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Proposed change to ranked bans. Each player picks one.

Destaice··252 votes·7,013 views

It's been many years since League was released back in 2009, and many changes have come before it.

But one factor that has been a constant is the ranked system's banning phase. 1 player on your team is chosen to ban 3 champions. It was fine back then, but problems exist now and such a system leaves a bitter taste.

First of all, we need to address the ban amount. Why is it limited to 3 per team? It was back in 2012 when people started asking for a 4th ban, and with reason.

6/123 champions. Don't you think that's a tad small? There are around 20 current champions which are considered the problem children, so why let 14 instances of "unhealthy" champions get past the gates?

For the first change, we need to increase this number to 10. 5 bans for team. Sure some unhealthy champions are still getting passed, but at least you're able to limit to better to what can be counterpicked more easily. But, we can't let this be put in the hands of a single player.

Why is it that one person decides the bans? Why is it that one person decides which champions your team might be facing against?

The issue with this is that you're putting faith into 1 person knowing who/what to ban that would be optimal for your team. And in truth it just doesn't work out. The bans shouldn't be determined by 1 person, it should be determined by everyone on your team. After all, it is a team game.

Instead of just throwing them all at one person and hoping they do good, we give each player a ban. One by one everyone will decide who to ban. Everyone can get rid of a champion they wont feel comfortable playing against. Everyone can feel like they're being a part of the team.

134 Comments

Señor Karthus28 votes

We have been asking for this for a while and I think it is just common sense. There are too many op champions that need to be banned. And there are more champions in general. It is just logical to increase the number of bans. Also, letting each player to select the one they fear the most is just reasonable. Everything is always worse when everything depends on one person in a game that is supposed to be a team game.

lDontLiftIcarry1 votes

it was fine in s2/s3 before riot fucked up first pick with randomized first pick so that the lowest MMR is your first pick the guy who's plat when you';re diamond 4 Or the guy who's d5 when you';re d2. Its just. Wow. Why is this even considered a good change? god only knows.

Nameless Voice8 votes

Because having 5 more MMR than another player doesn't means that you are much better than them; it's far more likely to mean in a previous game that game each of you played, they randomly had the AFK player on their team, while you had the AFK player on the enemy team.

Keevalroy14 votes

That would mean Yasuo gets banned in every single one of my games with no hope that he'll ever make it onto the rift...IT'S LIKE A DREAM COME TRUE!

You've got my full support. +1

trexmixG4 votes

ahaahhahahahahahahhahaaahahha

yas is not op.

Keevalroy3 votes

I don't care if he ever has the lowest win rate over all of League's roster; he's a cancerous abomination and infuriating to play against at all stages of the game. I hate every last pixel that makes him and think the idea behind a kit that toxic should have gone out the window immediately. Unfortunately "Those LCS Big Plays Doe!" triumphs again and he was sent out.

FastAsHeck3 votes

he is fine in most aspects. what is really obnoxious about him though is

  1. double crit. WTF RITO? the adc has to work hard for these crit items and end up with like 70% at most (statik, ie, maybe yomamas ghostblade, maybe phantom, maybe trinity) while he just gets statik and ie and he is roflstomping you with 80%.
  2. 50% armorpen. okay what the hell, RITO is all about counterplay but where is the counterplay when he ignores like 100 armor from a tank? (thornmail & randuin almost make it 200 total) add in the last whisper and boom, armor is pretty much not existing. they should remove that and maybe give him a straight up Q damage boost instead (since the q needs some skill to land)
  3. insane mobility. provided there is a minion wave nearby, he can just jump endlessly.

im fine with his ult as it is (except the armorpen) and the potential for synergy. his shield is ok early, but in the last few levels it becomes a bonus 1/3 HP, pretty OP if you ask me. Wind wall should last less.

Keevalroy3 votes

I agree with everything you said, but I can't say the ult is fine when it can proc when someone sneezes on me. Seriously Anivia's wall pushing you back a few inches shouldn't give Yasuo the ability to teleport to you, launch you 15 feet in the air, and get free stats for it.

Wind wall shouldn't exist.

Fixed this for you.

FastAsHeck1 votes

{quoted}

I agree with everything you said, but I can't say the ult is fine when it can proc when someone sneezes on me. Seriously Anivia's wall pushing you back a few inches shouldn't give Yasuo the ability to teleport to you, launch you 15 feet in the air, and get free stats for it.

yeah thats also another thing. also he can ult you if you get thresh hooked (i get it with the flay, but the hook?)

FastAsHeck1 votes

wind wall is very strong, but i think they should make it absorb a total of hp before being destroyed (blocking an entire team is not healthy)

hgjkdlsaf jeldvb1 votes

The only time Yasuo is an issue is if they pick a champ with good knockup potential for him to work with. Otherwise, there are plenty of good counterpicks to him in lane. Malz and Karthus come to mind. Kayle does well too. None of them are really meta, but they work, and are quite powerful when used correctly.

