Simple Request : Nerf LeBlanc's early game, buff her late.

dakota saturn··4 votes·907 views

I am saying this as a LB onetrick with over 1 million mastery points on her.

She's more binary than she ever was before the rework - since she can't pick off the enemy ADC after 40 minutes due to the sigil timer, she HAS to snowball and win her lane and end the game before 25 minutes. If the game continues past 25 minutes, her winrate plummets to lower than every other midlaner except Akali and Kat. Old LB was still relevant, even with a mediocre performance early on because she could pop the ADC if they were out of position. New LB can't.

She has an extremely toxic and oppressive early game, and has one of the highest winrates that any midlaner has ever had for < 25 minute games. She makes whoever she lanes against cry and have the worst lane ever, with far less counterplay than she used to have. Any champ who isn't Ryze simply can't punish her even with her .25s W lockout, since she doesn't have to W on top of people to do meaningful dmg anymore. If a champ doesn't have instant point and click CC, she can simply blink back when the projectile is about to hit her, and she'll be stunned under her own turret in safety.

She needs to have her sigil scaled up to 1.75 at least in early game so she can't pop it just by landing chain and have the time scaled down as the game continues.

Her base dmgs should also be toned down for early levels, and her mana costs should be increased. Her E, for example, one of the most damaging abilities in the entire game, is only 40 mana at all ranks. It should cost 60 mana at least at level 1 and scale up with level. The waveclear nerf is a good start but it won't fix her issues and early game oppression.

20 Comments

Big Lincoln2 votes

maybe make her passive scale down

up it to 2 seconds at base, 1.5 at 6, 1 at 11, .5 at 16?

dakota saturn1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Big Lincoln,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qxE8q0gK,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2016-11-22T15:14:42.961+0000)

maybe make her passive scale down

up it to 2 seconds at base, 1.5 at 6, 1 at 11, .5 at 16?

Yup, exactly - this would be great.

Hupsis2 votes

0.5 is way too quick (and so is 1 sec imo). Q travel time alone takes 0.5 seconds. So it's basically the same as pre-rework Leblanc... with aoe burst.

She's fine currently. Just hide behind your minions and back off if she puts her passive on you. Poke her so she's afraid to use W offensively (it has a long cd in early game so bait it and then poke).

AttackOnTeemos2 votes

Or just play Galio mid and shutdown her damage...

dakota saturn1 votes

{quoted}

Or just play Galio mid and shutdown her damage...

Seriously? Maybe if this was season 3 and she still was maxing Q first. That matchup today is a joke for LB, and if anyone actually seriously picked Galio into my LB, I'd jump up and down because the enemy just gave me a free lane and basically guaranteed that I'm going to snowball that game. Galio is a joke right now unfortunately except in niche teamcomps. He's been irrelevant as a LB counter ever since her ult rework and going for W max first.

Putting aside the fact you're suggesting that one out of 130+ champions can actually go toe to toe with her in lane, what is a Galio going to do vs a LB?

All he can do is stalemate the lane at best. He has zero mobility, slow skillshots, and no CC beyond a slow and his huge CD ult. If Galio hits her with even a single Q, she messed up or is lagging. He needs a lot of cs before he can even stay in lane vs LB - he can't do anything versus her poke, and even Galio would be easily shoved out by a LB with a brain. The only way he could possibly 'counter' her is if he had a Lee Sin jungler who camped the fk out of her and ONLY her for the first 20 minutes of the game. And in that case, it doesn't have to be Galio, a Janna Mid would suffice just the same.

He just spams waveclear, but now with LB's buffed waveclear, she couldn't care less about enemies who push. Galio also has ZERO kill pressure on LB in lane, and at any point LB just walks bot lane and picks up a free double, while Galio's team spams 'report pls' in all chat since he can't stop her.

AttackOnTeemos1 votes

[{quoted}](name=dakota saturn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qxE8q0gK,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2016-11-22T16:42:05.164+0000)

Seriously? Maybe if this was season 3 and she still was maxing Q first. That matchup today is a joke for LB, and if anyone actually seriously picked Galio into my LB, I'd jump up and down because the enemy just gave me a free lane and basically guaranteed that I'm going to snowball that game. Galio is a joke right now unfortunately except in niche teamcomps. He's been irrelevant as a LB counter ever since her ult rework and going for W max first.

