Impure Shots (W) active attack speed gain reverted to 20/30/40/50/60 from 50/55/60/65/70
WHY? Just WHY? She doesn't have a huge identity as an adc that can do this or that. She cant reduce healing so now all we get is a meh attack speed buff and refresh of her passive that wont even go through minion agro? You could have just toned it down a little if the attack speed was too much, but why this. Im done guys.
Heckin Support19 votesBut champions like 
and 
can still destroy towers at any stage of the game and outrange you by a mile late game.
Leu0716 votesYeah, basically they ended up nerfing the W, they removed GW and now the AS steriod is totally meh. But hey! it now gives Strut! the most useless passive in the game which only works to get to lane faster! hurray! at least make the W strut activation to not be removed for the first 3 seconds after activating by damage, otherwise, it is almost completely useless and just an overall nerf to her W. MF's only trademark that makes her unique is her ultimate and yet it is very lackluster IMO compared to other aoe ultimates.
Fadedpf22 votesYeah riot kinda lied when they said gameplay and visual update. Her visuals are better but gameplay still crappy and worse.
Captain Lito6 votes**DISCLAIMER: I do not main Miss Fortune or play her yet, I'm just giving some statistics/opinions from an outsider's perspective. Please don't hate me, I just wanna state my view. **
If people are wondering, her current changes (as of now) are:(Credit to Surrender at 20 for info)
Double Up (Q)
Impure Shots (W)
Cooldown lowered to 12 seconds from 16 seconds Grevious Wounds removed. Grants Strut when activated.
Make It Rain (E)
Duration lowered to 2 seconds from 3 seconds Slow increased to 40/45/50/55/60% from 25/35/45/55/65%
So what this means is that with the current changes at lvl 3, MF will have a 40% slow at rank one, a slightly better Q, and a lower cooldown W. Now I'm not an MF player, I'm planning on buying her to check out how she is right now. But from a viewer's perspective, it looks like this:
Her Q: Looks like a good buff, can't really disagree with more damage. (If it procs off minion to champ too, bonus harass!)
Her W: This is the bad part, obviously. It looks like it'll help her chase potential a bit and having the attack speed more often should help in trades/wave clear, but without the big attack speed buff to make up for removing grevious wounds, I don't know how this will go, it just sounds like she'll be rendered useless in trades since you have to max her q and some champs (ex. Draven, Vayne?) will just bulldoze her.
Her E: Escape/Chase potential, but that's it.
tl:dr From a non-MF player's perspective, her w seems way too weak now, and while 50% does seem a bit overkill at rank one, giving her 30%-40% would probably help her quite a bit without making her too broken. (That and letting the strut activation on her w ignore minion damage))
Fadedpf11 votesThings I want to happen with mf:
Passive ignores minions after level 9 or what ever level is appropriate. (most important)
Reduce E mana cost or give it no cast time which ever is fine.
same suggestion as you said
W having more attack speed or something better because of her GW being removed.
commit an hero2 votesThings I want to happen with mf:
Passive ignores minions after level 9 or what ever level is appropriate. (most important)
Reduce E mana cost or give it no cast time which ever is fine.
same suggestion as you said
W having more attack speed or something better because of her GW being removed.
But Rito's response was that GW wounds wasn't even a decision making. You just wanted the AS. Hur dur.
Fadedpf3 votesClassic rito. Adc is attacking the tank that has healing.... nope just for attack speed.
commit an hero5 votesClassic rito. Adc is attacking the tank that has healing.... nope just for attack speed.
I honestly think Rito doesn't play their own game sometimes.
Silents4291 votesWhat moron ADC focuses the tank?
5G8Nri0B543 votesADC Rules #1: Go for the safest target, even if it means you'll only be attacking the tank. Your job is to deal DPS, not get kills. As long as you're attacking an enemy hero, you're doing your job.
Silents4291 votesGo for the safest target, in the given scenario they are wasting abilities on the tank which is a big no.
5G8Nri0B542 votesYou seem to be confusing ADC's with assassins and mages...not just mages, but burst mages.
Heckin Support3 votesBut Rito's response was that GW wounds wasn't even a decision making. You just wanted the AS. Hur dur.