I think double crit is a bit dumb. +50% crit would be better, and would still force actual crit investment, as opposed to just building shiv and critting 50%. Wind wall needs some kind of limit on it. 50% bonus armor pen is dumb. These things are all tuneable though. The big issue is that he gets considerably stronger with champs that synergize with him, in fact, he's dependent on those champs for success in most cases. This causes him to either suck, or be massively overpowered, cause you can't do anything to deal with him if malph gets a 3 man ult and yasuo takes his free ticket in to kill 3 people, and mop up the remaining two.

Keevalroy1 votes

It's not that I think he's brokenly overpowered (anymore), but I do think that he remains to be conceptually broken and horribly designed.

I also get that he's easy to kill, whatever, but the fact that he has all these free stats packed into his kit, and watching him woosh, woosh, woosh, woosh, woosh all over the place with an expandable fart wall that blocks all projectiles, in addition to an ult that procs ON THINGS THAT AREN'T ACTUALLY KNOCKUPS, it makes me want to gouge my eyes out with a spoon watching him in lane. His kit is obnoxious and has never been fun or engaging to go against.

I feel the same way about Kalista - from my perspective, neither of them are champions to me. I simply cannot accept that anything that toxic should be allowed to exist on the roster.

Desmond Law8 votes

This is a good idea, provided that older champions get brought down to 450 ip, as more bans means you now need 20 champion pool rather than 16.

Jenova Synthesis5 votes

Clever idea, but all this does is take away from the "team" aspect of the game. It makes it more of a selfish, "Who can I ban to help myself?" type situation. It will also increase the amount of people who say "Well, I banned Riven so I'm going top. I don't care if I'm last pick."

More bans would be good, but I think 5 is too much. 4 would be sufficient. I also think that this system would only increase toxicity, but who knows?

Tuckerr16 votes

In solo queue, you need to rely on yourself first, and your team second. In ranked teams, you can coordinate better. The current system allows the top player to use all of the bans in their favor.

"Whoops, I can't stand playing against Fiora. Hmm...You know, Gnar is also difficult to deal with top lane. Buut then again, I also really don't like playing against the new Sion."

At least a system where everyone gets one ban each requires people to talk and share their ideas for strategy, and gives everyone a fair chance at helping to shape their lane.

And to address the "Well, I banned Riven so I'm going top. I don't care if I'm last pick." That kind of player is going to do whatever they want anyway, regardless of what other players want. It doesn't matter whether you give them power or not, Riot already has made their stance clear. Those players eventually get punished anyway, especially in ranked.

Mahautsukai4 votes

A small issue for newer players who already have a wall of grind ahead of them is that increased ban numbers increases the minimum # of champions for entry. It is not coincidence it is 10 for aram and 16 for ranked, it is i believe, to ensure you can have a champion. However unlikely it would be to occur.

iamthegoatofwar13 votes

Good it means they can learn more before joining ranked.

Mahautsukai2 votes

Not sure how slogging IP in non-ranked style games is going to really prep them up for ranked matches any more at that point. Of course I get that you were a better new player to ranked and anyone joining today is a scrub not up to your standards and therefore should have a longer pre-build. Still nothing like jumping in to really hone ones skills.

iamthegoatofwar9 votes

...I'm not sure where to begin you with you so I'll use little words. Longer time in normals=more skilled when entering ranked. Side note I didn't just "jump" into ranked. I never claimed that anyone joining today is a scrub. Don't accuse me of being like that again.

Mahautsukai3 votes

You are correct, I apologize for the unwarranted assumptions.

LeeDark6 votes

I get that you were being sarcastic, but you're right. We were relatively better when we first started ranked. Because there were fewer champions. The burden of knowledge required for an individual player to consistently perform well in ranked was lower, so by comparison, new players in ranked now are further below that burden than any of us were. This is a particularly egregious burden to put on them if they are first pick, when they are expected to ban 3 champions without having the knowledge necessary to do so.

Mahautsukai2 votes

Good points. There is a lot to learn in this game. A better approach to my thoughts perhaps, would have been, how much more will someone learn going 70k of ip grinding vs 60k. Further a person who just RP' buys there way to the total doesn't learn anymore so I felt the two were not fully related.

I hear were there are more champions but that doesn't mean a higher ratio of OP champions. A question i would like to raise is how large has the elite champion pool been in each season, and how much has that grown versus the entire pool. A concern is would it then stop at four or five bans or would the next handful of champions in line just be the new OP that we need more bans for?

hgjkdlsaf jeldvb1 votes

Riot could easily solve this by increasing the IP gain for new players so they can get up to speed.

A Silver Scrub3 votes

Hey guys lets add 10 more broken champs and not increase the amount of bans!

SaltiestHealer3 votes

The issue Riot has had with raising the number of bans we get is that it affects competitive play. If each team can ban five champions, it becomes a hell of a lot easier to ban a certain player out and open up a huge gaping weakness in a team. They also don't like the fact that it would make it harder for pro players to play signature champs in matches (Like Froggen's Anivia

With that being said I don't really understand why they can't just give pros the same they have now and give regular players more bans. Because heaven forbid Riot make this game not all about the pro scene.

