Tip : Teammates perform worse if you harass them after a mistake.

dakota saturn·Jan 28, 2017·56 votes·2,120 views

PING PING PING PING PING "?" "?" "?" WHY WERE YOU THERE??????? PING PING PING PING "?" "?" "?" /all REPORT THIS MID TROLLING

sigh....

40 Comments

Nameless VoiceJan 28, 201710 votes

I wish Riot would start banning for ?-ping spamming.

rengar voreJan 28, 20175 votes

MisterJuliaJan 28, 201714 votes

{quoted}

.

good point.

rengar voreJan 28, 20171 votes

{quoted}

good point.

thank you <3

Critmaster GarenJan 28, 20173 votes

why WERE you there?

in most cases when someone asks this, you ran either into the middle of the enemy team, or you just chilled in one spot while there was clearly a gank coming from you visible on the minimap. or you ran bot at 25 minutes to farm, while baron was contested. or you put yourself in some other way clearly out of position for no reason.

there is no reason to start a fight around dragon area, when there is no dragon there. or to run into the enemy jungle to steal a camp when the enemy jungler has not been spotted away from that side of the map etc.

maybe you should take this as a hint to improve your awareness.

not saying you should constantly harass your teammates for making a mistake. but when a person is making the same mistake multiple times in a row, it might be a better idea to listen to complaints than writing them off as toxic behaviour.

CheekynorthJan 28, 20174 votes

Why were they there? Because it was a mistake.

Critmaster GarenJan 28, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Why were they there? Because it was a mistake.

right, its still usually a valid question, because every time you move somewhere on the map you should have a valid reason for it. there needs to be something to gain from you being there.

CowseedJan 28, 20173 votes

And because of that it's less annoying and less tilting? Say your bs in chat so I can just mute you. Don't physically obstruct my gameplay with pings because you jumped into a 1v2 and expected me to follow you to you death (yes people ping for these reasons)

Supreme Senpai69Jan 28, 20176 votes

People are bad at the game. Harassing them makes them worse. Why would you want to sabotage your chances of winning even more? You're not wrong, but there's nothing to be gained from pointing that out to them in-game.

Critmaster GarenJan 28, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=Revan Senpai,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=yRJnH6Er,comment-id=0001000000000001,timestamp=2017-01-28T17:30:05.821+0000)

People are bad at the game. Harassing them makes them worse. Why would you want to sabotage your chances of winning even more? You're not wrong, but there's nothing to be gained from pointing that out to them in-game.

why are you sabotaging yourself at winning the game by pointing out allies mistakes?

the way i see it, you can either not do it and sabotage yourself by staying quiet and having the ally make the same mistakes repeatedly and eventually throw the game, or you can point out his mistake and take the chance that he might learn from it and stop making the same mistake.

pointing out allies mistake isnt toxic behaviour, when youre just trying to help them udnerstand what they did wrong, so they stop doing it wrong.

Supreme Senpai69Jan 28, 20175 votes

I'm not really saying it's toxic, though 90% of the time it is. But you can totally do it in a way that isn't toxic. But more often than not, one of two things happen. One: The person is just really tilted and knows they messed up but don't even care. They hate themselves for their mistake and after hearing someone call them out for it, they begin making more and more mistakes because of the tilt. We've all been there at one point I'm sure.

Or two: they're a sensitive sally and begin to troll, AFK, or intentionally feed. This happens a lot for me. Seems like most players are actively looking for the slightest reason to throw the game on purpose. Most players in ranked are a ticking time bomb. One time my ADC began to intent feed in my last promo game because I said "GJ, Ashe!" when she got a quadra kill. Maybe she was upset she didn't get a penta? Who knows. I just /mute all nowadays.

You're totally right but as it is, it's just better not to say anything. In theory you're right and that's the way it should be. In practice it's almost always better to stay silent

Raven RedeemedJan 28, 20174 votes

Pinging an ally is a very passive- aggressive action and there is almost no way for an ally to take it as informative correction. If you can ping it, they probably already know about the mistake. If you think they actually don't know what they did wrong and would like to inform them, the mistake is probably more subtle and you have to use chat in an informative, non-passive agresive manner ("I think you need to kite more." instead of "Why were you just standing there?")