Not every player just does it for attack speed. Good mf players that understand he kit use the GW based on who they are fighting. Not every player mindlessly just presses things for its main stat.
5G8Nri0B543 votesAs someone who played MF a fair bit...
Her Q's always been situational, worse, it's exclusively a lane-ability. Mind you, it's very good in lane for slowly poking down the opponent. But situational nonetheless. This buff, while it's objectively an improvement, is even more situational.
It will neither help her escape nor will it help her chase. The shitty thing about MF's Passive is that every little thing shuts it down. And she isn't exactly the most mobile champion to begin with.
Neither. It has a long-ass cast delay, a point that's been brought up everytime people discuss MF. That and slows aren't the best chase/escape tools now that even ADC's have their own built in gap-closers
Overall these changes show a pretty clear lack of foresight on Riot's part. The only thing that is undeniably a buff is her Q. But it's no where near enough to make up for her severe nerfs.
With these changes, she lost the ability to effectively take on heal-tanks, Soraka-like supports, and the ability to duel anyone who forces an engagement on her (pretty much everyone because she has no built-in escape)
OperationDEEZ16 votesYet they let Jinx keep the free 120% AS steroid.
commit an hero1 votesYet they let Jinx keep the free 120% AS steroid.
To be fair she uses rockets late game.
OperationDEEZ15 votesAOE crits aren't much healthier.
A Miss Fortune5 votesI don't see why everyone keeps calling her a trash-tier ADC. Personally I'm doing fine with her against people far above my elo. I've been going on a streak where I've been going around 20-3 a game and just got my 4th pentakill with Miss Fortune last night. These are my last 10 games played with her.
Kills - Deaths 23 - 7 18 - 1 22 - 4 20 - 6 25 - 8 8 - 5 23 - 3 21 - 3 9 - 2 11 - 5
I'm not trying to brag or just prove I'm the best player in the world, which in all honestly I'm not even close to. However I think a champion is fairly good when someone like me can average 17.8 kills and 3.3 deaths with the champion that I play 1 - 5 times a day. These are from me playing her both AD Mid and AD Bot against a lot of different matchups.
As for the changes to her Attack Speed reverted, personally I don't even know why they gave her such an enormous buff to it. A lane bully has a 12 second cooldown (that only lasts 6 seconds if you include the duration if I remember correctly), 50% Attack Speed buff at level 1 or 2, that also grants her bonus damage to her auto attacks, and also reactivates her passive. This seems a bit overboard. She's really underestimated which is both annoying and saddening, but after playing almost every ADC in the game extensively, I see plenty of power Miss Fortune holds over others. She isn't the best at everything obviously, however she is far from the worst.
And I know people are going to say "Oh you're Silver, you're trash, you have no idea what you're talking about". Actually, my elo doesn't effect my opinion or statistics about a champion, and if I'm THAT bad why am I doing SO well with a champion that is "Trash tier", especially against people who are Gold and Platinum or just people noticeably above my Rank.
A good argument to this would be nice.
Fadedpf3 votesShe doesn't have anything special. She doesn't have poke like Corki or Cait. Doesn't have long range like Trist, Jinx or Ashe. Isn't a better lane bully than Graves, Lucian or Draven. Doesn't have a dash or and Hard CC. There are just so many flaws that riot needs to address. Her W is not good after these reverts. Her E is still a waste of mana and has a cast time. The slow buff wont help you much at all. Her Q is great and is good. But her passive will just be useless in fights and wont allow you to chase if a minion hits you. Do you get the point almost every other adc has something to make them great, im not calling mf trash but unless you are fed why even bother?
A Miss Fortune5 votesThe thing is that Miss Fortune, while she isn't the BEST duelist and nor is she the BEST teamfighter, she has a strong mix of both. She can outduel a lot, but not all ADCs, and she can have a much better teamfight than most, but not all ADCs.
She's like if you threw someone like Sivir and Vayne together but lessened their core strengths so she wouldn't just be the best ADC in every way...aside from infinite dashes which Riot definitely wouldn't allow to happen CoughKalistaCough.
Even if you're not fed, remember that people like Sivir, Lucian, or Twitch won't be doing much damage either unless they're at full build. This pretty much is the same with every ADC except Vayne or Kalista if played properly.
