. However as it stands divers currently need to be reworked because they can't function as is without being hyper nuke (akali), or just a cc tank, which is why riot needs to add gimmicks like xins new ulti.

I suggest making tank items gold efficient, or we could just deload ad items, most of them have extras that they don't actually need. The last thing we need to do is stop generalizing everyone that at one time built tank as tanks, and nerf damage champions appropriately when they build tank fizz fiora, yasuo and ect...

Also, in my opinion, the way to encourage damage dealers to deal damage is to increase their ad ratios/ap ratios, but make them have less base damage. This forces them to build higher damage to have damage, but allows them to also scale quickly with damage purchases. One way to limit their damage if it is an issue is like doing old poppy's Q. Where she could do a maximum amount of damage based on the skill level.

As for itemization: I strongly believe Tanks/divers also need options like Qss, and an upgrade for it.

Please don't just downvote and move on, lets have an actual discussion.

6 Comments

Ben Sharpio1 votes

[deleted]

GigglesO1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Corsair Sion,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=t5mWKB8G,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2017-09-17T08:02:30.415+0000)

i want sion to be reworked into a fucking damage dealer instead of whatever he is supposed to be currently

I miss old ad sion tbh...

MLDzXnRRR1 votes

Man, you can read the abilities of the tanks. Not only most of them have high base dmg and very low AP scaling, they also have % health dmg that means that your dmg doesn't fall off. Low elo ADCs will never buy MR, so the tank can solo him at any point of the game. The only reason why ADCs win vs the tanks is the broken supports, the broken lifesteal and range advantage. Divers just don't work as a concept in this game the higher you go. They are not tanky, don't have enough damage and aren't even that interesting to play (mostly stat checking the enemy team). You can even lose brain cells playing Vi, Jax, Xin etc.

GigglesO1 votes

{quoted}

Man, you can read the abilities of the tanks. Not only most of them have high base dmg and very low AP scaling, they also have % health dmg that means that your dmg doesn't fall off. Low elo ADCs will never buy MR, so the tank can solo him at any point of the game. The only reason why ADCs win vs the tanks is the broken supports, the broken lifesteal and range advantage. Divers just don't work as a concept in this game the higher you go. They are not tanky, don't have enough damage and aren't even that interesting to play (mostly stat checking the enemy team). You can even lose brain cells playing Vi, Jax, Xin etc.

Did you even read my post? I suggested actually nerfing tanks if they got to strong if they buffed tank itemization. There is a very clear difference between juggernaut/divers, soaks and tanks, the only class currently able to do its job and feel good about doing it is the tanks category. All 3 classes actually share the same itemization too. Itemization being so poor is also why they have to overload tanky class champions so much to make them viable. Just look at nasus and cho for that example.

MLDzXnRRR1 votes

Nasus has one of the simplest kits in the game. He is not overloaded, actually he is super linear, predictable and underpowered . The last time he was able to win a pro game was in season 4... So OP champ. You can't nerf tanks, they are semi-balanced gameplaywise. Divers need complete rework. ADCs need heavy nerfs (itemization) and gameplay changes, so they don't revolve around right clicking (mainly Trist, Twitch, Vayne, Cait), but more about some kind of ability combos. Kog has interesting kit, too bad that he has only 1 ability - his W. Outdated champs like Voli, Trynd, Jax, Pantheon, Aatrox, Yi, Wukong, Morde need changes, so they aren't 1 dimensional and they would have some sort of outplay potential. Yasuo needs a rework that makes him more fair to play against in the laning and viable in high elo, because now you just counterpick him and he feeds all game. If you don't counterpick, he will just 1v5 midgame, if he is semi-decent.

GigglesO1 votes

So you haven't been reading about low MMR complaining about nasu's R cdr buff to his q, or chogath and stoneplate + feast...

Also, it isn't always a bad thing to have one dimensional champions. Champions like morde actually have alot of skill expression in how they heal and shield. Not only that, but it takes alot of work to actually do something with his low mobility. It would be even if tank items are better. Not every champion should be so complex that you are on an azir level micromanagement.

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