Putting aside the fact you're suggesting that one out of 130+ champions can actually go toe to toe with her in lane, what is a Galio going to do vs a LB?

All he can do is stalemate the lane at best. He has zero mobility, slow skillshots, and no CC beyond a slow and his huge CD ult. If Galio hits her with even a single Q, she messed up or is lagging. He needs a lot of cs before he can even stay in lane vs LB - he can't do anything versus her poke, and even Galio would be easily shoved out by a LB with a brain. The only way he could possibly 'counter' her is if he had a Lee Sin jungler who camped the fk out of her and ONLY her for the first 20 minutes of the game. And in that case, it doesn't have to be Galio, a Janna Mid would suffice just the same.

He just spams waveclear, but now with LB's buffed waveclear, she couldn't care less about enemies who push. Galio also has ZERO kill pressure on LB in lane, and at any point LB just walks bot lane and picks up a free double, while Galio's team spams 'report pls' in all chat since he can't stop her.

Really? Because I start Galio with my E and I managed to delete a LB easily. Even though we lost the match I still won my lane against her. You don't USE your Q on her you USE your E. If she binds you you simply W yourself to negate the damage.

Just cause you are bad with a champion doesn't mean everyone else is lol.

dakota saturn1 votes

{quoted}

Really? Because I start Galio with my E and I managed to delete a LB easily. Even though we lost the match I still won my lane against her. You don't USE your Q on her you USE your E. If she binds you you simply W yourself to negate the damage.

Just cause you are bad with a champion doesn't mean everyone else is lol.

I am a LeBlanc onetrick - I'm not talking about any of this from the Galio's perspective.

And if a LB seriously lets you poke her down with a slow moving projectile that does MAGIC DAMAGE: 60 / 105 / 150 / 195 / 240 she was either drunk, high, or has never played LeBlanc before in their life.

If you only save W for when you get bound, cool - I'll just poke you down with auto's and W's. It's not hard to bait an enemy's defensive ability by faking your moves, then going in once the shield is down.

I have played LB in thousands upon thousands of games, meaning I've been 'counterpicked' by galio over 100 times. Galio is a free lane for me at this point. He doesn't counter her anymore like he did when she was forced to max Q first. There should be no reason that Galio should ever even hit LB with any of his abilities in the entire laning phase, outside of a Flash Ult. And even that gives a good .25-.5 seconds of reaction time for the LB herself to dash or flash out.

I don't mean to sound like a typical '1v1 me brah', but if you're as good with Galio as you're implying, I'd love to see how a Galio would beat LB in lane, and I'd be more than happy to try a custom game with you for a few minutes to see the strategy.

nm10102 votes

W to negate carry burst, wave clear to stop roaming, and ult to lock you up. That is a hard counter through and through.

ChaddyFantome1 votes

She makes whoever she lanes against cry and have the worst lane ever,

Cassiopeia

dakota saturn1 votes

{quoted}

Cassiopeia

Sure, if you're playing a melee champ in top lane she's a nightmare, but her winrate in mid is average at best. She's actually pretty manageable. It sounds crazy but I actually pick laning Evelynn into her since she can dodge Cassio's skillshots without having to use a dash or blink by using her W. If Cassio tries to chase Eve, she just runs away laughing. Even if Cassio picks up Rylai's, her W cleanses slow, and Eve always maintains the advantage of initiation because of her stealth.

Cassio can't really do anything to Eve at all, and with Eve's speed and Cassio's slow windup time on her ult, it's very easy to bait her entire combo and have her miss everything and go on tilt.

ChaddyFantome1 votes

[{quoted}](name=dakota saturn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qxE8q0gK,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2016-11-22T15:17:28.762+0000)

Sure, if you're playing a melee champ in top lane she's a nightmare, but her winrate in mid is average at best. She's actually pretty manageable. It sounds crazy but I actually pick laning Evelynn into her since she can dodge Cassio's skillshots without having to use a dash or blink by using her W. If Cassio tries to chase Eve, she just runs away laughing. Even if Cassio picks up Rylai's, her W cleanses slow, and Eve always maintains the advantage of initiation because of her stealth.