Miss Fortune is a pretty interesting ADC, she isn't the best at anything, but she can do it all at the same time. Due to this she has relatively no hard counters, and just last night where I got my fourth pentakill I was actually up against Quinn, arguably Miss Fortune's biggest counter. She synergizes in or against any team comp, and her early - mid game is insanely good. I would confidently say her early game is the best, especially now, of any ADC and I think her mid game is arguably one of the best of any ADCs too.
Sure, Vayne can outduel a Miss Fortune, and sure Sivir or Twitch can have better teamfighting. But Vayne's teamfighting? Unless you're Gosu with perfect mechanics, which I guess applies for mostly any champion, you're not going to be the best in teamfighting. Sivir in a duel? If you dodge her boomerang the only thing she has damage-wise is her auto attack resets, but even then Miss Fortune's auto attack resets do damage and have a much lower cooldown, Vayne's auto attack resets are on a 1 second cooldown and allow her to tumble.
I think a lot of ADCs have more defined strengths and weaknesses, but Miss Fortune's identity is being much more flexible. If you need an ADC that can teamfight really well, but also hold her ground more than well enough, she's a great pick and I'm quite surprised she isn't played more often considering she statistically does better than most ADCs. Now I'm not saying stuff like winrates are the BEST to go off of, but she's maintained around a 51.70% - 52% winrate throughout every patch since her last changes.
Fadedpf2 votesYeah she has a mix of things. I don't know what you mean as in mix of Sivir and Vayne because she doesn't have slippery mechanics, chasing potential, or tank shredding like Vayne. Or Sivirs utility with her Ult. She has good aoe and can win against certain ADCs but at that point it is up to jungle ganks and the support to help out and kill MF because she is immobile and just shut her down before she gets strong. And when MF is behind its not fun.
A Miss Fortune5 votesI'm comparing it because Vayne is a god dueliest, easily the best in the game if used appropriately. While I think the champion in general is overrated, especially in lower elo, she still is a great duelist.
For Sivir, Sivir has an awesome teamfighting and probably one of the best of all ADCs if not the best, due to her ability to engage or disengage on top of her Q, W, and she can also ignore something like a Leona ultimate with her Spellshield that would stop her from disengaging.
I've gotten behind with Miss Fortune in early game, but her mid game is so strong that I tend to get back up and actually get fed during that time. If not, I won't be useful until late game. I think this is fine, I would actually think it would be quite overpowering if her late game was just as strong as her early or mid game, since she would then have no hard fall offs. I think It's obvious that she does poorly late game until full build where basically everyone is viable in one way or another.
I think you should try Miss Fortune out, personally I thought she was terrible when I first started playing her, eventually after a month of buying her I played her again and started to get fed for a few games in a row. I think the misconception that she is strong is largely due to her unpopularity and simply due to the fact Humans are just sheep, we're made to believe what others , especially people like the pros, think in certain aspects like this. I think a lot of champions are improperly judged like this. Zed? Even before his nerfs I don't think he was a huge problem and never had many against him if I played well. Elise? She's not the best and I think they Olaf'ed her, however she isn't unviable and is great for picking out high priority targets for your team.
One thing about shutting Miss Fortune down, it's almost impossible early - mid game due to her having so much damage output, but due to how terrible she does late game there's a huge window of opportunity which I think is totally fair.
NeoJusteBelmont2 votesThe 'Humans are just sheep' statement, I feel like this whole community really is like this, they only base things on what is hype and then adapt it as the 'great one'. Myself, I try to think that when I play MF, I play her because I like her character overall, so I'll deal with all her aspects, good or bad, instead of just gunning for victory. Am I going to be an eternal loser this way (note that I'm not as good as you, I don't do those fantastic scores regularly)? Maybe. I don't know.
It's like what they want for MF is to be strong in all eras, or have something that makes her stand out compared to the other big guns (like Corki and Lucian). And as far as 'getting shut down', I think that is why positioning is extremely important, even the most mobile ADC like Lucian or Kalista would be shut down if they ever misposition or the team did not protect them. Or if they expose themselves silly.