AeszarckJan 29, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=yRJnH6Er,comment-id=00010000000000010000,timestamp=2017-01-28T17:36:30.761+0000)

why are you sabotaging yourself at winning the game by pointing out allies mistakes?

the way i see it, you can either not do it and sabotage yourself by staying quiet and having the ally make the same mistakes repeatedly and eventually throw the game, or you can point out his mistake and take the chance that he might learn from it and stop making the same mistake.

pointing out allies mistake isnt toxic behaviour, when youre just trying to help them udnerstand what they did wrong, so they stop doing it wrong.

If I make a mistake, I know I made a mistake and I feel bad. The last thing I want is more people telling me I made a mistake. If you ask me why, I'll say that I overextended or I overestimated my damage or I was making a poor decision or whatever. Just know that I'm wasting time by typing that out, and that I am not likely to fix that habit within the course of a game, because fixing "stupid decision making" isn't just something you can fix like that.

Chief KebbieJan 28, 20176 votes

Yes, let's legislate every decision our teammates make. I would like a 3 paragraph memo whenever you leave base as to why that particular decision is being made. Or... you could acknowledge that being forced to type out a response whenever you make a mistake is a further waste of time and is in and of itself a mistake. Ask yourself if the time needed to type out a response and the corresponding drop in moral is worth the "hint to improve your awareness". Instead of wasting these comments on questions that are pointless say things like:

We don't have vision on red side so we probably shouldn't be split pushing down there
Drake is up in 30 seconds, let's set up Physically target the adc before a fight so there's a big old target over its head for everyone to see

Catch the mistakes before they happen, help newer players see what they are missing, DON'T pointlessly question when the only response is "it was a mistake"

Critmaster GarenJan 28, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=Chief Kebbie,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=yRJnH6Er,comment-id=00010001,timestamp=2017-01-28T17:03:06.003+0000)

Yes, let's legislate every decision our teammates make. I would like a 3 paragraph memo whenever you leave base as to why that particular decision is being made. Or... you could acknowledge that being forced to type out a response whenever you make a mistake is a further waste of time and is in and of itself a mistake. Ask yourself if the time needed to type out a response and the corresponding drop in moral is worth the "hint to improve your awareness". Instead of wasting these comments on questions that are pointless say things like:

We don't have vision on red side so we probably shouldn't be split pushing down there

Drake is up in 30 seconds, let's set up Physically target the adc before a fight so there's a big old target over its head for everyone to see

Catch the mistakes before they happen, help newer players see what they are missing, DON'T pointlessly question when the only response is "it was a mistake"

the problem is, that many people dont neccessarily realize that they made a mistake, or what mistake they made.

if you dont say anything, then it might happen that they repeat that mistake over and over again.

like i said. harassing your teammates is not ok, but when someone questions "what were you doing there?", it might be a good idea to take a second to think what you actually were doing there out of position. and maybe avoid making the same mistake in the future.

i mean youre probably dead and have 30 seconds to think about what happened anyways.

Weasel KenseiJan 28, 20175 votes

You dont capitalize the first word of your sentences.

Thats a fuck up.

Why?

You are fucking up every time you dont capitalize the first word of a sentence... I DEMAND ANSWERS!

First, its true that you are doing it incorrectly.

Second, dont you think I sound like an ass for pointing out your mistakes and demanding answers to why your doing it wrong?

Go on, introspect... I'll wait.

Critmaster GarenJan 28, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=Weasel Kensei,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=yRJnH6Er,comment-id=0001000100000000,timestamp=2017-01-28T18:57:06.786+0000)

You dont capitalize the first word of your sentences.

Thats a fuck up.

Why?

You are fucking up every time you dont capitalize the first word of a sentence... I DEMAND ANSWERS!

First, its true that you are doing it incorrectly.

Second, dont you think I sound like an ass for pointing out your mistakes and demanding answers to why your doing it wrong?

Go on, introspect... I'll wait.

its not a fuck up when its intentional.

its also not negatively impacting other people. your quality of posts doesnt depend on me writing correctly.

however a person making a mistake in the game, negatively impacts his whole team. thats why people in this game get aggravated so easily. i did write you shouldnt harass someone. pointing out a mistake isnt harassing in my opinion.

Weasel KenseiJan 28, 20176 votes

Oh, your intentionally fucking up by writing wrong on purpose, just assume theyre intentionally fucking up too.

