Combine Wit's and Dervish?

Rebonack·Nov 29, 2015·16 votes·1,166 views

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That would put it on a price-point similar to Mercurial and finally solve the problem of Wit's not really fitting in anywhere (by removing it). It would give champs more interested in attack speed an alternative to Mercurial and it would also provide us with a big-ticket attack speed item, something the game is really missing out on right now.

So basically you would be looking at 75ish attack speed, some OnHit magic damage, magic resist, a MR stealing OnHit effect, and of course the Quicksilver active.

EDIT

Alternatively, we could keep a scaled down Wit's ( + ) as a component item with two upgrade paths.

Combine with to create Dervish Blade. Gets Quicksilver, but lacks MR stealing.

Combine with to create Madred's Bloodrazor. Lacks Quicksilver, but gains MR stealing and %Max HP damage.

18 Comments

MecarNov 29, 20153 votes

I'd say that this is overloaded... Mr steal, CDR, Magic on-hit, attack speed, QSS... I think stinger should be removed, but otherwise it's a good idea :D

RebonackNov 29, 20151 votes

{quoted}

I'd say that this is overloaded... Mr steal, CDR, Magic on-hit, attack speed, QSS... I think stinger should be removed, but otherwise it's a good idea :D

It isn't that bad.

Compare it to Bork.

PartholonianNov 29, 20151 votes

{quoted}

It isn't that bad.

Compare it to Bork.

Comparison to BORK is why nobody has built wits end in a long time; one is a balanced item and the other is hideously OP, so of course people want to build the OP one.

RebonackNov 29, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Comparison to BORK is why nobody has built wits end in a long time; one is a balanced item and the other is hideously OP, so of course people want to build the OP one.

Bork isn't particularly OP at the moment.

Not even Vayne is building it anymore.

MunchCrunchLunchNov 29, 20151 votes

Bork got nerfed. its still a good item. but honestly in the right situation. in which if you have strong mages on the other team I'd go wits since mages usually don't have that much base MR. especially for devourer users.

Irelia BotNov 29, 20151 votes

Well in reality the current Mercurial Scimitar is also kinda overloaded. 75 AD 10% life steal 35 MR UNIQUE – QUICKSILVER: Removes all debuffs from your champion and grants +50% movement speed for 1 second. 90 second cooldown.

This is more an attempt to make Wit's end into something worth considering over the meh status it currently is in..

shalexadeNov 29, 20151 votes

Where does the CDR come from?

AS
MR
Witsend onhit
QSS

Compare it to other items around that price point

+250 HP +15% AS +25 AD +5% MS

250 mana +20% CS +10% CDR

+75 AD +35 MR +10% Life steal

+65 AD +20% Crit +30% CDR

onhit Mana regen

Remove stinger and it just becomes a cheaper option to upgrade the QSS into.

RebonackNov 29, 20151 votes

Seriously, though.

Just adding Dervish to Rift was kind of silly, especially when you compare it with Mercurial. Way better stats and two offensive scaling stats rather than one.

Irelia BotNov 29, 20151 votes

I would be alright with this with a few changes

The question I do however have is how much on hit magic damage would it actually have? ANd would the cost be within reason for actually considering.

Also it does not need to reduce enemy MR since that passive was the thing that basically killed wit's end for non magic focused champs.

just a general concept of what such an item might have

So basically Recurve Bow (1000) + Stinger (1200) + QSS (1300) + 300 = Dervish Blade (3800) 75% attack speed 10% CDR 45 MR unique passive:Wit's end 40 on hit magic damage: Auto attacks give this item a stack up to 4 times, each stack increase the on hit magic damage and owners MR by 5. UNIQUE – QUICKSILVER: Removes all debuffs from your champion. Melee champions also gain +50% movement speed for 1 second. 90 second cooldown.

The ability to steal enemy MR is what killed Wit's end for champs who are not largely magic damage focused. I would rather see it removed and instead have the item give more on hit magic damage in trades instead.

RebonackNov 29, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=Irelia Bot,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=sTuGAeAA,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2015-11-29T17:23:03.239+0000)

I would be alright with this.