You know, sometimes I wonder, if I want MF to be buffed, it's not because I want to win with her easily. But more like so I don't have to hear this whining anymore. I'm very sure that other fans, like Azir or Cassiopeia, would think the same way, they get tired if others do nothing but whine about their favorite champions. Riot needs to assess this situation to shut these whiners up and not giving them a chance.
Just what does it take for a champion to be called 'viable' and not 'sub-par'? Mobility? Win rates?
Let's discuss this, because you seem like a very reasonable guy.
Leu073 votesThe 'Humans are just sheep' statement, I feel like this whole community really is like this, they only base things on what is hype and then adapt it as the 'great one'. Myself, I try to think that when I play MF, I play her because I like her character overall, so I'll deal with all her aspects, good or bad, instead of just gunning for victory. Am I going to be an eternal loser this way (note that I'm not as good as you, I don't do those fantastic scores regularly)? Maybe. I don't know.
It's like what they want for MF is to be strong in all eras, or have something that makes her stand out compared to the other big guns (like Corki and Lucian). And as far as 'getting shut down', I think that is why positioning is extremely important, even the most mobile ADC like Lucian or Kalista would be shut down if they ever misposition or the team did not protect them. Or if they expose themselves silly.
You know, sometimes I wonder, if I want MF to be buffed, it's not because I want to win with her easily. But more like so I don't have to hear this whining anymore. I'm very sure that other fans, like Azir or Cassiopeia, would think the same way, they get tired if others do nothing but whine about their favorite champions. Riot needs to assess this situation to shut these whiners up and not giving them a chance.
Just what does it take for a champion to be called 'viable' and not 'sub-par'? Mobility? Win rates?
Let's discuss this, because you seem like a very reasonable guy.
Can I tag along? Because my duo and I ran bot lane MF to the point of carrying ourselves to high gold elo (may not be much but hear me out); At this point, it was pretty much mandatory to switch to another adc, not because we lost bot lane, but because the advantage we created for ourselves in lane didn't match up to the scaling of other adcs if the games dragged out. Jinx with less items could win trades or duels simply because of her insane AS steroid in switcheroo and her ulti to wrap it up with a bow on top. That's not even talking about lucian shenanigans with his passive or draven's 85% free AD for each axe he throws at you.
I think that viability is important for a champion to be experienced in a fun way. MF's ulti is really fun to use and she's my favorite adc, but it's frustrating to see how she's getting nerfed AGAIN after the Black cleaver wombo combo shenanigans, given that item was reworked and now is no longer worth it for her.
All other adcs whose kit has been changed have gotten considerably more games afterwards, mainly because they were buffed and added fun mechanics to their kits. For Miss Fortune, it looks like they're not even trying to make her kit cohesive like they did for Tristana and Ashe.
And there's talk that they're going to look at Lucian and Ezreal because their performance as adc has become subpar, lol
A Miss Fortune4 votesI think a champion is unviable when they're Syndra with a 28% _ CONSTANT_ win rate or something. Other than that, all champions are viable. Especially Miss Fortune.
As for getting buffs to Miss Fortune, they're nice and all but the buffs aren't huge and she doesn't really NEED them. They are buffs however going to be noticeable.
Also, I kind of don't want buffs for her in general either. I like her being never picked or banned and It's kind of funny when they think "Oh look, a Miss Fortune, this is going to be easy." and I end up going 20-0 or something. Actually I just played a game and ended going 20-5 (I died a lot because uh, their Udyr got Sated..). People expect Miss Fortune to be weak but she's not. Her kit is awesome and statistically she's a lot better than champions that are considered top-tier-ADCs.
NeoJusteBelmont3 votesAs someone who didn't really like tier-lists, I share this sentiment. Basically, it doesn't matter the champion I face is in terms of viability or win rates or skills, at the hands of a skilled player, they can be seriously godlike and bring their team to victory. Yes, even Syndra. At the hands of a less-than-skilled player who is worse than people just starting out, AKA people going YOLO and think that because the pros use them it'll be easy victory... well they can drag a team to defeat. Even ones like Corki, Lucian, and if you step out of ADC territory; Lee Sin, Zed... Well that's just my opinion.