Stephenizgod3 votes

This is a pretty good idea but what im more curious about is why Riot has not implemented it. I want to know their reasons as to why it hasn't been done already, there is probably a good reason for it that we cant think of :). But i never see a red comment on any posts like this one.

RogueWill2 votes

What about getting a vote like we did for all for all. We just vote and whatever gets the more votes get banned.

Zmuecat2 votes

I feel like that'd take awhile.

Besides, one person getting a ban means that they ban what they don't want to fight. I can handle some of the current OP things against people of my skill level, but I don't want to play against anything that'll hurt me when I play Sona.

Sigma1172 votes

I bet the main reason they're against more bans is that it makes removing a player from a team (primarily LCS) a lot easier. If you know a teams adc carries a lot then you can ban his/her 3 mains and still have 2 left over for important bans.

Mikau2 votes

I'd like it. I hate it when FP bans people HE wants and not that would cause the team to lose, and then complains when we're dying so often.

Jamatrix6662 votes

{quoted} Instead of just throwing them all at one person and hoping they do good, we give each player a ban. One by one everyone will decide who to ban. Everyone can get rid of a champion they wont feel comfortable playing against. Everyone can feel like they're being a part of the team.

I love this idea

injourn1 votes

This has been mentions a million times and it hasn't ever happened once. I don't think it will. Just like how people said that riot should nerf fizz and THAT never happened either. What I am saying is just because you ask for something, that doesn't mean that Santa will give it to you for Christmas!

SpongebobIsLife7 votes

but fizz was nerfed?

Nameless Voice2 votes

I personally dislike Fizz because of his low-counterplay skills, but he *was *nerfed. He's not much fun to play against, but balanced now.

SpongebobIsLife3 votes

I think fizz is the example of a healthy assassin. He has clear and identifiable pros and cons.

ImHerVoice2 votes

6 sec i-frame Pros and cons where exactly?

KING OF MASKS1 votes

5 bans per team is probably ramping it up a bit too much too fast. Changing it to 4 per team would be an easier transition.

Though of course that ruins the "every player gets a ban" idea, but oh well.

Junkο6 votes

everybody but first pick bans one champ? I mean he already gets the benefit of picking whatever role he wants

Brenticus123 votes

Being first pick is really a major disadvantage unless you're going to be playing something like Gnar or Irelia that works really well in most matchups and don't do that bad in disadvantaged matchups.

I hate being first pick because I won't know what the enemy will pick. I prefer 3rd or 4th pick.

brad1 votes

ok but what happens when all the bans are adcs?

riot will not allow that and the bans will never go up to 10

Nameless Voice2 votes

There are 19 champions tagged as "marksman". 17 if you take out Urgot and Teemo.

They can't ban them all.

Support is tighter, but there are many supports (Alistar Leona Annie, etc.) who are not tagged as "support".

Pastramka1 votes

Any ideas on what to do with the rising number of min required champions to play ranked, if the bans are raised to 10?

Champion Skin2 votes

Then you would need 20 champions 10 banned 9 champions picked =19 So if you have 20 champions you will always have at least 1 champion you can pick

Pastramka1 votes

:D

I know that, but there are a lot of complaints lately that getting to 16 champs for new players is a bad barrier. So raising to that number of champions will worsen that I guess....

So i was asking a solution about that; an improvement so new players don't get stuck at level 30 for months.

Champion Skin1 votes

Honestly I don't really think 20 is that much... after all you can buy 12 champions for 450 champions... The cheapest you can get 20 champions for is 16200 (about the price of 3 champions in the 6300 category a bit cheaper actually) And it might be a good idea to wait a little while before jumping straight into ranked

New players get stuck at 30? I thought everyone got stuck at 30..... Did I miss the new expansion raising the max level

Pastramka1 votes

I thought everyone got stuck at 30..... Did I miss the new expansion raising the max level

LoL

I agree, 20 is not that much. It might be the cause for more troll picks but still that's why we have bronze :D. But as I said people are complaining at the current leveling up, there are dozens of post with something like "...address the new player experience..."(which I personally think are ether smurfs or control freaks trying to get their girlfriend to play ranked) backed up by hundreds of up-votes in which one of the things they point out is an "IP wall" preventing one to get new champs to play ranked.

So I assumed that requiring 20 champs for ranked with no other changes will cause a big ruckus afterwards.

YOU BEEN WARNED1 votes

If Riot is afraid this will be abused by banning out a player's roster, implement this change for soloQ only initially and decide on team ranked queues later.

Champion Skin3 votes

Well so what if someone gets banned out? The other team can just return the favor they have just as many bans.. and this could force people to learn more champions and more diversity

YOU BEEN WARNED1 votes

Actually, very good point. I like it.

hgjkdlsaf jeldvb1 votes

right. LC$... that would force players to have like a 7 champ pool.

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