Doesnt affect anyone how you write? I dont like looking at it, you dont like looking at your teams fuck ups.

You will tell me "so what, get over it" and I guess thats what you should expect from your team when they get caught out: "I did it intentionally, so what, get over it."

Youre reaction was perfect too, I seriously dont like reading all lowercase shitty looking lazy dipshit post, but will you change that for me? There you go, question people why they fucked up, now you tilted them and they will play worse cause now they have to defend themselves. Just like when YOU AND YOUR LAZY NO CAPS self thinks, stfu I dont give a damn about what you think when I question you on it... but its too late now theyre in tilt mode.

Now you know.

AsylianaJan 29, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=Weasel Kensei,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=yRJnH6Er,comment-id=000100010000000000000000,timestamp=2017-01-28T23:25:27.314+0000)

Oh, your intentionally fucking up by writing wrong on purpose, just assume theyre intentionally fucking up too.

Doesnt affect anyone how you write? I dont like looking at it, you dont like looking at your teams fuck ups.

You will tell me "so what, get over it" and I guess thats what you should expect from your team when they get caught out: "I did it intentionally, so what, get over it."

Youre reaction was perfect too, I seriously dont like reading all lowercase shitty looking lazy dipshit post, but will you change that for me? There you go, question people why they fucked up, now you tilted them and they will play worse cause now they have to defend themselves. Just like when YOU AND YOUR LAZY NO CAPS self thinks, stfu I dont give a damn about what you think when I question you on it... but its too late now theyre in tilt mode.

Now you know.

And much like in a league match, the one throwing a fit and ? pinging can also be subject to the same harassment, despite acting holier than thou. People make mistakes.

Why don't you use the correct your/you're? Why don't you use apostrophes?

Sometimes the pot calls the kettle black.

Weasel KenseiJan 29, 20175 votes

The first your that should have been youre was probably a typo, as years of gaming have really messed up my qwer, wasd, and that side of the keyboard is very prone to typos because the keys have been hammered so much. As you can see in the second to last paragraph the youre was used. Im sure youll never believe it, but likely a typo. A few semesters serving as an editor on my college newspaper keeps me from making that mistake except on nights of the new moon when my proof reading skills are at their weakest.

As for apostrophes, I often skip them for short one sentence responses because meh extra button. For anything more substantial they generally go in, I use spell check pretty liberally on most anything I write. I leave the red squiggles under contractions here because on the LoL forums any apostrophes appear as

&# 039 ;

With no spaces in the preview when you hover over a thread title. Try it, if you should respond, make sure to just type those characters with no spaces, and see how they turn into an apostrophe.

So someone types "I don't get why xyz happens in match." It appears in the quick view as "I don&# 039 ;t get why xyz happens in match." So Iv trained myself to not fix those contractions ever on LoL forums.

I feel when an idea is crafted, and shared, it should look like some effort went into it. A common analogy I use is "That dirty homeless looking guy with no teeth is giving me some very detailed suggestions on my future, finances, and health; but hes a toothless homeless guy covered in dirt so Im just going to ignore him.

See, all lowercase post... are the ravings of the toothless homeless guy. Visually, looks wrong, kinda dismissing it. Im not the only one who thinks this way for your information.

So there you go, a supposed typo, and the fact that League forums use a symbol code for each and every ' in the forums. No kettle, just you and no reasonable reason why you wouldnt capitalize sentences other than a missing pinky finger, or perhaps serious laziness.

VenomarJan 29, 20172 votes

This is great because:

You're trying to argue that it doesn't help while the other poster is.
He admittingly says that it's intentional and makes no effort to conceed, digs his heels in and trys to defend his actions.
Didn't help.
The guy still argues his point that it'll help and further tries to justify his actions.

Much like how it would go in a match.

Not defending or flaming either of you but it's basically a beautiful pocket example of what OP made this thread for.

Weasel KenseiJan 29, 20171 votes

{quoted}

This is great because:

You're trying to argue that it doesn't help while the other poster is.

He admittingly says that it's intentional and makes no effort to conceed, digs his heels in and trys to defend his actions.

Didn't help.

The guy still argues his point that it'll help and further tries to justify his actions.

Much like how it would go in a match.

Not defending or flaming either of you but it's basically a beautiful pocket example of what OP made this thread for.

So youre saying Im brilliant?