And again, what you call buff, they call nerf. From what you said about Syndra, does this mean you say that viability is based solely on win rates? I may be the only one who doesn't think that, and these guys are just following your statement of 'Humans are sheeps', they are sheeping towards the 'win rate' instead of developing their own opinion and standing strong for them. Then comes about 'fun = win' so they can act like some big **** and ridicule the loser, so they want their favorites to be able to score easy wins gratuitously...
What do you think? What would happen if Riot bite in and then cater to these whiners' ideas of updates, what would become of MF?
A Miss Fortune4 votesThe Miss Fortune that would happen would be one that is unkiteable, unkillable early game, and one-shotting entire teams mid - late game.
They really are being a sheep towards Miss Fortune, because she's unpopular and because she's not Ahri with a 55% winrate in Diamond+, means nothing really.
NeoJusteBelmont3 votesLet's say that those 'changes' stuck to MF: "unkiteable, unkillable early game, and one-shotting entire teams mid - late game." For the long run, would it be good for her? Because I have a feeling that aside of making her the next 'best ADC' where people worship her for her pick and win rates, they might instead turn MF into another whining subject of "Too OP pls nerf" like what Lee Sin and Zed have been experiencing...
(But on the other hand, people will FINALLY say she's no longer a shit-tier ADC)
A Miss Fortune2 votesI'd rather play a trash-tier-useless-ADC than one that is just freelo and exists to ruin other people's games.
NeoJusteBelmont2 votesI'd rather play a trash-tier-useless-ADC than one that is just freelo and exists to ruin other people's games.
Am I the only one who notices that whinings for MF or any other characters come from people who wish their favorite champions is just freelo? Is it a trend going on? Because if it is, then I want it to burn to ashes.
Leu072 votesAm I the only one who notices that whinings for MF or any other characters come from people who wish their favorite champions is just freelo? Is it a trend going on? Because if it is, then I want it to burn to ashes.
Freelo is Tham Kench's W+Kalista's R, THAT'S freelo, a mechanic that, whoever gets sucessfully grabbed by it, can't do anything to play against it.
I don't want MF to be overtuned to the point that we get ourselves a Lucian nerf galore on her. what the OP and most of us are asking is WHY would you shave power of an adc who already has a lackluster, uncohesive kit compared to other ones in the same role
Leu072 votesLet's say that those 'changes' stuck to MF: "unkiteable, unkillable early game, and one-shotting entire teams mid - late game." For the long run, would it be good for her? Because I have a feeling that aside of making her the next 'best ADC' where people worship her for her pick and win rates, they might instead turn MF into another whining subject of "Too OP pls nerf" like what Lee Sin and Zed have been experiencing...
(But on the other hand, people will FINALLY say she's no longer a shit-tier ADC)
The pls too op riot pls nerf already happened, it's called the black cleaver MF era. She got nerfed to the ground because of an item mechanic she can't even exploit anymore.
What's so unkiteable about having Strut not be taken down by minions though? it's decision making just like it would be for Garen's passive. When you're playing agaisnt Garen, there's decision making in the fact that if you don't keep that passive down, Garen is going to just heal the damage you did back up again. MF's strut is pretty much "oh she'll lose it with the next minion hit if they happen to aggro her"
Leu073 votesI think a champion is unviable when they're Syndra with a 28% _ CONSTANT_ win rate or something. Other than that, all champions are viable. Especially Miss Fortune.
As for getting buffs to Miss Fortune, they're nice and all but the buffs aren't huge and she doesn't really NEED them. They are buffs however going to be noticeable.
Also, I kind of don't want buffs for her in general either. I like her being never picked or banned and It's kind of funny when they think "Oh look, a Miss Fortune, this is going to be easy." and I end up going 20-0 or something. Actually I just played a game and ended going 20-5 (I died a lot because uh, their Udyr got Sated..). People expect Miss Fortune to be weak but she's not. Her kit is awesome and statistically she's a lot better than champions that are considered top-tier-ADCs.
Syndra's win rate is so low because her skill cieling is one of the highest in game, but she's balanced. Those who have mastered Syndra can tell you she's VERY strong in the right hands. Much like the new Cassio.