Cassio can't really do anything to Eve at all, and with Eve's speed and Cassio's slow windup time on her ult, it's very easy to bait her entire combo and have her miss everything and go on tilt.

I think you missed my point. I am not talking about how laning against her is a nightmare (tho it unarguably is and if you claim otherwise you are bias)

I was saying that laning against Leblanc as Casseopia isn't a nightmare.

dakota saturn1 votes

{quoted}

I think you missed my point. I am not talking about how laning against her is a nightmare (tho it unarguably is and if you claim otherwise you are bias)

I was saying that laning against Leblanc as Casseopia isn't a nightmare.

Oh sorry, I wasn't aware a post simply containing a champion portrait and zero context was supposed to have a point. My bad.

I gave you a direct example of a champion who has advantage in lane over her, and LB also has a direct advantage over her as well with her mobility. But Cass still has outplay potential, it's a skill matchup either way.

But apparently that makes me 'bias' if I don't think that Cass is a super ungodly overpowered POS. Because she isn't.

ChaddyFantome1 votes

[{quoted}](name=dakota saturn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qxE8q0gK,comment-id=0000000000000000,timestamp=2016-11-22T21:26:00.419+0000)

Oh sorry, I wasn't aware a post simply containing a champion portrait and zero context was supposed to have a point. My bad.

You know, if you ignore the post i quoted, sure.

I gave you a direct example of a champion who has advantage in lane over her, and LB also has a direct advantage over her as well with her mobility.

Yes, lets ignore the fact that Cass has an ability specifically designed to stop mobility and happens to be at the same range as Leblancs W.

Lets forget that Leblancs W travel speed was nerfed , making it easy for Cass to just Ulti her as Soon as she jumps her.

But apparently that makes me 'bias' if I don't think that Cass is a super ungodly overpowered POS. Because she isn't.

I never said that she is tho.

dakota saturn1 votes

{quoted}

You know, if you ignore the post i quoted, sure.

Yes, lets ignore the fact that Cass has an ability specifically designed to stop mobility and happens to be at the same range as Leblancs W.

Lets forget that Leblancs W travel speed was nerfed , making it easy for Cass to just Ulti her as Soon as she jumps her.

I never said that she is tho.

You make zero sense and you're making my brain liquefy and leak out of my ears. -_-

ChaddyFantome1 votes

[{quoted}](name=dakota saturn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qxE8q0gK,comment-id=000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2016-11-22T21:43:22.399+0000)

You make zero sense and you're making my brain liquefy and leak out of my ears. -_-

Genius tier response there. You sound like a spoiled child on a tantrum.

dakota saturn1 votes

{quoted}

Genius tier response there. You sound like a spoiled child on a tantrum.

You give zero explanation and expect people to understand your point just from posting a champion portrait, then you edit your response which originally was childish and said to the effect of 'if you disagree with me you are wrong', and I'm the child?

Lawl.

ChaddyFantome1 votes

[{quoted}](name=dakota saturn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qxE8q0gK,comment-id=00000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2016-11-22T22:17:03.067+0000)

You give zero explanation and expect people to understand your point just from posting a champion portrait, then you edit your response which originally was childish and said to the effect of 'if you disagree with me you are wrong', and I'm the child?

Lawl.

Someone not only can't seem to read, but has their nickers in a twist over nothing. Someone has some growing to do.

dakota saturn1 votes

{quoted}

Someone not only can't seem to read, but has their nickers in a twist over nothing. Someone has some growing to do.

Okies. I have better things to do than argue with a four year old who missed nap time.

Have a wonderful rest of your evening!

Catastrop1 votes

There are worse people than Cass. Like you have to be playing a melee with no gapclosers whatsoever to call her a miserable laning experience.

ChaddyFantome1 votes

{quoted}

There are worse people than Cass. Like you have to be playing a melee with no gapclosers whatsoever to call her a miserable laning experience.

Again, you are missing the point. I am not trying to excuse Leb my shufflign focus to Cass. that is weak sauce shit. I am saying Laning against LB as Cass isn't miserable.

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