Probably not. I do like making points though, and I feel as though if I can abate one more person from asking a stupid question of "Why did u make that mistake?" Only to be responded to with "Cause... it was a mistake... Im not a machine that produces flawless results? I though I could get away with it?"

I mean that gray screen with a death recap probably lets someone know they messed up. What they dont need now is someone asking them why, so they can be distracted from what theyre going to do next.

Good observation, I like it.

AeszarckJan 28, 20173 votes

[{quoted}](name=Weasel Kensei,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=yRJnH6Er,comment-id=0001000100000000,timestamp=2017-01-28T18:57:06.786+0000)

You dont capitalize the first word of your sentences.

Thats a fuck up.

Why?

You are fucking up every time you dont capitalize the first word of a sentence... I DEMAND ANSWERS!

First, its true that you are doing it incorrectly.

Second, dont you think I sound like an ass for pointing out your mistakes and demanding answers to why your doing it wrong?

Go on, introspect... I'll wait.

That was a very good way to show your point of view. Great reasoning.

watch the bushJan 29, 20171 votes

Glad to know you're one of those people who take their time in game to type and bitch at your team when they're doing poorly. Fucking scum actually trying to defend this?

Critmaster GarenJan 29, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=watch the bush,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=yRJnH6Er,comment-id=0001000100000001,timestamp=2017-01-29T02:52:48.853+0000)

Glad to know you're one of those people who take their time in game to type and bitch at your team when they're doing poorly. Fucking scum actually trying to defend this?

do people not read the part where i said "its not ok to harass your teammates"?

this is what happens when you only read the first sentence of a post.

there is a difference between pointing out a mistake and spam pinging on him and starting to scream at them.

"why didnt you come help me?"

"because we would have both died. why were you there?"

and screaming at your teammate throughout the entire game are two different things.

VenomarJan 29, 20172 votes

An additional problem Is that anyone pointing out that mistake to them in the heat of a match isn't going to make them realize it if they don't already. If you jump off your couch and hit the coffee table and break your toe me telling you that was dumb isn't going to unbreak your toe. If someone roams your lane and dies and feeds and you tell them that was dumb, they probably know, they died, I'd hope so. But if they don't know already, you telling them won't make them magically know when what how or why it was dumb, and could just result in them saying "fuck you" and you being on your own with a fed lane where you actually need them now.

League requires a lot of self reflection. People make mistakes. A lot of people make very bad calls. There's also a lot of people in masters and challenger who aren't mechanical gods but have incredible game knowledge and map awareness.

When I played counter strike years ago I was mechanically good, from the start. It wasn't until I learned the maps and player tendencies and behaviors that I started getting bans for hacking because I'd destroy entire servers.

Even now I've been playing league for nine months and I'm just getting to the point where I am "seeing" things that are happening(or aren't, but will), predicting enemy movements, ganks, objective takes, having reliable internal timers. My last few games (barring the most recent debacles in my match history trying new Champs at 5am) have involved a lot of me carrying and impacting the map and make good picks and decisions and helping out my team immensely and willing them to victory. Even in a lot of my losses lately I'm kicking ass just having someone carry harder than I on the other team.

That didn't come from the guy who told me I was an idiot for not roaming and counter ganking a mid roam when I pinged missing twice and danger 2 weeks ago with a wave shoved up my ass. Didn't come from the guy who told me to uninstall 3 months ago. It came from me buckling down and wanting to Improve myself, finding roles and Champs that work for me, and generally wanting to be better at the game.

I realized why my decisions were bad, and I made an effort to improve upon them. I saw why that fight went wrong. I saw why I got ganked doing X in one game but didn't get ganked in X the game before that. I saw why my team was trash and didn't do anything to help the intended lane. I saw why my gank didn't get us any sums or kills.

No one told me.

GayFluffyUnicornJan 29, 20171 votes

I don't think i should need to write that kind of shit in diamond but i have to so i have to ask "how did you get here without understanding fundamental basics of this game? " So asking out mistakes or why they went bot for 3 CS when the enemy was preparing baron is a legit attempt to correct your teams mistakes and prevent them from happening again

VenomarJan 29, 20171 votes

Yes but asking why someone did something after the fact doesn't help prepare for anything. The damage is done, they got baron.

Going to defend baron and losing and going "why didn't you go help me contest baron" doesn't accomplish anything either.