That game you're talking about.....those things happen, specially in normals and lower elo ranks. I'm not saying she's trash, but in platinum she has a 3% pick rate, in diamond she has a 2.3% pick rate. Both as of July 8th in Lolking's statistics
She sits with Quinn and Twitch with the lowest pick rate for adc starting at platinum elo. All other adcs have a 10% pick rate at minimum
if Riot wants ranked games to be more diverse instead of the big 3 adcs for each meta, isn't it logical to bring those sitting down up to the standards of the community that plays the role?
Cindikle5 votesHate to be that guy but it's because you're Silver 5. MF preforms best at lower ranks as she doesn't have a complicated kit and is strong early game. She easily get a lead and can hold it. This is something she has to do to compare to other ADC's. This is because of how a lot of her kit works. R is like asking to get dived/CCd later in the game. Mobility isn't rare so people generally can get out of easily. What makes her stronger early is her mixed damage and her Q. She can front load a lot of damage fairly well. But it's risky to do so. Something that can more easily be gotten away with in bot lane than a dragon fight. I guess the easiest way to put is is that she's an amazing duelist with a teamfighting R. I'd say on par with Vayne in terms of 1v1 damage. But Vayne has way more mobility/self peel.
This is usually where the "bronzie" argument comes from. And holds true as long as someone doesn't take it too far(as such when they cannot explain something other than it's because of their rank).
Overall. You're playing at a lower level. But you are good with MF. So you end up preforming well on her. Even if you lose the game. I'd suggest learning other rolls/champions if you want to improve. It's probably your understanding of the game as a whole that is holding you back. A pro would beat your MF with any champion likely, because they understand the game a whole. Even though you're good with MF and should be able to 1v1 their worst champion. But that's what makes them pro's.
A Miss Fortune3 votesActually, I don't even play Ranked so I tend to see a bunch of Golds, Plats, and even Diamonds.
As for my understanding of the game as a whole, I'm pretty sure I know more than most people and my champion pool is fairly big. I can play any role effectively and carry, including Support which was the first role I mained, and most of the champions I own I've played extensively including champions I haven't owned.
Don't try to pull my elo into this, as my elo has literally 0 relevance to Miss Fortune's power. If I'm really that bad at the game "overall", then why am I doing so good with a champion that is SO bad, against people who are literally Plat and Gold while i'm low Silver?
Sure Miss Fortune isn't going to do as well as she does in Bronze - Gold, however last time I checked, this applies for all champions. Riven? Of course she will do fantastically in Bronze, but while she is arguably overpowering or just frustrating, she obviously is going to do worse in Diamond, this applies to every other champion.
Cindikle5 votesAccording to OP.gg you're normal MMR is around 1200-1300. I think this is roughly Silver 2.
Normals will have a lot of variations of ranks because not every plat plays a lot of normals. They have separate MMR pools.
I never said MF was that bad. But she isn't that great. You were stating how she's amazing because you can preform well on her. She has a good early game and can hold that well. But she can very easily fall behind if she doesn't do well early. Going by your score you can handle this hurdle. She's an early game duelist who has to hold her lead to be of use to the team. ADC's are about the late game. Every other ADC is more likely to out preform her late game. Unless you're one of those odd balls who consider Quinn an ADC still. Despite having strong dueling powers and a strong teamfight AoE she's actually weak past lanning phase. Because those qualities all have drawbacks that come to light once lanning phase is over.
Riven actually preforms better the higher you go. Becuase she has some huge hurdles to pass over. Someone in diamond will very likely know those and is able to preform these things that a bronze player cannot. She can do well in bronze as well because her kit is very simple and easy at it's core. I suppose this is more so the skill floor required to play her at that level more than about her viability though. But a the difference in a diamond Riven and a bronze Riven is much greater than that of most other champions.
A Miss Fortune3 votesI'm not stating she is amazing because of my personal performance, I'm stating she is due to me having experience with basically every ADC in the game extensively, meaning I've played them enough to not master them I guess, but I can play and carry with them. She's a great ADC, regardless of if you're going to be a sheep and I don't think my opinion will change until you provide a better argument than.
ADC's are about the late game.
Which is where Miss Fortune falls off, but also is 100% inaccurate. A lot of games don't even have a "late game", and imagine if Miss Fortune's late game was as good as her Early and Mid game are. It wouldn't be fair.