The question I do however have is how much on hit magic damage would it actually have?

Considering that the components alone cost 3.5k gold? Probably more than 40. But I figure that exact numbers are a thing for the Live Balance people. They can iterate on items while I can't.

The ability to steal enemy MR is what killed Wit's end for champs who are not largely magic damage focused. I would rather see it removed and instead have the item give more on hit magic damage in trades instead.

I'll admit that I'm biased toward the MR stealing since I'm a Koggy main. But I can see how it wouldn't be attractive on, well, pretty much anyone who isn't Kog or Shyvana.

Irelia BotNov 29, 20152 votes

So what if instead of stinger it was a single dagger? Recurve Bow (1000) + QSS(1300) + Dagger(300) + 800 gold= Dervish Blade 3400

50% attakc speed 50 on hit magic damage UNIQUE PASSIVE – WIT'S END: 50 on-hit magic damage; Auto attacks give this item a stack of Wit's up to 4 stacks. Each stack increases magic damage on-hit and MR by 5. UNIQUE ACTIVE – QUICKSILVER: Removes all debuffs from your champion. Melee champions also gain +50% movement speed for 1 second. 90 second cooldown.

It would be worth getting in this situation and also be a comparable option to Mercurial Scimitar

Irelia BotNov 29, 20151 votes

Well WW, Udyr and Shen also have tended to get Wit's end but the MR shred has made it limited to say the least.

RebonackNov 29, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Irelia Bot,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=sTuGAeAA,comment-id=000100000001,timestamp=2015-11-29T17:54:36.474+0000)

Well WW, Udyr and Shen also have tended to get Wit's end but the MR shred has made it limited to say the least.

It's actually kind of funny. Given the way Koggy's W works now, he would be more interested in an item that gives attack speed, a hefty chunk of AD, and an OnHit effect. I'm worried how he'll fair when Riot finally gets around to making Rageblade reasonable, assuming they don't do something like just making it Ranged Only and calling it good.

RebonackNov 29, 20151 votes

Alternatively, we could keep a scaled down Wit's ( item 1033 + item 1043 ) as a component item with two upgrade paths.

Combine with item 3140 to create Dervish Blade. Gets Quicksilver, but lacks MR stealing.

Combine with item 1043 to create Madred's Bloodrazor. Lacks Quicksilver, but gains MR stealing and %Max HP damage.

RandomoniumNov 29, 20151 votes

I think I'd prefer if they toned down the stats on Wit's End, made it closer in price to 2,000 gold, and then provided us with multiple items that it could be upgraded into. Right now Wit's End just occupies a very weird price point and a very strange niche for stats.

Chicken4dinnerNov 30, 20151 votes

Just a thing, 75% is waayyy too much attack speed so maybe remove recurve bow from the recipe and give it 50% with better on hit stats (so it becomes a niche snowball item for devourer esque on hit champions. Looking at you kayle and jax)

LynXerfNov 30, 20151 votes

I like the Idea, how about this then:

item 3091 Wits End (Cost = 2200) Recurve Bow = 1000 Dagger = 300 Null-Magic Mantle = 450 Recipe = 450

Item Stats: 30 Magic Resistance, 40 Attack Speed

UNIQUE: +20 on-hit magic damage UNIQUE: Basic attacks (on-hit) grant +3 magic resistance and reduces the target's magic resistance by 5 for 5 seconds. Stacks up to 5 times for a total of +15 magic resistance and 15 magic resistance reduction.

item 3137 Dervish Blade (Cost = 3800) Wits End = 2200 Quicksilver Sash = 1300 Recipe = 300

Item Stats: 60 Magic Resistance, 40 Attack Speed

UNIQUE ACTIVE QUICKSILVER: Removes all debuffs from your champion. Melee champions also gain +50% movement speed for 1 second. 90 second cooldown UNIQUE: +40 on-hit magic damage UNIQUE: Basic attacks (on-hit) grant +3 magic resistance and reduces the target's magic resistance by 5 for 5 seconds. Stacks up to 5 times for a total of +15 magic resistance and 15 magic resistance reduction.