What needs done and what I try to do is ping baron, say "I think they're trying baron come help me contest" and pinging assist is all you can do. If you do that and the dude goes for 3 CS then there's nothing you can say to change what he did or will do in the future.

My very last game I made a bad call. I was pushing bot and had two people with me, we drew two enemies and they had three pushing mid with our other two contesting them. I was fed and thought we could at the very worst hold them mid and get an inhibitor, or trade two towers for one etc. I don't back, I saw it, but didn't back. I made a choice. We ended up losing a 2 towers and an Inhib for two towers. I didn't ask anyone to go help mid, I didn't do it myself, and I didn't blame the two that stayed with me for not backing and letting me solo push the botlane. The damage was done we had to adjust. We still won the game and kicked butt but me asking why my teammates didn't back wouldn't have changed what was done or helped anyone.

Had I asked someone "one of you go mid, I'm fed I can push this lane in myself 2v1(because I was and could have)" and they didn't, then maybe I could say why didn't you. Even then, what would it accomplish? It's done and we have to make due with what we have.

I'm not diamond or master tier or have a great ability to macro, but I've picked up a lot on this game and the way things "should" be done. I'm sure it's a lot more frustrating having to play with players that should know what they're doing. But I'm of the mindset that you can't assume everyone knows thier role or place or what to do. I try and vocalize and direct as much as possible and own whatever outcome it creates.

I dont see how this changes at any Elo. You have to communicate with your team regardless of what anyone "should" know or doesn't.

RalanrJan 28, 20171 votes

When a teammate is constantly making the same mistake over and over you either play till the game ends so you don't play with them again or make it so their actions aren't a mistake.

I'm all for trying to help people but there only so much you can do in one game.

Weasel KenseiJan 28, 20172 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=yRJnH6Er,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2017-01-28T13:17:21.982+0000)

why WERE you there?

in most cases when someone asks this, you ran either into the middle of the enemy team, or you just chilled in one spot while there was clearly a gank coming from you visible on the minimap. or you ran bot at 25 minutes to farm, while baron was contested. or you put yourself in some other way clearly out of position for no reason.

there is no reason to start a fight around dragon area, when there is no dragon there. or to run into the enemy jungle to steal a camp when the enemy jungler has not been spotted away from that side of the map etc.

maybe you should take this as a hint to improve your awareness.

not saying you should constantly harass your teammates for making a mistake. but when a person is making the same mistake multiple times in a row, it might be a better idea to listen to complaints than writing them off as toxic behaviour.

I have a theory that people who write in all lowercase post are bad people... The negative tone of this post is probably just a coincidence.

CowseedJan 28, 20173 votes

Wait really?! I always assumed that flaming and ping spamming all boosted my teams moral to play on the same level of faker.

Nah, I'm right. You are just trash at the boards. Report OP!

Gimpy89Jan 28, 20171 votes

just ? ping back

SweedishGunnerJan 28, 20171 votes

I don't flame people for one mistake.

It's when they're 0-7 10 minutes into the game where I start getting salty.

AeszarckJan 28, 20171 votes

{quoted}

I don't flame people for one mistake.

It's when they're 0-7 10 minutes into the game where I start getting salty.

Even if this is a terrible player, he or she will still do worse when you start getting salty. Better to encourage the player and give some constructive feedback.

GayFluffyUnicornJan 29, 20171 votes

At this point it doesn't even matter anymore. There isn't more room to get worse like seriously. But i guess in silver or something that doesn't annoy because i don't expect more from them. But when that shit happens in plat + i get really salty because by reaching the higher ranks you should be able to NOT average 10 deaths per game

grugJan 29, 20171 votes

though flaming aint cool, somebody has to threaten these players into proactivity IE TANKS/INITIATORS THAT NEVER ENGAGE

dakota saturnJan 29, 20171 votes

{quoted}

though flaming aint cool, somebody has to threaten these players into proactivity IE TANKS/INITIATORS THAT NEVER ENGAGE

And that's how you have your amu Q'ing into the enemy team when your ADC is farming bot and your mid is taking blue.

Lord GalvatronJan 29, 20171 votes

Those moments when its 45 minutes into a game and your team catches out one person from the enemy team that was isolated. You can practically hear the enemy team MIA spam pinging the person who died.

VenomarJan 29, 20171 votes

Tip: So do enemies ;)