Cindikle5 votesSome may never see late game. But they are more common than not with the tank meta. The comment wasn't about if there was a late game. It's that as an ADC you want them for the late game. Not all have amazing late games. But ADC's in general are all strong late game. Because of how they build. But in terms of this, MF is in the bottom of the pool.
MF is good at early game. But there are enough champions who also are good early game and can bring more to the team past lanning. Jinx does almost everything she does but better. Better poke, better CC, better AoE. Even vs MF's ult Jinx will out damage it with 2-3 AA(depending on crits) and her ulti. All while being able to move between attacks. Main thing MF has over her is better base range, her Q can bounce further(Jinx needs a few Q ranks to match this) and her CC is instant.
There's also Lucian and Graves. Who provide strong early games but are much stronger late game and even mid game than MF. MF will come out slightly ahead in sustained single target damage. But despite what ADC haters say, it takes more than right clicking to be a good ADC. And after she uses R, MF mainly only has her right clicking. Even Vayne has more interaction outside of her AA's.
I think a lot of how this will change will depend on this W change applying Strut. Does it give the full MS? Does she get to keep it up for a duration even if she gets hit right after hitting W? If these two can happen her ability to R a teamfight then go back to a duelist will make her much safer to play and a little less reliant on her early game. Or say W gives her Strut, but it has to scale up. And it cannot be forced off until it's maxed. Her late game still wont be amazing. But it'll be something without changing her playstyle too much.
A Miss Fortune2 votesWhy are you comparing her to ADCs kit-wise, especially Jinx, Lucian, and Graves who have 0 similarities to her except maybe Lucian.
Every ADC is going to be different but none are inherently "better" while being balanced.
Cindikle6 votesLucian and Graves are lane bullies like MF. While MF is a little stronger, it doesn't make up for what the other two have for the rest of the game. But MF cannot just become better at lanning. It'll feel like Draven with his dot passive again.
I compare Jinx because they are in a way similar.
Both can harass beyond the minion line. Both have some CC for self peel. Both have an AS steroid. Both can deal a lot of AoE damage. Both have MS passives.
MF doesn't need to build up her AS and brings more reliable single target damage. Jinx has better ranges and poke. But has delays.
They have more in common than you'd think. Outside of a stronger early game there isn't much that MF can do that Jinx cannot do better.
I'm trying to widen my comparisons overall. Instead of "Varus and MF both have an AoE slow, why can't MF have %hp damage too?" type of thing we see on the boards once in a while. MF's selling point is her early game. She has to carry this with her all game to make up for what she lacks. Her R does help but it has a lot of counterplay. If you're looking for teamfight AoE damage you're better off with Jinx, Twitch or even Sivir(although it'll take a couple Q/W rotations to pass MF). Maybe even Graves. But I wouldn't get too far head on that one.
Again not saying MF is bad. She's just greatly outclassed in many ways and her strengths don't go with what you bring an ADC for.
A Miss Fortune3 votesRefer to my previous conversation with Original Poster.
Leu072 votesWhy are you comparing her to ADCs kit-wise, especially Jinx, Lucian, and Graves who have 0 similarities to her except maybe Lucian.
Every ADC is going to be different but none are inherently "better" while being balanced.
When you're playing ranked games, you HAVE to measure what you can bring to the table as an adc. It's only fair to compare the more "AoE themed" adcs kit wise, and when you do, you find the discrepancies between their tools to move you to different picks. That's why there's "diversity" in the game. There's protect the vayne and kog comps, Turret pushing with Tristana and and Jinx, Engage/disengage with Sivir. They all fit a role. With the removal of grievous wounds, there's nothing MF can bring to the table that other adcs with similar tools can't.
DrinkMoreWhiskey3 votesYea a hero that's entire kit is designed around punishing poor positioning doesn't feel stronger at low elo where people... position poorly?
Try playing her at higher levels and her ultimate is mostly mitigated through cc and better positioning. She also lacks the almost necessary mobility to compete vs other adcs at that level.
People like you are why people dont take low MMR opinions seriously. The fact that you literally don't understand her kit is designed for punishing mistakes that happen 50x more often at low mmr than at high mmr makes the level of play incredibly relevant to how effective she is.
NapaIm3 votesI don't see why everyone keeps calling her a trash-tier ADC. Personally I'm doing fine with her against people far above my elo. I've been going on a streak where I've been going around 20-3 a game and just got my 4th pentakill with Miss Fortune last night. These are my last 10 games played with her.
Kills - Deaths 23 - 7 18 - 1 22 - 4 20 - 6 25 - 8 8 - 5 23 - 3 21 - 3 9 - 2 11 - 5
I'm not trying to brag or just prove I'm the best player in the world, which in all honestly I'm not even close to. However I think a champion is fairly good when someone like me can average 17.8 kills and 3.3 deaths with the champion that I play 1 - 5 times a day. These are from me playing her both AD Mid and AD Bot against a lot of different matchups.
As for the changes to her Attack Speed reverted, personally I don't even know why they gave her such an enormous buff to it. A lane bully has a 12 second cooldown (that only lasts 6 seconds if you include the duration if I remember correctly), 50% Attack Speed buff at level 1 or 2, that also grants her bonus damage to her auto attacks, and also reactivates her passive. This seems a bit overboard. She's really underestimated which is both annoying and saddening, but after playing almost every ADC in the game extensively, I see plenty of power Miss Fortune holds over others. She isn't the best at everything obviously, however she is far from the worst.
And I know people are going to say "Oh you're Silver, you're trash, you have no idea what you're talking about". Actually, my elo doesn't effect my opinion or statistics about a champion, and if I'm THAT bad why am I doing SO well with a champion that is "Trash tier", especially against people who are Gold and Platinum or just people noticeably above my Rank.
A good argument to this would be nice.
I used to be for the changes. I was fine without the GW. The attack speed buffs more than compensated. Now the only real buff she got was to her q. Her w activating Strut does pretty much nothing for her during the times she wants to be using Impure Shots' active. I have been playing MF on the PBE, and a LOT on my main.
Tbh, they just need to make strut not broken by minions past level 11, and re-revert the attack speed changes if they don't want us to have her GW.
Leu075 votesI asked Moobeat about Strut's scaling and she replied that the level scaling in Strut didn't go through the PBE. Vesh is aware though. I just hope they have actual decent changes to come because so far they're just nerfing her and nerfing her.
Remlap12234 votesEach day that passes gets me more and more sad for the eventual release of her. She's already uplayable right now due to Sated Devourer cheese (NOOBLORD 
NOOBLORD NOOBLORD NOOBLORD NOOBLORD NOOBLORD NOOBLORD NOOBLORD NOOBLORD NOOBLORD NOOBLORD ), and from the looks of it, even after Sated Devourer gets axed, she's going to be unplayable because of how much Riot nerfs her.
Stackless Python4 votesIf the passive still gets taken off by minions she is going to be just a useful as she is right now, and that is pretty useless. I don't see Teemo getting his movement speed taken off by minons, Garen's Q speed is shut off by minions, Shyvana's W speed isn't shut off by minions. Almost everything in the game, besides mobile boots, keeps it's movement speed while being attacked by minions. Use your common sense Riot, please.
TheUltimateSpear3 votesAgreed, it just seems so silly that they're nerfing her attack speed when it's steroid was only on par with Graves. "But MF isn't an autoattacking ADC, she's an AD Caster!" Obviously both of these champions aren't COMPLETE AD casters, they still rely on autos a fair bit. But the point is Graves is just as much reliant on his burst/abilities as MF is, and his AA steroid currently is 30/40/50/60/70%. And every other ADC with an attack speed steroid is just as good if not better than those two. And now MF's is on the same as live without grievous wounds.
This is ridiculous. I love MF but she wasn't an outlier as a lane bully ADC on live and now it's going to be worse. :/
Emperor Time2 votesMF just needs a decent kit overhaul because right now it's trying to be like other adc, but worse. Her passive is a worse jinx passive, her q is a worse version of Ezreal Q, her attack speed steroid is a shitty version of any other adc steroid, it's like Dravens except Draven can use his more and more when he catches axes. Her E is just a slow field...Like other adc's totally don't have this mechanic...Mind blowing kit we got here gents.
Fadedpf3 votesShe just needs a kit that can come together and pull something off. Shes a good lane bully early after that she doesn't have much to offer and if she gets cced or dived by someone her tools to escape are her crappy E. And she basically got straight up nerfed at this point so...